Reflux/ question regarding IGE/IGG testing
Hello,
Haven't been here for a while. Kayla is 8 yrs old and has Autism, Tourette's, and OCD Traits. She was recently diagnosised by her Ped. to having acid reflux. However, we now believe she has had it from the age 2, but it was misdiagnosised as suspected seizures(choking and vomitting in sleep). So far, she hasn't been responding to the medications very well. Kayla was on Prevacid for 1 1/2 month the first time, than was switched to Zantac for about 2 weeks which didn't work due to the her aversion to the taste of the liquid medication. She is now back on Prevacid. Last night she got sick shortly after taking it, and woke up this morning feeling sick again. We gave it to her again this morning but it did not help. She hasn't been eating well except in the afternoon. Which can also be variable. Today, she hasn't been eating well at all. I just got the allergy testing back. Which is confusing... They did IGE and IGG Rast testing. IGE Total...Conc IU/ml...25.00 Absorbance..0.166 Egg white....0.12 (I Mild reaction) Absorb.....0.030 Wheat...0.02 (Negative) Milk was negative in both IGE and IGG Testing Wheat...11.55 (III-Moderate) in IGG Testing only. Absor..1.016 So now I am wondering if she is allergic to Wheat instead of milk which we were eliminating. She also has been tested for Celiac Disease through the blood test several times which have been normal. I have Celiac Disease. She has been on the GF diet in the past but we did not see much difference. Is there a test for Gluten Intolerence vs Celiac Disease? So far, she has had IGA and IGG testing once, and the anti-tTG/anti-endomysial, which were both negative. The IGA was negative and the IGG was equiv., so they did the other testing. She is also allergic to grasses. Also, what does it mean when the allergy testing shows a wheat allergy for IGG but not for IGE? Also, are her IGE Total Levels considered to be low at "25.00"? Are is this still within the normal range? She will be going back to Wisconsin this Friday. Any ideas of testing anyone might suggest we might want to do? I know that he is going to do an Asthma test since she is having chest pain with the reflux. She also has a cough that I think is related to the reflux. Although, at times it is hard to tell from Tics or a cold. We went recently to Wisconsin to see a DAN Doctor at the Allergy Associates. Rast IGE tested Dermatophagoides farine?, Egg White, Cow milk, wheat, corn (flour), peanut, Candida Albicans, and Altemaria tenius. IGG tested for Cow milk, wheat, candida albicans. Kayla also has a history of having dental problems we thought was related to the medications, but now we wonder. She also has trace/low amounts of Ketones in her urine (unexplained) She will see a GI Doctor that visits in November. We are going to ask if they going to do stomach testing to test for Celiac while they are at it. We are now wondering if she has EE, which we heard is related to allergies. Her brothers also had testing. One of her brothers had very high IGE Totals at 223.48 and he is 12 yrs old. His Grasses for IGE came back at 26.71 (V) which is very high. Can this cause a severe reaction like food does? If the grass counts get too high? He also has Asthma. On the IGE testing it showed he was allergic to Egg Whites .10 (I), Cow Milk .15 (I), Wheat .59 (III), Corn .31(II), Peanut .51 (III), Ragweed .75 (III). The doctor though he wasn't allergic to Wheat or Corn instead thought it was cross-reactivity. Now, I have read that during pollen season that one can have reactions to the food is the same group. So might he also be allergic to wheat and corn during pollen season? He also appears to get itchy while eating Watermellon and Cantelope. His IGG on milk came back 14.47 (III), and Wheat 2.37 (I). Skin testing showed allergies to tree pollens, grass, cats, dogs, and mold. My oldest also showed more reaction to the IGG than the IGE his total was 69.73 and he is 15 yrs. Thanks Diana Thanks Diana |
Hi Diana. IGG means that your child is intolerant, as opposed to anaphlyxis-type allergy. If your children are allergic to grasses, you also need to keep in mind that most grains, including wheat and rice, are members of the grass family. An allergy or intolerance to grass could very easily translate into an allergy or intolerance to wheat or rice. Did your daughter have an endoscopy with biopsy for a diagnostic tool, or just the bloodwork? It is possible that she could be celiac, just not have enough damage to show up on tests. Did she have the genetic test run? I hope you are able to figure out what is going on with your kids soon!
~Dessa~ |
Hi Diana,
Have you read this site yet, about the relationship between gluten and GERD? http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz...uxdisease!.htm Anne just posted some info the other day about Dr. Rodney Ford here~ http://forums.braintalk2.org/showthread.php?t=2065 The positive IgG testing suggests some degree of wheat sensitivity. There is a food allergy page in The Gluten File linked below, that has some info on IgG/IgE testing and what it means. Classic allergy is based on IgE reactions. IgG reactions are considered 'delayed' food allergy. Some of the allergy sites listed there give good explanations. Generally, mainstream allergy testing only looks for IgE allergy, but it appears that the idea of IgG allergy is catching on. There is also a page about gluten sensitivity vs. celiac disease with links to websites of doctors who are more open to the idea that gluten sensitivity can cause problems in people who don't have celiac disease. The IgG antibodies seem to be the only indicator some of us have. Here are a few things about Gerd and asthma. They can also be related. Quote:
I may have more later, and I will have to reread your post more carefully. I am in a hurry, but this is what I could find quickly. Sorry to just dump and run. Oh..you might also check out TGF page called Not Celiac? It reviews some other information on food allergy, protein intolerance, etc. Cara |
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The most sensitive test for gluten sensitivity is Dr. Fine's stool test through www.enterolab.com This test cannot diagnose celiac disease as celiac disease is currently defined by a positive intestinal biopsy or a positive skin biopsy. Dr. Fine contends that the antibodies to gluten will first show up in the gut before they show up in the blood and before damage is done to the villi. Here is the link to the section about gluten sensitivity vs celiac disease on The Gluten File that Cara mentioned http://jccglutenfree.googlepages.com...sceliacdisease I know that if one has a low total Iga then all Iga may give false negative results. I don't know how a low IgE affects tests. This may help http://www.dlslab.com/dls/page_serve...96EEE16E2B313C It says <80 for an 8 year old. Anne |
Hi,
Thank You, for all the great information. We went to the Ped. today, and discussed Kayla's reflux. She is still having problems and is on the maximum dose allowed. Unfortunately, she isn't able to do anything until we see the GI Doctor coming from Iowa City. Has anyone ever seen Dr. Biship? So far, Kayla has never had any testing done, except allergy testing and blood test for Celiac Disease. I discussed the IGG testing with her and she said to try her on a wheat free diet, which we have already started. We were told that the IGG is a protein, and that it does not show allergies? Can anyone explain this to me? Joshua on the other hand came back with IGE reactions to corn (II), Wheat (III), milk (I), Peanuts (III), and eggs (I). We asked the doctor what this means in regards to food. Can he have any of these items in limited quantity, especially the mild foods? Also, what about shots and medications? We have asked to see and Diet. to talk about how to plan meals. Also, is there other conditions that can mimic Acid Reflux that do not adhere to Previcid medications? Also, can someone sufficate if they reflux in their sleep? There is a strong family history of Acid Reflux with both my husband and his mother having it. She also had Stomach and Throat Cancer and was not a smoker. Also, does anyone know of any good Ped. GI doctors at Mayo, Rochester? Thanks Diana |
Hi Diana. IGG means that your child is intolerant, as opposed to anaphlyxis-type allergy. If your children are allergic to grasses, you also need to keep in mind that most grains, including wheat and rice, are members of the grass family. An allergy or intolerance to grass could very easily translate into an allergy or intolerance to wheat or rice. Did your daughter have an endoscopy with biopsy for a diagnostic tool, or just the bloodwork? It is possible that she could be celiac, just not have enough damage to show up on tests. Did she have the genetic test run? I hope you are able to figure out what is going on with your kids soon!
I will do some research on the grass families. I do know that Joshua also says he gets itchy when he eats watermelon and cantelope. Do your know how one would react to an intolerance vs allergic reaction? I am wondering about acid reflux, could one get acid reflux as an intolerance reaction? She has not had any endoscopy or other testing done yet, except the blood testing. She however did have some genetic testing done that showed she had an elevated Carbohydrate Transferrin level, but the next level was normal. The Genetics said that she did not have the condition related to that. She also has a copy of 2q13 missing on one of here chromosomes. Thanks Diana |
Check out some of these sites. They have good explanations of the various types of reactions. Our mainstream allergists usually only focus on IgE "immediate" allergies, not IgG "delayed allergy" . I have no connection to these sites, but they offer some quick reviews of the subject matter.
http://yorkallergyusa.com/dfa.html http://www.foodallergytest.com/ (you need to poke around this one) The bottom of this one has some articles on GERD: http://www.foodallergysolutions.com/...ergy-news.html Quote:
http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz...uxdisease!.htm You might be able to find something helpful in these tips, too! See Appendix B http://cantbreathesuspectvcd.com/page10.html Now that I have exhausted the resources I have given you, I wish I had some personal experience. Well, for myself, my GERD greatly improved on a gluten free diet, but I don't have any experience with my children. But...others have~ and I hope they will post. Cara |
I don't have any reflux experience, but have also heard cow's milk is a big culprit. I wanted to suggest you cross-post over on the Child Neurology forum (http://forums.braintalk2.org/forumdisplay.php?f=9). However, I get the feeling that most of the Child Neurology folks are migrating back to Original BrainTalk. So, I'd also suggest posting there, on the original Child Neurology forum (http://brain.hastypastry.net/forums/...play.php?f=115 - if you haven't already been here, you'll have to register. You can use your same name as here.). Lots of those folks have reflux experience, and they might be able to tell you about doctors, too.
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Re: More questions Re: 8 yr old recently diagnosised
Hello,
I have been going to the websites I have found on this site. I really liked the "Crying Over Spilt Milk". Anyone here have kids with multiple food allergies like milk, wheat/gluten, corn, peanuts, and eggs? I am finding it challenging to find food without all five of these ingredients. I did find rice chex for cereal. But wonder since Joshua has such a strong reaction to grasses if this will affect him too. So far, we don't know what IGE reactions he is having to the foods, since we don't usually see any outward allergic signs. Can IGG reactions impact as IGE reactions but not show up as an immediate reaction? I do now notice that his ears do change red when he ate a food at school with one of these ingredients. I just got the doctor's script for eliminating the foods. How does one get the school to make lunches free of these foods. My son is on an IEP and is in the Level 3 placement. It will be really interesting when they go to McDonalds and other places and get lunches there. Is there any fast food places that anyone can recommend to be free of these foods on some of their menu items? I will also look into some of the recommendations on the can't breath...website. I hope some of these will help Kayla, since she has many of the symptoms listed there. We have been using Soy milk in place of dairy. But, I know the school isn't following this diet. Our doctor wouldn't write a script but referred us to the allergist to do it instead. So, I will call them tomorrow to see if they will do it. I Hope. Any ideas of lunches for school which do not have to be refigerated or cooked. This is our schools regulations... Which I think will be difficult to do.:( Also, does anyone know of any financial programs that will assist in paying for the speciality foods since they can be expensive when you are putting your whole family on them. My oldest son also came back milk, egg, and wheat allergy. Are there foods you can make that do not need special ingredients, like snack foods minus (wheat, corn, peanuts, milk, eggs). Thanks Diana |
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Barley is a sneaky ingredient - I have been fooled more than once by barley. It is not in the top 8 allergens so it does not have to be in the allergen statement. It is often hidden as "malt". The only place I know of that helps people with the cost of the GF diet is the UK. From what I understand, if you are diagnosed by biopsy, then the food is a prescription. I don't know of a program in the US. Most insurances will not even pay for a consult with a dietitian :eek: The medical community does not see the heal qualities of food. :( Too tired right now to post links to fast food places. Many of them will have info on GF selections. This may help you for McD's http://www.mcdonalds.com/app_control...nts.index.html Anne |
Darn...I just accidentally backed out of this and lost my post. I'll give it another quick go.
Meanwhile..may I suggest a new post titled something like this to draw out some more responses. wheat, corn, peanuts, milk, eggs free- HELP! I was also going to suggest vising the Child Neurology board..as I think some of them are very well educated about the ins and outs of IEP's in the school, perhaps not in regard to food, but in general some really know the law. I do believe the school has to provide for your child if you have a doctor's script, but I think most of us feel we wouldn't really trust the school to provide safe food...so just send our own lunches and keep snacks/treats available. I think you would just need to be very involved to make sure they get it right! I thought that one can save receipts and deduct the food expenses as a medical cost, but I'm not sure many do it. I've heard the hassle isn't worth it, but maybe someone else here knows differently. [oops...maybe in UK or Canada???? I don't of anybody personally who does this] I think others here will be able to help with snack ideas, too. Here are some recipe sites... I think the Paleo recipes might fit most of what you need, and the GF/CF ideas will be a good start, and then just watch out for the other problem foods. Paleo Diet Recipes Gluten Challenge :: Gluten, Dairy, Soy free Menu, Lunches and Snacks Plans! Recipes4US - UK - Special Diets GFUtah GFCF Recipes GF/CF Recipe Forum You might be able to find some info about handling schools here, too. It looks like they have some info. The Food Allergy & Anaphylaxis Network (FAAN) But..make a new post about help with dietary restrictions. I know Judylv's son has many restrictions, and others here as well. Cara |
Hi Diana,
I found this website to give a good explanation of IgE, IgG, and IgA: Diet Net I recently did some IgG testing myself. I cut out both the moderate and mild categories of food I was reacting to and felt better. If you have been cutting out casein, then the IgG for that won't show up anymore as your body will stop producing antibodies to it. Currently, I'm not eating gluten, corn, dairy, soy, nuts & seeds. It's a long list, and I pretty much have to cook everything myself rather than relying on processed or restaurant foods. Eating out if very difficult for me. There are other groups of parents who have kids with lots of special needs like yours. Here's an interesting website from a mother of a child who is autistic: Dana's View from the Inside You might also find the yahoo groups on "enzymesandautism" interesting. Here's Karen DeFelice's website on digestive enzymes. From what I gather, it's a lot of figuring out what works for you kids. I don't think you can depend on the doctors figuring it all out for you and testing isn't perfect. Claire |
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It makes sense to me to eliminate all potential reactions (positive scores or high risk cross reactive foods) and then, once they "even out" challenge under a dr's care. (Or at least in close proximity to a hospital) That way you can establish their true tolerance levels, and weed out false positives. Meanwhile, a food diary may help to find any more links to foods that were not tested for. |
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I really need to talk to either his teacher or the cafeteria folk about the form. I prefer Option A, but *I'm* not requesting that they feed my son. GF without rice eliminates a lot of ready made stuff, and then to remove dairy on top of that...:rolleyes: And I don't trust them. They could do a lot of whole foods, but he's a picky eater and it's important that he actually EAT the food he's served. So... I'm doing nothing. Anyway, if you have something from your doctor, I'd see if your state has a similar type form. Oh... and what's a "Level 3 placement?" Tom has an IEP. I have no idea what level he is. Quote:
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We *had* a GF Restaurants thread in the old Braintalk. Until that rises from the ashes, you might poke around out here, there's many places that have GF menus. You do have to be concerned about cross contamination however :( Here's one I found recently as they I see there is one coming to my area :) http://qdoba.com/Allergens.aspx Also - http://gfiowa.us/restaurants.htm |
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Claire |
Hi, welcome to the forum. :) My family eats a meat-free, dairy-free, egg-free, gluten-free, hydrogenated oil-free, corn syrup-free, dye-free, preservative-free, organic whole foods diet. Additionally, my son is corn-free and soy-free. Thank goodness we arrived here over time! It can be overwhelming to remove favorite food groups from the diet, but it can be done! Our motivation was to feel better. Once you're feeling better, that's the motivation not to go back! ;)
I prepare our food. We brown bag it (or haul our cooler) if we must eat away from home. Here are some ideas for food to eat and/or substitutions. Milk substitute --> soymilk, almond milk, rice milk Cheese substitute --> there are soy cheeses, but we consider them "processed foods" and no longer eat them. We've found that many foods topped with cheese are just as good without ... once you get used to it! Gluten-free grains --> we eat brown rice, millet, quinoa, amaranth, buckwheat Nuts and seeds --> we enjoy almonds, walnuts, cashews, flax seeds, sesame seeds, etc. Beans --> we eat a lot of black beans, pinto beans, chickpeas, etc. Fast food for us --> We do use pre-packaged rice cakes, Tinkyada rice pasta, and rice tortillas. The rice tortillas can be toasted in a skillet to make "crackers" or "pita". It can be baked in the oven to make a quick "pizza crust". Rice cakes are good with various nut butters. My son especially likes almond butter and cashew butter on his. Recipes --> Check out the recipe threads that are just getting started in this forum. You'll find some good ideas! Also, I really like Food Allergy Survival Guide by Vesanto Melina. I have yet to purchase it since it is readily available at my library.:o |
Thank You, Thank You, Thank You
Just wanted to Thank:D all of you for all the great responses and websites. I know these will be keeping me busy for a while. I have talked to my son's nurse and she said they would let us use the frid. and microwave in his room. She said since they have a kitchen that it would not be like my daughter's school. That will be another issue. We discussed the lunches and decided it would be safer and easier to bring his lunches.
Are any of you familiar with DAN Doctors? I was surprised the one we saw told us to disregard the IGG results for all of our kids and some of the IGE results for Joshua (Wheat and corn due to cross reactivity). I have found alot of research that says some individuals will react to these foods when there is pollen involved. Even, our ped. told us to eliminate the IGE foods.:confused: Grasses and Ragweed seem to be an issue at school. They are questioning whether to not expose him to field trips like the park or nature center due to his high grass and moderate ragweed allergies. What we have noticed is only the asthma reaction, and lately red ears at times. But not other reactions, except possibly chronic fatigue. Does anyone know if there can be intolerance reactions that occur during IGE allergic reactions? I noticed some of you had children with reflux. Are there specific foods that you noticed that caused the reflux in your children. We have read that milk and wheat are many times culprets. We have been on the dairy free diet about a month, but have heard that the school hasn't been doing it all the time. Kayla also has PICA and picking skin behaviors. She also has Tourettes, at times very severe. Do any of your children happen to have/had these behaviors and did you find certain foods helped with any of these? Also, Joshua has hypersensitivitiy to loud noices. We have been told that one can get food stamps through medicaid to pay for the special foods since it is a medical problem. We will check into this tomorrow. The nurse told us this. Anyone, else hear about this? Thanks Diana |
Here are a couple of essays that may help. They were written by Dr. Lewey who is a board certified GI doc.
The first is about cross reaction between pollen allergies and food allergies: http://ezinearticles.com/?Food-Aller...lens&id=306107 This next essay is about heartburn/reflux and CD/GS. What is interesting is that Dr. Lewey mentions that he was diagnosed as gluten sensitive through Enterolab and is now GF. :cool: http://ezinearticles.com/?Heartburn-...flux&id=315638 I hope the help with the expense of the food works out. Anne |
I saw a DAN! doctor for my daughter, and he suggested food allergy testing through Sage Labs, and because she had positive antigliadin IgG antibodies suggested a gluten free diet...and then anything else she would have tested positive too. She turned 18 and didn't want any more testing.
We also consulted with another DAN! doctor about pyroluria, a condition my daughter tested positive, too. Actually, I learned about pyroluria on Braintalk from a woman named FJ, whose son's had TS among other things, all responding very well to treatment for pyroluria. In your spare time ;), you might want to read about that. There is a page for it in The Gluten File, or you can google it. Try googling it with "FJ" and you might find some her posts. Also, there are a small number or TS patients who respond to dietary changes. I've heard PICA can be related to iron deficiency. THat has been checked? Cara |
Here is another way to treat reflux.
Anne http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=pubmed_DocSum Quote:
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:eek: Wow - it's no too often you find 100% in these studies. Very interesting...
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Wonderful advice and info from all!
Yes, stomach reactions to incoming food proteins that one is sensitive to, can and often do cause gastric reflux episodes! Some high up reflux episodes can cause asthma, VCD/vocal cord dysfunction (laryngospasm), etc. The high up type of reflux is called LPR/laryngo pharyngeal reflux, and can be silent, sometimes. (Laryngo=larynx=voice box; Pharyngeal=throat, which is above the larynx; Reflux is backing up of stomach liquid in esophagus. The non-technical term for LPR is "regurgitation", as was mentioned above. Usually, there's no heartburn, with LPR). Dr. Fine, in his EnteroLab website, at http://www.finerhealth.com mentions gastric reflux as one of the many possible symptoms of gluten sensitivity (can be with or without heartburn). I have some gastric reflux tips (drug-free----no acid blockers), on webpage 10 of my website. See Appendix B (gastric reflux tips for adults & older kids), and Appendix C (gastric reflux tips for infants), at http://cantbreathesuspectvcd.com/page10.html Getting off gluten, casein, corn, soy, maybe yeast, maybe eggs, etc., usually lessens the reflux problems, and also lessens breathing problems. Carol http://cantbreathesuspectvcd.com |
Feeding a family
I know you must be going thru a difficult time and are facing some decisions that will change your lifestyle. I have suffered many years with food allergies and have changed my eating habits accordingly through the years. Although I have been lucky enough to be able to eat rice. I do not eat any other grains except a little corn. I am GF, DF, & mostly grain free, corn syrup free, & saturated fat free. I eat only an occasional egg, and am also allergic to the following: grapefruit, blackpepper, mushrooms, chick peas, split peas, English peas, potatoes, beef, sodas, coffee, tea, cod fish...
I also do not eat salt with iodine in it. I use a good grade of sea salt, the taste alone is worth it. I have absolutely nothing with any artificial sugar as an ingredient. I also try to avoid all of the additives & artificial color and preservatives that I can. I am feeling so healthy & have energy & great looking skin. I am now making my own jelly & jam, I brush my teeth with baking soda. to me this sounds a little out there but I have evolved as I learned about things that were not in my best health interest, I discarded them. I love chocolate as much as anyone but really I am getting to be a huge believer in eating whole foods. I think fruit & nuts is the perfect breakfast food... I encourage you to try the basic whole foods for your family. I know it is not easy but I think you will see results that will make it all worth while. & please do not listen to everything the docs say... |
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Anne |
Minerals
Has she ever been tested for mineral levels? Children with autism commonly have low levels of magnesium, zinc, and selenium, and elevated levels of copper.
(This is NOT due to diet or intake, but from metal/mineral metabolism in the liver). |
Anne, I missed this when you posted it! It is going in the file! I've said many times that my GERD mostly cleared up when fixing my B12 deficiency, and I also began supplementing with a multivitamin, magnesium, P5P, and fish oil at that time. I know GI symptoms are associated with B12 deficiency.
I had further GI improvement when I dumped gluten from my diet, with my stools returning to normal (no intermittent diarrhea, blood in stool). Cara Quote:
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