Counting the days?
 

"Well done" isn't anywhere near enough of a pat on the back.
Here's a thought though. I am only on day 31, and I am beginning to wonder wether or not it's a good idea, (for me), to be counting up? Sometimes I wonder wether or not my subconcious is using it as a countdown to the next drink?

Coopster, I think that "counting" works differently for different people.

I counted for the first year or so but now I just reflect on how much healthier I feel as well as looking at my bank balance and smiling :cool:.

I sometimes have an echo in here with kiwi ;)

Thanks Coopster. Yes, it's a personal thing, probably 50/50 even. For me, and I think for Icehouse too, it's a way to be accountable. I loved seeing the numbers tick, like a child looking in a gas station meter (but in reverse, I guess...) and report on them here.

But now it may well be I'm going to concentrate less on it, "move on" as it were. Do something with my new found freedom. Maybe just mention it yearly.

To come back to you, if it makes you feel in any way uncomfortable, don't count. Many don't, and still stay sober. There are no wrong or right ways, except for drinking or not. How you get there, what works best for you, you have to find out. Counting is probably not for you, so don't. :)

Well, I use a counter on my phone for two reasons.

1) To be accountable to this group and to my Wed night recovery group.

2) I really don't have another reason.

I used to watch it like a hawk for the first year or two, now I only check it once a month (on the 2nd). I actually have no idea what the actual number is unless I look....that is a good thing.

When somebody asks me about my sobriety I usually just say, "I have been sober for years"

That makes me feel good.

It's funny, although I'm not in AA, and have only quickly read the Big Book, I find myself somehow doing amends, and contacting people again I should have contacted long ago.

You know how families can be complicated. Well, I haven't spoken to my brother for at least 20 years, but he has a daughter who's mum - my brother's first wife - passed away earlier this year. So I contacted my niece with my condolences, we talked a little more, and will see each other somewhere in the new year to have a good long talk. I have only ever seen her as a 6 month old baby, she now is a mom herself, so that's also a bit of a shock about time flying and all that.

Anyway, I think there is value in trying to correct some wrongs from the past, even if they are not directly related to your addiction. :)

I am not an attendee of any AA meetings either, not since my first stint at rehab. BUT, I am an advocate of amends.

I finalized my last one in October and it was like "breaking the chains". I highly recommend this for anyone in recovery from an abusive addiction.

I have used the idea of amends a lot.

For me it is based on the Maori word for enemy which is hoariri.

The literal translation of hoariri is "angry friend" - I don't think that I have any enemies :).

Had to think of you today. Had lunch with an old friend. He used to see me every week - even during my really heavy drinking periods - both for work and private (we played music together). He was one of the ones that thought "it wasn't so bad though was it?" He still did today BTW. But more important, I somehow said "2011 days now", and he said "they all do that, don't they, the counting?" So I had to explain to him that no, some don't.

Find your own best rituals, it's a very personal thing. I remember this being discussed in rehab a lot too. There it was about "but we always talk about booze here, so of course we think about wanting to drink all the time". It's similar, in that you somehow learn to separate the subject or the "number" from the actual drinking.

It may well be that, after a while, you feel secure enough to start counting. Or, again, not. Doesn't matter Never feel bad about how you do things, as long as they help you.

Also interesting: he is one of the people that think/said "But if you drank today, it wouldn't be so bad anymore, would it? I mean, after 5 years plus!" He was serious, and concerned, it wasn't to yank my chain. So I had to explain that it is not how it works, on the contrary. He learned a new word today (kindling...)

There are still many misconceptions about alcoholism, even with very smart people.

Just checking in. Unfortunately I am missing out on much of the holiday festivities as they involve walking and standing and I can't put myself in that situation and so have had to make up random excuses to hide behind. I must keep my expectations modest and realistic. I manage well in my little dwelling but when I venture out I struggle. Today I am going to do a bit of shopping but long gone are the days where I can spend hours at the stores just to knock things out. If I can manage an hour I will consider that a good day.
There is much drama around me with neighbors and friends. It is just especially sad this time of year when so many are sustaining such terrible losses and struggling with major illnesses. As discouraged and depressed as I am over my neuropathy issues, I consider myself lucky as I look around me and the struggles of others. I brought this on myself while they are innocent victims. My heart hurts for them.

I think you are doing a good job - or getting better at - managing expectations. PN will hinder us - each and every person on this thread I think - but will not prevent us from living a full life. And indeed, many people are so much worse off.

Also: to be clear, improvement is still possible. I'm trying to be as honest as I can here, but things are always "in a context". I went from a level 7 to 8/10 pain situation to a usual 2 (with proper medication) to 4 (on a bad day). That is huge. But it's still chronic pain, and affects me, and I need to deal with that, and I have bad days with "why me?" too. But less and less so. Because I adapted my expectations to match reality.

Sure, no all day shopping for you, I get that. But shopping for a small hour is about a small hour more than I could manage after 8 months sober. It took me 2 years before I could go to a live pop-concert, standing for 1.5 hours, but sitting down occasionally for some relief. Still, I was up for about an hour though, at least. Felt like I finished a marathon and won the lottery at the same time.

So... enjoy that one hour or even 30 minutes you can manage. Festivities are a blessing to some, but a total drag on many many people. So yeah, try to have some fun nonetheless, and good on you for being able to think about those who are less fortunate still. :hug:

Wide-O, Thank you so very much for sharing. Reading about PN and the prognosis on the internet does not mean as much as real life experiences. I am a bit more encouraged and will hang in. Again, my sincere thanks.

Wishing all my Christian friends here a wonderful Christmas.
You all are a joy to me and I am grateful for all the support and insight you have so graciously offered. May we all have a healthy and happy 2018. :hug:

I wish all here (regardless of religion) alcohol-free cheer over the holiday season and for 2018.

Yeah, can a poor condemned-to-hell atheist like me not have a good day? ;)

Just kidding, no offense taken at all. :hug:

Just a quick note that for various reasons I needed to bring out some low THC/high CBD weed again for someone else's nerves. I tried it myself too, again, to see if maybe it would... but nah. Even after one and a half joints: nope.*

This question comes up a lot, and legalities aside (it's legal-ish here): don't expect it to work for everyone. For some people it's a blessing, for some, like me, it does nothing at all to change the PN feelings. I'd get high long before I would feel any less discomfort - which is not what an addict like me wants to pursue - and I never liked getting high (or too drunk) anyway.

I was glad I could put it out and just grab my trusty old vape again.

Anyway, happy holidays to all of you, and thanks for the support, as always! :hug:

* in case someone wonders "but was it good stuff?", I can confirm that the other person was high as a kite, nerves duly calmed. :D So: yeah.

When stressed my PN is always worse so in this regards the weed helps. Funny that a drunk like me does not like the feeling of being high, never did, and yet with my first drink/buzz I felt normal for the first time in my life. Go figure.

Right, good point. But probably related, as it does not calm me down - I'm one of the people that start to feel slightly paranoid/antsy. Something to do with certain brain receptors (I know our brains have a specific receptor or THC (or was it CBD? no, THC I think), and mine doesn't work properly heheh.

BTW, met many many people in rehab that had gone bonkers from weed. Not sure if because it is super-strong these days (like 20 times stronger than before). They had a serious hard time getting off it, so as always, some things are are mostly non-addictive to most can sometimes be very addictive to others.

Still (half off topic) I am for legalizing it, as when you buy the stuff in Holland for example, you have the legal shops with much choice, advice, and they get tested/have a reputation to protect. Less chance of buying someone's lawn mixed with a bit of hay like when you buy on a street corner. :D ) But that does not mean it's always harmless - that I have seen first hand. Pretty shocking even, those folks were just as washed out as us alcoholics, heroin addicts, etc. (it was a multi-addiction facility)

Smoking cannabis is associated with schizophrenia though the cause:effect relationships are not clear.

Maybe people with a predisposition to schizophrenia are more likely to smoke cannabis than people without a predisposition. Maybe smoking cannabis can trigger schizophrenia in some people and maybe both of these can happen in some people.

Exactly. The going theory in rehab from the psych was that in most cases, the cannabis brought out the underlying dysfunction, but most probably didn't cause it. FWIW, I haven't really done any research, but he is/was a highly respected professional (and president of the Psych society in my country).

Thinking/remembering further... it also brought out paranoia in people who were already very anxious. When I went in there was one guy, Jewish, very intelligent, one big huge gigantic bundle of nerves. He had been in the circle of nervous-smoke joint to calm down-bad effect-another joint to try-bad effect and even crisis.

He didn't stay. His addiction to cannabis at that point (something you rarely read) was so strong that he managed to make an arrangement with his uncle in Tel Aviv to come over; his family here (in Belgium) had said: 'If you leave rehab you are no longer welcome here.' Well, he uprooted his life, left rehab, left all his belongings (car even) and went to Israel. (not sure if he could find weed there coming to think of it, but I guess he will have)

So when people tell me "cannabis is not addictive" I say, "uhuh, sure, most of the time, but not everyone is like everyone else". I think if there's anything we learn here at NT is that no 2 people are alike, that stats are nice, but not always useful when it comes to the individual. A famous Dutch writer once wrote: "A statistician had carefully calculated, after years of research, that the little river in his town was 20cm deep on average. He waded in. He drowned." ;)

My thoughts are that pot should be legal or at least decriminalized for the casual user. I believe there could be addictive properties since many who partake use it to self medicate and unless the underlying issues are addressed the propensity exists. Heck, even sex, sugar and food in general can be addictive to a certain subset.
I have a child that struggled with opiods. He is on drug therapy for the long haul and yet still drinks and smokes weed. My understanding is that these should be avoided yet his addiction specialist doctor claims that opiods are unlike other drugs and so abstaining from all other drugs does not apply, as long as they are used in moderation. I don't understand that logic.

Anyone else have the sensation that their feet are ice cold and yet are warm to the touch? I am sure it is PN but this weirdness just started a month ago. So annoying and I have to wonder if it will continue in the warmer months. Always something new with this beast. :(

SC,
completely agree.....My daughter had been a cocaine user; she was in rehab a couple of times.. Although alcohol is not her drug of choice and rarely every drank; it was greatly stressed NO ALCOHOL.....or any other drugs. She goes to AA meetings and has to say; "My name is .........; I am an alcoholic and drug addict". She has been "clean" for several years. But thru rehab, those in charged; if you stop one; you will eventually go to the other....

BTW: She thoroughly believes in AA meetings has and still has been going for years. She is now a Certified Alcohol & Drug Counselor (CADC), as well as a Certified Recovery Support Specialist for Mental and Substance Abue (CRSS).

Gerry

Yes, I still worry about him and wonder if he has ever worked thru his demons. I watch his behavior closely and while I don't think he drinks to great excess, it could escalate at any time. Once an addict always an addict and he likely inherited my addictive personality. As for me I always loved my beer. I thought drinking non alcoholic beer would be a logical substitution after rehab but even that was stressed as a big no-no and brain tease.

I wrote a very long reply yesterday, forgot to post (grr), but basically agreed mostly. Shame.

Just imagine my usual long-winded post to say in my own way I agreed. ;):D

I happened to find a pic from, erm, someone who used to drink. It's erm, a friend. Yes, a friend. On the left he was 10 days in rehab, about 5.5 years ago. On the right, a non-photoshopped (so he tells me) version of the same friend, yesterday. My friend say he hoped it may inspire people if they are looking for a reason to get or stay sober.

Attachment 10132

I wish you all a great 2018!:hug:

Oh wow! Very powerful visual!

Thanks! I mean, I'll tell my friend. ;)

Um, weird, I had a "friend" over the other day too....he got sober in 2011 and here he is a couple weeks ago.

Kid is pretty ugly so I was reluctant to post his picture....

http://https://www.neurotalk.org/att...4&d=1514724856

The visuals of your friends is so powerful. Both men truly have stepped back in time and look so fresh. Please tell your “friends” they’ve done good and while I’m all about being humble, it’s important to acknowledge and credit the work they have put in to maintain their sobriety. Really well done :hug::hug:

Those are inspiring before and after images of your friends Wide-O and Icehouse.

Thank you both for sharing them :).

Hi all.
Firstly, happy new year to you and all other members.
About the cold sensation in your feet, I too get it, even as we speak. It doesn't matter what the weather, I think it is part and parcel of the numbness etc; I've been 55 days sober as of today, (christmas has been easier than I thought), and I haven't noticed any improvement, or worsening of the pain. My GP has put me on 10mg Amitriptyline, one a day, but I am only 10 days in, so haven't really noticed any difference. One thing that the Doc said that did resonate with me was that none of it will ever be cured, but it's progression may be slowed. I suppose only time will tell.
Ironic event of the year? An Alcohol support worker turning up at my home, at 44 days sober, (and after countless referrals), offering me a place in a detox and rehab center, which I have been asking, or rather begging for, for months.
On the bright side, it's a new year, and it will turn out as good as I want it to be.
Hard graft and faith in ourselves is all we can do.

Oh dear! Having done the same myself on numerous occasions, I know the frustration! One thing it has taught me, the right click mouse and copy button!

I would post my "friend" but her before and after pics look the same as she only has 6 months of sobriety. FYI, your "friends" are hotties!:D

Computer, I am confused. Is this a job offer or for treatment?

I usually do two things when composing a long post: press Control-A (Windows, not sure what the equivalent in OSX is) and then Control-C. This selects all and copies it into memory. Then I do a Preview Post. The preview is a "second copy". If it gets very long I paste the text into Notepad or Word before hitting Preview Post.

vBulletin works great most of the time, but it's easy to press a wrong button (like backspace...) and lose your complete post. Hence me taking precautions.

Of course, completely forgetting to hit "Submit Reply" and then go to sleep and turn off computer will not help at all LOL. :D Ahem.

It worked for me, but had too many side effects in the end. (like waiting 5 minutes to start to pee... :rolleyes:, weight gain, and blurry vision). But we are all different, so you may be luckier. It's a very old and well known med - as in *really old* so all the effects are known and there are no surprises anymore.

You need to give it a month at least, and maybe see if you need to up the dose slowly until it starts to really work. (ask GP I mean!) I forgot how much I took in the end, but it was much more than 10mg.

Edit: right, found an old stash. I worked up from 10 to 50mg IIRC. Of course, the higher the dose, the more chance for annoying side effects. And as always with these: don't just stop, but ask for a regimen to go off them gradually.

As to long posts I have decided just to Keep It Simple and sweet. As to the amitriptyline I tried that with Gab but did not continue or do the follow up as I was actively drinking and got no relief. (dah). I suspect I will need revisit the drug therapy. I had hoped in abstinence I would have gotten some relief but none so far.

I'll just keep reminding you that I felt at my worst after 8 months sober, pain wise. When I was still drinking, I only felt pain until the first 3 whiskies were downed...

So, if you are saying "it's not better", that would mean it didn't get worse when you stopped drinking. That's a very good thing. I know it sounds boring or even "there he goes again :rolleyes:", but remember that the pictures of our friends above were after 5 and 6 years, and I still need medication to control my PN. It's nowhere near as bad as after 8 months, but it certainly is not gone, nor do I think it ever completely will. You will find a balance after a while between taking (some) medication, and living with a degree of discomfort (well, ... pain) that you can manage and won't bother you too much in your daily life.

We humans are flexible. There are athletes without legs who run 100 meters. It's about adapting and accepting that things have changed, and then to make the best of it, and even be proud that you manage after a while. Keep doing what you are doing (staying sober, looking for solutions), you will get there too. :)

Never gets boring and those are the words I love to hear again and again. I made my New Years resolutions. Where I have failed in the past is expecting too much.

I wouldn't call it failure - that's too hard on yourself. It's very normal to expect/hope for a swift recovery. I mean, "I did a huge thing, I stopped drinking, I deserve at least some relief." Been there too. So, no, not a failure, just (indeed) over-expectations, impatience, which, funnily enough, makes things worse - as it adds to the stress levels. Adjusting expectations, and being glad with each little step forward, each bit of understanding, is key. And that takes time, there are no shortcuts (sadly).

Sure, I have pain, still. (but not too much to stop me from doing things. Many, many things.). Probably for life. But... I am soooooooo much happier now than I was 6 years ago, feeling so relieved, it should almost be illegal. :D A bit like my friend on those pictures! ;)