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Old 10-17-2012, 09:33 PM #1
kevin99 kevin99 is offline
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Default Extreme Foot Pain

I am a Type II Diabetic for the last 20 years. For 15 years I was symptom free even though I led a very unhealthy lifestyle. Everyone warned me but I did not believe them since I was fine. BUT - the Neuropathy came on about 5 years ago. Both feet - the entire foot - feel very cold and pain radiates throughout. About 2 months ago it became extreme and this month it is horrific and has put me into a deep depression.

I have been forced to seek out heat. I now take 2 to 3 hot baths a day, and every 15 minutes I go to the sink to fill up a large pot with hot water. That is the only thing that works, but it only removes the agony for about 10 minutes. My life is no more as I am completely consumed by this pain and the never-ending scramble to relieve it. I can sleep only for about 1 to 2 hours, then wake up - have to soak my feet again - then go back to sleep for another hour or two.

Even when I manage to get my sugars regulated - the pain lessens just slightly but remains.

I read and read and read about ALA and the various forms, along with vitamins, IV Vitamin therapy, etc etc etc. Even looked into electric shock and leg artery stints. They all seem to have mixed reviews. I thought I had PAD because the pain is much worse when I am lying down. I had a test done with the pressure cuffs and 2 Techs taking readings and it came out negative.

I have very little pain while walking as some have stated here. My pain is relieved slightly during walking but returns fully once I sit or lie down.
Also, I do receive Oxycodone and Opana each month. The Oxy helps dramatically - then I run out and have Opana left. But the Opana does very little and the pain comes back with a vengeance.

Lastly - there is a natural relief it seems - for me (it may not work for others). When I run a couple of miles . . . so long as I really push it, the pain goes from a 9 down to about a 3 and an internal warmth is felt in my feet. It lasts a couple of hours then the pain returns. If I run several days in a row the relief lasts longer, sometimes until I go to bed The problem is I have never been able to regularly run - even when faced with this horrific condition. So now - my main focus is on learning how to develop self-discipline. I am a lazy guy - admittedly - and so far cannot go out each day and face that intense gasping for air. I feel as if this is on me now - either I do what I know works for me and run, run, run . . . or go on a long series of Docs, tests with fish oil and vitamins, surgeries, etc.

I am wondering if any Diabetics out there have had a similar experience with foot pain and what have you tried ? Thanks a lot !!
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Old 10-18-2012, 12:50 AM #2
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Hi Kevin, I had prediabetic neuropathy but my feet burned like hell, also had the sharp jabbing feelings as well.
I am good these days but it took a long time to heal completely.

I highly recommend R - lipoic acid 100 mg daily plus GLA [gamma-linolenic acid] 480 mg daily, it is found in evening primrose oil, and if your on metformin I would take B12 methylcobalamin daily as the metformin can deplete the b12 levels.

Try to keep your blood sugars as close to normal as possible, this is the most important thing but those supplements are also very good for diabetic neuropathy, it all takes time nerves heal very slowly.
best of luck to you.
Brian

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Old 10-18-2012, 05:50 AM #3
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Lightbulb

Exercise dilates blood vessels, and so does heat.

I'd suggest putting some epsom salts in your soaks. This will provide magnesium and open up your little blood vessels.

Diabetics need more magnesium than others, because it is lost in the urine commonly in diabetics. Once you get an improvement with epsom salts, then you can take a magnesium supplement,
orally. The tests for PAD only check the larger blood vessels and not the small ones.
This is my magnesium thread:
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/thread1138.html
Don't use OXIDE as it is not absorbed...and is mostly a laxative.

R-lipoic acid stabilized is good too for diabetics... start at 100mg a day
Benfotiamine also at 300mg a day to start.

I'd ask the doctor to test for immune antibody complexes.
IgM or MGUS, and also for cryoglobulins (which thicken the blood when temperatures are cooler or cold). I'd stay away from very fatty meals, saturated and other. Elevated triglycerides will clog and thicken the blood too, which will impair circulation in the tiny blood vessels, as well.
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Old 10-20-2012, 01:31 AM #4
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Thanks for the replies.
I read the Magnesium thread, and although it was detailed . . . it did not say which pill to buy ?? (brand, milligrams, and link)
Or if not in a pill, which foods to eat to get it ?

I have read so many various meds and chemicals. It seems to me that you can find 1000 different people that all swear by 1000 different meds or vitamins / minerals. Magnesium I have not seen much on but I do not debate that it could be effective. R-ALA does seem to be a common theme as far as neuropathy goes.

I want to try various things to find something to help me. But then again, there are so many being touted on the many forums that I find myself becoming bewildered with all the advice. Also - every time someone says "THIS works !! " then later I find someone that says "No that does not work - try THIS instead !!". It is hard to know.

Let me ask about the Epsom salts. I am not understanding how the Epsom Salts help and how does that differ from a hot soak with just plain water ? I do know they are good for infections (just like sea water is) but as far as pain I am not following that part. Does the salt soak in and do something ? Or does it just help the skin ?

Thanks
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Old 10-20-2012, 07:41 AM #5
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Lightbulb

Epsom salts contain magnesium.
this will penetrate the skin and enter the body, mostly where the soak occurs.

Magnesium has been found to be very deficient in the US. Estimates are 70% of people do not get the RDA of it 400mg for adults, or are losing it quickly thru the urine, diabetics, diuretics, alcohol, caffeine.

Foods high in magnesium are on that thread.
You can look up foods that you commonly eat on this website to see how much magnesium you actually consume:
http://nutritiondata.self.com/
Pay attention to the serving sizes in the upper left of each page, so you can figure out your magnesium intake. That site is very interesting and shows many things you can profit by. The inflammatory index is also useful...you want to limit inflammatory foods.

You can choose any chelate-- glycinate, gluconate, malate or citrate. Target 200mg elemental a day to start which is 1/2 the RDA for adults. I explain "elemental" on that thread.
Many supplements do not give elemental on the label. You might have to look that up.
For example a 1000mg magnesium malate has about 150mg of elemental magnesium in it. The rest is the malate portion

I think you should start here, because of your diabetes, and poor circulation.

I also think you should have thyroid testing to see if your body temperature is low, due to low thyroid. When you get that testing done soon, also ask for B12 test and Vit D.
Diabetics can be low in Vit D often as well.
Bring your numbers here because doctors do not interpret the B12 and Vit D tests accurately in this country, commonly. Your B12 should be at least 400 and the D at 40-50 (in US units).
Metformin that some diabetics take will reduce B12 as a side effect. So do acid blocking drugs...for GERD/heartburn...they
prevent B12 absorption.

Do the magnesium first. That may be all you need. Get some more testing as I suggested in my first post and this one and then you can think about lipoic acid. It may be that magnesium is all you need at this point.
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Old 10-20-2012, 08:53 AM #6
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Default Heat

Try using the foot warmers that fisherman and Winter hikers use. They can keep your feet warm up to 8 hours. You should have a barrier like socks though especially if you can't feel how hot it is. Get them at any sports store or even the drug store. They can keep that chill from going through your foot.A small space heater under your computer desk will also help.
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Old 10-21-2012, 10:33 AM #7
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I started taking epsom salt baths for my high blood pressure. It was purely by accident that I found out every time I soaked in epsom salt when I checked my blood pressure afterwards it would go down 10 to 20 points. I always checked because I was afraid hot bath would RAISE my blood pressure.

So, I took epsom salt bath regularly for blood pressure, then found out, again by accident, that it helped the neuropathy in my feet.

I am a complete advocate for epsom salt baths. It gets the magnesium into the blood stream fast.

I will never stop using epsom salts.

As far as how confusing it is to read for cures, that is true. However, nobody cares more about you than YOU. So read, read, read. Knowledge is power. Sometimes you buy something that does not work. So go on to the next thing. You can't give up, cuz doctors certainly don't care. They throw a pill at you and move on to the next patient.

I will NEVER stop reading, researching, and hoping. This forum and others have been INVALUABLE to me. Finding benfontiamine was a MIRACLE for me. The burning in my feet improved 90% within 24 hrs. I still have bad spells but it's still a miracle. That comes from reading, trying, trusting, asking, and hoping. NOT from a doctor.

Nobody can do the work for you. YOU have to do the work. You will get great advice on this forum but you wont get a perscription for a cure or a perscription specifically for you. THAT IS UP TO YOU.

Knowledge is power.

good luck
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Old 10-22-2012, 05:31 PM #8
tailam08 tailam08 is offline
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Definitely PN symptoms. I used to have really bad pain and pain meds didn't help. Until I got my spinal cord stimulator implanted, I am pretty much pain free for the most part.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevin99 View Post
I am a Type II Diabetic for the last 20 years. For 15 years I was symptom free even though I led a very unhealthy lifestyle. Everyone warned me but I did not believe them since I was fine. BUT - the Neuropathy came on about 5 years ago. Both feet - the entire foot - feel very cold and pain radiates throughout. About 2 months ago it became extreme and this month it is horrific and has put me into a deep depression.

I have been forced to seek out heat. I now take 2 to 3 hot baths a day, and every 15 minutes I go to the sink to fill up a large pot with hot water. That is the only thing that works, but it only removes the agony for about 10 minutes. My life is no more as I am completely consumed by this pain and the never-ending scramble to relieve it. I can sleep only for about 1 to 2 hours, then wake up - have to soak my feet again - then go back to sleep for another hour or two.

Even when I manage to get my sugars regulated - the pain lessens just slightly but remains.

I read and read and read about ALA and the various forms, along with vitamins, IV Vitamin therapy, etc etc etc. Even looked into electric shock and leg artery stints. They all seem to have mixed reviews. I thought I had PAD because the pain is much worse when I am lying down. I had a test done with the pressure cuffs and 2 Techs taking readings and it came out negative.

I have very little pain while walking as some have stated here. My pain is relieved slightly during walking but returns fully once I sit or lie down.
Also, I do receive Oxycodone and Opana each month. The Oxy helps dramatically - then I run out and have Opana left. But the Opana does very little and the pain comes back with a vengeance.

Lastly - there is a natural relief it seems - for me (it may not work for others). When I run a couple of miles . . . so long as I really push it, the pain goes from a 9 down to about a 3 and an internal warmth is felt in my feet. It lasts a couple of hours then the pain returns. If I run several days in a row the relief lasts longer, sometimes until I go to bed The problem is I have never been able to regularly run - even when faced with this horrific condition. So now - my main focus is on learning how to develop self-discipline. I am a lazy guy - admittedly - and so far cannot go out each day and face that intense gasping for air. I feel as if this is on me now - either I do what I know works for me and run, run, run . . . or go on a long series of Docs, tests with fish oil and vitamins, surgeries, etc.

I am wondering if any Diabetics out there have had a similar experience with foot pain and what have you tried ? Thanks a lot !!
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