I'm not too sure how much swearing Doc John allows but let's just say I would like to say a whole lot of those words.

I keep trying to type and I keep deleting it - I just can't get it right. Just know I care and I'm sorry and sometimes family sucks.

Greta,
I'm terribly sorry to hear about your brother. I must say that is an odd way to find out, but we all have our family "stuff" to deal with. I wouldn't let it stop me from having a baby. Unfortunately, physiologically, I haven't been able to hold onto a pregnancy. I don't think it has a thing to do with the MS.

Sarah,
I don't mean to get pushy, but if what you are saying is indeed true, you and several Neurologists would be VERY WEALTHY and FAMOUS!!! The symptoms of MS and Lyme's may overlap, however it is NOT the same disease.

WOW! Greta,

What a way to find you have MS and to have such a strong family history of MS. It was only 8 years ago that neuros universally thought there was NO linkage of MS in families. Surprise! Another revelation we patients taught the almighty neuro community.

I don't think you should worry about having children and them being affected by the MS gene. Probably by the time they would even get any type of diagnosis there very well be a cure for it through stem cell research or genetic engineering. Don't let this stop you from the joy of having children. They are such a blessing..................and challenge!:rolleyes:

Hi Greta,

I'm sorry your brother is the way that he is... But you're fabulous. :hug: Sorry that MS seems to be running in your family. :(

That being said, I think you and your DH would be fabulous parents and hope you can have a baby. The treatment for MS has advanced so much, and you've done very well with it so far not having any attacks and such.

Whatever happens, I wish you the best, and try not to fret over your NSDB (not so dear brother). Sometimes I think there's one in every family.

Hi Greta, It seems that there is one in every family that causes problems.
Sorry to hear that he has ms. Would not wish that on anyone no matter what their attitudes are.

Don't let family matters and the ms stop you from having children.

I have two wonderful children. There are so many women out there that
have ms and they went and had children. That is the greatest gift that God
can give to you. There are a couple of relatives in my family that have ms.

That did not stop us from having children. Go for it. It will make you and your husband two very happy people.

Joyce :hug:

Greta & sideways to Chris-
 

Greta, if you grew up in CT and HAD Lyme and now have MS I would bet my life you still have Lyme. Seriously. We have had so many people come to our support group with tick bites who went on to develop MS. And they got better with longterm IV Rocephin. Lyme tends to go into REMISSION, not cure. It OFTEN comes back in a later stage- that is why they say "Tertiary Lyme disease" or "secondary stage Lyme". Secondary stage Lyme tends to be firbomyalgia or CFS. Tertiary can be MS. It often goes away completely and comes back in a later, more serious manifestation.

Sideways to Chris, nope, I will never be wealthy. When I did have money, I gave it all away!*)!*! I don't want to be wealthy- on the other hand, would be nice not to be poor but that's ok, too, I am rich with friends and life. And cats. And a pygmy goat*)! And human kids, two girls, Evan & Isadora*_!!

Anyway, I know, sounds like I am a crazy Lymie. That's okay. This one neurologist Patricia Coyle once told a MS Lymie acquaintance of mine,

"The only differential between Lyme & MS is response to treatment."

And since the insurance company standard treatment is 30 days, I would have been diagnsoed MS or Parkinsons I am sure! Because I did not respond to Lyme treatemtn until 18 months in!!! 1 year of orals- and 9 months of IV total- but thank god I hung in there because I am 100% symptom free today. (And let me say that Parkinsons is rarely rarely Lyme, I just happen to be one of the lucky (not!) 2% of Lymies with Parkinsonian features).

There is an investigation by CT Attorney General Richard Blumenthal into a cover-up by mainstream researchers of the true nature of Lyme. Sounds Plum island, I know, but it's true. Do a Google news search with "Richard Blumenthal" and "Lyme disease" if you doubt me*)!!

Anyway, it's a paradigm shift. I know this young Lymie activist named Victoria, she is only 15 (or 16? 15 I think!) and has the seizures version of Lyme, and she wrote to me once, "It is not a question of IF, it is a question of WHEN." It will happen. I know, I sound preposterous. I don't think ALL other diseases are often Lyme at all, but MS, yes, I do. Based on being a support group leader for 8 years now and having multiple people get Lyme and then get MS and then get betetr with IV abx, and we have a local primary care doc, bless him, who rediagnoses his MS patients as Lyme, and they have gotten better, too!

This study by
Brorson & Brorson
found spirochetal cysts in
10 out of 10 MS patients-

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...ubmed_RVDocSum

This study also shows a strong link in MS patients:
http://www.aaem.pl/pdf/aaem0024.htm

There are many many abstracts that show they are the same on MRI. And Lyme is negative 80% of the time in LPs.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9...ubmed_RVDocSum

QUOTE:
It is widely accepted that magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) findings are not totally specific for the diagnosis of multiple sclerosis. White matter lesions that mimic those of multiple sclerosis may be detected in both normal volunteers and patients harbouring different diseases. Virtually all the characteristic features of multiple sclerosis are sometimes encountered in other conditions affecting predominantly the white matter. Different conditions such as vasculitis, subcortical atherosclerotic leukoencephalopathy, Lyme disease, or acute disseminated encephalomyelitis can be virtually indistinguishable from multiple sclerosis on conventional MR images. UNQUOTE

Here's why Lyme is negative in spinals- because it goes into cystic form
which reads as negative, does not react same way with fluids-

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9...ubmed_RVDocSum

ANyway, thank you for not being mean although we disagree. There is technically no difference between MS & Lyme. There is more than crossover, there is identical manifestation, virtually not a single thing MS does that Lyme doesn't. If you go to this page and look at the maps, you will notice
there is something VERY interesting about them- these are the Lyme maps of mortality- Lyme deaths- and the MS maps- of MS deaths- please, anyone here can go ahead and say, "Sarah, you are a whacko Lymie!" but FIRST
please, pleease, pleeeease, just GO HERE and LOOK at the MAPS!!!! Just LOOK at the maps!!! Please!!! Go to this link & scroll down & just LOOK!!!

http://www.canlyme.com/megan_geostat...analysis2.html

Then you can see why I think what I do, ok? Seriously!!! Megan Blewett is at Harvard and a great researcher and I have a lot of respect for her work.

And lastly, look at this poor guy!!! I was searching the old John Hopkins autopsy database and came across this guy- just 40 years old!!! You think he died of MS, fine, but every single thing he had could have been Lyme-
and he would have lived!!! He would have lived. He had POSITIVE Lyme serology and it was ignored. He would have lived.
http://www.angelfire.com/planet/lymedisease/2/7.html

My mainstream docs were letting me get progressively weaker with "a multi-system progressive neurological disease triggered by post Lyme Syndrome" as they put it. They let me devleop a movement disorder, chorea with athetosis.
They let me get IBS and FMS and weaker and fall. They let me get numb from my knees down to where I could not feel my feet!!! And that all went away with Lyme treatment- they could have helped me- but they were stuck in their way of thinking-

Greta- I would really urge you to see an LLMD, a Lyme Literate MD!!!
Seriously,
Sincerely,
Sarah

Hi Gret~~~ Yikes, that's disturbing news. Too bad your bro didn't have the you know what's to call you all in person. Just think of how much help you could have been to him.

I'm just glad that you are doing ok. Besides, WE is your family!!

That's not a bet I want to win!;)


that's ok - you sound like a really nice crazy person:D


This is why I don't really have much doubt Sarah, you see, I responded brilliantly to treatment with interferon. If it were lyme causing lesions and O-bands in my spinal fluid, an interferon would do nothing. I started a DMD almost 5 years ago and since then, there have been no changes to my MRI (except some lesions disappearing), no enhancements, no exacerbations, no symptoms, no nothing. I don't consider it a coincidence that my MRI stopped changing as soon as I started an interferon. Additionally, I changed my diet to one advocated for MS, and I believe that's helped to slow it down as well. In truth, I've never actually had an MS symptom. My lesions are in silent parts of the brain.

When I was treated for Lyme 18 years ago, it was figured out within 3 weeks of getting the bite (yes, I know exactly when and where I picked up a tick even without getting a bullseye). They treated me with abx for 3 weeks and after recovering, I've never had a problem since. I was lucky that it was figured out so quickly and treated.

I would kill to have lyme instead. I would love to take some abx and never have to worry about MS again. Unfortunately, the facts don't support lyme for me. I know you mean well, but some people really do have MS.

Greta, You have never had an MS symptom? Wow, that's amazing. What sent you to the Doc to be tested, in the first place?

You are a true testimonial for early, early treatment..:)

She wanted to be like Laurel and Me! LOL!

:p