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Old 04-11-2015, 04:50 PM
Healthgirl Healthgirl is offline
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Healthgirl Healthgirl is offline
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Originally Posted by Neuroproblem View Post
same sceptism as you, i basically went to a forum where theres people who claim they had lyme disease, these are the chronic lyme disease believer i was talking about, as soon as i started questioning the validity of chronic lyme, i basically became a pariah, of trash talking and extreme confrontational people, i basically asked them to prove that thier assumptions with scientific research, they said "tests are not accurate, only an llmd can diagnose by symptoms alone", which they couldnt even explain, and then they started become incredibly defensive, and said i was a liar spreading misinformation.
The reasons i dont believe in chronic lyme, thats why there is the term disseminated lyme disease:
several red flags.
-LLMD/ND do not accept insurance, because they would have to follow some kind of ethical guideline or policy with the insurance, 2ndly, they can charge more per appointment than billing any kind of insurance. third they try to push you into some kind of herbal/antibiotic regiment which does more harm than good. and many so-called llmd who wrote books, believe that if your not suffering, the treatment is not working.
-The blatant prescription abuse by the doctors, of antibiotics is very concerning as, antibiotic breed abx resistant bacteria, adding to the already global issue, antibiotics destroy your own natural "micrbiome" allowing candida to cause infection.
-abx has many side effects, to human body, IV antibiotics used in this manner have cause much more injuries.
- then here comes the lab test that the llmd will only do, igenex, quest,,etc. Very expensive tests, furthermore its not really verifiable as these labs do not let any intense investigation, to see if thier test are valid.
-Now there are actually laws in some states protecting Lyme "specialists" from persecution by law, or punishment by the Medical doctors association of america.
-lasty, is no modern doctor, will diagnose based on your symptoms alone, if its as complex as LYME disease, something like skin infections are clinical.
-see a doc, ordering igenex test, going on reccommended regiments of antibiotics and herbs, can cost in thousands per month, i was wondered how they are even paying for it.
even some forums that allow posting your health related questions, give protection to chronic lyme believers.
- The most unusual thing is that LLMD, or specialist do not want to be publically known(red flag), even some forums give a ultimate rule "no llmd name or address be given publically".
if lyme is disseminated as in some people, antibiotics are almost useless against this stage of the disease, but you see theres claim that continued use of antibiotics will "force the bacteria" out.
i think these people should take a course in microbiology.
hopefully the OP will not get sicker,and make his PN worst with the questionable treatments.
Overall, chronic lyme believer, based thier ideas on pseudoscience, and the experiments or research they have done on lyme, saying that certain herbs/abx can kill certain stages of the bacteria, there is no peer review, and these experiments cannot replicated by official labs or instituition. The only place i find these "Evidence" is on herb treatment related websites, no other sites like ncbi, or some kind of university doing this.

The majority of people who are chronic lyme believers, based on several forums, indicated that they got even sicker on the abx, whats more alarming is that they believe thier children have lyme, and force them on these regiments herbs/abx, which is toxic for children to begin.
I agree with you.
Everything you say here sums up my opinion as well. I feel that many of these "lyme people" are taken advantage of easily because of their desperation to be out of pain and to think that they are going to get better.
However, what about the people that do?

I walked into the llmd's office with my opinion already formed that he was obviously going to think I have lyme and want me as a patient (customer). I still have the same attitude, but don't think he was trying to sell me on anything. I think he is a pretty smart guy who genuinely believes that lyme and coinfections cause almost everything.

The problem is this: mainstream medicine cannot figure out what has assaulted an attack on my body. Was it viral? Bacterial? Environmental?
They can tell me my nervous system is damaged/being damaged probably due to my antibodies. What set off this strange trigger? They don't know. I don't have neurological problems in my family, so its probably not genetic.
As a holistic health practitioner, I am mostly opposed to medication of any sort unless absolutely necessary. I don't even like to take an ibuprofen for a headache.
For me...to even consider this, I must be crazy.

I have to consider it though. I live in a huge tick zone. I have removed several ticks off of myself in the past 12 years. I have a cat who brings in dead rabbits, mice, and birds. I pull ticks off of her all summer and fall. I have found them on the floor walking around full of cat blood. I have been bitten by my cat (no rash though, indicating bartonella aka cat scratch fever)
I have also had several spider bites over the years that were pretty nasty.
I have never had the bullseye, or a fever after any bite, and being a nature person -never worried.

My choices are these:
1. do nothing and keep hoping
2. go with the sjogren's treatment of plaquenil
3. try antibiotics for a while and see what happens.

The only reasons I consider the third option is because of the research being done that links autoimmunity to lyme.
The other reason is that my neurological symptoms are so clinical for lyme even according to mainstream lists.

http://www.ninds.nih.gov/disorders/lyme/lyme.htm

There are many doctors who believe that rheumatism is due to bacteria (not just llmd's)

http://columbia-lyme.org/research/scientific.html

I am terribly upset to mess with my own body, something is clearly messing with it anyway and I am trying to figure out what to do.
If it were up to the neurologists, I would be on Lyrica, mestinon, tramdol, baclofen, and plaquenil right now. I prefer to suffer and take occasional pain relief than pollute myself, but how long can I do it? Sometimes the damage to a persons mind and spirit from pain and fear is worse than getting relief....rambling-another topic.

I think a lifetime of someone taking the above mentioned drugs since 38 years of age would be worse than a trial of a few months of antibiotics (as monstrous as I know they are).

Anyway, it isn't easy, so I'm not jumping to anything. I'm going to see what the next blood work looks like while I ponder.
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