[dancinglady]

All of this information and not until we are diagnosed with this devastating disease do we find out that if we had done things differently we would not be suffering. WOW. Listen to one of the doctors about Cipro and used to take them on a regular basis. WOW again. I have been damaging my nerves for 40 years. Great what a reward for listening to doctors.

[icelander]

Originally Posted by dancinglady

All of this information and not until we are diagnosed with this devastating disease do we find out that if we had done things differently we would not be suffering. WOW. Listen to one of the doctors about Cipro and used to take them on a regular basis. WOW again. I have been damaging my nerves for 40 years. Great what a reward for listening to doctors.

Pharmaceuticals are often dangerous. Those "side effects" are not side effects IMO, they are effects proper. The medical model used to make these meds is that they target a certain symptom and make the assumption that that direct path from (A) pain to (B) symptom is a clean line from A to B. But the brain/body doesn't work like that. (A) can effect (B) or anything else from (A) to (Z). It's all effects. So while you might get relief of some pain you might also damage some other parts of your physiology. Like your bladder won't work right or you'll damage your nerves etc. These are not side effects. These drugs are dangerous and they know it or they choose to ignore it for profit.

The medical model IMO is mostly broken. The place they still shine is traumatic injury. They have that down very well and help people.

But often disease is the result of lifestyle choices and other environmental factors. This is hardly addressed by the medical profession now and the only reason it is at all is that patients have revolted and insisted that lifestyle can be a direct cause or worsening of disease. But they are hardly the experts in this most important area. They hardly mention it if you don't bring it up. It's a dangerous maze you must navigate when you involve yourself with pharms. By the time most people are ill they feel they have little choice. But it's a crap shoot if you will be helped or hurt as is evidenced by all the legit drug deaths every year and that does not include folk who are only made worse or sickened.

[Patrick Winter]

Originally Posted by icelander

Pharmaceuticals are often dangerous. Those "side effects" are not side effects IMO, they are effects proper. The medical model used to make these meds is that they target a certain symptom and make the assumption that that direct path from (A) pain to (B) symptom is a clean line from A to B. But the brain/body doesn't work like that. (A) can effect (B) or anything else from (A) to (Z). It's all effects. So while you might get relief of some pain you might also damage some other parts of your physiology. Like your bladder won't work right or you'll damage your nerves etc. These are not side effects. These drugs are dangerous and they know it or they choose to ignore it for profit.

The medical model IMO is mostly broken. The place they still shine is traumatic injury. They have that down very well and help people.

But often disease is the result of lifestyle choices and other environmental factors. This is hardly addressed by the medical profession now and the only reason it is at all is that patients have revolted and insisted that lifestyle can be a direct cause or worsening of disease. But they are hardly the experts in this most important area. They hardly mention it if you don't bring it up. It's a dangerous maze you must navigate when you involve yourself with pharms. By the time most people are ill they feel they have little choice. But it's a crap shoot if you will be helped or hurt as is evidenced by all the legit drug deaths every year and that does not include folk who are only made worse or sickened.

My take is in general pharmaceuticals are not a great option. There are times when they fill a vital role of course, diabetics, thyroid issues, etc. Things that are genetic defects and require intervention. Pain also at times needs pharma. Because at times when you have pain, it is very tough to be optimistic. if something can alleviate that and give you a decent quality of life and offers a side effects that are minimal in comparison to the sickness you have. Its a learning process. Doing research is what is key.

[pinkynose]

For me one of the main problems with Pharmas are they don't correct the cause of the problem ie pain. Take a cortisone injection for example. It is not even directed at the pain, but is an anti inflammatory that will pretty much affect everything in it's path. It will mask the pain and then people think they are better and will go out and really hurt themselves so they end up with joint replacements. Btw one of the side effects is neuropathy.

Then there's the ever popular antibiotics which doctors prescribe and people take for a cold. It destroys both good and bad bacteria leaving your gut in an awful state primed for another infection.

I could go on and on but the point is imo we all need to educate ourselves before we see doctors. Even if you take that prescription you can still go home and research before you fill it. What would be best would be to find a doctor that will work with you to look for causes.

And yes, I do know that unfortunately to be able to live with some of the symptoms many of us are having we must give in to the meds, but not because we are ignorant.

[Patrick Winter]

Originally Posted by pinkynose

For me one of the main problems with Pharmas are they don't correct the cause of the problem ie pain. Take a cortisone injection for example. It is not even directed at the pain, but is an anti inflammatory that will pretty much affect everything in it's path. It will mask the pain and then people think they are better and will go out and really hurt themselves so they end up with joint replacements. Btw one of the side effects is neuropathy.

Then there's the ever popular antibiotics which doctors prescribe and people take for a cold. It destroys both good and bad bacteria leaving your gut in an awful state primed for another infection.

I could go on and on but the point is imo we all need to educate ourselves before we see doctors. Even if you take that prescription you can still go home and research before you fill it. What would be best would be to find a doctor that will work with you to look for causes.

And yes, I do know that unfortunately to be able to live with some of the symptoms many of us are having we must give in to the meds, but not because we are ignorant.

Very true. i always can tell when a doctor is not good. i see it so often. They get an irritated look on their face when they prescribe meds and you either refuse to take them, or do take them and say that they aren't working or that you don't like taking them because of the side effects. 9 times out of 10 then get irritated or frustrated and have a baffled look. Rarely is there a guy who will say, ok, so here are the natural options. They say, lets try a different med, or give the med more time. Or the side effects will go away eventually, etc. What do they care? they dont have the sickness. Or let's keep trying to figure out the root cause. Every now and then you get a doctor who is good with other options but it is just so rare.

[MikeK]

In my case if it wasn't for drugs I'd probably be dead, like they say the cure the cure is worse than the disease......

see my signature line for explanation

[Neuroproblem]

Originally Posted by Patrick Winter

My take is in general pharmaceuticals are not a great option. There are times when they fill a vital role of course, diabetics, thyroid issues, etc. Things that are genetic defects and require intervention. Pain also at times needs pharma. Because at times when you have pain, it is very tough to be optimistic. if something can alleviate that and give you a decent quality of life and offers a side effects that are minimal in comparison to the sickness you have. Its a learning process. Doing research is what is key.

Pharma is there to make profit, and they will charge the alot to the insurance or hospital who uses thier products, which why certain generics exist to keep costs low. Thier excuse for an overcharge is to recover"investment from research and development" Of course they have that right, but thier profits already exceed thier research anyways, the worst thing is that since they have patents, nobody can make cheaper alternatives, this allows them to have monopolies on the drugs. the most profitable drugs, i learned from my biochem teacher was lipitor, a CHOLESTEROL drugs, it earned them hundreds of billions of dollars. chronic conditions are pharmaceuticals main market, because they know that people who have chronic illness need these medications.
for antibiotics, there is a big problem, because using antbiotics to treat a viral disease is wasteful and its ineffective. AS abx breeds antibiotic resistance,

[pinkynose]

Originally Posted by Neuroproblem

Pharma is there to make profit, and they will charge the alot to the insurance or hospital who uses thier products, which why certain generics exist to keep costs low. Thier excuse for an overcharge is to recover"investment from research and development" Of course they have that right, but thier profits already exceed thier research anyways, the worst thing is that since they have patents, nobody can make cheaper alternatives, this allows them to have monopolies on the drugs. the most profitable drugs, i learned from my biochem teacher was lipitor, a CHOLESTEROL drugs, it earned them hundreds of billions of dollars. chronic conditions are pharmaceuticals main market, because they know that people who have chronic illness need these medications.
for antibiotics, there is a big problem, because using antbiotics to treat a viral disease is wasteful and its ineffective. AS abx breeds antibiotic resistance,

imo that overcharge excuse for research is a crock. Ambien has had a generic for a long time yet it you go to buy brand ambien you will pay a minimum of $450.00 for 30 pills.

[mrsD]

Big pharma hasn't done research for many years. Today they lease drugs from universities and NIH etc. But they would like everyone to believe they did the development of a new drug... it is just another lie they love to push.

http://www.wanttoknow.info/truthaboutdrugcompanies

I have Dr. Angell's book, BTW and it is a good read.

[madisongrrl]

Originally Posted by mrsD

Big pharma hasn't done research for many years. Today they lease drugs from universities and NIH etc. But they would like everyone to believe they did the development of a new drug... it is just another lie they love to push.

http://www.wanttoknow.info/truthaboutdrugcompanies

I have Dr. Angell's book, BTW and it is a good read.

I listened to a good interview with her a few years back on a podcast called Econ Talk. I would like to read her book.

http://www.econtalk.org/archives/201..._on_big_p.html