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Opinions on progression of toxic cause of PN

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Old 01-06-2008, 01:20 PM   #1
HeyJoe
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Default Opinions on progression of toxic cause of PN

Im asking here for opinions based on experience, reading, research, observation about the progression of my PN and wether it would fit the time frame of a toxic exposure causation or toxic exposure causing repiratory infections which lead to autoimmune response which attack nerves. After reading another thread about how toxin related PN's take a while to become evident and progress, which i have heard before of course, i just want to throw this out there and see what people think. Please dont hesitate to tell me what you think, Im not going to debate it or argue im just interested in input.

I was exposed to numerous toxins over 6 years ago now in a large dose in a two day exposure and then to a lesser degree over the next four months. I developed numerous respiratory infections and asthma a month later and at the same time i noticed that my big toe was partly numb. The progression of numbness and pain from 2001-2005 was relatively equal on both feet and calves and from 2003-2005 on both hands. Since 2005 it has stalled and hasnt progressed in area that i can notice though the degree of numbness has become greater. EMG/ncs have also not shown increased involvement of areas though the areas affected have gone from moderate to severe in the feet and mild to moderate in the hands. Ive had bloodtests for autoimmune causes, paraneoplastic causes, athena, toxins in blood ( not until October 2003, two years later) mri's, spinal tap etc. Nothing comes back positive except emg/ncs.

I have always felt that my PN was cause by toxic exposure or toxic exposure leading to respiratory to autoimmune response. What has nagged at me is that my numbness started a month after exposure at the same time the respiratory infections started. Based on the timing of the start of PN and the rate of the bilateral, equal progression do you think i may be offbase and what i think caused it is unlikely? Thanks.
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Old 01-06-2008, 01:27 PM   #2
mrsD
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Lightbulb I don't think you are "off base"

But I have a question. With all the antibiotics, and relapses, for the lung involvement, were you ever checked for yeast/mold cause?

Many pneumonias that are chronic, may be fungal noscomial infections.
And when that happens, the PN gets bumped into overdrive due to the high level of aldehydes the organisms dump into your blood stream.
http://www.merck.com/mmhe/sec04/ch042/ch042d.html

I seem to recall that you respond somewhat to Thiamine. So that makes me wonder.
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Old 01-06-2008, 04:57 PM   #3
dahlek
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Default Joe, there is SO much we do not know about Toxins.

Yes I can see where a person suddenly exposed to toxins can and do affect people. Look at how long folks have fought for their rights due to asbestos, coal dust, Agent Orange and other new things? It scares me, but I keep trying to look for any real and true connections.
I have worked in 'insulated' environments where the 'insulation' was likely asbestos, also in truly certified 'sick buildings'...But I had always been in above average health...until I'd gotten that one bout of pneumonia that led me to 'this'...where I am now. I believe it is called either an immune or auto-immune 'cascade'. Some parts of potential problems are genetically in place and have and perform a very delicate balance in maintaining one's health. When things go klaphooey? Well, as we all know they can do that big-time!
I have to surmise that knowing what the toxins are or might be is a help...but in many situtations, such as mine, in a cumulative assault on the 'systems' Its a who KNOWS? thing.
What's worse about this all is that...we are not hot-house flowers. Therefore to the 'scientific' communities responsible for establishing 'cause/effect' true clinical 'evidence'...we, the sufferers aren't the perfect 'lab-rats'.
Also we are of the first generation who has grown to 'age' and 'benefitted from: Processed foods; plastics, microwaves, drug therapies[in copious amounts], and innoculations. Everything is up for supposition?
Joe, I truly wish and hope that SOMETHING can be done to ease your pain, and maybe help you BE better! Soon.
I wish there were, truly ANSWERS out there...just know that...I'm looking for them! This 'ideopathic' stuff has got to end!
For you heaps of these to ease the pain? 's - j
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Old 01-06-2008, 05:16 PM   #4
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Mrs. D Thanks for answering!

I have had Ige blood test for antibodies to mold but not the type of blood test where cultures are grown if present. I do get thrush( its amazing how sore your tongue can get) which as you know is candida yeast from time to time during antibiotic/steroid treatments for respiratory infections. It is treated with liquid nystatin. I m up for another blood test. Thanks.
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Old 01-06-2008, 05:23 PM   #5
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Thanks for answering Dahlek! This is a partial list of known toxins some of which are known neuro toxins. The reason for my uncertainty is the lag between exposure and symptoms such as pulmonary fibrosis, cancers etc. Neuro toxins may destroy nerve much more quickly.

Chromium,
lead,
mercury,
polychlorinated furans and dioxin,
polychlorinated biphenyls, pcbs,
asbestos,
pvc ,
polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons PAHs,
pulverized glass fibers,
alkaline dust ph
coarse particles,
pulverized cement,
silica,
paints,
vermiculite,
chyrosotile,

phthalates,
jet fuel,
Volatile organic compounds
Synthetic vitreous fibers (SVFs)
Particle bound polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons PAHs

I know some of these are not specific but it is all i can find at this time. Thanks.
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Old 01-06-2008, 06:06 PM   #6
shiney sue
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Default Hey Joe

Thanks for the list,was going to askto compare. Yes the trush ouch,
I eat Activia during the Antibiotic-Steroid,I think most lowfat yogurt
Blue bunny,Dannon works. Ask your Dr.it helps me,and thanks for
bringing. this up...Sue Bob is eating this now after his bout of Pneumonia.
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Old 01-06-2008, 06:26 PM   #7
glenntaj
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Default And--

--the other aspect to your particular situation, Joe, is that in addition to KNOWN toxins that you were probably exposed to, there are likely many substances that have not yet had toxicity levels established that you were also exposed to. Add to this the fact that many of these substances were altered in unpredictable chemical ways by the heat, pressure, and mixing, and it would almost be surprising if you didn't have symptoms.

When it comes to toxic neural damage, a lot has to do with dosage size as to whether one gets an immediate reaction of whether it come on over a longer period--and there's no way to determine what kind of doses you may have experienced. But I suspect that at the least you're having some sort of autoimmune situation that may involve molecular mimicry from organic molecules on top of what ever inorganic "direct" toxicity your body has experienced from metals and ceramics. And, an aspiration of fat from you body would be very interesting (many of the heavier materials migrate to that type of tissue over time).

Last edited by glenntaj; 01-07-2008 at 06:59 AM.
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Old 01-06-2008, 06:48 PM   #8
mrsD
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Lightbulb I don't see arsenic on that list?

It is a major cause of PN. Either thru criminal poisoning, exposure to
toxic waste, and even well water can be high.

A woman in our area got arsenic poisoning from playing softball in a city park that had pressure treated wood near by. They closed the whole park after that event!
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:08 PM   #9
Aussie99
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Default Hi Joe

When my PN came on, I was actually in a commercial laundry facility all morning. It then came on very sharply in my eyes first,and head, and within weeks spread to entire body. At that time I had both a bad case of bronchitis,as well as a long standing gut infection with H-pylori.

I have become chemicaly sensitive since then,and unable to tolerate a wide array of chemicals,and now as most people know I am now also sensitive to medicines too.

While I am not getting worse,and I don't have too much pain anymore, I do have alot more autonomic system issues that are unpredictable and fleeting, and distress me.

I have had enormous amounts of testing done as well that show that I am rather healthy aside from the PN.

I second what Glen has said, maybe there was a mild toxic exposure, and your immune system went into overdrive especially with a co-infection/virus. In my case it is beleived that it was an immune system attack monophasic in nature.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:27 PM   #10
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Thank you Glenn, after reading your posts over the years that is what i have suspected. Thanks for putting it out there again. Who does fat aspirations, as in what specialty?

Thank you again Mrs. D and im not sure if arsenic was present or not.

Thanks Aussie for sharing your similiar type of experience.


Sometimes after the years of noncommittal or skeptical encounters with the medical community, I begin to doubt myself or wonder. Thanks for all the replies.
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