So now I forgot a benchmark - 2700 days (2704 today actually). Time flies!


Sloppy is a good thing in this case. I really don't concentrate on it anymore when it comes to "my" recovery. But: still getting angry when I see how people and media pussyfoot around the alcohol addiction problem. They are fine to talk about heroin (it's "cool" in a perverse way) but alcohol... too close to home I suppose?


But let's not end on an unhappy note: I still think it's the best thing I ever did in my life, 2704 days ago. Not for pats on the back, no, just for myself.



PS: fasting (accidental in my case, busy, forgetting to eat, not really hungry) works wonders against the pain too. I've had 2 weeks of almost zero pain, even though it's a stressful time for me. Could be a coincidence of course, but always worth a try to not eat for a day or 2 (if you can manage, don't faint on me OK?)


OK, chase with Icehouse back on. Getting married, on the Bahamas no less! Tssk! ;)

Hard to answer: usually PN would start in your feet first and then go up if you don't stop the cause. The honest truth is even the best neurologists sometimes have to guess a bit. Our nervous system is incredibly complex, and it doesn't help that our brains play a part in deciding what we are feeling (or not). Even the "knots" along the way can generate their own pain as they expect a signal but don't get it etc. And those can be "retrained" it seems to "shut up".



I have zero pain in my calves, they do feel slightly numb, but all the real pain is concentrated in my toes (big toes the worst). I have very very light tingling sometimes in my fingers - but not bad enough to prevent me from playing piano or guitar or bass -, but no where else on my body at all.



As said, keep a diary, but be fully prepared to not listen to "us", as you really seem to have a different condition that isn't "peripheral".

Thanks Wide-O, super helpful. Will definitely take your advice.

Think you are right on the neuro guessing a bit, I pushed him pretty hard on everything. After the EMG was normal, pushed him on the SFN and skin biopsy. In his opinion, because this didn't really start and worsen in my feet/toes, the labs were fine, EMG was fine and the physical exam was fine, he felt like there isn't much more to do.

He just told me to come back in 6 months to a year if things don't get better or get worse! In the meantime I may see if my regular doctor can test me for any vitamin deficiencies (other than B12) and/or alergies.

Blood panels are always useful. I don't know where you live, so it may be easy for me to say, and expensive/cumbersome for you.


When I was in a bad shape and searching for answers, I had regular blood panels done, to also see trends, to see what supplements actually worked etc. But for me, if I call today, it will be done tomorrow morning and would have the results Tuesday for €2.00 Your mileage may vary.


I put the important ones in a spreadsheet to see over a full year what worked and what didn't. That way I ended up just taking D3, magnesium, and B12 - which is what my GP completely agreed with too, plus watching my diet. Not like a maniac, I still had my fries or whatever once a week, but my "bad cholesterol" was reduced to 1/3rd in 8 months (she had to look twice, but yep...). While eating quite a bit of healthy fats still (olive oil etc), but just going easy on the carbohydrates (and fast sugars, d'oh).



So still lots to try without stressing out too much. I spent 10 hours on my feet working on my car yesterday, using heavy machinery etc. No pain today (yeah, my back LOL). Age 57, so no longer a pup... So we learn to manage it, good days and some bad ones.

I made it back to the USA (kicking and screaming) with my wife and we will settle back in to reality in the morning....grrrrr.

Looking forward to you passing me in the fast lane Wide-O!!!

Hello everybody,

Glad I found this forum!

I'll introduce myself properly soon, but I wanted to know if there's a sticky or post summarizing all the basics of alcoholic neuropathy?

I'd also really like to know what tests and such can rule out, or confirm the disease. As I always fear the worst, so it I'm hoping it's possible for a doctor to diagnose.

Thanks so much.

Hi grifter

Welcome to NeuroTalk :).

As far as I know there is no single place where all of the signs of alcoholic PN are collected in one place if only because it varies between different people.

The older version of this thread (https://www.neurotalk.org/alcoholism...europathy.html), which was closed because it was getting too big, is worth checking out in this context.

All the best.

Thank you, I'll check it out.

What about getting a clear diagnosis if the disease?

Are there tests that make this possible? Or does a doctor just make an educated guess?

Thanks again. (I'm freaking myself out )

This is very hard to say; often PN has no known cause(s).

In my case I stopped drinking more than ten years ago. My PN is in my hands only and has been stable/slowly decreasing since I stopped drinking.

Thank you.

Sorry, if I do have PN I'm sure it's from alcohol, but what I meant to ask is if a doctor can confirm that you have PN or not?

I'm worried about it perhaps being a long and complex thing to diagnose.

Or are there tests which can help give a proper diagnosis?

I also have health anxiety, so I'm making myself sick over it all.

:(

I'll share my story when I return from AA. And again, I'm glad I found such a supportive place online. Big thanks to everybody here.

Alcohol has destroyed me.

The worse thing is that I had plenty of warnings, which I ignored. This makes me hate myself even more right now.

I began abusing alcohol about 5-years ago.

I was also pulled up on it rather quickly from my wife.

This lead to doctors visits, and multiple 21-day rehabs with various lengths of sobriety.

I lost more and more each relapse until I had lost everything including my wife, friends, job, possessions, family, my health, and my sanity.

I'm now in a 9-month public rehab completely broken and hating life. I can't believe I've lost everything.

I also don't fit in with the people here.

Not trying to sound better than anyone, but most people here are both ice addicts and have come here from jail.

So the "jail talk" shocks me. So does the drug talk.

I feel completely hopeless and that my life is over. I can't stop thinking of what I've lost and I have no idea how I'll ever get over it.

The biggest thing giving me crippling anxiety at the moment is my health anxiety, and it's what lead me here.

The worst part is, that since I have health anxiety I don't know if I'm thinking the worst, making myself feel symptoms I don't have, or I really do have alcoholic neuropathy.

Anyway, after spending a week in hospital about 3-months ago for suicidal thoughts, along with alcohol and Valium abuse I left and continued to drink 10 schooners of beer a day for about ten weeks.

(But I did manage to taper off Valium completely in those weeks.)

During those weeks I started to get pins and needles in my hands, and sometimes my feet overnight.

My hands were also blotchy and red.

Instead of quitting, the only way I knew how to deal with it was to continue drinking, which I did until I checked in to a detox in hospital for a week before coming here.

Funny thing was, after a week in hospital I was feeling amazing and had no pins and needles! Yet that soon changed when I was an anxious mess as soon I started the rehab.

I wanted to run away.

Anyway, I've been here almost four weeks, and in that time my left elbow began hurting, and that numbness, pins and needles, plus burning returned worse than ever to my left hand.

Since it was only in one arm, and on the arm I broke my elbow as a kid which then required further surgery later in life, I guessed that I was using my bad arm more (as there's a lot of cleaning and kitchen duties here) and it was just some overuse issue.

But as it continued I then convinced myself I have alcoholic neuropathy.

I then further convinced myself I wasn't walking properly. Even though I was walking up 4 floors of stairs multiple times a day previously.

So, I feel I need to get properly tested so my mind doesn't keep destroying me.

As really, I don't know if this is alcoholic neuropathy, anxiety, Valium withdraws, or some sort of injury in my elbow.

I'm really hoping tests will be able to diagnose me.

As I'm going insane.

Thanks for reading and would love your thoughts. As my brain is not working. x

Deja-vu for me!

Drink lots of water and juice, get on a vitamin regime to replace all that you have lost, start some mild exercise to keep the muscles moving and, more importantly, try and leave the "drink" at the door.

The first year is tough BUT there is a light at the end of the tunnel for many of us!

Thank you for reading.

I'm guessing you can't really diagnose over the internet, but what do you think of my symptoms?

PN, or could it be something else? (Anxiety, elbow injury, Valium withdraws?)

I'm freaking out so damn hard and don't know how to calm my brain down.

It certainly appears like PN symptoms. The anxiety will most likely heighten the symptoms too.

Hey grifter, welcome. Yeah, anxiety is a sure way to make PN feel even worse. Try to calm down, take stock of the situation, and see what you can do to improve (quit drinking, replenish vitamins, start a healthy way of eating - which is not as complicated as many want you to believe - and keep or start moving a bit (little goes a long way).


Do not fret over the past: you can't change it, not even if you are Superman. You will find people in this thread who have been exactly where you are now (or worse...). We made it work, and we are in no way exceptional people. But we did stay focused, and wanted out/a better way to live.


Indeed we can not diagnose over the internet, but let's say I would be highly surprised if it wouldn't be PN. Some symptoms may be unrelated, or made worse by the PN, but yeah, if I were a betting man...


One tip: don't feel better than the folks who are worse off. For me it helped to be humble: my brain wasn't going to make me better, listening to other people did. Accepting help. And yes, I too learned where to score drugs etc. I too heard stories I had never dreamed of; people setting their house on fire to get attention, some people died while I was there in rehab... Try to filter out the noise, but don't judge them. Focus on you.


Good luck, keep visiting, keep trying. At some point it goes "click" and a new world and future slowly open up. And you will appreciate it even more when you look back and remember the state you are in now.


You can do it.

Hi Grifter. I am glad you found this community and that you are focusing on treatment.

I was warned about my neuropathy after my first 28 day stint in 2016. I didn't stay sober and kept putting poison in my body. Eventually in 2018, I went to rehab again, this time for 4 months. Nothing like waking up in a detox in a massive amount of pain from neuropathy. Anxiety ridden, loss of hope, confused, and lost. That was me.

There is lots of wisdom in Wide-O's post above. Awesome post.

I know this is tough, but I can tell you that it can get a lot better. Everyone's bodies are different but we are resilient. What's key is to stay sober, and to take it easy on yourself.

I can give you insight for what has helped me. In short though it's lifestyle changes. Exercise and diet. Making adjustments. It takes time but it's very much possible.

When I got here I read the entire first thread and this one. So if you havent already I would do some digging. I think you will find some hope in seeing how people have battled for a better life. I know I did.

Hang in there for now. I know you can do it. If you have any specific questions, shoot them out. I'll be back later or tomorrow and can post more of what helped me early on when I was in treatment.

Please do, and one thing that always strikes me...


When people ask me "but how did you DO it" ... I find it's impossible to summarize in a few words. I bet people get frustrated when they hear "be humble, open, look for, and accept help." It sounds like snake oil, right? One of these bloody motivational posters that are all over the internet. "You are a star, like the sun" or some such utterly useless BS. :D



But it is exactly what helped me. I'm not a patient person. I'm an "instant gratification" one. I'm not someone who doggedly keeps trying. I get bored and move on to the next thing. I had no real true reasons to feel "bad", and yet I started drinking like a fish. I had given up diets, or stopping smoking, hundreds of times. No willpower to speak of there... I struggle with how cruel the world can be, and my empathy was killing me. I'm a master in finding excuses. So now you want this type of person to get sober? Good luck!


Unless.. yeah, you accept your intelligence or status plays no role. Knowing stuff doesn't help you. But listening to other folks - both those who are in the same boat, and those who can give you a hand and give some nuggets of info, some survival strategies, some little tricks to get over that first year, the first weeks...


And like you, I also started to listen to people who had made the "journey" to sobriety.



I often think I made it because I felt I was nothing more or less than the worst people I found in rehab. I didn't drink & drive ... yet. I didn't beat up my wife ... yet. I didn't steal ... yet. But the edge was much closer than I liked to think. The "never before 8"s that became "never before 4"s... I think my death was planned for about 2014, maybe 2015. Before that there would only be hell on earth. And I wanted to live.



So don't be disappointed if we don't seem to have the "ultimate" quick answers. We try to describe what we did, how we felt, how we opened up to listen. How we slowly built our bodies & minds up with a healthier lifestyle. I could measure my sobriety in how well I started playing table tennis again. :) I found the little things that got me going - which may be different from yours. It's an active process too, you need to want to see the help that is offered. When someone asked me to make a drawing depicting how I saw sobriety, I could have said "Dude, are you nuts or something? Do I look like I'm 5?" Or just sit down, and let my inner kid (the one who never needed a drink to be happy BTW) do its thing.


My happiest moment was when I could put on my pants while standing up again. There. That was the real progress. A benchmark.



Anyway, hijacking OAF's reply. Over to you. ;)

How you making out grifter? Apologies I had a delay getting back to the thread.

I was mainly going to give some insight into how I have made adjustments through the past 1.5 years. Diet and exercise. My diet is low carb / no sugar. Exercise, I get some form of cardio in every day. Getting the blood circulating is something that is essential for me. Also the release of natural pain killers as a result of exercise helps too.

One of the benefits of this thing is getting to know your body and mind. I think we are a lot stronger than we originally understand prior to getting ourselves into a tough spot.

Everything that I incorporated I have done in small doses. I didnt just wake up and start riding a bike 60 mins a day with a gym membership. My exercise started with barely being able to do 5-10 pushups at a time in detox. I didnt jump straight into a keto diet lifestyle. I slowly removed sugar, then did the same with carbs.

My day is structured in a way that I have to do certain things in the morning to set myself up for success. And then I need to understand my limits and not take on too much later on in the night. Its about adjustments. I think what's tough is everyone is different. And at different ages, with different abilities. But for me I just try to do my best day in and day out. And I have to keep positive. Looking forward always, and never backwards with regrets.

Great post OAF.

3044 days sober!

Married a month now, and I had forgotten how nice it is to have a family that supports despite our brokenness :)

8.5 years later I still have lingering PN issues...mostly just tiredness in the legs and minor balance issues from time to time.

I do NOT miss alcohol at all....

Broken perhaps, but we sure did a hell of a job to “mend” it, no?
And no, can’t say that I do either. I just bought an expensive bottle of grappa in a liquor shop as a present to my wife, and didn’t even make the connection.

Or did you mean broke? 😉 I started working again, biting through the PN obstacles. Going fine so far, back on the horse. Another step in the recovery.

Congrats again on your marriage BTW! ;)

Thats great to hear Icehouse. Support from family gives me strength.

I could live with some lingering issues like that. But I try not to think of results and just focus on finding a process that I enjoy.

Getting cold here in NYC. Which means I wont be riding my bike across the 59th st bridge to work. So my morning includes a bit more time at the gym it would seem.

Another adjustment that I will be focusing on is getting a new job, one that allows some days that I can work from home. I worked from home for 7 years, and almost drank myself to death. After being back in the office for 6 months, I find enjoyment in it. And having the challenge of getting there by bike was awesome. But at the same time, I benefit for a few more hours in the day to be able to get things done while I feel strong in the morning.

Agreed. That was my biggest mistake! I loved having my own business (and I did really well) but I lack the ability to drink responsibly :p:D

Well, I'm mostly working from home again - which ain't a bad thing given the PN is usually most noticable in the morning.


I've obviously deleted the whole "drink at the same time" routine, and I'm not too worried about it this time. But I do remember how devastating it was not having to go out and being able to drink without anyone really noticing. I would have walked into trouble a lot sooner if I hadn't worked from home.


It's fun & exciting - but also a wee bit scary - to start this new chapter of running my own company again - after being a "houseman" for 8 years. I thought I'd find cobwebs in my brain, but no, it's all still pretty sharp, and the energy is there too. This time however it will be without my old companion, Mr. Jameson. ;)

Good luck on the new chapter Wide-O. Sounds exciting. Bet you still have it.

Interesting that your symptoms for PN come in the morning. For me, when I first wake up things are pretty quiet. No burning or shocks in the morning really. However they are really sensitive to being put down on a hard floor. Once I get moving though things are pretty good. Its all about getting the circulation going in the morning. I have been doing a few good old fashion jumping jacks in the morning that I have found really help with that when I'm short on time. Most days I can get a mile run in which sets me up for success for the day. Last night was a brutal one for sleep though. Which came out of nowhere because as of 9pm I was feeling so good. PN is so weird like that.

It's a weird but very pleasant surprise. I haven't paid any attention to my field of expertise (IT consulting, programming, design, UX etc etc) since the day I went off to rehab 7.5 years ago. My last program I wrote back then was a counter to see how long I was smoke & cig free, how much money it saved me, and then I never looked at it again.


Sure, I had some catching up to do (reading mostly), but it was amazing how quickly it all came back, and in the mean time I've finished a few smaller projects to great success, leading to more projects as well.


I honestly thought 57 was way too old to start again, especially in such a fast moving field, after such a long hiatus (and after battling an addiction). But the skills to navigate those fields are still there, are still just as valid, and being a house-man for 7 years has given me new energy in some weird way, like I only took an extended brain-vacation to load up the batteries.


ANd it's not just the money (I earned as much in one month (November) as I normally do in 10 months), it's also the realisation that recovery is an ongoing thing, and somehow this feels like the final stage of really getting back on the horse, and dealing with the PN as just a slight disadvantage instead of it being the center of my world.



So yeah, I'm pretty stoked. :)

Hey all thank you so much for your thoughtful replies.

Sorry for being a ghost, I’ve just been extremely anxious., but I’m back now!

I have a few questions that I hope you great people can answer:

As my initial symptoms that I thought was PN (which was my hands and legs "falling asleep" at night) disappeared when I was sober and hasn’t returned. Does that mean I healed from it?

And in saying that, my new symptoms of tingling in my left hand’s pinkie and ring finger, along with tingling on the palmar side of my hand under this, along with elbow pain on the same arm (which I fractured as a child and had operated on as a teen), only started two weeks into sobriety.

(Health anxiety makes me very vigilant to how my body’s feeling, so I would have know about it when I was drinking.)

So I’m wondering if since these symptoms appeared when I was two weeks sober, while the other symptoms I had disappeared in sobriety, that it may be unrelated and something to do with an ulnar nerve injury, or my health anxiety going mad?

As I can still do everything as normal. I just have these tingles and elbow pain.

I also want to get a clear diagnosis. As my doctor did some strength and reflex tests in her office which she said was normal, so she wants me to come back in six weeks if symptoms don’t improve.

However, my brain can’t handle the wait, so I’m going to return next week. So I’d like to know what to ask for to get a diagnosis. A referral to a neurologist? Or certain tests? As my biggest mental problem is "not knowing" if I’m imaging PN or I have it.

Thanks again, and really hope to get your thoughts on the above. As my brain is killing me more than the symptoms.

Whoa! They changed the look! Nifty!

I had some tests done at the local rehab place and they were essentially nerve tests. They pricked my hands and feet with sharp tools and measured something or other....I was not 100% but passable.

I remember, all so well, the numbness and tingling in my pinky and ring fingers. The tingling (like my legs fell asleep) in my lower legs was almost constant for about a year and that was one of the reasons I resorted to a wheelchair.

BUT, it does go away and I would not get too worked up about it. Laying off the alcohol, proper nutrition and vitamins and TIME will help you feel better.

I promise.

I am 8.5ish years sober now and I can assure you that things CAN get better!

Did they? Attachment 10276 :D

(yes they did, but you can change that look at the bottom of the page, left hand corner)

But yeah, what he said. Although I'm only just over 7.5 years sober at this point, it's the same message we have been giving over the years now: cleaning up our act works. Even if not everything will get back to 100%, it will become a side-issue.

Try to take control of the health anxiety, and convert the fear into action.

That's awesome! I am in IT as well. I am a PM/BA/Tech Lead supporting Salesforce.com implementations. I started as developer way back over 15 years ago and moved out of coding but still work with developers on a daily basis. I have some work to do with getting back to some more hands on work with Salesforce, not coding but configuration. I stepped away from that kind of stuff about 10 years ago, and then got put on a **** project doing PM work that I had no control over and it lasted 4 years. I enjoy the Salesforce.com space, currently working on landing a full-time roll which will allow for partial remote work. It's nice to be able to stay home a few days a week, and my wife and I can travel often (she's a flight attendant so I have benefits). So being able to work from anywhere is a big plus when you can take 4 day trips here and there.

It's awesome that you are getting back into it, especially if it's fulfilling.

Great message. Love the "convert fear into action".

I see a common thread forming here. I am also an IT guy (but now I work in housing) with a B. Sc. in programming and design. I still do IT work at my current job but it't mostly networking and trouble shooting :)

Hey grifter, I am no expert at all, certainly not as knowledgeable as others on here, but I am going through something similar so thought I would share my experience.

I too am a hypochondriac, and it causes me much anxiety. Mine all started about 9 months ago, I noticed being a bit shaky, some back pain, and legs more sore than normal from minimal exercise. I didn't think much of it and kept going about my business (ie drinking fairly heavy - 3 or 4 times a week). Then about 4 months after a bender with a college buddy I started noticing being more shaky and tingling all over my body. The tingling only lasted like a day, but would come and go, started getting some fasciculations in my calves mostly, but randomly as well in other parts of my body. So I shut the booze down mostly, maybe a few glasses of wine with dinner here and there and decided to consult a neurologist.

I went in and he gave me a full neuro exam which is basically testing for all all of your senses, touch, pain, temperature. Then they do strength tests on all of your limbs as I think some more serious disorders begin with weakness in the limbs. Then you walk down the hallway normal, on your heels and toes, the doctor is looking at your gait, again to assess any other potential neurological issues. Since they found nothing wrong in the physical exam they sent me for an EMG test.

An EMG basically tests nerve function, and is really 2 parts, the EMG and an NCS. The NCS is a nerve conduction study where they put electrodes on your arms and legs and shock you a bit to test the speed the electricity is moving through your nerves. The EMG part is a bit more uncomfortable as they put accupuncture like needles in your muscles and have you flex and read the electricity in your muscles. Both tests are looking for any deterioration in nerve function which alocohol neuropathy generally causes, but is sometimes hard to detect.

In my case, he said based on my EMG, and because my symptoms were not textbook for neuropathy (ie pain/tingling in toes/feet, that moved to my legs and hands), he said just to monitor any progression and come back in 6 months to 1 year. We went back and forth a good bit about alcohol, etc and all he said was take it easy on the alcohol as it can cause long term damage and other issues, but he didn't think my current issues are alcohol related. Apparently there are tons of benign reasons for all of these symptoms, very frustrating.

Further, about a month ago I started getting a twitch in my right ring finger. Interestingly my legs feel much better, but hands and arms are worse. I emailed my doctor as I was nervous about more serious neuro disorders and he said not to worry that something like that, again, can be caused by many benign things, but if it would make me feel better to come back in for another physical exam. I might do that next month for piece of mind.

Another thing, I had shingles 3 months ago, and viruses like that can cause these neuropathic symptoms apparently.

Sorry for the long response, but hopefully it gives you some idea of the process. Unfortunately all of these things are super hard to diagnose, but if you find a good neurologist that you like and can talk to, they can be very helpful in helping you find the cause for your issues, or at least put your mind more at ease. I am still freaking out I have something way more serious (probably unnecessarily), but it is nice to have a dr that listens and responds to my paranoia.

Hope that helps.

3075 days sober

Well, it was quite the year, 2019 that is. Bought and sold an 1880 house, promotion at work, got married, and traveled to 3 different Countries for pleasure!

We break ground on our new house (with a mountain view) in a couple weeks and I am starting up another "recovery" group here in Virginia.

Here is to 2020! <clinks glass of soda>

But, overall I feel great, I still have sporadic bouts with balance and I am still thinking about that whole running thing. My wife runs often and I think I may have to succumb to peer-pressure soon....yikes!

Tell her one of the key things you learned about staying sober is completely resisting peer pressure! ;)


Sounds like 2019 was a good one though, and HNY, may this year be at least as good.

Congrats on an awesome year! Super inspiring.

I have been running a mile most mornings. It's become fairly natural to get it in, I dont experience much discomfort doing it. Just numbness down there, and I have to be careful with where my foot lands to avoid falls but I really enjoy it. It was 65 degrees here last Sunday, and I ended up getting 6 miles in. Granted it was super slow, I can't believe it actually happened. The longest I had done prior was 2 miles. For me what has been important is just doing what I feel comfortable and slowly adding little by little.

3107 days sober!

Just got back from a weekend at the beach. Walked about 3 miles on the sand and that was a workout in itself!

I have come to a plateau in recovery I believe, I am not getting any better or worse. Perhaps when the new house is finished I will get one of those funky elliptical things and see if that helps any....

70F (21C) today and I am heading to the river for lunch!

I think you are right that there is a time when there is no more progress, I have been noticing the same. I was gonna say "wow" @ the sand walking, but then I remembered I did pretty similar in the summer of 2018 in Italy. I was pretty relaxed back then (stress still has a huge impact on my pain levels), and the walking was pretty painless.


Anyway, not much to report, will be 2800 days next week. I will be going on a trip to Africa (Kenya) next month - if the corona virus doesn't mess things up, but I think it won't - with lots of travelling & trips. I have to admit I'm nervous about my feet holding up, but then again I think the reward will be worth it.

If you had asked me in 2012, I don't think "travelling to Kenya" would have been something I could imagine doing, but here we are.


Finally: for the folks who are still in doubt about their drinking, I'm currently reading this book from Prof. David Nutt, called "Drink?" It's pretty sobering (pun might be intended) as it lays out everything that happens when you a) drink and b) have a hangover. It's a pretty scary read, and before you think he needs to loosen up: he is a big proponent of THC, mushrooms, and even LSD used in the right way (could cure depression and PTSD...), so no, he's not "anti drugs" at all cost.


Anyway, even if you don't believe him (that alcohol is by far the worst drug humans ever invented), it's still a very interesting read, also with good tips for people who do NOT want to stop drinking.

Can't edit previous message anymore, but if you prefer video instead of reading, here is a 2 part, 90 minute interview where he explains most of what he wrote in this book. :)

DAVID NUTT - DRINK? Why Alcohol Is The Most Damaging Drug In The World - Part 1/2 | London Real - YouTube

3135 days sober..

Not much to report this month. Work, build house and weekend trips...

Spent a weekend in Washington DC, at the Museum of the Bible, and it was 6 floors of exhibits which, after an eight hour day, felt like MILES of walking.

Good thing the hotel had a hot tub!!