anticholinergic part 2

As only gathering facts - not a theory ....just questions and and inclination to find out exactly what is going on there. going to post facts as far as i can understand. it;s at NMDA receptors that I get lost but i usually get the drift eventually One knot in my stomach is designated to get to the bottom of cholinergic research. which is a line of words that all start with A... anyone agree A words all alike are assinine arggghhhh!

I can't resist giving this cholinergic dig a try, because it's where i am exactly and i have good friiends in the same place. but if any readers can see where I am in error or way behind or mistaken,, why would you [ understander of what i'm asking completely, who are open to what i am just grasping. ] - not speak up and set me straight? i don't venture too far into the biologic chemistry and it's not new thinking?

Drug developers are in a different mindset, many if them and researchers, cetainly big pharma , lobbyists , and even the president are taken in by the same wrong thinking , based on dollars. if we didn't have the stem cell breach that i am sure no one wants to talk about - because how divided this nation is - after listening to bush is stupid and how stupid anyone is to think embryos are people , etc ec for eight years now people freak out if you mention the administration when our health care and economy are at risk.

The future is in Europe.

we had best get it together and recognize
"the urgency of now" MLK

questions:

is this producing anything?
http://www.michaeljfox.org/research_...s_3.cfm?ID=454

also trying to understand this one its's over my head, altho it does mention blocking the excitatory effects of actetylcholine-not sure what that means - it is classified as a cholinesterase inhibitor-not what i see any evidence of pwp needing yet
http://www.pdonlineresearch.org/reso...ease-eliprodil

no results reported
http://clinicaltrials.gov/archive/NC...979/2008_03_03

i have found nothing on better anticholinergic drugs like artane yet they are saying pd dementia also is low in acetylcholine but why hasn't one person come into the forum and said that? we know that anticholinergic drugs make you cognitively out of it -like cogentin. . i understand that lowering acetylcholine causes cognition interference but where is the evidence that we are low in acetylocholine?

I'm not convinced these drugs are for pd
What defines pd dementia ? i am starting to dislike that term.

Can someone explain this study?

About Fipamezole

Fipamezole is an antagonist of the adrenergic alpha-2 receptor with a novel mode of action in the treatment of Dyskinesia in Parkinson's Disease. The rationale behind the development of fipamezole is to increase noradrenergic release in certain areas of the brain, resulting in rebalancing of the distorted brain network and potentially alleviating symptoms of advanced Parkinson's disease such as dyskinesia, motor fluctuations, orthostatic hypotension and cognitive impairment without exacerbating the underlying Parkinsonian features of the disease. In a recent Phase IIb study, Santhera demonstrated that JP-1730/fipamezole has the potential to reduce Dyskinesia in Parkinson's Disease with the study results also suggesting that the drug has the potential to reduce "off time" and improve cognitive function. Furthermore, the reduction in dyskinesia was found to be strongly correlated with the investigator's clinical global impression of improvement in overall condition.

http://clinicaltrials.gov/show/NCT00767091

thank you

Paula -

you asked: why hasn't one personcome into the forumandsaid that.we know that anticholinergic drugsmake youcognitivelyout of it

see this thread started by olsen in October:

anticholinergic drugs and cognitive decline in PD

http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/sh...rgic+cognition

Paula,

Cognitive decline and dementia in PD and AD are entirely two distinct entities with different biochemical profiles. NOT ONE of us should be offered an anti-dementia drug prescribed for AD patients!

Three things (well, four actually- see my fipamezole post in clinical trials; good news on this)

Neuropsychiatric differences between Parkinson's disease with dementia and Alzheimer's disease.
Int J Geriatr Psychiatry. 2001 Feb;16(2):184-91.
Aarsland D, Cummings JL, Larsen JP.

OBJECTIVE: To compare the profile of neuropsychiatric symptoms in patients with Parkinson's disease with dementia (PDD) and patients with Alzheimer's disease (AD)... CONCLUSIONS: Neuropsychiatric symptoms are common and severe in patients with PDD, with important implications for the management of these patients. AD and PDD patients have different neuropsychiatric profiles, suggesting different underlying mechanisms. Cognitive impairment, psychopathology, and motor features progress independently in PDD patients Copyright 2001 John Wiley & Sons, Ltd.

Brain metabolism differs in Alzheimer's disease and Parkinson's disease dementia.
Alzheimer's and Dementia, Volume 4, Issue 6, Pages 421-427
H. Griffith, J. den Hollander, et al.

Few comparative studies exist of metabolic brain changes among neurodegenerative illnesses. We compared brain metabolic abnormalities in Alzheimer's disease (AD) and in Parkinson's disease with dementia (PDD) as measured by proton magnetic resonance spectroscopy (MRS).
Methods

Twelve patients with idiopathic PDD, 22 patients with probable mild AD, and 61 healthy older controls underwent posterior cingulate MRS.
Results

Patients with AD exhibited reduced N-acetyl aspartate (NAA)/creatine (Cr) (P < .05) and increased choline (Cho)/Cr (P < .05) and myo-inositol (mI)/Cr (P < .01) compared with controls. Patients with PDD exhibited reduced NAA/Cr (P < .05) and glutamate (Glu)/Cr (P < .01) compared with controls. There was reduced Glu/Cr in PDD compared with AD (P < .01).
Conclusions

Patients with AD and patients with PDD exhibited distinct brain metabolic MRS profiles. Findings suggest that comparison of brain MRS profiles across dementias provides useful direction for future study.

READ this, please!


"Cholinesterase Inhibitors: Drugs Looking for a Disease?"

I had read these drugs don't even help Alzheimers patients that much. Laura thank you for finding this! Drugs looking for a disease. Let's be the first community to stop what i would almost call criminal activity.....

As for anticholinergic drugs being dangerous too... They probably are for the elderly and maybe for us too. I know cogentin made me out of touch with reality. But we have pd. not alzheimers and shouldn' t the focus be on better ways to lower acetylcholine? Better anticholinergics?

Laura you have helped tremendously - thank you.
paula