http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/dayart...apablesuit.pdf

the first link is the copy of court papers filed.

http://www.firingsquad.com/news/news...searchid=14938



http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/47692.html


do a google search bobbi...yep. looks like a lawsuit is in the works.

My understanding, prior to getting this 'puter with VISTA installed, is that most probs. to possibly anticipate would be associated with "upgrading" the O/S to VISTA from, say, XP. At the same time, however, I'd also read that MS released a patch/patches that were alleged to address conflict "issues."

Now, as you can see, my thinking has been revised; I totally understand that probs. with programs are not restricted solely to revising the O/S and installing VISTA on an older 'puter or a 'puter with XP, etc., previously installed.

In time, I suspect, MS will have all this "stuff" ironed-out. For now, however, if someone has a computer that is working perfectly fine with XP, my suggestion is: don't install VISTA at this time. Let MS get the "kinks" worked out first.

Basically, I'd go by the adage: If it ain't broke... (and VISTA sure won't fix it; so I'd leave it alone so it continues working).

I'd like to see it that when "allegedly" newer, better, improved platforms are forced on everyone that they must also function with "backward" compatability - or so that software continues to function (as designed).

Fortunately, with the new 'puter, mine has 2GB RAM with the CPU. That has made a huge difference in running some programs (that previously ran poorly on my machines).

Good advice. I upgraded my PC as the laptop was unreliable, and chose Vista Premium. It is very good, with new features and helpful things. I don't think I would recommend you upgrade an older PC to Vista, as it is such a different program that you will have all sorts of problems getting things to work. Wait until you need a new one.
I specified that I wanted to be able to download analogue video from my camera. So they put in a video card. However, it would not pick up an audio. Tried umpteen things, phone calls, emails etc but no good. Finally read on the Internet that Vista was much more discerning with sound cards, and what worked with XP was not necessarily going to work with Vista. So I had to take the PC back to get a Vista certified sound card installed (the one they had put in wasn't certified-they just assumed it was OK as no-one else had complained). And then the audio pickup was fine.
That is the sort of problem you can expect as you are really mixing 2 technologies.

Thank You! I haven't read each page, yet, but I did do a quick glance at each. The ones about MS and "misleading," I'm sure are not applicable to what I'm "experiencing." I wasn't mislead; I had my doubts prior to when the computer was bought for me - and I think the suits are more central to people who have been trying to "upgrade" to VISTA.

This is the track, however, I was asking about . All the millions of people who have had no probs. whatsoever running software applications purchased - until, getting a new 'puter and the only option offered is: VISTA. Why VISTA includes the compatability mode options? Who knows. There is, in actuality, no option but to run the programs in VISTA mode, that is, if the programs will even install.


I started with the lower-level or less costly program installation, first. I'm afraid to see what may happen when I start with the more costly ones, such as Dreamweaver. I am so p'd right now (and given other expenses), I'm purposely waiting to even attempt installing it.

Hey Bobbi,
I tell you what, you send me a private email with an address that will accept mail to/for you and I will burn and test 5 Linux distro's
LinuxMint
SimplyMepis7.0
PCLinuxOS
ZenWalk
VectorLinux
and maybe one or two others too, Sabayon and DreamLinux or ???
and mail the CDs to whatever address you desire. Or pick out one of the CD distributors somewhere and talk to them and tell them that somebody will buy you 5 Linux distros but you don't want them to have your address and just tell me which vendor you chose and I'll see to it that they are sent to you for me.
And I'll email you 40 or 50 forum/help/WIKI sites that will help to insure your success too.....


Dang...Where to start....

>>> "To pay a premium for a computer that does not support programs intended for machines with an O/S by MS makes no sense. It's a rip-off." <<<
No, it is not a "rip off"!(well it is, but not for the reasons you claim as true)!
The "premium" you paid for was
A) not for a computer per se, other than the bloated hardware requirements that the OS of your choice required anyway
B) was for the Operating System itself, and that's all
C) the manufacturer and configuration of the hardware is completely separate and distinct from OperatingSystem you choose to purchase and click "I Agree" to.
D) NOT to "support programs intended for machines with >>>>an<<<< O/S by MS makes" but rather to "support programs intended for machines with" >>>>"MSVista"<<<< specifically. There is a big difference and too many people confuse the issues.

>>> "I'd like to see it that when "allegedly" newer, better, improved platforms are forced on everyone that they must also function with "backward" compatability - or so that software continues to function (as designed)." <<<
Nothing was forced on anybody. You voluntarily chose to purchase or use a system that had MSVista preinstalled. The minute you clicked on "I Agree" you completed your voluntary acceptance of the MS EULA terms and conditions. Whether you read it or not doesn't matter at all. You made a clear and legally binding choice.
You want "backwards compatability"? A 1952 Chevy can be made to run on 2007 pointless ignition and fuel injection systems, but it takes a lot of work, and money too. And, everything else will continue to function "as designed" once you get all the kinks ironed out.

>>> "This is the track, however, I was asking about . All the millions of people who have had no probs. whatsoever running software applications purchased - until, getting a new 'puter and the only option offered is: VISTA." <<<
Whenever anyone purchases any software from anyone, it is only professed to work on the Operating System(s) that are listed as compatible. Not an undetermined and as of now yet to be designed and engineered system that comes down the pike at some as of yet to be determined date. You had the right to and could have refused to click on "I Agree" and demanded your Operating System costs be refunded. What the "millions" purchased was software designed specifically to run on one system only, as above, getting/installing anything else was a personal choice, and who was it clicked "I Agree" anyway.....
As for options, At least 6 BSD variants, several hundred Linux variants, Solaris variants and there are quite a few others too. The CHOICE to buy a PC preloaded with MSVista and to then click on the "I Agree" was 100% the purchasers!


>>> "I upgraded my PC as the laptop was unreliable, and chose Vista Premium. It is very good, with new features and helpful things." <<<
Very good stuff huh? That would explain why: "I specified that I wanted to be able to download analogue video from my camera. So they put in a video card."
I have no idea why a new modern PC with 2Gb RAM would need a video card for such a simple process unless it was running MSVista. A decent motherboard even with shared memory for video is more than sufficient for anything non graphics intensive, which "to be able to download analogue video from my camera" is certainly not. All the modern chipsets and boards are more than sufficient for such demands.
"So I had to take the PC back to get a Vista certified sound card installed (the one they had put in wasn't certified-they just assumed it was OK as no-one else had complained). And then the audio pickup was fine."
I wouldn't consider a sound card as a requirement for any modern system period, unless you are a serious audiophile. It just plain isn't necessary, onboard sound is very good now-a-days, and has been for a while now.....

And, all y'all need to be aware that:
>>> "In time, I suspect, MS will have all this "stuff" ironed-out. For now, however, if someone has a computer that is working perfectly fine with XP, my suggestion is: don't install VISTA at this time. Let MS get the "kinks" worked out first." <<<
Oh yeah, now we're really off to dreamland. MS has already announced a permanent fix for all MSVista issues, sometime in late 2009 you will be expected to shell out another +$200 for MSWindows7.......pretty good fix, eh?

Now the biggie:
>>> "There is, in actuality, no option but to run the programs in VISTA mode, that is, if the programs will even install." <<<
Yes there is..... W.I.N.E. (a Linux "MSWin compatibility "layer") can and will run most any MSWinXP software without issue, and what issues there are, are fewer every day.
And there is Cedega as well, and more if you look around too.
Why one of the online PCmags last week even claimed that their testing shows that games written for MSWin systems actually perform better running on W.I.N.E. under Linux than the same games do under MSWin/Vista.....
Oh yeah, W.I.N.E. is free too, and MS is not happy about Linux users running MSWin stuff without issues and without having to pay for MSWin/Vista. Oh well..........

Caveat Emptor
From Wex, everyone's resource for law learning:
Latin for "Let the buyer beware." The idea that buyers take responsibility for the condition of the items they purchase and should examine them before purchase. This is especially true for items that are not covered under a strict warranty.
See, e.g. SEC v. Zandford, 535 U.S. 813 (2002).

2 really really good reasons:

Q) who/what is the largest Linux user on planet earth?
A) Google, everytime you go to google, you are using a Linux operating system runnig on regular everyday available low cost "common" and "generic" hardware scaling from single user desktop PCs to the worlds largest most usage intensive server farms in the world.

Q) who/what is the world's number 2 Linux user on planet earth?
A) That would be the National Security Agency. You know, you taxpayer supported super duper top secret spy agency. So confident in it are they that they even publish their own version of Linux for secure and safe computer use for all. It's called "Security Enhance Linux"
What? You think I'm making this up?
http://www.nsa.gov/selinux/

If those two are not good enough reasons, maybe the US Army working moving 100% of its' systems from hand-helds to weapons systems to mainframes to a Linux OS is?

OK, preacher man is done for the day, it's nice outside, and besides, I have dogs that need playing with....

Y'all HAGD!

I think what we have here is - to paraphrase Cool Hand Luke - a failure to communicate.

A) I didn't but the computer, as I have stated more than once. It was a gift.

B) I've not inquired about replacing VISTA with Linux.

C) I'm not soliciting people to send me free items or trying to arrange for items to arrive at no cost to me.

D) I thought I was in a support forum, not one where I'm patronized: "....Oh yeah, now we're really off to dreamland...."


Thank you for the offer, but no thanks.

I do own Linux software. How idiotic of me, though, huh, to have forgotten that I purchased it from RedHat - when I was going to install it on an old PC, but, instead, dumb again, I gutted it and set it up for a friend's son. Dang, I must be a total fool.

I'm sorry I even bothered.

I'm not a fan of the "Redmond mafia" per se. But I am glad that I stuck with XP. Even though I sometimes get nostalgic for 3.1 where you could actually go to the DOS command and make changes. Ah...the good old days!

I'm not going to get into a technical argument here, just will say that the onboard sound was unable to work with Vista. I agree that Vista should be able to download analoge video-poor effort that it can't. XP could.