[dmouse]

I think I may have found a food allergy as the cause of my itch and rash! When I was on an elimination diet avoiding chicken and eggs, I made beef stroganoff with rice instead of my usual egg noodles. Within 2 hours, I was itchy & sneezy. The next morning, I had eggs and was okay. Last night, I made beef stroganoff with rice, and 1 1/2 - 2 hours later started sneezing my head off, nose got really runny, and wouldn't you know it, started itching like crazy again! 2 nights ago, I had wheat pasta and no itch, no sneezing, so I don't think it's wheat intolerance. In fact, it was a very "calm skin" night.
I have to go through my journal and cross reference all the different ingredients used in my stroganoff that I also use in other dishes, but I may be allergic to RICE. It's not very common here in the States, but I grew up on a lot of rice dishes, and I have a few I make now so there is increased exposure?

I think I may, after the symptoms go away, do my own version of a scratch test, using rice water... maybe.

*** Looking a little deeper, it could also be a sensitivity to MSG. I use beef bullion and packaged gravy for the stroganoff, which has a lot of MSG....

[mrsD]

allergies to rice do occur, but are pretty rare.
http://yourtotalhealth.ivillage.com/rice-allergy.html

The MSG however, is nasty. I can get blurred vision, sneezing, shortness of breath,
and pain in my feet if it sneaks in. I avoid it alot, but restaurant food usually has it..even places that were safe for me previously, have substitute or new cooks...and bingo..I get a reaction.

There are other names for it... "hydrolyzed vegetable protein" is one.

Allergy to wheat is not the same as gluten intolerance.
Allergy is fast in onset and reacts to proteins in wheat.
The gluten response involves gliadin specifically. Gliadin is found in other grains besides wheat.
http://www.foodintol.com/wheat.asp

[dmouse]

First off, MrsD - thanks for making me look past Mastocytosis! If I would have gone in and been told it wasn't that, I'd feel very dejected!

I'm still not convinced it's gluten sensitivity though. My only gastro/intestinal issues are rather infrequent and involve a constipation, followed by loosness. My understanding, according to foodintol.com is: the common and well-known Gluten intolerance symptoms are gastro-intestinal (diarrhoea, flatulence, bloating etc.). Again, this has never been a major symptom for me.

I just read http://www.msgtruth.org/allergy.htm and http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/press...MAY/000518.HTM
This is how I understand it: MSG sensitivity can increase allergic response in people who have multiple allergies, which I assume explains the pruritus and hives. I have been very allergic, most of my life, to cats & dogs, feathers, dust mites, tree pollen, mold, grass, floral perfumes & lotions (trigger my asthma) and the usual ragweed and such. It is possible that I have an intolerance to rice, but, combined with MSG makes it an allergic reaction...

In keeping this journal, I have discovered that I get what I call "asthma-ish" Not quite a true asthma attack, but a little short of breath. When my symptoms do flare - it does seem to be an allergic reaction of sorts.

One thing I considered doing today, since I have leftovers from last night... I can eat a bowl of plain rice today and see what happens. If that doesn't trigger anything, then tomorrow I can eat a little of the gravy from my stroganoff. If nothing happens from that, then mix them together as I would normally eat them and see what happens. That seems the easiest way to figure this out.

I still need to figure out if this is related to my SFN. MSG is a neurotransmiter... but this needs much more research.

[dmouse]

Looking into histamine and neuropathy:
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=14156441

This MAY explain why, when I'm extremely itchy, the SFN in my hands and feet is worse?

Thoughts?
ADDITION:
Found this on CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/HEALTH/diet.fitne.../msg.avoiding/)
"Sufferers of MSG's effects are not experiencing an "allergy." Instead, they are experiencing the results of direct nerve stimulation and possible nerve damage, although the latter has not been verified in humans. Emergency room physician George R. Schwartz, author of "In Bad Taste: The MSG Symptom Complex," says MSG is a "neurotoxin," a substance that actually induces nerve changes and possible nerve damage. "

[mrsD]

Originally Posted by dmouse

Looking into histamine and neuropathy:
http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=14156441

This MAY explain why, when I'm extremely itchy, the SFN in my hands and feet is worse?

Thoughts?
ADDITION:
Found this on CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/HEALTH/diet.fitne.../msg.avoiding/)
"Sufferers of MSG's effects are not experiencing an "allergy." Instead, they are experiencing the results of direct nerve stimulation and possible nerve damage, although the latter has not been verified in humans. Emergency room physician George R. Schwartz, author of "In Bad Taste: The MSG Symptom Complex," says MSG is a "neurotoxin," a substance that actually induces nerve changes and possible nerve damage. "

There is some evidence that MSG reactions can be blocked by Vitamin B6. It is not a "cure", but is supposed to help.
MSG is an non organically bound form of glutamate which floods the nervous system and supposedly stimulates the NMDA receptors. Glutamates attached to organic molecules found in food, are metabolized more slowly. (Parmesan cheese is very high in natural glutamate).

Glutamate is a neurotransmitter in the brain...70% of all nervous transmissions involve it. It can in high amounts cause seizures in animals and people. Humans need glutamine/glutamate for development.
Human breast milk is 10 times higher than cow's milk.

I hate MSG myself!

[dmouse]

I'll remember that about the B6. Do I remember right though from another post, that you have to be careful with B6? Or is that another of the B vitamins?

MSG seems to be the culprit, based off my journal and reading all the labels in my house. Lipton's Chicken Noodle Soup, Taco's (in shells and seasoning!), roast beef (I use instant bullion for extra flavor), Lipton Parmesean Noodles, Meatloaf (use parmesean cheese in the mix), even my homemade potato soup cause I use Swanson's Chicken Soup base are all the foods associated with itcy days! Lucky for me, my chip dip has some MSG, but it doesn't seem to trigger the itch!

That instant bullion has 4 different MSG ingredients!

I will be one of the happiest people on the planet if I really did figure this out!

[mrsD]

Being a detective typically takes longer than this!

You can take up to 50mg B6 daily with no likely problems unless you have some special genetic weaknesses.
The upper limit is usually 100mg, but I don't think that is really necessary for most people.

If that doesn't work, then try the activated P5P version. Since you may not be converting it properly. (Pyridoxine is not active until changed to P5P. Riboflavin B2 is a cofactor for that).

[dmouse]

I have a B100 complex I was taking. It has 100mg of all the Bs plus PABA, Inositol, and Choline Bitarate, except for Folic Acid which is 400mg.

Should that work? Or should I go individual B vits?

Just remembered - I took one of my B complexes yesterday late morning cause I needed an energy boost, and still got the major reaction with dinner. Does B6 it need to be taken shortly before ingesting MSG? If I remember right, B vitamins are water soluble, so taking it regularly wouldn't allow it to build up and act as a protectant?

You understand the vitamins much more then me, that's why I bring it up.

[mrsD]

Originally Posted by dmouse

I have a B100 complex I was taking. It has 100mg of all the Bs plus PABA, Inositol, and Choline Bitarate, except for Folic Acid which is 400mg.

Should that work? Or should I go individual B vits?

Just remembered - I took one of my B complexes yesterday late morning cause I needed an energy boost, and still got the major reaction with dinner. Does B6 it need to be taken shortly before ingesting MSG? If I remember right, B vitamins are water soluble, so taking it regularly wouldn't allow it to build up and act as a protectant?

You understand the vitamins much more then me, that's why I bring it up.

There is no guarantee about the B6.

You can take that 100mg you have every other day. I think that would be enough.
B6 is stored for a short time in the body, it is not all excreted right away. It is slowly converted to pyridoxal in the liver and muscles.

Give yourself time to clear the MSG you have already taken.
And continue your elimination diet. Remember a typical suspected item should be eliminated for at least 2 weeks before being reintroduced.

[dmouse]

Originally Posted by mrsD

Give yourself time to clear the MSG you have already taken.
And continue your elimination diet. Remember a typical suspected item should be eliminated for at least 2 weeks before being reintroduced.

That will be the hard one, since MSG is in almost everything I prepare/eat! I need to find out the safe foods, and plan my own food around that.

It will be interesting to see if I regain the nerves already damaged, or if it will only keep it from getting worse, if that's what it is.