Through Google, I came upon this forum. Specifically a thread about suboxone used as a last resort for treatment-resistant depression. Suboxone is usually prescribed for opiate dependence...as a maintenance therapy...but there have been a few cases where it was prescribed for depression.

I recently was prescribed suboxone and found it to be life changing. When I read the thread on this forum I was motivated to post myself. Of course, being an opioid, there is controversy and legal muddy water. Suboxone may be controversial as a depression treatment, but it IS used as such in some cases, and should at least be discussed openly. I wanted to start my own thread to get a good discussion going.

I was prompted to post after reading a poster who adamantly defended suboxone's use as an anti-depressant. His post was followed by some agreement and some strong disagreement. Both responses make sense...this isn't a simple issue. I simply want to give my take on it all for anyone who might find it helpful. Knowledge is power, right? Below is a snippet of the post that defended suboxone's use as an anti-depressant, followed by my own post. I look forward to discussing this further on this excellent forum!

I registered on this forum specifically to post in this thread. I'll try to make this brief(yeah right...I cannot do that!), but I hope my post will be read by people in the future and will help those who need it. FYI: I'm a 28 year old white male in otherwise good health. I'm a bit of an introvert and tend to lose myself in my creative pursuits(art, music, writing) more than anything else. That's me in a teeny little nutshell.

So, to cut to the chase, I've been depressed for some time now. Many years. Infact, the more I think about it, this has been something I've had to deal with my whole life. It occurs to me that my brain simply cannot handle life the way a "normal" brain can. Depression is most certainly a disease. However, it may not "flare up" until you are exposed to the right stimulus. Depression, rather than being a disease you "catch" instead seems to be a condition one is born with...a condition that will make itself known when the right triggers come along. If you can manage to avoid such triggers all your life, you could conceivably never experience depression symptoms despite having a brain susceptible to depression.

Well, the right concoction of triggers entered into my life, and the tide turned. Depression has robbed me of years of happy meaningful living. I've learned valuable coping techniques and I definitely do not believe there is a magic pill for this debilitating disease. Any effective treatment will be a mixture of several things. However, medication CAN help. I went far too long before giving into that. I tried hard to beat my depression without trying medication...and after a while I simply could not do it any longer.

So, I finally made an appointment with a local doctor. Immediately I was prescribed Paxil. Gave it an honest try...with zero results. It did absolutely nothing. That was disappointing. My next attempt was with Wellbutrin. Better, but still no cigar. It seemed to relieve depressive symptoms by, say, 10%. Hardly worth it. Next, I tried the OTC natural route. I started taking 5-HTP at night and L-Tyrosine in the morning. This...helped...but just a bit. Still, better than the prescription meds. The plus was that these amino acids are inexpensive, quite natural(compared to rather synthetic feeling SSRIs and MAORIs), and non-addictive(huge plus). I highly highly highly recommend anyone suffering from depression give the 5-HTP/L-Tyrosine method a try. There's plenty of info online on how to administer doses. It seems to have helped many people to an extraordinary degree. It didn't help me AS MUCH as most people, but it helped. Again, before giving any prescription meds a try, give this a chance! It could be the answer you're looking for and you won't need to do anything else.

Anyway, sadly the 5-HTP/L-Tyrosine simply didn't cut it for me. I don't want to steer people away from this combo as it seems to be ridiculously effective for many...and it's rather safe. So, please, try it first! OK, enough preaching. On to my own story...

I continued my downward spiral. Marijuana, when I can obtain it, has helped IMMENSELY with my depression. If it were only legal, I would have had a much much happier and healthier time in my 20s. It is flat out insane to me that it is an illegal drug. Such a shame. Not only is it a wonderful anti-depressant, but the empathetic, creative, and spiritual elements make it something you simply must try if you want a true taste of what the human experience can offer. But....it is illegal. And, I got caught. Yep, I had a friend over to write some music. We smoked beforehand, as musicians often do, and soon enough the cops were knocking at the door. They were at my apartment complex on an entirely unrelated call and were simply checking each apartment to make sure the residents were ok. We were quite OK, but they smelled the smoke, and basically barged in immediately, trashed my apartment, threw furniture over, and ransacked my place looking for the marijuana. They found it. I went to jail and was later sentenced to 15 days in jail. Well...that sure helped my depression. :P After getting out of jail I became horribly depressed. I'm a rather sensitive soul and jail was simply NOT a place conducive to my well being. I took it way too hard. Looking back on it now, I'm glad I had the experience. It taught me alot about a side of life I previously knew little of, but, at the time, I took it hard.

I began drinking heavily and was soon suicidal for the first time in my life. Soon after, I lost my job due to the economic crash of winter 2009. I lost my apartment and moved back in with my parents at 27. Things went from bad to worse, partly spurred on by my awful alcohol consumption. I was on probation after the marijuana incident and subsequently turned to alcohol to try and achieve the well-being that marijuana had given me since marijuana shows up in drug tests and alcohol...doesn't. Sadly, alcohol aggravated my depression to an extreme degree. One morning it all got to be too much and I was committed to kill myself. I look back on this morning with great sadness. I came so close to accidentally stabbing myself through the throat with a large butcher knife. My parents had to wrestle me to the ground. I caused them so much pain that morning...it hurts to think about it even now. After they got the knife away from me, they called the cops. When the cops showed up I was told I had to be put on mandatory 72 hour suicide watch at the local mental hospital. That was a fun day... :/

After I was released, I was DE-PRESSED as all hell. I simply lost the will to live. I simply couldn't understand why I felt SO bad. I had lost alot in life, yet I still had a life that 80% of the world would be envious of. Why did I feel so miserable? I knew something was wrong, chemically, in my brain. This problem simply went beyond a case of the blues. I had some sort of chemical imbalance or deficiency. Yet, I had tried nearly everything I could think of.

So....I got online, for the umpteenth time, to search out a cure. And I randomly stumbled upon suboxone. I knew a few friends who used it as opiate-detox/maintenance and they raved about it. It saved their life, albeit for a different reason than my life needed saving. It seemed to be a miracle drug in the opiate community. I had tried hydrocodone once, recreationally, and found it to be quite weak and nothing to write home about. I'm glad I never tried the harder opiates...I'm sure my depressive brain would have latched on to that and I'd have much bigger problems today than depression.

Suboxone seemed interesting. There were anecdotal reports of it being an effective depression therapy for SSRI/MAORI-resistant patients. It wasn't prescribed as such by hardly anyone, but the few who did use it for depression had good things to say. So, I decided I must give it a try. The hard part now would be to fake opiate withdrawal so I could get a prescription. I stayed awake for 2 nights straight...I began yawning constantly, was bleary eyed, my nose started running, and I was achy all over. Insomnia seemed to mimic opiate withdrawal quite nicely. Next, I went in for my appointment with the suboxone doctor. He bought my story easily. I looked miserable. I felt somewhat guilty faking an addiction, but it was either this, or suicide. I knew that. I HAD to do something...or risk loosing my life.

I was given a prescription. The downside? The pills are EXPENSIVE! About $7 for one 8mg pill. Then again, suicide has it's own costs, doesn't it?

Most addicts are prescribed 8 to 16mg a day. Some even go as high as 32mg a day! An opiate-naive individual will get quite high from suboxone, using as little as 2mg. I decided to start by taking a measly .5mg. That's right...1/16th of the pill. Luckily, this made the extreme price a bit easier to swallow. I could make one pill last 16 days!

I took my first dose...and waited. About 30 minutes after putting it under my tongue, I felt....ok. Kind of...good. I had energy I hadn't had in years. Depression leaves you feeling weary and worn, mentally and physically. The suboxone gave me a noticeable boost, mentally and physically. I didn't feel high by any means. I just felt good. I felt comfortable in my body, in my own skin. I also felt less socially anxious. I started chatting up my mom and felt quite good about life in general. My problems didn't melt away or disappear...BUT, for the first time in AGES they felt...manageable. Life didn't feel so overwhelming and bleak. You know when the sky is overcast and gray...and then the sun peaks out and everything gets a bit lighter and warms up a bit? It felt like that.

I was thrilled. This tiny crumb of a pill changed everything. AND...it lasted forever. The feeling lingered into next morning, at which time I could notice my usual heavy depressive feelings resume a bit. In all, this .5mg dose lasted me a good 24 hour period. And I wasn't high at all. Just normal...what I assume normal must be like.

I've been using suboxone like this now for about 6 months. IT SAVED MY LIFE. I now use about 1mg a day. This simply seems to be the most effective dose. I don't feel any need to increase it ever. I have tried, out of curiosity, about 4mg at once. And this is where a word of caution is needed. Suboxone IS an opioid. It's not heroin by any means, BUT a 4mg dose WILL get you high. It was a rather enjoyable high too. I felt super energetic. I nice mix of that opiated lull mixed with a speedy energetic buzz. I wanted to talk to everyone in sight, was happy as could be, and thought cleaning the entire house sounded like the most fun I could possibly have. I can definitely see where habitual recreational use could turn into a problem. So...there's your caution. That IS indeed a downside...BUT, I simply have the will power to use this only for what I need it for...as an anti-depressant, using 1mg a day. The chaos of my past has taught me well...addiction is NOT worth the trouble.

A word on addiction, while on the subject....Suboxone is addictive. No way around that. After 5 months of daily use, I decided to stop cold turkey just to see what would happen. Sure enough, I went into withdrawal. Was it horrible? Not at all. Was it really uncomfortable? Yep. It kicks in about 2 days after your last dose, gets worse for about a week, and then gets better. I got back on it after that week. I now know that should I ever need to get off this, I can. At 1mg/day that is. Any more and I imagine the withdrawal could be a hell in it's own right. This is a drug that demands will power! If you don't have the necessary will power, be careful. Of course, as other posters have stated correctly, depression itself is dangerous and most prescription depression meds are quite addictive. Personally, I'm totally fine with the moderate addiction I have to 1mg suboxone. It's a trade-off that makes sense compared to the depression hell I've suffered through long enough.

I hope this post(remember I said I'd keep it short? lol) helps someone...even just one person. Suboxone is not easy to get prescribed. I did my homework beforehand. Many doctors will drug test you to make sure you do indeed have opiates in your system....so be forewarned. Look up how long it takes certain opiates to leave your system so that when your urine test shows up clean, you have a good story about how long your withdrawal has been going on for. And research opiate withdrawal symptoms. It won't be easy. It requires some oscar-worthy acting. I feel a bit uneasy advising anyone to lie to get an opioid....BUT, it saved my life. So...I'm a bit biased.

BEFORE YOU EVEN THINK ABOUT USING SUBOXONE FOR DEPRESSION.... Give 5-HTP/L-Tyrosine an honest try for a few weeks. Also...exercise! Eat right! Drink alot of water! Get enough sleep! I cannot recommend that enough. When you're depressed, that advice sounds petty, I know. I was there. I'd think "Exercise?? Sorry...but my depression is too strong to be helped by mere exercise." Don't be stubborn...a healthy diet, sleeping habits, and lifestyle will do more to combat depression than even suboxone. It took getting on suboxone for me to get the willpower to finally give those things a try...and when I finally did, I wished I had tried such simple(and free) remedies much sooner. Now, combined with a low-dose suboxone regimen, I'm FINALLY living the life I was meant to live. I'm balanced, happy, and life is meaningful.

My life has even taken on a spiritual dimension. When depressed, I was a super cynic. I hated the police(for obvious reasons) and hated religion. I still do to some extent lol...BUT, I've learned to put away hate. Righteous anger? Sure. But...no more hate. I'm not religious by any means, but not being depressed has allowed me to develop my spiritual/aesthetic/social/creative life in a way that has allowed me to do more than just survive...I now can FLOURISH! Life is no longer just about getting by and not dying...it's about seizing on my potential to live a satisfying, meaningful, and joyful human experience.

I'm SO grateful to suboxone. That little orange stop sign shaped pill saved my life. I would be dead and rotting in the ground right NOW if it hadn't been for this left-field anti-depressant. I hope the medical community soon recognizes the benefits of this and gets over their opiate phobias. Sure, opiates aren't anything to prescribe like candy...but for patients who face certain death due to their depression, it can help.

I hope anyone who suffered through reading this mini novel finds it useful. I hope it may inspire someone in the depths of suicidal depression to consider a radical alternative that requires some work on your part to obtain. AND...I hope no one uses my story as an excuse to use suboxone, or any other opiate, as their first line of defense. Suboxone is a miracle drug for many....BUT, it should be the last thing you try, when all else has failed. Otherwise, I can almost guarantee, it will hurt you more than help. It is a very potent, long acting, addictive in moderate doses, opiate. Don't take it lightly, please.

Cheers!

Suboxone and all opiates like Methadone, and Morphine for example help depression, this is what my doctor told me after I had given up opiates for 1 year 4 months, and wanted my energy, life, motivation, interests..the list goes on back.
I suppose there was always the element of some kind of chemical imbalance that made me feel not quite right, never thought, or more to the point realised it was depression I had, and was dealing, or at least trying to deal with. I think it was the depression that made me abuse drugs, all kinds you name it I have probably done it, and it was with opiates I felt most normal, stable, level headed. So after realising the dangers and addictive nature of opiates I tried to get off them, was put on Methadone to start ( 2 years ) and after that Suboxone (3 years ) all the time trying to, Wanting to just feel normal without drugs without these evil opiates, well, I come off 24mg of Suboxone cold turkey, 1 month of feeling pretty ratty, but it wasn't as painfull as some say (different people different opinions) and after a good 5 months of being fully clean slipped back into depression,these "evil" opiates didn't seem so bad after all, or at least compared to the depressed state I was in, everything became very bleak, my day would consist of working coming home and going to bed, and the process would start again, definately one of the signs of depression, anyway I went back to the clinic I was getting my Suboxone from and luckly I was still active on there system so there was no red tape and rings to jump through, I had other illegal drugs in my system when they gave me the mandatory drug test, but no opiates, the doctor put me back on Suboxone and my life has returned, no more illegal drugs to try to fix myself (or self medicate as they say) I have taken up all my old intrests again, I don't go straight to bed when I finish work, i'm happy again not because i'm high, but because the Suboxone WORKS, i'm only on 8 mg opposed to the 24mg, 8mg is enough to keep me out of that dark place.
To sum it up opiates DO help with depression better that ANY anti- depressant the doctors have given me, they ARE addictive, massive downside, but given/prescribed in the correct manner ie enough to keep depression at bay, and not get you high they WORK, something maybe the pharmaceutical companies should look at, maybe putting together some kind of opiate drug that does away with the additive qualities, and treats depression the way opiates seem to do is the key.
Rubysun28 mentioned a very valid point, don't get on it without exploring all options ie 5-HTP/L-Tyrosine, for depression resistant peoples, well some of us have found the answer, it has a cost (financially, and addictively) but compared to depression, well there is no comparison, beesage.

Hello. I appreciate your post. I do think there is an as yet poorly researched role for opiates and in particular Suboxone (buprenorphine) in the treatment of mood disorders. Can I make one suggestion though? One thing that the practice of psychiatry has taught me is that every brain is different. You said that "4 mg. of Suboxone will get YOU high". The reality is that 4 mg. of Suboxone got you high but it would probably not get the average opioid dependent person high at all. Thanks.

I was lucky enough to find a doctor that let me try suboxone for my depression, over many many years I had tried everything else, with nothing but bad results. To my surprise suboxone really helped me. I will continue to try and improve my brain chemistry so that I won't need anything for depression and I am getting close, but am just not quite there yet.

Hi, Rubysun, I wish I was here in 2011 when you wrote this post. Do you have an update on how you're doing with Suboxone and depression? I'm on Suboxone and have been for the past four years for depression, but first it was for drug use. I was taking pain pills to ease my depression and ended up addicted. I searched and searched for help for my addiction and one day I heard about Suboxone. Suboxone makes me feel alive and every day is almost a good day and that's a lot coming from a person who lost their smile almost a decade ago. I'm so thankful for Suboxone. If anyone out there has depression and everything else failed, I'd say, why stay depressed? Go to a doctor that is licensed to prescribe this medication and do what you have to to get on this med. It saved my life. But do remember, start out at a low dose like Ruby, even if your doctor starts you out on 16 mg a day because that's what is recommended for drug users.

What a relief to read about others who have gone through what I have for most of my adult life.
I am a 60 year old male. I have suffered from depression for all of my adult life, however though of it as just a chemical imbalance. I treated it with a life of living on opiods. Opiods helped, but I always felt medicated. 10 years ago, I decided to address my depression & started to see a long list of physciatrists. Most were incompetent & all wanted to load me up with drugs. All of the anti-depressants made me feel terrible. With that theory out the door, I decided to self medicate myself again. This time I found Ambien, which seemed to help. I abused Ambien & eventually wound up in a rehab center. Once out & doing out patient treatment, I found an outpatient coordinator who suggested I try Suboxone. After a few days of taken Suboxone, I found for the 1st time in 40 years that I felt "normal". No more depression, nor anxiety, nor lack of confidence. Life was good. My Suboxone doctor, who happens to be one of those, slam, bam, thank you maam $ type doctor, isn't buying into my theory.
After reading some of these posts, some which mirror my life, I feel so much better. I now don't feel like a druggie like I was brain washed to think when in rehab.
God Bless

I too was in the first year "white cloud" Suboxone gives you. I often called it a "god send" and my miracle. However, after the first year, all the good feelings have left and I know find myself worse off than before I went on it. I'm severely depressed, tired and cannot just quit taking it because of withdrawal. Suboxone, like any other opiate, creates tolerance. After you are on any opiate for awhile, you brain becomes tolerant and it quits working as well. I have been to enough forums and heard the same story as mine, over and over again. I am finally really believing what those Yogis, AAs all said. The only way to stay soberer not be depressed is to deal with the underlying issues, pray, meditate, lots of exercise and healthy diet. Every person that I know that followed that path, got well and stayed well, even improving every year. Maybe one day I will finally love myself enough to quit punishing myself and finding any way out except the right one?

I started on Suboxone 2 days ago, and the difference has been night and day. I was prescribed Suboxone for a long-standing opiate/benzo/sedative addiction history; although I had been clean for about a month, they still put me on Suboxone because my cravings were horrendous. I had previously been clean for over 2 years but my cravings never got better and I finally gave in. My counselor suggested Suboxone based on my past history of abuse and my level of cravings. Here's where things get interesting...I also have a life-time history of depression and anxiety...I got hooked on benzos because antidepressants never worked for me. I've tried almost every antidepressant out there..Paxil, Prozac, Trileptal, Lamictal, Wellbutrin, Pristiq, Abilify, Nortriptyline, etc etc etc. Nothing has ever worked except for the benzos, but of course that is out of the question because I'm an addict and I take way too much of them. Well, my first dose of Suboxone was two days ago, and not only are my cravings gone, but I am happier than I have ever been, while clean or using. I feel like a new person. It's like somebody gave me a shot of happy juice. I can't believe the difference!!! I thought this was just because I'm not craving anymore... but I never felt like this when I was using either...I was still depressed, but I was too messed up to really care. So, it can't be that Suboxone is making me high, because I never felt like this in the past when I was high...I didn't know what to think so I started searching on the internet on Suboxone side-effects and found this thread on Suboxone use for refractory depression....Can it really be that I have found something that will help my cravings AND my depression in one fell swoop??? I had stopped believing in God long ago, because the daily pain of living with addiction and depression had killed any belief that there was a benevolent loving being who loved me, but....this is enough to rekindle even my lost faith.

My problem/question/issue is this...the dose they prescribed me is way too high...I work about 30 hours a week and I go to school full-time so I can't be too sedated. He started me out on 10 mg the first day, then 12 mg for 2 days, and now 16 mg a day. I haven't been able to do a lot of homework or reading, even on 8 mg a day. I decided to only take 4 mg at night. What's the big deal right? I should just call the doctor and tell them I need a lower dose, no big deal. But...I already know I feel better than I have ever felt in my life - I already know I never want to stop taking this medication. But...I also know this addiction doctor, while he might keep me on it for months or even years, will probably not keep me on it for the long-term. So, I am already planning on stockpiling my extra medication so that when the time comes I'll have reserves. But today, at my weekly meeting, my counselor tells me that I have to bring in the empty wrappers. Two, she mentions that the urine test will show if I'm taking the right dose.

So, my first question is - will the Suboxone be damaged/inactivated if I keep the sublingual films in a baggie so I can bring in the empty wrappers? Two, does the urine test really show the "level" of the bup? I thought it was just positive or negative. It's so weird that, after years of using more than prescribed, I'm now trying to find a way to get away with using less than prescribed!!

Any help you can provide is much appreciated.

I know u wrote this a couple of years ago but I have to say that what u wrote really made me feel a lot better cause when u have something like this u feel like the only person in the world and when I tried this mix together I was like omg could this be true!!! I actually feel happy and a lot less depressed it was too good to be true!! But my problem is convincing my psy doctor!!! i have tried every antidepressant! i seriously want to thank u!!!!


srdr

I've been searching the internet, and there is ample evidence EVERYWHERE that Suboxone/ Subutex (Buprenorphine) works wonders for Depression. I have been taking it on and off for a few years - I never take it more than a few times a month because if I take more than that, it doesn't work. Plus, I don't want to end up in an ER with a broken bone and pain medication doesn't work. But yes, I swear it's a conspiracy. I don't think pharmaceutical companies want people to know about this because they want you to stay hooked on their tranquilizers (Benzodiazepines) and anti Depressants (SSRIs, SNRIs) for life. If you kept a pill around for once in a great while, when you feel truly awful - or one you could take for a week and feel better for a few months, how much money would they or your doctor make off of you? Not much. So, these doctors will continue to dope us up with anti depressants and tranquilizers. I'm currently hooked on Klonopin (2.5 mg a day for 3 years) and Effexor (150 mg for nearly 2 years) and they don't help much at all. Bupe (Suboxone, or Subutex) helps every time, but I wouldn't take it every single day unless I was in horrible pain, or if I was suicidal without it. You will become addicted and then what's the point - you're in the same boat you were in when you took the other garbage the doctor gave you. BTW, I have never been as addicted to anything as I have Effexor (Venlafaxine, An SSRI - that's a serotonin/ norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor). I had TRD (Treatment Resistant Depression) and I swear I wish I never got hold of this horrible drug. THe side effects are killing my relationship (no sex life, whatsoever), and if I miss one dose, my head is in horrible pain, I'm dizzy, nauseous, and horribly depressed. This has been my experience. Your mileage may vary. However, as far as Buprenorphine goes, I have always found it to be a godsend - but as I said I wouldn't dare take it more than once in a great while. I do think the doctors are starting to prescribe it for Depression because - it works - but I doubt it would work for long if you're taking it every day for depression. You want that euphoria, and after about a week or so, that goes away. I'm very angry with the whole psychiatric profession (I still thank them for trying) for getting me hooked on anti-depressants and NEVER TELLING ME THEY ARE HORRIBLY ADDICTIVE. Anyway, Buprenorphine works. I believe there was a study (only 1) done on people who took low doses for a week, and the vast majority were greatly improved - however a week is only a week. I wouldn't want to take this long term, but I'm sure there are some who do. If you do, chime in. Please.