Just got back from two weeks vacation so have just read all this lot in one go. GASP ...................

Is this meant to be a select club for old BTer's or does it want a broad based PD membership? What ever the rights and wrongs of the main issue it sure don't look inviting to any prospective new members or long term lurkers to join if they read most of what's been posted here!!

Like many others here I am also a member of other PD Forums and I have in the past posted a link on some of them to this site, rightly or wrongly.

I thought this might be an appropriate moment to provide a link to a fairly new UK based PD Forum. Not to try to poach members from here, it's almost certainly too "British" for most here anyway, but to show how a light less aggressive Forum style can work - I thought PWP were supposed to avoid stress at all costs? Something about Seratonin levels and medication effectivity?

http://pduk.org

Anyway if this is unacceptable DocJohn please edit and I promise I will not complain. But a bit of balance at this point may not be a bad thing at all. But if you do edit the link please delete the whole post because it is pointless without it.



Chris

Seems that this thread has had cathartic benefits. I loved and was moved by what the moderators and others without PD who don't visit here regularly had to say. I am thankful that I am not currently living with physical pain (a claim, I know, not every person with PD can make), and humbled to read about the sufferings and strengths of the wider community. The worse thing about living with a chronic illness, for me, is the isolation it brings. I have to fight to not let it cut me off altogether; NT is one place I can come to help keep me connected.

carey... after seeing you in action, i want to bow at the mention of your name. you are one amazing woman and i wanted you to know how much your contribution has made a difference in my life. ya know sweets.. you live not far from me.. somehow we must get together.. love ya.

How to explain without hurting any feelings. After being here for a long time, needless to say I've read and been in a lot of disputes.

It's hard to have to moderate these disputes; I wouldn't want to do it. I usually feel that people should be able to disagree publicly and even if they get somewhat angry, there is a way to get a point across and move on.

What bothers me much more than two people who are having a dispute, are the people who scold and lay guilt trips on them. [excluding mods, whose job it is to control it]

This has always been an agressive forum, a difficult place for ideas to be accepted. It's what we make it. I think we have built a place where we can disagree and talk about many of the taboo subjects not too offensively. When i first came here, people of faith were pretty much told to keep it to themselves.

Chronic illness that will kill many of us brought us here, but there are those who insist that you leave out what people need to talk about sometimes.

Ok so we have rules.

I am sorry i know this is going to step on a few toes and I hope you can try to understand - don't think if you have done this that "i don't like you" or 'I am mad at you.'

We are not here to perform for anyone else. It's good to think of the readers, but it's not my job to impress anyone or put on a dog and pony show. Chronic illness means pain and death, and if we get angry or blow it sometimes, readers who do not understand have other choices, which John granted permission to post about.

I"m here because i'm in real trouble health wise and probably won't live a very long life. There's no need to beat people up and criticize on top of it. What do they call those things that feed on their own? liberals? ....oooooooooo...just kidding! There that will give somebody something to complain about.

Olsen's signature line describes it very well...we are here to help others...don't know what the others are here for. IF you aren't part of the solution, you are part of the problem.

I paraphrased a bit sorry Madelyn.

Last thought...there is only one basic reason IMHO for why there are topics we can't discuss. IT's called hate.

As carolyn said, we have to take personal responsibility.

Paula

...just ignoring a particular thread or post is not enough to handle all problems but it seems that way.

More to the point, the legendary Parkinson's personality may be part of the problem, might it not. We tend to be a pretty hard headed lot and used to calling the shots. Put us all in the same room and it is bound to be interesting.

bring your steel toe boots, hankies, shoulders, and dancin shoes.. bound to be a party!

I thought I'd said everything I needed to say in my last post, and I'm pretty sure at least four members of this forum (and possibly the Administration) will wish I had left it at that. Sorry, I'm back.

The PD forum has the highest number of posts at NT, but the entire first page of this thread was written by two people; people who apparently believe they don't need no stinkin' rules. Most of the posts just referred to were themselves violations of the rules here: Public airing of disagreements with the administration.

They were complaining because one of them had violated another rule and felt mistreated when DocJohn did what the rules said he would do; delete the offending post.

Later, after DocJohn had tried to reason with the first two, a 3rd member dropped in to teach John how one should properly run a forum. I thought those posts were self-righteous and condescending; I don't worship DocJohn for creating or facilitating NT, but I'm grateful that he did, and I don't think he should be talked to like a miscreant because someone doesn't like the way he does things.

The rules in my house are that you don't disrespect a man in his own home. That's always been the rule, and I'm sure my kids weren't too happy with it more than once; especially when I ordered my oldest son to leave my home. But my kids still treat me with respect in my home -- and they treat me with respect the rest of the time too.

I didn't kick my son out forever, I told him to leave until he could get his mouth under control. I wonder if that might be effective here? I'm thinking that a couple months without NT might give some people a reason to want to play by the rules.

The real reason for a 2nd post, however, is the reappearance of the two who dominated the first page on this thread. I had hoped that the response from others outside the PD forum might have chastened them, but apparently not: they are back and almost performing victory dances. They apparently feel they somehow won something, but I fear it will be a pyric victory; emboldening them to further excesses and possible banning.

There has been a lot of talk about JL and BT here, and mutterings about his apparently near-maniacal banning of good people just before the crash, and I suppose that might be what happened. I know I was a thorn in his side for a very long time, and the only time he threatened to ban me was fully justified.

I didn't agree with his policy of banning people for public protests, but I was aware of it and unwilling to die on that particular mountain. I don't like the way some things are done here either, but that's just not my mountain. I fear that DocJohn's temperance has led these people to think they can climb the mountain and live forever. I don't think that's the way it will turn out.

In case you didn't get the message: Go back and reread the posts and count the "thanks" thingies. People who would never invade another fourm to address misbehaviour came here and did just that. We said we stand with DocJohn and the mods. You can't celebrate and begin this crap again. If you do, you won't find much sympathy when the hammer drops.

Having said all that, I now offer a self-righteous lecture to DocJohn: Ya shoulda just said "rules are rules"...Vic

Vicc, you said:

"The real reason for a 2nd post, however, is the reappearance of the two who dominated the first page on this thread. I had hoped that the response from others outside the PD forum might have chastened them, but apparently not: they are back and almost performing victory dances. They apparently feel they somehow won something, but I fear it will be a pyric victory; emboldening them to further excesses and possible banning."

on the contrary, their appearance now has everything to do with the very nature of the disease itself, the PD community in general, and this PD forum community in particular. it has to do with forgiveness, understanding, humor, reality, and life.

this thread has been a wonderful opportunity to hear from people from all forums and from the administration. but in the end, it comes down to and back to us. Parkinson's disease does things to our brains and lives that no one without the disease can possibly understand but another person with PD. Other diseases, including other neurological diseases, have their own set of peculiarities and circumstances that we can only imagine what must be like to live with, but never know the true experience.

all of the comments from people with PD on this page of the thread in particular are recognizably and comfortably Parkinsonian. they are predictable, headstrong, cranky, jubilant, realistic, irritating, hopeful and completely familiar. just like a family around the Thanksgiving table.

p.s. Harley - you have the heart of a lion and the soul of an angel! will I see you at the Seattle NWPF conference in November?

wwhhooooaaaa...

one question first...then i will need to digest this before i answer further..

have you ever been an administrator over a forum?

reason i ask is because i know the difficulty of being one. john has a very hard task and his decision to be part of the discussion should be commended. his quest for a solution should be applauded. it was a difficult circumstance for an administrator and the outcome of it should be viewed as a victory dance for nt.

there is no need in my opinion to further hash over what decision john has made. the thread holds many opinions from intellegent people speaking their minds. i think john has read each and every one of them. as an administrator, he took every thought from every post and came to a decision. we are fortunate here to have such a captain.

scuze me for a bit.. think i will go be human for awhile... peace to you vicc.