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brendaingram 08-02-2011 06:49 PM

Zygo, I can't imagine walking 2 1/2 miles in 90 degree heat. wow. You do what you have to do, don't ya?

It's really not fair that most of us here have more than one major disorder. Sorry about your COPD, PN and gastroparesis.

Brenda

norahs 08-02-2011 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zygopetalum (Post 792108)
Well I went to see my lung guy yesterday and got 'flamed' a little. I recently finished PT and her report probably stated I'd gotten some relief from neuropathy (and neck pain) from lowering anticholinergic dose. He made a few statements indicating he was insulted I had not discussed the matter with him, etc. I've been TRYING to do that with him and PCP for the past 3 years and no one would listen. Last year when I told him the pain varied with dose and asked him about parestheis listed as a side effect of med he stated it was coincidence. I took a couple of statistics courses, you can't prove it if it doesn't reach significance but you can't disprove it either, and I know from my experience the drug has an effect.

My referral for PT came from the local pain clinic, the PA there initially stated med could exacerbate PN, later denied he'd said it and refused to discuss anything further until I'd consulted Pulmo. I was planning to do that when I developed gastroparesis (which I was able to identify from reading this forum), I knew it would improve if I lowered med dose so I just did it myself because I was so tired of being dismissed. BAD PATIENT!! Yesterday Dr. agreed I had gastro, med lists ileus paralytic as a rarely occurring event and he agreed my lowered dose was ok. I guess if you develop a potentially fatal condition its significant but if your quality of life is destroyed it isn't.

I know they all feel my COPD is a life threatening condition and that treatment of that is first priority. I understand that but quality of life is an issue as well, and I just don't understand why no one has been willing to discuss a conservative compromise in treatment. I don't have a car anymore, took my pedometer yesterday and I ended up walking a total of 2 1/2 miles in 90 degree heat (missed the dumb bus). My PN hurt a little last night but last year I would have been in a LOT of pain. I know many of you would be thrilled to have that much improvement and I sincerely wish you could. There are a lot of COPD patients who would be happy to be able to walk that far as well.

I know my situation may not be typical but this forum has really helped and I appreciate it. Right now I'm going to get busy and go shopping for some easily digested food because I'm beginning to feel a little like I swallowed a rock again, learned that here too.

Sorry for the rant and thanks, have also learned here its not unusual for people in general with PN to have problems finding help.
Zygo

I have not hear of Gastroparesis before. Thank you for this information. I am struggleing with some stomach issues as well and you have really made me think. I am seldom hungry, a few bites fill me up, I don't have much desire for food as in nothing ever appeals so I don't know what to eat and I crave only carbs. Last week my stomach made so much noise constantly that it was embarrassing but nothing passed through. I thought that was very strange. Perhaps I should not be ignoring this. I have been blaming my med's (neurotin to be specific) but maybe it's not all drug related. I really appreciate you mentioning this, thank you.
Sharon

echoes long ago 08-02-2011 08:46 PM

which medicine are you referring to? i also have asthma and copd.

echoes long ago 08-02-2011 08:57 PM

i cannot agree at all with not bothering to see a neurologist because there is nothing to be done if it is PN. there are central nervous diseases and muscle diseases that have similiar symptoms as PN. There are also autoimmune conditions that cause pn that can be treated for a better quality of life. the same goes with diabetes and thyroid problems. there are also paraneoplatic cancers that can have PN symptoms, and those would need to be treated. get a workup and rule out what can be ruled out. it will give you some peace of mind and possibly a clue as to cause. people who give out advice about dont bother nothing can be done, are doing a disservice to new posters here.

zygopetalum 08-03-2011 03:18 PM

thanks
 
I don't have to walk all the time Brenda, at least it gave me a good opportunity to 'test drive' my feet. lol

Norah, I may have misspoke to some degree, I know Neurontin can cause constipation, etc. and see stomach and intestinal inflammation listed as a rare side effect but it affects a different neurotransmitter and I don't know if it is implicated in actual gastroperesis, people here know a lot more about that than I do. I'm not clear on whether you still feel you have PN or if its limited to EM, PN can cause it. I WISH my stomach would growl, its just kind of sitting there.

Echos, I was talking about Spiriva but I'm also on Flovent, I take the latter separately but its in Advair and some of the other combos as well. Both are listed as a low incidence cause of paresthesias. I see patient reports of neuropathy.

I have been able to separate what happens well enough to be fairly sure the Spiriva makes me numb and in a way that's hard to explain intensifies pain and makes it more diffuse. Flovent seems to create a burst of burning pain. One or both of them seem to be causing weakness (noodle arms, etc), I thought it was Flovent but am not sure. I've also had killer muscle pain from it but its hard to tell the difference between that and nerve pain when I take Spiriva because I'm numb. PT gave me a diagram of nerves and there was frequently a nerve where I had pain ie sural nerve.
I've also dropped dose of Flovent which helped as well. Pulmo told me I could go off it if I wanted, he didn't admit it caused any problems though. I will probably try that.

I've read that paresthesias can be very painful if they are severe enough, I don't know what kind of pain they mean and thought a neuro would be better able to tell the difference between something like that and SFN. I also think Glentaj is right that it depends on the neuro.
I just had thyroid panel and biopsy (eek) and its all fine. Don't think I have paraneoplastic syndrome because I have relatively frequent CT scans as I did have lung cancer 7 years ago, it was never advanced enough to cause it and if I had something new they should see it. I wasn't diabetic 1 1/2 years ago, PCP said I'm stable and I don't need yearly blood work anymore.(?) I have wondered about an immune problem, Flovent can cause neuropathy associated with Churg Strauss Syndrome, I don't have that but thought there might be other issues.

Echos I don't know what your PN status is or if you are on either of these, but I'd think about talking to Dr if you are (hope hes nicer than mine). there is something going on in some people with those meds.
Zygo

echoes long ago 08-03-2011 08:41 PM

im currently taking advair, spiriva, hfa rescue inhaler and duoneb for the nebulizer. i was taking singulaire but was taken off of that when the pulmonary doctor ran across information that it may be contraindicated for those with PN. nothing firm yet but he took me off anyway. i havent noticed the spiriva having any differing effect either way on my pn than singulaire did. its such a tradeoff between taking medication and side effects. i not sure if you are familiar with FEV1 (forced expiratory volume) on pulmonary function tests but mine have dropped from 115% of expected down to now 43% of expected over the years.

glenntaj 08-04-2011 06:07 AM

If you did have lung cancer 7 years ago--
 
--even if it is in remission or cured, you should look into paraneoplastic syndromes that cause neural symptoms, among them neuropathy.

The testing for this is very specialized; not many places do it routinely. Still, its worth checking, as lung cancer is the most common cancer to produce autoimmune based neurological symptoms, and these often persist even after the cancer is dealt with:

http://neuromuscular.wustl.edu/nother/paraneo.htm

http://neuromuscular.wustl.edu/antibody/sneuron.html#hu

zygopetalum 08-04-2011 03:40 PM

Echos, how did you lose so much lung function, do you have that genetic form of COPD? Mine is about in the same range, 45%-50%, I was still at the mild stage before surgery, they removed a lobe and then it tore open before healing so I lost more than was expected.
It sounds like you Dr. is more aware that you have other issues of concern than mine is, I suspect I'd have been left on the Singulair without irrefutable proof, and I think the drug companies are a little reluctant to provide that sometiimes. I'd REALLY like to know what they are calling 'paresthesias'. I went off Spiriva for 5 days and my sensations returned to normal, all I had was that burst of neropathic-type pain when I used the Flovent. I'm glad the meds don't seem to be bothering you, a lot of people seem to take them with no ill effects. I actually seem to be breathing better with a lower dose of spiriva, I'm probably just sensitive to it. I was on Advair but had some cardiac issues, again Dr. Weasel (can I say that? lol) didn't consider a lower dose. Its a shock to have more than one life-altering disorder, for me the neuropathy has been worse than cancer. People in this forum live with a lot of hardship.

I'm not ruling out anythiing Glentaj, just started with the meds because I knew they were having an effect. I didn't develop neuropathy until around 3 years after I'd had the cancer, I have wondered if there were some subtle signs I didn't notice. I also took a ton of fluroquinolones (sp) during that time but again didn't notice anything except they made me twitch when I was on them.
I've been wondering if you all are aware of any conditions considered risk factors for neuropathy, one site listed Neurocardiogenic Syncope. No one in my family has ever been tested but I'm sure several of us have it, I used to faint all the time as a kid.
Re: Melody's post, I also had a German grandmother and her mother looked like she should have been wearing a babuska in a Polish villiage...leading a cow.
Zygo

echoes long ago 08-04-2011 08:47 PM

im taking 500/50 advair which is the highest dose. if you had such a dramatic improvement stopping taking spiriva then i think i would be insisting to discontinue it and use something else. i used pulmacort for a while and did ok on that. then i was treated by another pulmonary doctor and he preferred advair, which again i have no problems with.
i went from 115% of predicted fev1 to 80% in weeks after being exposed to a large amount of toxins for months. since then it has continued to decline and i also have nodules on my lungs which they keep an eye on.

i went today to get mri on my cervical spine and two different places with two different size machines i just couldnt do it. its very embarassing. i hate what i have become, its the opposite of what i once was. i had it done in 2003 and 2008 but this time i just couldnt do it. i have 3 herniated disks in cervical and 4 in lumbar that meed to be checked from time to time. this time especially since my legs have locked up on me twice. ill have to contact an open mri place, this one was called a large bore but i still couldnt do it. i really dont want to do it at all. im at a low ebb and worn out between cat scans, mri's, xrays for breaks, bone scans, blood tests etc.

stan t 08-04-2011 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by echoes long ago (Post 792233)
i cannot agree at all with not bothering to see a neurologist because there is nothing to be done if it is PN. there are central nervous diseases and muscle diseases that have similiar symptoms as PN. There are also autoimmune conditions that cause pn that can be treated for a better quality of life. the same goes with diabetes and thyroid problems. there are also paraneoplatic cancers that can have PN symptoms, and those would need to be treated. get a workup and rule out what can be ruled out. it will give you some peace of mind and possibly a clue as to cause. people who give out advice about dont bother nothing can be done, are doing a disservice to new posters here.

I totally agree. It would be like burying your head in the sand and giving up.


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