MY Vitimain D is said to be very low
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To MrsD: I just got back from my new doctor getting the confirmation that I do NOT have diabetes. :D However, she implored me to take a prescription amount (a very large dosage) of Vitamin D. She showed me my level and it was only "15" whatever that means. She says its very low -this despite me taking some Vitamin D supplements already. I feel she is really onto something here. Still, I asked her to lower the prescription dosage some and then raise it later, because I fear taking such high levels of anything might be too much too fast. So, I will be taking 5000 mg of vitamin D per day and then return in 2 months to get my levels read. Does anyone here know if my Vitamin D levels (of 15) is really a concern? Please help. I appreciate any advice. On a positive note, I feel this doctor is really trying to help me, and indeed, it seems she already found something that many other doctors have overlooked, including 2 neurologists.:winky: |
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I think you mean 5000 IU -- not mg.(?) As long as it's D3 (and not D2) which can be gotten OTC, you should be on the right track. There's a higher (mega)dose doctors sometimes prescribe, but IME it's usually D2, which isn't recommended anymore. Vitamin D: A Rapid Review Doc |
Yes, that level of Vitamin D-
--on a blood test is pretty low, though not the lowest I've ever heard of, even on this board.
Still, the low end of "normal" range on most serological tests these days is about 30, with a high of about 100. Many researchers are now saying the 30 is too low and something approximating 70 or so would be more optimal--this is definitely an area of ongoing research. It is thought that both the modern tendency to stay out of the sun and use lots of sunscreen to help allay skin cancers (Vitamin D is produced through chemical reaction in our dermal layers upon exposure to certain wavelengths of sunlight), as well as our tendency in the modern world to simply be outside less (and in front of computer screens more), and our increasing tendency to be somewhat deficient, through consuming the "standard American diet", in calcium and magnesium may be contributing to lower D levels among the populace. Take a look at our Vitamin D reference thread (lots of articles/papers/studies): http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/showthread.php?t=1448 |
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http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23304571 Obviously, this caught my interest. Though I'm not diabetic, I hope I get some of the similar healing effects that the person in the linked article did. Surely, the low D level I have, must be having some bad effect on me, so taking the replacement supplement should help some. I have not gotten the vitamin D from my pharmacy yet. Later, I'll post here what type and kind it is, as well as how I feel after a couple of weeks of taking it. Question: Why is the "D2" type of Vitamin D NOT good anymore? ::::::::::::::::::::: ::::::::::::: |
Please read other posts here.
I am on an iPHone and have to remain brief. Anyone reading posts here to learn would know about VitD by now. VitD2 does not work much at all in humans. Your goal is 50 at testing minimum. I tell all newbies about VitD testing when they first post here. Read your labels carefully . VitD OTC is D3. Rx from a Rx from a doctor is usually D2. 5000 IU D3 is a proper dose daily to raise you to a level of 50. See you in Sept. this is easy and inexpensive for you to do. We have had posters here who have reduced pain by fixing this. |
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I was told by my nutritionist optima levels are between 40-60. My levels were 31,she told me to take 2000 a day. I took 5000 a day for over a yr. My levels only went up to 32. Don't worry abou taking too much ur levels are way too low. If ur Dr gives u a rx take it! u can take up to 10,000 iu on ur own. Low vit D, can cause osteoporosis, bone pain, cancer among others! Hope this helps |
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They are 50,000 units of Vitamin D2. I am supposed to take 1 every week, for 4 weeks. Obviously, I am afraid to take such a megadose of this, but it would only be 1 pill every week NOT day, so that's a big relief. However, I'm told my so-called natural level of Vit D is probably more like a 9 or 10, since I had been taking a multivitamin with D in it already for some time. This is also some evidence that I have an undiagnosed condition that stops me from absorbing normal levels of vitamin D, though we don't know what that is just yet. I figure that such a low level can't be good. So I plan on taking the prescription as ordered, I just hope I don't react badly to it.:o |
Please go to the vitD thread at our vitamin forum here.
It has vitD video in the title. D2 just does not work well in humans. I have links explaining why. You can find D2 new findings on Google too. D3 is not approved by FDA as a drug.. it is an OTC supplement instead. I cannot go into detail now but this information is available on NeuroTalk. 5000IU of OTC D3 daily should get you in range within 3months. It is very inexpensive too. There is not much VitD in food. You need 1000IU D3 for every ten points to raise. Humans are designed to make D from sunlight. And BTW VitD is not a vitamin... It is hormone. |
Humans make their own vitamin D from exposure to sunlight. However in recent years, with a thinning/perforated ozone layer and rising skin cancer rates, people don't spend as much time in direct sunlight as they used to. Today, Americans get most of their vitamin D via fortified foods, which may not nearly be enough (e.g. milk is fortified w/ only 100IU/cup in US).
See: Office of Dietary Supplements fact sheet: Vitamin D Doc |
I was floxed in Dec 2012.
At that time my symptoms were limited to insomnia, numbness on my head and chest, plus tendon and joint issues. I actually couldn't walk well for about a week. I got better over 4 weeks and returned back to normal. Fast forward 7 months and after a rabies vaccine I have lower back pain/burning, joint issues and as of 8 days ago parethesia (prickly/itchy feelings under my skin). Is this what you are experiencing? |
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I'm more concerned about bad side effects from such a high dose, rather than its sightly less effectiveness than D3. As it is, If I can get my levels up, I can switch to D3 later on by myself and in smaller dosages. Here is the article I mentioned (It's in the spacing "D2 VS D3") http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2912737/ If for some reason you feel that taking the Vitamin/Hormone "D2" will HARM me please let me know, as I'm about to start taking them tomorrow evening. Much appreciated, for your info and thoughts.:hug:. |
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If so, I have much worse pains, now mostly pins and needles pains and deep bone pains in my fingers, toes hands and feet. With various burning all over my back and body. Somedays are worse than others, somedays are pretty low, pain-wise. ...For me, it appears weather (especially high humidity) is a regular trigger. I never experienced anything that gave me trouble walking, more so, it was just the onset of painful Peripheral Neuropathy that caused me such havoc. Now, PN is a warning on the Ciprofloxcacin side-effects warnings. It is highly suggestive that taking both Naproxen (such as Alieve) and a Benzo (my Clonazepam) together with the Cipro is what made my case so bad. Still, my very recent discovery of having a very low Vitamin D level is "suspected" as a strong irritant of it as well. By the way, can you please tell me the manner and drug use that got you floxed? You are the only other person here that I have met that has been floxed other than me. So any trading of experiences should help us both. |
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Errg! here is the other article I was talking about "D2 (as effective as) D3" http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/004897.html |
I am on an iPhone and don't know how
to copy a link. Maybe someone here will get that link For you. Or you click on NeuroTalk above where It is underlined and it takes you to The main forum index. Everyone should check out our other forums As there is a lot to be learned from Others' experiences. |
JesseM
here is the Vitamins etc Forum http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/forum49.html and specifically the Vit D thread http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/showthread.php?t=1448 Here is the main index for all of our forums http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/index.php |
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Then 24 hours later the other symptoms hit me. Every tendon in my body alternately started burning... I swear I was playing whack-a-mole with my ice pack. Then joint stiffness and pain started... then the numb head and chest and insomnia. I recovered pretty quickly. I will PM you a great private group on Facebook with over 1,000 members for Flouroquine Reaction. |
Thank you Chemar .
I hope to learn that link thing by the end of this summer. This is the first vacation I could come on often at all. The better VitD thread is the one with video in the title. I think it is on the first two pages and is a newer thread. That thread gets more views than the older one. When our son visits he will give me another lesson on this new iPhone ;) |
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If so please send me the link also. |
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It's not like your going to have to run the gauntlet or give up your first born to get in. :D |
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New medical information on Vitamin D + videos: Doc |
Thank you Dr. Smith.. That is the one!
Post #70 has a link on why d3 is more useful. One thing to remember is that while on VitD supplements , some doctors suggest to limit calcium supplements to no more Than 600mg a day. This is because D will Improve absorption from food. |
FWIW, our docs here do not rx D2 anymore, given that D3 is over the counter and (and I quote) "as good, if not better" than D2. Typically, you buy a very cheap product at our pharmacies that has 4 oily capsules with 25,000IU of D3, and you typically take one a week. If you are very low, you can safely take 2 (i.e. 50,000IU) the first week. (I did this a few years ago, with obviously no ill effects).
My doc now routinely advises many of her patients to get this product during winter, as a vast percentage has a deficiency or is borderline. Also, this D3 product (D-Cure) is so common and ingrained that there's just no reason to go the D2 route. Personally, I prefer to take a daily dose of 4,000IU (D3 ;)). It comes down to the same dose, and I have no proof, but I suspect that works better than a large dose every week (how much of that would be absorbed?) I have however stopped taking it back in May to see if I could get my levels up by being outside most of the day. Will be interesting to have it tested/see the results in Sept. On a more general note (and this is not a dig): please read this forum carefully. There is so much info on D3, B12, magnesium, B1 etc. that it's almost impossible to miss. All these can be bought cheaply and taken safely. They may not cure PN (in this case) - although they sometimes do (!) - but they are so fundamental that healing is almost impossible if you don't have these levels in a safe and comfortable range. |
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Oddly, for some reason, clicking on the link from here sends one to a log-in page, whereas clicking on the exact same link from google sends one directly to the pertinent page. (I've checked, and the URLs are identical) :Dunno: I tried it again, and this link sends one directly to the pertinent page. Vitamin D: A Rapid Review: Vitamin D2 and/or Vitamin D3 - Medscape Doc |
Am I reading this right -- I'm doomed to PN basically forever?
I read through the first 6 pages of this thread & finally had to stop to ask this question...
Am I basically doomed to PN by the combination of chemotherapy (Taxotere & Taxol), antibiotics (Cipro & Flagyl at various times), along with NSAIDs? As part of my treatment regime for breast cancer, I was given Cipro at least twice (for almost a month following surgery) while also taking various NSAIDs to combat inflammation, swelling, and associated pain. One of the times I know I was on Cipro & NSAIDs was fairly soon after my chemo-induced PN began & caused my chemo regime to end earlier than planned. Since that surgery, I've had all sorts of nerve problems including TOS. Is it possible (probable) that my continued nerve problems is due to the mixing of these drugs? Would nerves already damaged by chemo be more susceptible to damage from these other drugs? Cancer really did ruin my life. :-( My last 4 years: 7/7/09 Diagnosed with Stage 2B BRCA1 breast cancer in axillary tail of left breast while 20 weeks pregnant by excisional biopsy (lumpectomy) without anesthesia 7/31/09 port placed, started FAC chemo (with steroids)/1st FMLA leave granted 11/27/09 delivered healthy baby girl (8#4oz) (antibiotics & anti-inflammatory/opiate given given) 1/2/10 began Taxotere chemotherapy with steroids 1/16/10 switch from Taxotere to Taxol (with steroids) because of PN & slight allergic rx 1/30/10 all chemo halted because of worsening PN & allergic rx 2/19/10 bilateral radical mastectomy, skin & nipple sparing with expander implant reconstruction, port removed (antibiotics & anti-inflammatory/opiate given given) 41/10 returned to work with FMLA approval for flare-ups (continued until dismissal) 7/2/10 oophorectomy & implant exchange surgery cancelled due to low neutrophils 8/28/10 tubes & ovaries removed, implant exchanged cancelled due to excessive internal bleeding requiring 2 transfusions (antibiotics & anti-inflammatory/opiate given given) 10/2/10 emergency hysterectomy due to abscess on uterus from previous surgery (antibiotics & anti-inflammatory/opiate given given) 2/17/11 implant exchange surgery (antibiotics & anti-inflammatory/opiate given given) 4/?/11 began seeing a pain management dr (what a crock) 10/29/11 autologous TRAM flap reconstruction/implants removed (antibiotics & anti-inflammatory/opiate given given) 11/15/11 began physical therapy 12/20/11 totaled vehicle due to pain/loss of grip from TOS 12/?/11 EMG & vascular studies show brachial plexopathy -- PT continued 5/14/12 1st rib resection for TOS (antibiotics & anti-inflamatory/opiate given) 6/2/12 left lung partially collapsed due to infection (antibiotics, & anti-inflamatory/opiate given) 8/?/12 sent by employer for 2nd opinion = same diagnosis 12/31/12 PT discontinued due to insurance & nothing further to be taught & increasing harassment at work 1/11/13 dismissed after almost 9 years of commended work due to absences & falsely accused work difficulties/inadequacies 4/15/13 SSDI application filed with lawyer 8/10/13 General Medical Exam ordered by SSDI |
[QUOTE=Biologybrain;1006796]I read through the first 6 pages of this thread & finally had to stop to ask this question...
Am I basically doomed to PN by the combination of chemotherapy (Taxotere & Taxol), antibiotics (Cipro & Flagyl at various times), along with NSAIDs? As part of my treatment regime for breast cancer, I was given Cipro at least twice (for almost a month following surgery) while also taking various NSAIDs to combat inflammation, swelling, and associated pain. One of the times I know I was on Cipro & NSAIDs was fairly soon after my chemo-induced PN began & caused my chemo regime to end earlier than planned. Since that surgery, I've had all sorts of nerve problems including TOS. Is it possible (probable) that my continued nerve problems is due to the mixing of these drugs? Would nerves already damaged by chemo be more susceptible to damage from these other drugs? :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: ::::: Okay, first off, let's get some things into perspective. Don't panic!:) For many -and I do mean many! PN is NOT permanent. I have been challenged on this subject many times and even on this site, there seems to be little hope of actually curing from it, though their certainly is a lot of hope in improving. And they are right about that part for sure. But here is the facts, there are many who do, indeed, heal from pn. This is a slow process and it sometimes takes years. This has much to do with how resistant your body is to the antagonist drugs. As well as your genetic predisposition. Case in point: A man I met at the neurologist office (admin edit) Who got severe pn from a mix of flagly, then later Cipro. It took him 3 years to return to normal, citing that he now only gets very minor pn pain during major storms or extreme stress in his life. Essentially, he is healed from it. More fortunately a young man, I know of, had Neuropathy from taking Cipro (and took it several more times afterward -bad idea!!!) and he did in fact heal from it after stopping the drug. This too, took some time, but far less than I imagined (only about 7 months). Why this is, is unsure, but it's probably due to his own body's ability to to resist toxicity. There are thousands, if not millions, who take the same drug concoctions we took, yet they are fine - more evidence that there is probably a genetic factor involved in whom is more resilient to toxicity. This made me realize that you do NOT even need to be completely cured for PN anyway, just enough to get your pain and symptoms reduced that it does not interfere with your Quality of life. Even severe pn sufferers can achieve this. Everybody's body is different, some have a higher tolerance for such drugs, while others do not. Yes, you most "probably" got PN from those mix of drugs. And, yes, they knew it was a possibility you could get these side effects from taking them. But the question is; what to do now? First thing is first - you NEED to get a doctor that can help you manage and treat Neuropathy, or one that will send you to a specialist that can do so. This is not an easy task. I have been dealing with bad Neuropathy for over a year, and I just found a doctor that can understand my needs. The crucial elements between doctor and PN patients is "communication" - it means the world to have a doctor that can REALLY help you out. You and I have something in common, we both got PN from a mixed dose of drugs - in my case, Cipro, NSAIDS, and Benzos. Separately, these drugs can be harmful to some, let alone taken together. :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::::::: Okay, now what to Do? Get your head straight - realize that your case is unique to you - your body is not the same as everyone else, so no one can say if you will heal completely or be Doomed. Most assuredly, if not healed completely in time, you WILL get much better. ...And yes, you can get your life back. Just hang in there. :D You need to take a certain amount of control of your own life, doing research on pn and what vitamins, hormones/supplements to take in order to start a strong healing regiment. In other words, don't rely on your doctors, most are very ignorant of what pn is and how to treat it. There are however, specialist places for pn, such as the one in Chicago and other Neurological Medical establishments. However, like me - some get denied after assessment. Still not sure why? But if you can get a chance to see a specialist in the field of PN you should go see them. Here's a personal example: I went through loads of blood tests, but only recently, have I gotten the news that my vitamin D levels are extremely low from a low of 9 - to a high of 15. Something I did not know about or was even aware of until about 3 weeks ago. This alone might be a great discovery in helping me fight off pn. So you see, you have to be "proactive" in finding out what works for you -what makes you feel better, and what to take in order for you to live a less painful and stressful life. You can get great advice from this wonderful forum, which updates its site with new discoveries very often. Let's recap here: #1: Know that you are NOT doomed! This is not a pep-talk it's reality! Even if you do not heal completely, in time, you WILL heal enough to get your life back. #2:Try to find a doctor to whom you can communicate well with and who can help you "Manage" your pn issues. #3: Be proactive - learn all you can about your condition and how to possibly heal from it. Be wary of "quick-healing-scams" and what you put in your body. But don't over analyze too much, or it will drive you crazy. Use common sense and patience about such things. #4: Stick to a strong regiment of supplements and lifestyle. Carefully select what supplements help you and which do not, and try not to indulge in things that might make your brand of pn flare-up. #5: Please keep a daily journal of your progress. I have a very detailed journal of my pn troubles pains and healing strides, and there is no doubt I have gotten better. In times of depressing flare-ups, it is important to have this as a clear gauge that you will get better. My advice about using this site. This is a smorgasbord of information that is very, very helpful in healing and understanding pn and its victims. However, do not engage in tedious debates, as in all forums, there are always some who like to debate, more than contribute. In other words, don't be overwhelmed by some negative things you may read here. Take what is useful to you and ignore any Doom-Sayers - your mental health is just as important as your physical health. Something to keep in mind. God Bless you, and I pray for a steady and bright recovery.:hug: Here is a list of links you may find helpful: http://peripheralneuropathycenter.uc...ic/drugs.shtml http://www.hindawi.com/crim/endocrinology/2012/165056/ http://nervepainhelp.com/products/ http://jac.oxfordjournals.org/content/37/4/831.long :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: |
Good post Jesse!
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Healing quinolone induced neuropathy
After making some radical changes to my diet and lifestyle, I've seen major improvements in nerve pain. I had to cut out all grains, (wheat, rice, oats, etc), dairy, soy, sugar, coffee, alcohol, processed foods or beverages, and nuts (these can be inflammatory). I only eat organic or grass fed foods and drink distilled or purified water. Plus, I exercise lightly for now - walking, yoga, or light biking. And on top of all that, I take high doses of magnesium (including Epsom salt baths), vitamin D, B12, CQ10, and quite a few other supplements. Sleep and managing stress are important too.
Although extreme and these changes have not been NOT easy, the idea is to reduce inflammation in the body which reduces pain and allows for healing. Since I didn't know what specifically caused inflammation for me, I cut out everything that possibly could and will slowly add foods back down the road. So far, this regimen has worked for me and if I follow it ever day, the pain is very well managed. If I vary from this regime, then the pain comes back. For example, I ate a few servings of rice and nuts two weeks ago, and suffered for five days because of it. One online book I would highly recommend is "The Levaquin Tendonitis Solution". It provides a lot of good information about supplements and the healing process after Quinolone toxicity. |
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And, of course this does not work for CMTers as CMT is inherited. Probably fine for someone who does not have an inherited neuropathy.
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Thank you for your comments. My peripheral neuropathy was very intense after my initial reaction to Ciprofloxacin this July. Although it is much improved through diet and lifestyle changes, it's hard to say if the damage is temporary or permanent. I am not very familiar with other forms and causes of neuropathy, so my suggestions are definitely more related to quinolone induced neuropathy.
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Where are you now Jesse M? I realize this is an old thread. It's now 2 years later. I am just wondering If you had any improvement in your PN?
Thanks!!! |
I may possible have just figured out where my idiopathic PN came from!! I have recently been reading about long term use of Ambien causing Peripheral Neuropathy. It is listed as a side effect under Central and Peripheral Nervous System. Now, thanks to this post I am reading about the relationship between some antibiotics and PN.
I have used Ambien for years as prescribed by my doctor. I have taken it continuously since January due to many horrible events in my life . I stopped a week ago after reading about it and my symptoms are starting to lessen. I do not want to get too excited because every time I think I've figured something out my symptoms start up again and I'm back to square one..... Then I remembered my pulmonary doctor put me on azithromycin 250 mg a day for 2 months May and June. I don't know if this effected me as I was already having symtoms but I doubt it was helpful. Also this antibiotic is not on the list of ones with PN side effects but at this point I don't have a lot of trust in Pharmaceutical companies. I am definitely going to look into Benfotiamine and make my standard liver tonic (Beet Kvass if any of you are interested let me know and I'll explain further.) Thank you!!! |
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When i first got this i found a capucturist with a background in neuroligy and he adviced me to take Alpha lipioc acid&Acetyl L-Carnitine and borage oil. Its a different aproach then what you have taken. So why take these vitamines?What reseaurch have you done to support this approach?I am very curouis. I am now 6 years into this PN thing. If i mountain bike 35 km i will get a very nasty flare-up for about a week where i dont like my feet. The same goes for doing squats so i am really limited at this moment which is a big frustration. My PN developt a completly diverrently,in my case it developt very slowly and got wurse over time.I dodnt experience the pain that goes with dying nerves. What is very uncomfortable are the flare-ups mostly after a sport activity,somethimes if i really feel good even the numbness is less dominant. |
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JesseM has not been around to Post for about 20 months. Perhaps you would like to expand on your Post so current Members can address you personally. Welcome to the Community. Dave. |
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Fluoroquinolone
Hello and welcome to the NeuroTalk Support Groups.
A good way to find more posts regarding Fluoroquinolone or Fluoroquinolones, is to use the forum search feature. I'll leave the link below. There is no need to put in a username but check for posts on the Peripheral Neuropathy Forum. I just did that myself and found a number of posts that may be of help to you. Unfortunately you would need to do your own search as my page filled with search results will not copy over. http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/search.php p.s. There are also some in the PN Tips, Resources, Supplements & Other Treatments sub-forum |
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