cost to the UK $ 328 million

cost to America $ 1000 million to $ 5000 million

US GDP is seven times that of the UK so pro rater we come in at approx $ 2,500 million. Remember we get a lot of Eastern Europeans (non EU) and Indian sub continent.

I accept my initial statement was wrong, it just seems like we pay out to everyone due to their "human rights". Even failed asylum seekers are eligible for NHS care prior to deportation and believe me it is tough to fail to immigrate to the UK. We even had a bunch of guys fake a plane hi jack to land in the UK, then they claimed asylum and were allowed to stay.

Come the revolution, Tony Blair and Gordon Brown will be first up against the wall

Take care,
Neil.

Befuddled , she slithers among the patriotic chest bumping to. ask a few questions

is it all about numbers? is it a matter of shifting and how accountable is the govnt to provide?


Ironically. will we still be paying higher taxes..0f course with the screw sneaking up on the middle class?

teach me about it please and thank you.
p

editing to add that this is incomplete. actually i mean in the first question - are there too many of us?

and in the second, i didn't add the complete thought - meant to explain the irony and that would be if it all comes out the same....but who is in charge?

recalling the recent holiday, but think it's meaning is archaic. need a new holiday celebrating other things...

zzz

Thanks, Neil -- I found some stats, but they were five years old. Looks like you found more current info.

I have been following this thread with interest. I am an ob-gyn in practice for 27 years and trust me, our system is seriously broken, and anyone who doesn't see this is not looking. My patients are losing insurance coverage along with jobs, can't afford Cobra (which is temporary, expensive extension of your health insurance from your recent employer) or finding that any policy they are able to afford covers very little. Heaven forbid there should be a pre-existing condition! The insurance companies are profit-driven which translates into denial of legitimate claims or endless appeals and delays until you are paid. Usually 1/3 to 1/2 of your billed services. The percentage drops every year. In 2008 I made the least profit I have ever taken out of my practice. This is with very little change in my billing amounts. Even with PD I am working hard and would love to cut back but can't afford to. And if anyone thinks there are "free market" forces somehow applicable here that is some kind of nostalgic fable. I sign a contract with your insurer that says that I will accept their reimbursements and I cannot bill my patient for services that are denied by their insurer. So I am out the cost of the bone density study that I ordered for my post-menopausal breast cancer patient who can't take estrogen and whose mother died of complications of osteoporosis. Her insurer claims that the bone density study is "investigational"!!! That's it, case closed, I eat the unpaid bill. After a lengthy appeal no doubt.

My best friend from medical school works in the VA system. She has been there a while so makes a generous salary, 5 weeks paid vacation, 1 week paid CME, she will have a pension, great benefits, Federal holidays, etc etc. So what exactly is it about the government-run system I am supposed to be afraid of? She likes her practice and takes care of patients who need her.

I have to hire an extra person to spend the day begging the insurance co's to pay for legitimate services. It is hard to budget when you don't know when or if you will be reimbursed. And yet the insurance companies make a profit--why?? What service does a bureaucrat from BCBS provide for my patient, and why does that entitle them to large executive pays and profits?
I don't doubt that a public plan will not be without its drawbacks but the current system with no checks on insurance co. power is not superior. Lucky you if you are happy with your current plan but I see a bigger picture of many hard-working people who aren't able to obtain or afford coverage and they aren't all illegals or deadbeats.

I'm sorry to be so lengthy but I don't post too often and it's mainly when I feel strongly about something. One last thing: another of my med school (Duke) classmates practices in Canada, and the system works pretty well in her viewpoint. She is a psychiatrist who has practiced in both countries. I see the propaganda about how terrible the Canadian system is and I think it is all being funded by ins cos and big pharma and they have the clout to get whatever they want I'm afraid. Sigh. The status quo.

thanks for the post - good to have your perspective. i'm just learning the details, but i think medicaid workers don't always get their paychecks on time, but when the money is there.

paula

I've been following this thread with interest as well and did post a little earlier re the Canadian system. My comments may have been lighthearted previously but after the previous exchange, I can safely say that I am glad to be practicing as a family physician here in Canada. There is no insurance company deciding for me what is a necessary investigation and covering the costs (or not) accordingly. I simply order whatever my clinical judgement has decided is in the best interest of the patient. The patient never has to be concerned regarding payment. Sure we don't have MRIs in every clinic and if you need your shoulder instability investigated, you may have to wait, but your clinician is worried about a potential tumor, then your scan is expedited and given first priority.

Universal health care essentially covers all your health care costs from cradle to grave regardless of your socioeconomic status (this does not include some ancillary services such as physio or psychology which has some restrictions in terms of public funding and patients must rely on third party health insurance). Anyone can have access to the top physicians in any field and benefit from the same standard of care without having to worry about how they are going to pay for it.

Every system has its limitations and Canadian health care is not above that. There are always issues with longer wait times for nonemergency cases and a shortage of health care professionals to name a couple. And although we may complain at times, overall Canadians are fairly proud of universal health care and it is undoubtedly part of our national identity.

I was 22 years in a government run healthcare system - for the US military. On the whole, we received excellent care. But because it was "free" care, the waiting room was always full (i'd say if there had been a co-pay of any kind, half of the people in the waiting room would have stayed away). You would just show up if you were sick - and wait and wait. There was no choice of doctors. If they had the equipment, you would get the prescribed test. If treatment were deemed urgent, they would medivac you to a specialist. And of course if you were a General or an Admiral (active duty or retired) (or the wife of...) you would go to the head of the line and receive special treatment.

However, the VA medical care given to my dad was so awful that my dad quit going there. Their "approved" treatments didn't cover the medicines or tests he needed. His treatment there was nothing short of a nightmare. If that is the kind of gov't run health care we have to look forward to, I dread it.

Thank you for sharing your viewpoint, it is nice to hear from someone actually in the ranks. Somehow, though, you are an anomaly to me: every doc I know or have experience with is still making a VERY good living, living in a million dollar + house, their kids have every thing and get to do every activity...country club, nice vacations, a lot like your friend at the VA. It's hard to feel sorry for a medical profession where virtually every doctor you have ever met makes so much money and lives so extravagantly, even now.

I did read a recent (yesterday, in fact) article about the Canadian system being unsustainable. The statements come from the lady who I understand will be heading it up, so I give it credibility. Here's the link: (BTW, however you take her comments, it gives us all food for thought, in terms of how we reform our current system. We have several countries with public healthcare: we should study those and learn all we can before proceeding forward, and this takes TIME, something our administration seems unwilling to do.):

http://www.google.com/hostednews/can...335rGu_Z3KXoQw

interesting summary of costs, healthcare setup and results between the 4 countries.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8201711.stm

France and Singapore look best imho.

Neil.