[reverett123]

So many symptoms of Vit B12 deficiency from malabsorption match up with those of PD that it is constantly in the back of my mind. A similar flag is up for connections to h. pylori (the ulcer bacterium). The following is interesting-

http://archinte.ama-assn.org/cgi/con...ull/160/9/1349

Helicobacter pylori—Is It a Novel Causative Agent in Vitamin B12 Deficiency?

<quotes>
Background Evidence for vitamin B12 deficiency usually involves combinations of low serum vitamin B12 levels, clinical and metabolic abnormalities, and therapeutic response. Identification of the underlying cause is important in the diagnosis of vitamin B12 deficiency that is usually attributed to malabsorption. Helicobacter pylori is one of the most common causes of peptic ulcer disease worldwide and a major cause of chronic superficial gastritis leading to atrophy of gastric glands. It is suggested that there may be a casual relationship between H pylori and food-cobalamin malabsorption.
<end>
"leading to atrophy..." - that sounds like one might have an infection of HP, throw it off, and be left with a B12 problem.

[leonore]

Great detective work, Rick!
So, if this is true, what are implications for relationship between PD "off" periods, lowered levadopa absorption, and B12 deficiency? I remember there's
a B vitamin that interferes with levadopa-was it B6? still struggling big-time, Leonore
ps My neurologist decided today to start me on Azilect, given Adagio reports, and in spite of PDF's cautions today, wanting further peer evaluation. I consider my neurologist enough of a skeptic that if he prefers this to overtaxing my ststem with more Stalevo and riskking priming my body for worse dyskinesias, I'll give it a whirl. My friend, Cyndy, who he treats, did get melanoma from Azilect while it was in clinical trial, and he won't let her take it, anymore. But, he knows agonists and I are not on the best of terms, so....and he will discuss with GI trying a different antibiotic than Biaxin for h-pylori. We shall see...What are the probiotics you suggested?

[reverett123]

Looking for a better antibiotic says that the danger still isn't recognized. H. pylori is no ordinary bug and this is a big understatement if one has PD. You cannot afford to kill off a colony unless you are either moving the dead ones out fast or you are doing something to neutralize the toxic remains. I don't want to be alarmist but the wrong decision could put one in a wheel chair permanently. At the minimum, print out all that stuff I sent you, highlight the scarey parts, and insist that he read it with you. He is a neuro and doesn't know about HP. The GI guy doesn't know about PD. We are where two fields meet and that is dangerous in this case. The studies that revealed the danger were suspended to new enrollment because the researchers got scared, for goodness sake. End of lecture.

Back OT, HP is a fascinating creature. Anyone see the movie "Alien?" HP is the ONLY creature that lives in the human stomach. And the human stomach is the ONLY place HP can live. It even offers some protective benefits in small numbers. It is when it gets out of control that problems start. So, think control rather than eradication. Reduce its numbers with something other than antibiotics, because it mutates in response to them. Rhubarb and turmeric have been shown to be effective without trigering adaptation. But again, slow and easy. Also, there is a constant process of your stomach wall shedding HP into the gastric space where they are forced to swim upstream like little salmon and then reattach to the wall and bore back in. Cranberry juice might help prevent reattachment, although that is speculation on my part.

I think that all things considered that I will follow my own advice and start taking just a pinch of raw turmeric powder once a week. The tablets seem to breakup in the intestine and don't affect the HP. I tried taking the powder before and scared the wee-wee out of myself as the toxin hit and I didn't understand what was going on for two weeks. Could barely walk by then. I don't scare easily. In fact, hadn't been that scared since I saw "Alien."

Good luck and be careful.

[lou_lou]

I have hypoglycemia and it is caused by a malabsorbtion problem
as a teenager -I went to the doctor w/ my Mom who had hypoglycemia and was given B12 shots...
and it was my great aunt on my mothers side, who had early onset PD about the age of 40 -

my diagnosis was confirmed by Dr. Norman Freeman , in VA. Beach - Virginia
as hypoglycemic damage - and malabsorption problems previously - as cause of my parkinsons disease...
I have known this and I believe somewhere in my posting - I have explained this... continue this line of thinking - PD is caused by Toxic environment
and that is why we all have our own way down the PD path -
we just need to spiral off this path.

[lou_lou]

http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/thread22047.html

[leonore]

thanks again, Rick. About rhubarb root-I have "Nature's Answer," fluid extract, since last month-any strong feelings about using it with or without alcohol in bottle? And as per turmeric, maybe I'll try a pinch daily, cautiously. Thank you-I know your experience with it was scary.
I did give my neurologist info you gave me. He hopefully will find time to read, and get back to me re: warnings about LPS, and dead cells releasing toxins, but I'm not clear on what action you're hoping he'll take regarding this, versus me just proceeding with additional rhubarb/licorice root/turmeric routes.
He is ridiculously over-extended and I am not sure what you hope he'll do differently, other than more fully educating GI about PD and h-pylori. They have no real relationship, and right now, next step is re-testing . best, Leonore

Originally Posted by reverett123

Looking for a better antibiotic says that the danger still isn't recognized. H. pylori is no ordinary bug and this is a big understatement if one has PD. You cannot afford to kill off a colony unless you are either moving the dead ones out fast or you are doing something to neutralize the toxic remains. I don't want to be alarmist but the wrong decision could put one in a wheel chair permanently. At the minimum, print out all that stuff I sent you, highlight the scarey parts, and insist that he read it with you. He is a neuro and doesn't know about HP. The GI guy doesn't know about PD. We are where two fields meet and that is dangerous in this case. The studies that revealed the danger were suspended to new enrollment because the researchers got scared, for goodness sake. End of lecture.

Back OT, HP is a fascinating creature. Anyone see the movie "Alien?" HP is the ONLY creature that lives in the human stomach. And the human stomach is the ONLY place HP can live. It even offers some protective benefits in small numbers. It is when it gets out of control that problems start. So, think control rather than eradication. Reduce its numbers with something other than antibiotics, because it mutates in response to them. Rhubarb and turmeric have been shown to be effective without trigering adaptation. But again, slow and easy. Also, there is a constant process of your stomach wall shedding HP into the gastric space where they are forced to swim upstream like little salmon and then reattach to the wall and bore back in. Cranberry juice might help prevent reattachment, although that is speculation on my part.

I think that all things considered that I will follow my own advice and start taking just a pinch of raw turmeric powder once a week. The tablets seem to breakup in the intestine and don't affect the HP. I tried taking the powder before and scared the wee-wee out of myself as the toxin hit and I didn't understand what was going on for two weeks. Could barely walk by then. I don't scare easily. In fact, hadn't been that scared since I saw "Alien."

Good luck and be careful.

[reverett123]

I was just wanting to hammer on the antibiotics warning since it is so counter-intuitive.

About the turmeric, I'd start with a pinch a week because a big pinch per day was what got me in trouble. And I don't think the alcohol would matter. Keep us posted.

[made it up]

There's a paper written and recently published appearing in todays wemove news.
It can be found at wemovenews@wemove.org and the title is HPylori Infection
Affects PD Symptoms.
Sorry, have no idea how to transfer this news to here but if any of you can I think it'd be worthwhile.