Parkinson's Disease Tulip

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-17-2013, 06:20 PM #1
GerryW's Avatar
GerryW GerryW is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 613
8 yr Member
GerryW GerryW is offline
Member
GerryW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Marysville, WA
Posts: 613
8 yr Member
Default Docs Ignore Constipation in Parkinson's

http://www.medpagetoday.com/MeetingCoverage/MDS/39901
GerryW is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
"Thanks for this!" says:
reverett123 (06-18-2013), Tupelo3 (06-18-2013)
Old 06-18-2013, 07:54 AM #2
soccertese soccertese is online now
Magnate
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,522
10 yr Member
soccertese soccertese is online now
Magnate
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,522
10 yr Member
Default

i've read that constipation may slow gastric emptying which leads to more l-dopa getting broken down to dopa and less l-dopa getting to the brain so it's just not the discomfort that's a factor.
soccertese is online now   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
"Thanks for this!" says:
Tupelo3 (06-18-2013)
Old 06-18-2013, 08:44 AM #3
Bob Dawson Bob Dawson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,135
10 yr Member
Bob Dawson Bob Dawson is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,135
10 yr Member
Default Talking points for your next Church supper

Quote:
Originally Posted by soccertese View Post
i've read that constipation may slow gastric emptying which leads to more l-dopa getting broken down to dopa and less l-dopa getting to the brain so it's just not the discomfort that's a factor.
That's right. Absorption is not through the stomach, it is through the small intestine. It is most noticeable when the constipation ends. For hours or even a day or two, I am wondering why I feel so badly over-dosed by the drugs. It's because more of the drug is getting past the stomach and absorbed by the small intestine, and from there, to the brain.

Conversely, block up that drainpipe, with no "movement" in the small intestine, and the drugs are delayed, and get chewed up by acid in the stomach, and I have to take more drugs to get the same "bio-availability" reaching the small intestine.
It is yet one more factor that makes it devilishly hard to balance your drug intake. It's not only a question of how many pills you swallow; it is moreso a question of where they go after you swallow them - how much gets to your neuro system and how fast.
The whole Duodopa schtick is about that: installing a new pipeline to bypass the stomach entirely, and have a steady flow of drugs, and you can speed up or slow down the flow.
But AbbVie charges $60 Grand a year for the product. Would be cheaper if we could balance by bio-availability; the right dosage at the right time. Never get it right, too many factors changing hourly, but keep on trying to balance the dosage.

Next time you feel very under-dosed or over-dosed, think back: when was the last time you used the toilet plunger? Is there a co-relation in timing?

Has the municipality sent you a legal notice about blocking up the town sewage treatment plant? That's always a bad sign.
Bob Dawson is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
"Thanks for this!" says:
Bogusia (06-19-2013), moondaughter (06-22-2013), Tupelo3 (06-18-2013)
Old 06-22-2013, 06:47 AM #4
johnt johnt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Stafford, UK
Posts: 1,035
10 yr Member
johnt johnt is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Stafford, UK
Posts: 1,035
10 yr Member
Default

Constipation is one of the worse symptoms of PD for me, and the only one that sometime is so bad I think it could kill me.

Like Bob I find an improvement in my PD symptoms after defecation.

Back in February, 2011 there were discussions about constipation in the thread "Faecal transplant eases symptoms of Parkinson's"
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/sh...ghlight=faecal

I proposed (post #21) the following hypothesis:
"rather than Parkinson's causing constipation (as I'd always assumed), it is rather the case, that with the wrong bugs in the gut, Parkinson's and constipation reinforce one another: Parkinson's slows the transit time, leaving longer for toxins to build up, leading to a worsening of the Parkinson's, and so on."

I presented (post #29) the following data:
"Since my diagnosis in 2005 I've collected PD relevant data, including between 2006 and 2009 defecation data. ( I gave up collecting defecation data because I was worried about becoming anally retentive [!!!].) Things are complicated by changes in medication, both directly for constipation and for PD. So, I've chosen a period between January and August 2006 when I was on neither.

"The frequencies of the length of time in days between defecations are:
[0,1) 23
[1,2) 45
[2,3) 16
[3,4) 24
[4,5) 3
[5,6) 3

The data above is from 7 years ago. I dream of having the same results now. As I reported then, I no longer collect this data, but my estimate in percentage terms of my defecation interval times now are:
[0,1) 10
[1,2) 10
[2,3) 10
[3,4) 10
[4,5) 20
[5,6) 20
[6,7) 20

For me Movicol with prune juice is the most effective treatment to keep the faeces relatively soft. If this for some reason does not work and the faeces harden, I find drinking a litre of hot orange juice over a period of about a hour helps as a laxative.

I suppose that if it gets worse, i.e. over a week without defecation, I'll try an enema. Has anyone got any experience of this?

Finally, although I can't compete with Bob and municipal warnings, I find that blocking the toilet is a problem. If you can, you want to break up the faeces before you flush. If I flush and the faeces block up the system where I can't reach them, I flush a few times to see if this gets rid of the blockage. If there's no luck and the toilet is only draining slowly, I find the best way to unblock it is to flush the toilet then put a football ( = soccer ball in US English) in the water and force it up and down, raising and lowering the water level, eventually it should clear.

John
__________________
Born 1955. Diagnosed PD 2005.
Meds 2010-Nov 2016: Stalevo(75 mg) x 4, ropinirole xl 16 mg, rasagiline 1 mg
Current meds: Stalevo(75 mg) x 5, ropinirole xl 8 mg, rasagiline 1 mg
johnt is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-22-2013, 08:58 AM #5
reverett123's Avatar
reverett123 reverett123 is offline
In Remembrance
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,772
10 yr Member
reverett123 reverett123 is offline
In Remembrance
reverett123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,772
My Mood: Docs Ignore Constipation in Parkinson's
10 yr Member
Default And we wonder why we can't get a date.....:-)

Welcome to the Club. There have been times when the time between BMs have been measured in weeks for me. Further, I can remember the problem as far back as the seventh grade of elementary school! I also remember that area of my body as being where I stored a lot of emotional energy - anger or rage in particular. A constant tensing of the muscles that continues to this day. Also a feeling that if I get angry enough that if that barrier ever collapses, somebody is going to be in deep ****.

I don't know what that tells me, but some possibilities include H. pylori as the culprit. Another is inflammation and its chemical entourage (can cause depression as well), hypervigilance resulting from exposure to bacterial toxins in utero keeping the tension level up there is yet another, and so on.

The one that intrigues me today is the possible role of the vagus nerve which wanders aimlessly around the viscera and plays a big role in such things. I have noticed that when I reach that "cliff hanging" stage when the meds just don't want to cooperate, that I can do a few situps as well as tightening certain strategicly embarrassing muscles and bump things to "on". Possible compression of the nerve can't be ruled out.
__________________
Born in 1953, 1st symptoms and misdiagnosed as essential tremor in 1992. Dx with PD in 2000.
Currently (2011) taking 200/50 Sinemet CR 8 times a day + 10/100 Sinemet 3 times a day. Functional 90% of waking day but fragile. Failure at exercise but still trying. Constantly experimenting. Beta blocker and ACE inhibitor at present. Currently (01/2013) taking ldopa/carbadopa 200/50 CR six times a day + 10/100 form 3 times daily. Functional 90% of day. Update 04/2013: L/C 200/50 8x; Beta Blocker; ACE Inhib; Ginger; Turmeric; Creatine; Magnesium; Potassium. Doing well.
reverett123 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
"Thanks for this!" says:
Aunt Bean (06-25-2013)
Old 06-22-2013, 11:54 AM #6
moondaughter's Avatar
moondaughter moondaughter is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: rural Eastern Oregon
Posts: 608
8 yr Member
moondaughter moondaughter is offline
Member
moondaughter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: rural Eastern Oregon
Posts: 608
8 yr Member
Default wheat belly

As of late I stopped eating bread (even ezekial sprouted grain bread) and am noticing sinemet lasting longer .....4 hours +. Also have slowly dropped a couple of pounds . Tis indeed a sacrifice to give up the rye toast in the mornings, pizza and artisan bread but carrying it around in my gut for days has tipped the scale in favor of giving it up. Brown rice pasta is better than wheat pasta imho and I have a yummy recipe for a curry quinoa salad if anyone is interested. I don't know for sure whether its the change in diet ( I'm also eating strawberries from my garden in the mornings ) that is extending the "on" time but its definitely helped reduce the tire round my belly -and i still get my ice cream....
__________________
Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors....
Nature loves courage.


“The day science begins to study non-physical phenomena, it will make more progress in one decade than in all the previous centuries of its existence.”
~ Nikola Tesla
moondaughter is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
"Thanks for this!" says:
Aunt Bean (06-25-2013), Stand Tall (06-22-2013)
Old 06-22-2013, 04:25 PM #7
Stand Tall Stand Tall is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 139
5 yr Member
Stand Tall Stand Tall is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 139
My Mood: Docs Ignore Constipation in Parkinson's
5 yr Member
Default

Love quinoa!
Stand Tall is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-22-2013, 08:32 PM #8
Songfellow's Avatar
Songfellow Songfellow is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 85
5 yr Member
Songfellow Songfellow is offline
Junior Member
Songfellow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 85
5 yr Member
Default

I've suffered with constipation for several years now and blamed it all on PD. Well, my problem now appears to be fixed.

It was probably due to a statin (Simvastatin to be exact) that a heart doctor prescribed for me several years ago. Looking back at it I can now see that the constipation grew progressively worse in the months following my first dose of the statin and has gotten progressively better to the point of having almost totally disappeared now that I have stopped taking it.

If you're taking a statin I suggest you think hard and long about why you're taking it. The many bad side effects just weren't worth the grief to me.

Steve
__________________
I am not a doctor, medical or legal professional. My statements are opinions based solely upon my personal experiences.
Songfellow is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-24-2013, 12:04 PM #9
NorCalGal NorCalGal is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 48
5 yr Member
NorCalGal NorCalGal is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 48
My Mood: Docs Ignore Constipation in Parkinson's
5 yr Member
Default An interesting thread.

Constipation has also been an issue for me!! There have been days if not weeks where I have not had a bm or very poor ones to say the least. After the Memorial Day weekend I had fruit every day (strawberries, grapes, watermelon, necturines) and a new salad blend from Costco...Kale something...contains broccoli, brussel sproats, among other "super foods" and still nothing....until last Wednesday. For some unknown reason I started having bms every day. Hope it continues but I need to stock up on more fruits and veggies!!
NorCalGal is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Old 06-25-2013, 06:07 AM #10
Aunt Bean's Avatar
Aunt Bean Aunt Bean is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: East TN
Posts: 779
10 yr Member
Aunt Bean Aunt Bean is offline
Member
Aunt Bean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: East TN
Posts: 779
My Mood: Docs Ignore Constipation in Parkinson's
10 yr Member
Default

Have never found a solution...constipation has been my major problem since high school. Only lately, the old stand-bys don't work as well (if at all) Cascara Sagrada has always helped..now I usually have to take 2 days in a row to get any partial relief. Used to take 1 a week so I'd MOVE once a week.Hardly ever have bowel sounds. ...which can be heard in a normal person all the time with a stethoscope. Dad also having problems with constipation since last year. He is now 87 (now with tremor, restless legs, sleep deprivation and memory issues) It is amazing in our family how issues start younger each generation. Has anyone else found this to be true?
Aunt Bean is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ignore Aussie99 Peripheral Neuropathy 3 07-27-2007 04:50 PM
please ignore just testing cals1 Computers and Technology 2 09-26-2006 02:36 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:18 AM.

Powered by vBulletin • Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO v2.0.31 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise v2.7.1 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
 

NeuroTalk Forums

Helping support those with neurological and related conditions.

 

The material on this site is for informational purposes only,
and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment
provided by a qualified health care provider.


Always consult your doctor before trying anything you read here.