Detox off morphine/Oxycodone..in 3rd day...
 

For those of you who are thinking about it, good luck. My doctors suck. I am about ready to file a complaint with the state of California on two of them. I called my Pain Med and Neurologist about 3am, left a msg. I requested an emergency appt with my Neurologist because Restless Legs Syndrome is driving me crazy. ReQuip, Neuronitin, Valium, and other things were a joke.

I have only had a few hours sleep since Saturday night. I finally used 15mg Oxycodone for relief and it worked. Just great. I want off Opiates and due to no support from my doctors I had to use an opiate to get some sleep. I am NOT happy with them.

I am feeling better this afternoon, I hope to get some good sleep tonight. Thanks to Oxycodone.

On the bright side of things I don't miss morphine, demerol, Fentanyl, etc. a little bit. I did not miss Oxycodone either.

If I had any advice to you, expect the unexpected.

My legs get restless when I try to stop my pain meds too. Drives me crazy. I hope you find a doctor who will help you with this rather than throw you to the dogs, so to speak. I have stopped all drugs before and after about 5 days it passes...hope that helps.

Best!
J

Thanks for the encouragement. It was 167 hours ago that I took my last morphine.

Due to either bad doctors or uncaring doctors, take your choice....my wife figured out the Librium was causing my RLS. I quit it and have not had SEVERE RLS in a couple of days. Of course, we HOPE it is that simple. I raised my Neurontin from 900mg a day to 1200 during this time, hoping it might make some difference.

I have had 3 or 4 days where I sleep all day and my wife can't wake me up. She shakes me, she yells at me, my Medic Alert Dog is frantic... my wife tells me she licks my face, sits on me (I was laying on the bed), she will even lay on my chest (45 pound Portuguese Water Dog) and lick my face or "punch" my chin with her nose. After I finally got enough strength to get up today, she followed me to the shower and laid outside it until I came out, she followed me into the family room and laid in front of me.... watching me the whole time. I have never seen her so worried (?) apprehensive (?) instinctively concerned (?).
I am amazed at her intuitiveness. She is my Service/Medic Alert Dog and .... wow ... she even follows me to the bathroom. Before I started this ... CCHS ... I quit breathing a lot when asleep. I did not say that well. CCHS is self explanatory. When you sleep, your brain/CNS tells your heart to beat and for you to breathe. Mine does not tell me to breathe. My brain does not know when it is out of oxygen. At the National Jewish Hospital in Denver, CO they ran my Pulse Ox down to 18. EIGHTEEN folks. At 88 your doctor would want you to be checked out. I knew my chest was warm, but I was talking to the doctors the whole time. What I did think was odd was that we had a LOT of people in the room while doing this...seems like at least 7 doctors and nurses. So going to sleep without my Ventilator and oxygen is dangerous for me.

Anyway, my wife is quite concerned too. She does not want to hospitalize me, but she is quite concerned about my not breathing and being so hard to wake up. It can take her a half hour (easily) to wake me up. If she shakes me, I roll over. If she yells at me, I ignore her (so she says ... I really don't remember). I am so tired I can't hardly stand.

BUT I DON'T MISS OPIATES, I DON'T LIKE OPIATES AND I HAVE NO DESIRE TO TAKE THEM.
I HAVE MORPHINE WITHIN 3 FEET OF WHERE I WATCH TV AND DON'T CARE. I WILL TAKE THE AVINZA TO MY DOCTOR AS TOXIC WASTE. I CANNOT IMAGINE WHY I WOULD TAKE ANY MORE.

That said, severe RLS means I have to take Oxycodone. I have taken it 3 times since last Saturday. 7.5mg once and 15mg twice. Since I don't seem to have any symptoms tonight, I won't take any. (Famous last words) It does seem like....if I don't take any and I have a problem, I need 15mg to "catch up" and defeat the RLS. If I take 7.5mg as I go to bed, I "get ahead" of the problem and sleep all night. I may be kidding myself. But I do NOT desire the opiates. They are merely a tool. I tried 2400mg of Neurontin, 15mg of Valium, ReQuip and something else ---- did no good. 15mg of oxycodone nailed the RLS in a short period of time and I could sleep.

If I did not mention it, I only got a few hours sleep the first few days. I fought severe RLS and refused to take an opiate. I think I am better off taking the 7.5mg or even half of that
so I can get some sleep.

If any of you understand this detox stuff, please tell me if I am making a mistake. I know every human body is different, but this seems to work for me.

I had hoped for the legendary "4 day detox" and that life would be wonderful by today. Now I am just gritting my teeth and taking it one day at a time. I am so amazed at how tired I am. Not sore and worn out exactly, just dog tired. As my wife has noted, I have slept most of at least 3 days. Makes no sense to me. Every time I wake up I have a little black nose on my chest or next to my face. My little girl and I are getting closer by the minute. She isn't a fur kid because she has hair, but she has really become my dog in the last few months. She knows..... somehow .... I am sick and she is determined to take care of me the best she can. I wish I were half as good a person as she is. I will win this battle. Never fear.

PS - when I started this, I thought I might get off morphine a few months to see if my other medical problems got better. And if they did not, I would go back on it. NO WAY.
Not after this. I pray to the Lord above I never need them outside of surgery. I am one of the luckiest men on Earth that I don't like them. I don't crave them. I am not addicted. In fact, I have forgotten to take them a few times. I don't want to push my luck. One detox is enough for me and my wife and my little 4 legged girl. Prayers gratefully accepted.

I have no experience with morphine so I can't speak to that. I think we are all different in how we respond to our medications. I hate them too, but I hate the alternative worse. I take as little as possible and go sometimes days without any. Do I have an addiction to them? Not mental. My body will tell me that it missed them, however, by giving my restless legs or a headache. I think it's important to have a doctor advise you on this, and maybe what you need is a new doctor? Good luck and hang in there.

Been 32 days. I am off morphine. At least I don't miss it one bit. But I picked up a nasty cold/flu from our grandson and it gave my wife and I, and our 31 year old daughter lung infections. I have NEVER heard of that in my life.

Anyway, I went into my Chronic Bronchitis Mode and wound up sick again. Grrrrrrrr.

My Pain Med doctor is a good guy, but his staff is terrible. I tried to make an appt with him - again and was told he only sees new patients.

I detoxed on my own. I was told it can take as long as 60-90 days to get all of it out of our systems, so maybe I am premature to say I have detoxed.

My back pain is not as bad as a few years ago, but I am being VERY careful not to do anything to hurt it.

If I learned anything from this, it would be to ask the Pain Med doctor, going in, if he will supervise your detox. I am zero for two doctors locally. The first said he did not know how to detox me, so I started this on my own. I guess I will finish it on my own too.

Enough whining, better days ahead.....

Well, I took myself, with no help from the medical community from 180mg of Avinza down to 90mg in either 1 or 2 days with no reaction. 60 was not possible physically. I tried. My first pain med dr. told me he did not know how to "detox" me. I was shocked and angry...asking him how in the ^%&$#&* did the state certify him to pass the pills out if he was NOT qualified to get people off. I called the great state of confusion (AKA Calif.) and the state medical board (lower case as a token of disrespect in this case) said that was correct. They did not have to know how to get me off. That is what detox centers do. I quit him and went looking for another Pain Med dr.

I was trying to get off the opiates in the fall of 2007 and no help. PM dr's acted like I was a drug seeking guy, NOT someone trying to get off. After about 45 days I was getting low on Avinza (remember, I went from 180mg a day to 90mg, so I had some left over - so to speak). I used them while finding my next PM Dr. So when I am not filing a complaint against this PM dr. and his staff, I am also trying not to burn a bridge.

I do not understand the PM dr. out here. If you are getting off, or trying to get off, they act like they don't want you around or something. Frustrating.

As I have said... I do not feel addicted. I have not taken Avinza for over 30 days and do not regret turning them back in to one of my doctors as toxic waste. I am about out of the last Oxycodone, so I will be through with it I hope. I may be kidding myself, but I don't crave any of it. I am in pain. More than I had hoped I would be, but my respiratory system demands I try something. As I said earlier, on one occasion, it took my wife and an RN about 30 minutes to wake me up. Yelling, shaking me...I knew they were there, but I could not remember how to wake up. I squeezed their hand and so on...only after they cleared my airway and put continuous flow oxygen canullas in my nose and held my mouth shut did I come around. Sitting here after the oral surgery, I was on a liquid diet and had a mouth full of Chicken Noodle Soup. I could not remember how to swallow it. I finally leaned forward and let the soup fall out of my mouth into the bowl, then poured it out. This does not take into account that my memory is gone. When talking about basic items I have to ask my friends and family things like.... "what is the word for going up a ladder?" --
They would say "climbing" (as an example). Simple words. I have taught graduate level
seminars in movie theater size venues. I can't remember simple words now. Please don't think I am complaining, just stating why I have to try to get off the opiates. I have little choice. My dad died with Alzheimer's .... he got it at around 82 years old. Twenty years older than I am. My actual age is about 63 (just had a birthday), but my effective age is about 75 right now. There is a website you can go to figure out what your effective age is, but I can't remember it.

So please ... wish me luck getting off them. My bladder, my urinary tract, my colonary tract, my kidneys, my respiratory system, my neurological system .... (had the hole in my heart fixed in 2007 - it is ok), all of me seems to be malfunctioning and a lot of it is on the list as side effects of Avinza. (EDIT: Esophagus, Vocal Cords too) Memory shot.... time to see if I can escape with what is left of my life. I owe my wife and family that much.

Hi dllfo,

I stopped taking ms contin and norco cold turkey. No help with my doctor at all because she gave me one months supply and said cant accept my insurance anymore cya....medi-cal was the insurance.

The first two weeks were absolutely horrendous! After that things would get better day by day with the rls lasting well into the second month. About the second week into the 3rd month I realized that I was feeling quite normal.

It is a very difficult thing to kick, and please dont beat yourself up for taking any pain meds for the rls. I too took a few norco just to get the edge off the intense rls, and flu like symptoms.

I still have the pain, but I am sooo glad to be free of the morphine. I can take the norco when things start getting out of hand, and wont ever get dependant on the other stuff ever again. Everything will improve if the morphine was messin with your breathing, you will even think clearer.

Too bad the pain just wont go away lol. :winky:

Detox
 

Reasons for detoxing are mostly to stop the side effects of high dose narcotics, such as dyspnea (difficult breathing), and terrible constipation (for those not paying attention to the proper diet, and use of adjunct methods to help alleviate this problem). If your pain has diminished and you find yourself wanting to get off narcotics, here are a few pointers.
A SLOW withdrawal of the narcotics is vastly better than cold turkey, but you have to have free time to do it. The drug CLONIDINE (an "alpha adrenergic drug) can be prescribed to help with the nasty freaky movements that drive you to distraction. BENZODIAZEPINES such as CLONOPIN are anti-seizure, which is basically what RLS and the other movement manifestations are all about. The mixed-agonist-antagonst opiate drug Buprenorphine, often is used to slowly wean one from opiate agonists. Cold turkey opiate withdrawal is hell, but does not result in the propensity to cause death, such as cold turkey alcohol withdrawal does.
For chronic pain patients, one should NEVER get poor treatment from the medical community. Anything less than "all the help that they can give you" is malpractice. YOU didn't choose to become addicted to narcotics; they were prescribed to you by the medical community to control life ruining PAIN. If you have to be on them for the rest of your life, this is NECCESSARY. Few chronic pain patients feel the euphoric effects of narcotics and don't seek to rapidly increase the therapeutic doses that are prescribed, do not crush controlled release tablets (they are usually also given quick release tablets for breakthrough pain), and don't double doctor or seek illicit "extra supplies". The bottom line is, narcotics can be used long term, but pain relief for the "extreme chronic pain patient" gets tricky because side effects do warrant periodic dosage reductions.
A good pain doctor can recognize the difference between users and abusers of narcotic pain medication. Unfortunately, we are stuck with the status quo until opioids are developed which do not cross the into the brain, but can effectively block peripheral opiate receptors, so that brain penetrating opioid agonists can then be administered long term without the terrible side effects that limit their great effectiveness at stopping life disrupting chronic pain.

Dextoxing in a Hospital?
 

NJPain:

I agree with you 100%. I already know now, IF my current Doc tries to Detox me ... I'm a dead man!! He knows about Dextox like I know about Nuclear Fission. ZERO!!!! I am on 100mcg of Fentanyl, 3mg daily of Xanax & 15mg x 3 day of Oxycodone IM.

My plan is to completely bypass the entire NIGHTMARE and check myself into a hospital. Mainly a detox hospital that deals with drug addicts. I AM NOT A DRUG ADDICT but the only people I am gonna trust is a Detox hospital that deals with this daily.

Most insurance plans cover it ... how are you feeling now? Today is Oct 9th?

Joe :eek:

More detox fallout...I took a VA disability hearing test --- twice.

One test is tones and the other is a "word" test. Maryland CNC or something like that. The dr. told me I had to answer before the next test sentence started or the test was over.

I came home from the first test and told my family I had a lot of trouble with being able to recognize some words. Not sure why.

After the second hearing test, Oct.24th, I came home and told them the problem is my cognitive skills. A side effect (for me) of the long term use of opiates. I can't remember nouns. The word "cowboy" was used in the word test. I heard cowboy....click, whirr my mind was processing it ...clank clank....yeah, I think that was cowboy, then by the time my brain told my mouth to say it, the next sentence was starting. I can no longer multi-task. Another apparent side effect of opiates.

I can tell you more of my problems, but let me summarize it by saying the first doctor said:
"Test reports are not reportable for adjudicative purposes at this time. Pure tone and speech testing was attempted; however, reliability of the test results was fair to poor due to inconsistent respones from Veteran. During testing he continually responded with half word SRT responses, extreme hesitation and inconcsistent responses. Behovioral testing was not consistent with DPOAE results (which do not require patient participation) indicating a misrepresentation of his hearing ability (padding thresholds). Vet's behavior indicated nonorganic indicated nonorganic tendencies."

SHE STATED IN WRITING THAT I WAS CHEATING AND MALINGERING. She and I and the California State Bd of Medical Review have a future date, she just doesn't know it yet.
She is NOT qualified to test and evaluate someone coming off long term opiates.

WATCH OUT AND WARN YOUR FRIENDS.

Another finding after being off opiates for over 3 months...... I sleep much less. I went to bed around 1am last night due to congestion, was awake around 5:45am. I seem to feel ok the rest of the day, so who knows. Before opiates I could sleep to 7am easily.

My Restless Leg Syndrome is back with a vengeance. I had RLS around 2002 or 2003, then it seemed to go away. MAYBE it was because of the increasing amount of opiates?

The normal starting dosage of ReQuip is .25mg for RLS (per my Neurologist). In order to calm my RLS I quickly went to 6mg. Not good. Nausea is my new companion.

My memory is still not good. Example is: You and I are talking and a friend asks you what time it is. You answer. I will have forgotten what we were talking about most of the time.
I am trying to be patient (like I have a choice :).

The reason I am posting these things is to let all of you know that the opiates may mask our pain, but our bodies ... may have other problems we can't anticipate. I hope that makes sense. I can't remember nouns well. Really a strange feeling.

Again, if you go to a Pain Med doctor, ask him how he will help you detox on down the road..... IF you have to do that. I never dreamed I would leave opiates, but my body demanded it. As one Pulmonologist told my wife, "Get him off the Morphine before it kills him..." I understand most of you will not have my problems, but you MAY be masking a different set of problems with your pain meds.

Well, now that I have cheered you up :) , keep these things in mind. I had RLS before the opiates, I just thought RLS had taken a vacation.

how did you detox in 3 days?
 

I have been on oxycodone for 12 years from cancer and then other pain issues. I detoxed myself off all the fentanyls but am having a hell of a bad time getting off this crap. I was taking 45mg every 3 hours and up to 60 when very bad. I started weaning down Dec. 22nd. I am now at 15mg every 3 hours and I take my Xanax (.50mg with it along with a muscle relaxer Skalenx or something like that. It does not make you zonky at all.) I am in such muscle pain in my legs, irritable, and so miserable I don't think I can make it. Why is this drug so hard? Please any tips to get me to the end? I have reduced it by 70% in 9 days but I am not doing well at this dose. Body won't get used to it. Should I just go lower and suffer more? Help I promised my family and I want off so badly. I am using accupuncture and other things for pain. Any tips to end this last part? It is a horrible *****. Can' work or function.

questions-restless leg and detoxing on your own
 

Can u please answer some questions for me? I have been on fentanyl, actiq (took myself off about 15 months ago after being on huge amounts-worked great on arthritis, neck pain, stomache and other issues)but they put me on oxycodone and the others which I can't stand. The oxycodone does work on the leg pain. This leg pain is new to me. I am trying to detox myself off oxycodone myself. In 8 days I have weaned from 45mg every 3 hours to 15 mg but my legs are killing me! I don't have pins and needles feeling. They just hurt all the way down and I have to stretch them straight out and it goes on for over 10 hours! It is new. It did start a few months ago before I started weaning off the oxy, Is this restless leg syndrome? I agree about the Dr.s' Long story but I am filing complaints on 2 myself. Mentally I am so done with these damn opiods-they change your personality and ruin your life but after 11 days of weaning down I am exhausted and hurting so badly. Any advice on how to get from 15mg every 3hours to the end of this hell?

I wish you all luck with your efforts, for me, if I go off pain meds I will die! I have tried most and settled for the one that makes me feel in most control, but my pain will never leave, its a fact, and I have tried doing without, can't live like that! I take only what I have to, always have more then I should at Rx refill time, take all I have so they will know I am not abusing, when something is not working right I demand to try something else! My pain has never completely left me, just dulled, got off all the crazy nerve pain meds that was making me feel like I had dementia, Like Lyrica, Neurotin, stuff like that! They had me on Kadian 100 mg 3 x a day and Ms 15mg 2 x a day and valium 10 mg 3 x a day (so I can pee and keep away terrible muscle spasms) so I had them change the Kadian to Opana 40 mg 2 x a day and it helps a bit better but still hurts. Every month I have anywhere from 4 to 10 ms extra and this month so far halfway through have almost 6 extra Opana, and always have 20 or so extras valium every 3 months and this has went on for years so I know I am not an addict, no way! I have to learn to live with a certain amount of pain, no choice! So far constipation is not as bad on Opana, and other things wrong with my body is direct result of spinal cord injury from surgery caused it all, even the surgeon that did it said so, and my labs are perfect along with BP, ect, just this damm pain and curve in my back,sigh. I do know I am not an addict, my body is dependent on meds that help get me to bathroom and I have never felt high.I have not had alcohol since years before the meds! I agree if you can live without them, go for it, otherwise use it wisely and listen to Dr unless he is quack! I feel anyone that wants to detox should be under care of Dr, if at all possible!
I wish you all well that has a choice, some of us don't!

Hi Junie,
I started detox around July 19th and it is January 19, 2009. SIX MONTHS. No opiates since around the first part of August and that was for Restless Legs Syndrome.

Looking back on it, I have mixed emotions.

Opiates apparently masked my RLS, TN, PN and Fibromyalgia. I just don't know which end is up right now. And I am a little scared. Nerve problems are nasty (in my opinion). I won't bore you with the specifics, but the spinal pain was more severe (at its worst). The new problems are too weird. Both knees quit on me two nights ago. I could not stand up. I now have a Power Chair from the Scooter Store because my feet will not always allow weight on them, so I fall. I use my Forearm Crutch even if I feel ok because I never know when some lower extremity will "short out" on me. Again, this pain usually only lasts about a half hour. There are exceptions, but the other "good" thing about nerve pain ... so far ... is that I can usually "get away from it" by moving my body. By shifting my body, I relieve the pain and can do without opiates. So far.

My Respiratory System is MUCH better. No more taking a half hour to wake me up. My Service Dog/Medic Alert Dog still monitors me closely, but she has not had to rescue me in a few months. My memory is bad. Cognitive skills are slow and not as good as they were.

I am sorry you have to be on opiates and other drugs. I am 63 and have so many weird things happening to me ... I don't know where or what condition I will be in next year. But the Lord has been good to me and life is good. When I fall in the floor my dog runs over to me and loves me. When I can't get out of bed in the morning because my knee won't work, my wife helps me. I am so lucky. It could be a lot worse and maybe it will get worse, but all you and I can do is take it One Day at a Time. Good Luck Junie.

I have been taking morphine since 1997, although I did come off it for 2 years (05-07) but found myself having to take oxycodone IR to cope with the pain. The main problem I had once I had stopped the morphine was restless legs, it very near drove me insane. I tried requip and clonazepan, but with little effect, it was so bad, I was having major problems driving and sleeping very little.

I had an accident at home in early 08 and ended up having to go back to taking the morphine again. I have cut my dose by two thirds recently and want to try again to stop it, but the thought of going through the problems of restless legs again scares me. My pain threshold is so low after taking morphine for so long, but I really want to get away from any opiate use.

Anyone have any experience with dealing with these effects of long term opiate use?

Day 2 of no Narcotic pain killers
 

Hi, I am new to this site. I had fought against taking Narcotics for the first 17 years of acute to chronic pain. I was an a car accident and also have brain damage.

About 3 years ago I went broke. All the ways I managed pain, acupuncture, massage therapy, hot / cold contrast baths, Letha Yoga; which is a system where somebody else stretches every muscle and joint in your body for you, are now too expensive. I have Medicare and Humana drug coverage, so Narcotics is the only thing I can now afford.

They enter my system as poison. I want to die for about 15-30 minutes, then I get 4 magical hours of no pain. If I can get the dose just right. Not enough does nothing, too much puts me to sleep.

My doctor convinced me to go on pain killers full time. This ended the poison feeling. For the first 2 years, they worked great. The problem now is, I kept hurting myself and did not know it.

The pain meds no longer make me feel energised and ambitious. Now they just make me sluggish and stupid.

I was using 75 Fentanyl Patches and 60 mg morphine every 4 hours. My doctor advised I schedule down in 3 day increments. My pharmacist felt that was too quick and thought 5 day increments would be better.

I got Valium and Klonopin, just in case. I am also bi-polar, and was epileptic for a time after the accident. I had a bruise on the right temporal lobe of my brain.

I started cutting down on December 28th. My last 25 Fentanyl came off 3 nights ago. I took the last dose of 45 mg Morphine 2 days ago. Last night I took a sleeping pill, Restoril.

So far so good. I am not planning on risking any type of irratic brain stuff, since I already have too much of that. I doubt this is the last morphine I'll take.

What do any of you find is the difference in effects of Morphine and Oxycodone? I have them both. I won't take any more Fentanyl, since I have two dogs. The last patch fell off and I have never found it. I'm praying it was already "dead" when it fell off, it had been over 3 days.

compare meds
 

I'm on my 2nd day off pain meds. Have you noticed any difference in mental ability on Oxycodone versus Morphine?

just looking at others
 

I just read your coment about morphine. I have been on 60mg 3X a day for about 5 years now and when I quit taking the drug, I have no energy or desires to do anything, plus my pain returns with a bad attitude. Was it like this for you? and how long before the body addition subsides from stomach cramps?
J**P

Getting through Morphine Withdrawal?
 

This is my first time replying on a forum. It put me right in the begging of the message im replying to. No blank block to state my issue.

I have fought a very vicious AML Blast Crisis Leukemia for 10 long years. As far as i can tell ive WON! I had an NDE in 2006 and died 12 other times from severe Pnemonia. MD Anderson in Houston tells me im the only one in the world to have done so. I had a 60% Blast Crisis and died in the Cancer Center.

I'm on my third day of getting of Morphine. I can't even walk well. I take Xanax and Ibuprophen to cut the pain enough to sleep a few hours. I am extremely weak.

Does anyone have any ideas... I hate Narcotics!

TaosGuy

Hi TaosGuy, Welcome.

Are you being tapered off under a doctor's care/supervision, or trying to go cold turkey? What dosage/level were you at when you began coming off, and are you taking any other Rx's that may be relevant?

Doc

to get off any medication , you must be under a Drs care . DO NOT DO IT ON YOUR OWN

@ TaosGuy:

When you hit the "quote" button the quote will be at the top of the reply box. You can either space down to when it ends, or start at the top. If you misplace your cursor slightly you will remove [ bracket and the quote will not appear as a quote.

I fixed that for you.

If you want to NOT quote someone, use the Large REPLY button instead of the quote button. On some viewing options here it is on the left bottom but some other skins it may be in a different place. Using Reply will not put the quote into your reply box at all.

I hope this helps.

It does on my browser (IE 9). I usually quote what I'm specifically replying to, but otherwise, I just hilight & delete.

The quote/multi-quote button doesn't do anything.

Doc