I wonder if Thelma knows that it's impossible for me to stop wondering....:D (((Thelma)))

Good questions, Wannabe :). I can't really answer for others (and there are so many thousands of SL members). There is another Isle, in SL, and it's by and for people with Cerebral Palsy (Live2Give); another Isle was founded by Support for Healing. Aside from health-related aspects and use of SL, some, I do know, use it as a type of release valve (winding down from stress - of RL work; some are doctors and interns) and the enjoyment of creating - items either given away or sold. Too, there are others who participate and offer "classes" and some who sell things and give monies raised to various charities.

It's not really a win/lose 3D "world," but one that is built on synchronous interaction and what individual members wish to use it for and make of it :). Because it is live-time interaction, it's also a dynamic medium that ever-evolves.

So, I suppose, it all depends on whom is asked, since there are myriad reasons people have joined SL.

P.S.: I'm on vacation right now (and want to head south along the coast today); other than that, if I had more time, I'd look for a few links that could probably explain better than I've done. I may have more time tomorrow. But, for now, the beach awaits my arrival. Ohhh, sure it does :).

aaaahhhh my favorite dancing partner:) I do not have any dates before me, but if my memory serves me right it has not been THAT long since BT became non-profit! John made a big todo about it and we all congratulated John, BT and everybody else that felt a part of the "program".

I was thinking it actually came about shortly after the "big money drive" for the server and other things. I could be wrong, but nevertheless it was not far in between and it has not been a long time.
I agree with what Thelma, Chemar and Curious and several others said. JohnLester does not"owe" us his time or money or anything except to be treated with some respect. He may be a genius, he is very smart, he used to act like a human being and he DEMANDED we respect his Moderators and David H.just because HE said so.

there is much here that does not meet the eye. Also many people that depended on BT as their life line, very ill people. For 2 months if they have tried to log into BT y'all know what they got. I worry for these people because I talk with them and sometimes I speak on the phone to some of them.
It was sad to see them send JL money for a server when they hardly had food to eat, couldn't afford their meds. etc.

Many people mentioned that he never even gave a thank you. I guess we just want to be treated like human beings too. I think that is where he has failed him. I know members sent him money off and on a long time, which is great and I don't doubt he put his own money in.

He needs to remember his humble beginnings. He may be a genius, but he could not have built his impire without the people, us, the members!! JL didn't do it ALL by himself.

If it comes to be that JL walked with the money, I will be in line with everyone else holding a stone to throw at him.


Added: Like I said though, that's yet to be proven.

Over 2 months now. The message has been down now for more than a few days. No update, no word to the thousands of people who depended upon the community. Some on a daily basis.

At this point, I guess we should stop holding our breaths waiting for its return and just get on with life and building this community.

It's sad, but I also think we shouldn't read too much into a person's motives or behaviors without them being here to defend themselves. Instead let's focus on the positive and what can be built here.

John

You are right DocJohn. I see the beginnings of something very good for all that care to be a part of. thank you for reminding us of our goal as to helping others, share their happy moments, share their sadness, but encouraging all the time, to all!! I'm going to work on a list of people we left behind and see if I can help at least some find their way here.

Can't thank you enough, DocJohn. thanks to all the good people that have helped in ever way thats needed. take care, Jo

The server saga and dollar stuff is here:
http://zero.hastypastry.net/forums/

Truly, I don’t know a single person who could "walk" for very long on $3,000. Lordy, I’d put it in a piggy bank and give it to him in a heartbeat. I'm not a happy camper about being let down and disrespected, but O think questioning the man's integrity is over the top.

Dr. Grohol, that was a pretty crummy thing to do, putting up a rational, empathic message just before I hit reply to post my diatribe. You popped the puff right out of it. I just hate it when that happens. :rolleyes:

Onward.

TCC

It is ironic that JL has now entered the domain of a person who takes funds and disappears, and is now the center of another "inquiry"...terribly, deeply ironic.

And the swarm of innuendo continues...some things never change.

Why not enjoy the day...utilize this new forum...and when/if BT reappears, let this JLester person account for everything. If it never comes back...hold on to the memories of those benefits that one once derived from it having been there. No one can make someone morally accountable.

Have we ever considered that something in this person's life may be keeping him from completing the task? Or, perhaps, that he has lost the desire? Or, that he HAD the desire to get BT back up, but came here, saw the silliness, and lost that desire? I could go on an on, and on with variations on a theme.

We can all agree that this isn't the desired state; we could go on and on as to the "why's of BT not being available, who has been let down, and the lack of communication" forever and ever. What does it solve, other than digging a deep whole that JLester may never be able to fully explain, resolve, or dig out of...time to move on.

I like Jo's idea of finding all the lost souls, and directing them here.

One problem solved.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14783327/

IF this is true. I hope John spends time in protecting peoples bank accounts and Identity rather than spending time worring about the selfishness posted here.

Im afraid now that its blatently obvious that there is more to this that what meets the eye..Strange..real strange

My thoughts are that this latest time out at Braintalk has to do with the trouble at Linden labs. He must be working to save his two sites there. They are connected to Braintalk in many ways. Perhaps he needs to keep Braintalk down until that is cleared up.

You know it could be a reason why he has kept the site down for so long.

The crash came in between the time they had a problem that must have alerted them and when they discovered what it was.

Maybe I got it............... maybe

GL
The "silliness" is not aimed at those that expressed their feelings of loss of support, rather, the offering of all kinds of "reasons/innuendo" for the "whys" of JL's inability to communicate.

Again, as I stated before, no one can make anyone else "do the right thing" or "want to do the right thing". That we are not experiencing the "desired state" is a given.

Rather than lament what we cannot control, take action on those things that we can...

Getting support here, is a great start. Waiting for JL to either "dig out" and communicate (as he has clearly, deeply hurt so many) is perhaps not worth the emotional effort. But, that is just my own POV...and usually not one agreed with or upon...

maybe
 

imagine how we are going to feel if it turns out that the reason he is not communicating is because he is in the hospital learning firsthand what we already know about having brain problems.

imagine how we are going to feel if the problem is that someone close to him is very ill and he is spending all his time taking care of them.

imagine how we are going to feel if we discover that the reason he has abandoned us is that something bad has happened to him.

maybe we should stop criticizing and blaming him and start praying for him.

maybe we should think about his needs for a change instead of demanding that he should take care of ours.

That's what I think. (I wish we could let everyone know about BT2, and yes, JL is very bright.)

but equally, there were people who were banned who did not understand why, and were hurt, I mean really hurt by the loss of the only community to which they belonged.

That was not good. I mean really.

So, from my point of view, watching that happen and the pain, I think he's not new to allowing people to be hurt.

In terms of the game... maybe that's all BT was to him. Maybe Second Life is an advance for him from BT.

Also remember that when BT was new he got massive notority because it was used, Used, to study interaction between people with neurological problems. That's quite different than just thinking of a way to help people...

I don't think there's anything wrong with studies... but... becoming famous that way, within a particular community, that's a big payoff. I think BT had gotten as big as it could get... and I think it was having serious problems, with all the bannings. So I think the chances of big payoffs in the future were... limited.

I just don't think something that is really good would ban people who needed the community so much. (Yes, I got banned. But I wasn't as involved as some of the people who were banned, nor am I quite a seriously affected by my illness. So to me, I missed it, but not as much as my friends missed it.)

I wasn't there as long as you -- at first, after being banned, I was going to do a forum... but then I thought that if one like BT with someone like JL running it could crash, then how could I keep one going, and I didn't want people to come to trust it and then be let down.

I had gotten the impression that crashing was very likely.

But... there are boards like the pbs one which have a lot of members and forums and posts, and they don't crash...

Or, I suppose it's possible that they simply haven't crashed while I've been around. I've only been there a couple years.

Nerve diseases are so different from measles, mumps, the kind of disease we encounter when we are kids.

I had tetanus, and now when I get stressed I have just horrible problems. I always feel as if the problems are with my muscles, but no, it's the nerves. My nerves were damaged and now stress really sets me back.

So I know how the loss of their community must have affected people for whom that was their major contact with others. To me, not posting updates (JL) and not suggesting places for people to go in the alternative, suggest something other than an altruistic intent.

Look, do you really imagine that any of these things could be true and he doesn't know anyone to make a post for him?

I was thinking, maybe I should get a break from having to feed my goldfish. I've had to think about their needs for so long. I think it's time they gave me a break. I want them to think about MY needs.

Is that reasonable?

User Name / Linda... Thanks... ((( for truly "getting it" ))). It means the world to me, personally, and I'm proud of you - for sharing how you felt, even when you read at 4 in the morn. :D.

As far as BT and L. Labs? I don't quite understand how folks come to the conclusion that something happening within L. Labs is connected with BT. L. Labs is where JL now works. (He has living expenses as do the rest of us :)). It's in the educational outreach area he works; I'm sure his job description spells it out far better than I have paraphrased, though.

As many in SL know, I've utilized much of my time (and creative abilities in SL) to raise donations for BT and also for Brigadoon. Do I think John "owes" me anything? No. Why so not? He offered an avenue that led me to deeper self-discovery. I know, not all feel or think as I do. That's okay too.

What's difficult for me is reading comments by people discussing SL whom are not members, and somehow wanting to link BT's down time to a situation that L. Labs has been honest about with its own members. Security - via SL - was compromised, and ... L. Labs got on it right away and took measures to seal off "holes" and advised its members of steps to also take. There is nothing nefarious about it.

It saddens me to think that there are members of BT whom might envision that others (also members) haven't taken efforts to "earn our keep" within SL as well.

Annie-

Well said. I couldn't agree more.

I wish he would post only to know that he is OK. However, if there is something serious going on (and what is going on at his job is not trivial), I understand why he is not posting or updating. Any good friend should.

My true friends understand if I don't get back to them right away when something serious is happening in my life. They are still there for me when the dust clears and I can join them once again.

I hope all is going to be OK with JL. I hope that BT will find its way back again. It has helped me greatly and I don't want to lose the wealth of info there. JL made a place for me to go and be heard, helped and hugged. I hope that we can do the same for him. That is what friends are for.

Just my thoughts for today.

Stacy

Bobbi you taught me a lot about Asbergers when they suspected my daughter might have it. I did a lot of research on it. I do know it's easier to understand something if take the time to learn about it. That applies to all aspects of our lives.

I really need to email you about something going on in my life and how much it keeps reminding me of you.

I love you Bobbi!!!!!!

Linda

I sent you that email.

Bravo!

Time to move on folks :)
Let's channel our energy into getting back to the vital function of caring and sharing here, and if and when BT returns, people will decide for themselves whether they feel more at home there, here or in both.

For John ........
 

I too have been visiting BT for many years - and it has been important to me in terms of being able to have a good dialogue with people who KNOW how I feel because they are going through the same thing. The whole thing about peer support is that. Yes, John did a great thing in setting it all up for us, but I am very baffled by the strangeness that surrounds this whole thing. At the same time that BT sank, John was apparently on a lecture tour that included slideshows that featured BT and his role in developing it, as well as projects like Brigadoon, as part of Linden Labs community efforts.

Now I'm no technical expert, but it was plain to see from a link in another message on this thread that the equipment that JL bought was under warranty from Apple for THREE YEARS from april 05. And its only september 06.......... The hardware should be okay, the data maybe not, but to get things up and running again it should have been a simple matter of reinstalling the software on repaired or replaced equipment. It does not take months to do, the software is not hard to put in place. So there MUST be other reasons for it not happening. If BT was a "non-profit corporation operating as a public charity" as described on the hasypastry page with John's message to us then surely there is some liability there - or maybe those words don't actually mean anything............

I am not writing this to attack John in anyway, he has given a lot of people a great deal over the years. I am however questioning his way of dealing with the members of BT - it seems neither responsible or ethical to leave so many people, many of whom have had devastating health issues affect them and their families, in this kind of limbo. I would just request respectfully that he steps up to the podium and offer an explanation to 'his' members about what has happened, instead of leaving them in the dark. And to do it here, and on the BT page where that rather old message is.

At this stage it is about re-empowering the people who made up BT, it's not about John, or who is to blame, it is about re-connecting people with THEIR support system, because it was not all about John and the work he did in setting things up, but about a whole community of very real people. Forums like these may seem as though they are 'virtual' - in reality they are not, we are just using a virtual medium, if you doubt that look at the Brigadoon people, their REAL lives are improved, in fact it is a lot less virtual than watching TV......

John, if you come here, or you have anyone looking in on your behalf, please let us know what is happening, if it is to do with the security breaches at LL then let us know, if you no longer have the time to devote to BT then let us know, if it all grew too big and it is too much then let us know, and allow a good end to the work you have done. IF you ARE going to put it all to rights, then also LET US KNOW, but please don't continue to leave people in the dark. It is not right to leave people with severe health problems in the lurch, it goes against everything you have worked for, everything you write about. The people who came to BT often had a commonality - they had questions that the medical profession would not or could not answer. You gave them the means to ask those questions, and find out some of the answers themselves. Well, we have another question now. It would be kind if you gave us an answer. And whatever that is, you would have more respect for answering it than for remaining silent.

Lindy

:) Good point. Well put. YES!

I have no bone to pick with JL, but if BT is the

(from Brigadoon)

it is inexcusable for a 'tech' to get to it, whenever. Other than that, I have no interest in what JL does or doesn't do.

If I click on a dead link once, I'll try again. 2, 3, 4 times, yes. After that? A website down for 2 months is the kiss of death online.

(((((((Dorry))))))))

Rip
 

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j1...naBirdd/bt.jpg

if you look at all the emotions that have been posted...i'd say that enough "grief" has been spent on bt. shock, sadness, loneliness, anger, remorse, sympathy, empathy...the list goes on and on. time to put it to rest. life goes on.

lol
you crack me up!!!!!!

oh...don't forget.....after most "funerals" there is a get together with food.

i have the brownies and hazelnut coffee. :p

;) thought you might like it consider this.

Oh, I LOVE Hazelnut coffee!!!!!

I'll bring coffee cake, Coffee Cake was big in my Polish family :)

Psychic much?????

((((((((Curious))))))))))

:D lots actually.

Ohhhhhh. Ohhhhhh.

Neat! (I trust it's not a worrying thing for you.)

nifty~ Someone save me a seat and some choloate anything. I'll be good!

(((((((((((KTM5665)))))))))))

me thinks we will have room enough for everyone! and of course i'll save you some choccy!!

silly monkey!! haha I love it.

::::bows to dorry::::

i had a good teacher. :p