Posted in chronic pain also. Help! New pain meds making me sick!
 

Hi,

I was all excited to finally get a referral to a pain management doc, and met with him yesterday. He spent about 40 mins going over everything with me, and then put me on some new meds to try. Unfortunately I seem to be VERY sick from them.

Wondering if anyone has taken these and gotten similar reaction, and if the side effects level out eventually (better yet, go away!).

I'm taking 5mg butrans transdermal patch for pain, along with my percocets which I've been taking for a very long time, so that's not a problem, and gabapenten 100mg twice a day.

I'm thinking it's the pain patch making me sick, but not sure.

Symptoms: abdominal pain, nausea, diarrhea, dizziness, fatigue and weakness.

I'm only on day two of the new meds. Any thoughts?
Cathie

Re: medication
 

Sorry you are having trouble with the new medications. I also have trouble similar to you with gabapenten, neurotin. It made me dizzy, nautious, and I felt wobblie all over. I really didn't want to take it. I did call the doctor. If your symptoms really don't improve you, or you feel are so uncomfortable, please do call your doctor, and at least let him know what kind of symptoms you are experiencing. I really do wish you all the best. less pain today. ginnie

Thanks ginnie,

I wasn't sure which of the two new meds were doing it? Problem with starting two new meds on the same day, and they both have side effects. Sometimes I think we are the dr and drug company's guinea pigs!

It is a bit less since I was able to get some food in me, we will see how it goes in the next day or so. I am feeling less pain, so I would like the side effects to ease off for some relief! Can't win, huh? Lol

Hi Cath
 

I really was very impatient not to feel the effects from gabapenten. I didn't give it much chance to work before I called in. I just didn't like it. I may be wrong, but you were started on a higher dose than I was. I sure hope that it does work, and maybe you should give it a bigger try than what I did. At the time my patience was running thin with just about everything. Take care, and I hope your pain goes down to a tolerable level. ginnie

Cath, gabapentin did give me "whirly" feeling for the first few days too - started out on 1 400mg at bedtime for the first three days, then 1 in AM and 1 PM. After a few days of that, "whirlies" went away - none of the other symptoms you list ever figured in. Now taking 1600mg gabapentin daily along with Percocet and am okay with that. Fatigue is constant, but not sure if it's the Percocet, the gabapentin, or the combination. Stress can also factor into that fatigue. I'll take fatigue over debilitating pain any day tho.
Don't know about the patch...

Does your Dr. know your still taking the perocet's ?
They told me to stop my vicodin, I just started a 10mcg Butrans patch.

Yes, they were prescribed at the same time. Perhaps your doc stopped your vicodin due to the patch? Sorry, I don't know anything about patches.

Yes, he told me I could still take percocets for break through pain. How is the patch working for you? Any side effects? How's the pain level.

Mine is only 5mcg, it still doesn't eliminate all the pain though. :( But it does help a lot.

Cathie

Me either. I stuck out the forst month, but I felt like I was walking around in a dream sequence in a "B" movie.... A Roger Corman/William Castle "B" movie! Couldn't get off of it fast enough. Couldn't think clearly/create/use my mind at all. For me, that's intolerable.

Doc

I kind of wondered about that too. The butrans is (from what I read) supposed to block the oxycodone from working by occupying the same receptors.

Doc

Hi Doc,

Did you stop cold turkey or did you have to wean yourself off the gabapenten? I don't really want to be on this stuff forever, hoping after I have the ulnar nerve transposition surgery I won't need it. (fingers crossed)

Cathie

That was a very foggy period for me. I vaguely remember calling my doctor and telling him it wasn't working. Whatever he told me to do, that's what I did.

Doc

Hey Cath, it is my understanding that Gabapentin must be weaned off. Have you called your pharmacist? I've said that I don't have any side effects from it but in the back of mind, since I began the Percocet and Gabapentin, I've realized I'm having difficulty coming up with the right word sometimes. Normally, I can spell anything....having some difficulty with that too sometimes. Just not able to express myself as well as I'd like. Don't know if it's the Gab, the painkiller, pain, stress or combination, but from what I've read lately, believe it's probably the Gabapentin. Have tried to ignore/deny the slight issue but it is there...

All of the anti-epileptic drugs--
 

--including Gabapentin/Neurontin, should be tapered off slowly, as the possibility exists for seizure if they are suddenly discontinued.

All these drugs work, at least in part, by suppressing the activity of the central nervous system to spread nerve impulses' they upregulate the inhibitory neural transmitters to ameliorate runaway nerve signals. The body, in response, tends to upregulate its response to this suppression, meaning if the drug is suddenly stopped, there is more chance of runaway signalling occurring.

This homeostatic balance in signalling pathways happens with a lot of drugs--part of the reason opiates must be weaned off of slowly is that body similarly upregulates its pain sensitivity in response to the suppressive activity of the opiates, and a sudden removal of them allows this upregulation to respond unchecked, which is experiences as withdrawl symptoms until the body "downregulates" back to a baseline.

Actually, now that you've mentioned that I have the effect too. I'm a graphic designer, and it seems to "dull" my creativity (which is one reason I don't want to be on it forever) and I also have to search for my words, even for simple words, during conversations. What a wierd side effect.

thank you....
 

I knew that about the opiates, I had to wean myself off of oxycontin and it was brutal, but I didn't know the Gabapenten was included in that catagory. I never just "stop" taking a drug without consulting both dr and pharamcist anyway, I'm way too cautious.

Thank you for explaining it so well for me!

medicine comments
 

I was only on gabapenten for one week. During that time I was a complete space cadet. I also am an artist and I could not function creatively at all. I got off the medicine and that fog lifted. Just to add to the dicussion on this particular medication. ginnie

"Ooh, that's a BINGO!" ~Col. Hans Landa, Inglorious [Barsteds]

IME, 99.44% it's the gabby. Antidepressants affect me the same way. It got so infuriating, it overrode the depression, and that's how I beat/dealt with it - the "alternatives" were worse than the depression, and in some cases, the pain. There's also been a residual effect, which should be clear in my posts here: I have a difficult time choosing words & phrases; that's why my posts are peppered with "/"s between terms, repeat words excessively, etc. I used to write much better than I do now. :o :( :mad:

Doc

Although the gabapentin maybe making you feel funny, this is also true for the percocetts:

Buprenorphine itself binds more strongly to receptors in the brain than do other opioids, making it more difficult for opioids (or opiates) to react when buprenorphine is in the system. The blockade effect also has the result of blocking endogenous endorphins from binding to receptors, which can lead to psychological alterations in mood and mental capacity. This can cause cognitive and memory deficiencies via blockade of the reward system, which is pertinent to memory formation and normal mental function.

My patch has been giving me a headache but no loss in mental/cognitive function... yet... sigh...

J.

Hope the headaches go away, and maybe you won't have any mental/cognitive problems at all!

Well now with the percocet and gabapentin together I should be coming up mute any minute now.....sorry, feeble attempt at a tiny bit of humor.

What I get that says, which appears to have been considerably altered from the original:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buprenorphine
is that the butrans would be the cause of cognitive and memory deficiencies by blocking the endogenous endorphins from binding to the receptors - not the percocet.

Oxycodone has some deliterious effects on some few patients, but generally with opioid-naive patients. More often it may have euphoric/calming effects, which wear off in time, (would be blocked by the butrans) and would not be likely with a patient who has taken percocet for a very long time.

The two 800 lb. gorillas in the room appear to be the butrans and/or gabapentin, and since the problematical effects seem to be abating, this (hopefully) won't be an issue for very much longer anyway.

Doc

Hopefully the gorillas are on a stronger patch then I am!!! LOL :Thats-Funneh:

Yeh, maybe I read that a little wrong.

hey not to steal anyones thread, but this seems to be a Butran thread.

Why would Butran cause dehydration?
I spoke with my physical therapist and she said that pain meds cause dehydration and I am thinking the headache is from the dehydration caused by the Butrans? Seems to be working since I started drinking more water no headache so far... sigh...

also having some heart palpitaions??

Thanks :)

I don't know that Butran, or pain meds, do necessarily cause dehydration. Some people get opioid-induced edema, which is retention of water. Dehydration or dry mouth (and headache) do come up as known side effects of many pain medications (including Butran), but the frequencies I've seen have been in the 5-10% range. Opioid pain medications do cause constipation, but from partial paralysis of the stomach, decreasing peristalsis, reducing digestive secretions, etc. Dehydration could certainly cause constipation, and drinking more water is advised to patients with opioid-induced constipation, but constipation doesn't necessarily mean dehydration.
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info...nstipation.php

Headaches from opioids usually fade within a few days as the body adjusts to the medication.

Palpitations are also a known side effect, but could also be more serious; I'd call your doctor about that.

Dehydration will cause a headache - that's pretty much what a hangover is.

Doc

relief
 

I'd like to say that I got my headaches(migraines) to calm down by not only drinking gatorade (sugar free) but I added MILK.

I'm not exactly sure why the milk works, but I believe it stimulates the liver to release it's toxin's.

Anyway, thought I would mention it in case anyone else is having the same issue.

They also added gabapentin to my regime today.. argh..

J.

I've never heard that; have you got anything (sites) on it? Milk thistle, yes, but milk - no.

Gatorade, I get - electrolytes. Milk is often named as a trigger/causal effect of migraine, but it's also mentioned as both abortive and prophylactic due to its calcium content.

These could both be clues if you get migraines other times.

Doc

I've been getting daily headaches from the patch (or gabapenten?) too. Some are closento migraine level.

I've been using accupuncture and resting more, coping with them. I just try to drink as much water as possible. Some days are better then others.

Good luck to us both!

I will try taking calcium and see if that does anything... I couldnt find any literature about it, just a random post and i remembered something about drinking milk with LSD from way way back when (i'm older)... lol..

Cath1 - I would be very interested in your results if you try drinking milk?

Google: migraine calcium

You'll find articles on both sides; some recommending calcium (and/or magnesium) and some on calcium channel blockers, which supports calcium being both cause/trigger and/or abortive/prophylactic, depending on the individual.
SMACK! :Doh:

Doc

I have milk everyday and still have a headache. I'm also on a whack of supplements and take extra calcium. Doesn't help my headaches though. :(

I will bring it up at my next drs appointment and seebif he has any advice to offer. I also find I'm very tired and foggy (which I dont like) haven't decided if I'm going keep sticking with it. Not sure what is worse, pain or side effects of drugs?

Cathie

:confused: I thought all the side effects had dissipated?

A lot of people have reported the tiredness & fogginess from gabapentin. That can take a bit longer to subside (than the week or so for the others we discussed) - possibly a month or so.
That's the $64,000 question. Earlier in my journey, I went through a period of depression. The S/E of everything they tried (and they tried them all) were worse than the depression. I got so angry about the whole situation that the anger motivated me past/through the depression better than the meds.

You have options for the headaches, but they'll depend on the cause/reason.

Doc

RE: medicines
 

Hello all. I took gabapentin for about a week. I felt like I was in some kind of fog. I couldn't form a sentance or concentrate on much of anything. I quit the drug and won't take it again. Some of the side effects we get, are worse than the pain. I guess I didn't take it long enough for some of those side effects to go away. ginnie

Hi Doc,

All the side effects are gone except for constant headache and a bit foggy. Almost like my world is dulled. No more nausea or tummy issues, and my sleep patterns seem better, but my head ALWAYS hurts. I have been trying advil ot Tylenol for headaches and it helps a bit. I don't know which med is giving me the headache though, gabapenten or butrans? I will talk to my PM dr next month about it.

I also went through a depression, was crying everyday, couldn't stop the blues. It was about three months post op. But my family dr had me start cymbalta and it went away. Chronic pain causes depression, vicious cycle we are in.

I'm going to stick out the meds a bit longer, I want to discuss options before I stop or ask to change.

Cathie

Ok. Keep us posted! :cool:

Doc

hi cat

sorry you have these terrible side gigs
all i wanted to say don't throw in the towel
i myself am back on all medicines i
had hoped to have been taken off
after surgeries
but you know the story
surgery took life from me
and back on powerful meds

please listen to your body
it does talk
we need to listen

take good care

Hi Cath
 

Just wondering if you are doing any better with the medications. ginnie

Hi Eva

I was thinking about you and wondering how you were. I haven't seen you on very much lately. I hope you are seeing a bit of improvement each day.

I'm hanging in there, most of my side effects are gone from these new meds, except for the constant headache. Haven't decided which is worst yet. :rolleyes:

I have another appt in march with my neurosurgeon to discuss arm surgery. I think if all the tests come through positive I will have it. It will at least be a shot at getting my hand back, I desperately need to use my hand again. I know you understand.

The new meds are keeping the neck pain under control, not gone, but tolerable at least. So I will stick it out a bit longer.

I hope you are getting some relief as well, I think of you often.
Take care,
Cathie:hug:

Hi ginnie,

I'm doing a bit better, thanks for asking. All the tummy issues have subsided, just wish this constant headache would go away. Not sure which med is giving me the headaches though since both list it as a side effect.:confused:

I guess time will tell....:rolleyes:
Thanks for checking in on me,
Cathie

couldn't take the headache anymore
 

Well, I just couldn't take the damn headaches any longer, by Friday afternoon I had another migraine and just couldn't do anything. I called the pharmacist and discussed my concerns with the 2 medications and he suggested I stop the gabapenten first to see if it was causing the headache since it's a shorter acting med then the Butrans patch.

I stopped the Gabapenten on Friday and I haven't had a headache since!! YAHOO! Evil stuff. Sooooo.... it's not the Butrans patch it's the Gabapenten making me feel like crap, the fogginess cleared up too. So glad, I'm actually awake today for the first time in 2 weeks.

:D
Cathie

Gabapentin was my suspicion.

I'm glad the headache stopped and you're feeling better. I'm also glad you didn't seize (but looking back, you've only been on it a couple weeks). Just curious - Did the pharmacist mention/say anything about that at all?

The next question (and this may be tough to determine) is, do you think the gabapentin helped your pain at all (if the side effects weren't there)? Some people benefit from it faster than others. It worked for me within an hour of taking it; for other people/types of pain, it may take a few weeks to kick in... I guess where I'm trying to get to is that your PM doctor may want you to try Lyrica, which is similar to gabapentin, but with a lower side effect profile (and more expensive). If this is where he goes, I'd give it a try (but you can look it up ahead of time and be better prepared to discuss it with him).

Thanks for the upadate,

Doc