Everyday impacts
 

Hi, new member here with an introduction and question (sorry if i have any grammar mistakes, english is my second language)

First off, Ive been dealing with pcs for several months now starting after my last diagnosed concussion in the summer 2017. I had to take a medical leave of absence from my college last semester because i was having bad physical symptoms as well as severe psychological issues(anxiety, depression, derealization) and the effort involved from school and part time job was making everything much worse.

I took the time off to recover and tried to do everything the doctors recommended (resting, light excercise, light socialization, mild activities, healthy diet etc) and my physical symptoms improved somewhat but the mental issues only got worse and that made it very difficult to properly assess my recovery as the psychological/cognitve stuff was kinda clouding evrything if that makes sense as it could be hard to tell what symotomes were caused by anxiety and what was from actual pcs(also because of a lot of brain fog which my docotor thinks is from anxiety). My physical symptoms were headaches, nausea(mostly motion sickness type feeling), very bad sleep issues, neck tension and strain, dizziness and maybe some other stuff but cant remember. These all seemed to improve quite a bit and aren’t very noticable day to day unless im really stressed or tired.

The doctor eventually said it would be ok for me to go back to school so since three weeks ago ( bginning of new semester) ive been back at my college but on a reduced course load to not put too much stress on my brain. Since ive been back my depression has been a lot better and ive been feeling happier in general but in the last couple months i have developped a new very debilitating and anxiety inducing symptom. This symptom is head sensitivity.

My head feels very sensitive to stuff like walking(the impact of stepping too hard or missing a step causes pain in my head), driving on bumby roads or bumby train ride(when its really bumby its like i can feel my brain rattle around inside my head) and even tiny things like someone sitting down next to me on the couch or walking by me on a wood floor(i can feel the vibrations in my head). Im also sensitive to mild head impacts like hugs with head contact, my girlfriend accidentally elbowing me or kissing me bit too hard and that kinda thing(i do everything i can to avoid it though).

These impacts dont seem to really worsen my condition per say but they can cause temporary pain and nausea which leads to anxiety attacks because i will worry that ive caused myself more brain damage. This feedback loop just makes me feel even more foggy and makes everything worse. Ive had doctors tell my that these things could not possibly cause damage to my brain and that its most likely health anxiety and maybe a neck issue but i just wanted to get the opinion and experience from people on this forum.

My daily routine of going to school involves quite a bit of walking, taking the metro train to and from school (the train sometimes shakes a lot and turns, brakes/accelerates pretty abruptely), i guess the occasional mild, unavoidable bumb and the head jerking caused from sneezing, jolting my head from being startled, shaking a bit from tense muscles, etc. The effects of these things on my sensitive head would be manageable if only i didnt have a huge amount of anxiety and fear surrounding them. Ive convinced myself that everyday im accumulating some damage to my brain that will eventually contribute to cte or something like that in the future.

I dont really know what to do cause doctors dont take me seriously or say they cant help me cause they dont know whats causing this problem and i need to just not focus on it. Im kind of stuck because i dont want to make myslef worse but also cant miss any more school. I guess im asking if anyone can either offer me some information on this sensitivity or at least some reassurance that they are not damaging my brain so that i dont have to focus on it as much.

I should also mention that after a long day with a lot of sensitivity i will experience a soreness feeling around the top and back of my head.
Thanks a lot to anyone who takes the time to read this and sorry if its not too long or not appropriate for this forum(idk im new).

Hi Ben

Welcome to NeuroTalk :).

The TBI/PCS forum is very active so I am sure that you will get helpful responses from other members (I don't know enough about TBI/PCS to say anything useful).

Best wishes.

BenW,

Welcome to NeuroTalk.

I think you have two or three issues to consider.

You mentioned neck issues. These subtle neck injuries can be the cause of many of the symptoms you are experiencing. They can be very sensitive to bumps.

You also have a serious history with anxiety. This can magnify any symptoms.

The worst is how anxiety can cause the brain to memorize symptoms, often a serious cluster of symptoms that make one feel like they have a full head impact. This can be PTSD, Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome, a miserable condition where the brain can flash back to prior manifestations.

Add some unresolved vestibular concerns that can be triggered by movements and trigger anxieties and more and you end up in the misery you are experiencing.

The challenge with the neck injury is finding the gentle treatments than can help and then the discipline to maintain good posture during sleep and other activities and properly protect it during those rough rides.

One trick is to avoid sitting with an erect back and shoulders by relaxing the head and shoulder forward so the spine has more ability to absorb movement. Sleeping with the head and neck straight is important.

This subtle neck injury will have minimal physical pain. Just some stiffness.
But, the inflammation is can cause can trigger headaches and reduced blood flow and vestibular dysfunction.

I hope this helps you get a start toward some help.

My best to you.

Thank you very much for your response, I will definitely look into treating my neck and getting evaluated from an osteopath.

I know you can't give me a definitive answer but do you think the impacts I mentioned would be a cause for concern and potentially damaging or do you think I should simply not worry about them and keep going to school and living my life as is?

Sorry to pester you I am just curious about your opinion as I can tell you are very smart and knowledgeable through reading your old posts.

I think you should get on with your life. Just learn a few accommodations on rough rides. I do not think they cause damage, just inflammation and anxiety. Anxiety is the hardest part of PCS to treat. I'd say your struggle is 20% physical and 80% anxiety.

Learn to moderate your life and move forward.

What country are you in?

On top of Mark's advice, you could perhaps consider an anti-inflammatory diet. Some of us have become less sensitive and prone to relapse thanks to it. You can use the search engine to find more informatiin about it.

Thank you for the response, i am 18 years old living Montreal, Canada

Thank you, ill look into it.

Ben,

Take some earplugs with you on the train. You might not be able to eliminate a bump but you can eliminate the edginess to noise...the more symptom overload you can keep at a manageable level the better your system can tolerate that which you can't change, keep the glass half full sort of.

Pay attention to your thoughts that accompany whatever makes you think possible damage can occur. If your thoughts go directly to a worst case outcome, I'll never get over this bump, the need to bolt from the situation, racing thoughts etc you can chalk that up to anxiety. Anxiety is a very tricky foe but once identified can be slowed down with accurate assessments/identifiable facts from past similar incidents. Deal in fact.

Bud

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. I guess I'm just pretty spooked with all these recent cte studies after my years of playing hockey and basketball and even like just rough housing as a kid

Your risk of CTE was established by your hockey and other injuries. They were far worse than bumps from riding in a train or other everyday life activities. If a rough train ride could cause CTE, the world would have an epidemic from the rough trains of the last century.

The only impacts you should be concerned with are true impacts. Falling on ice and hitting your head. Getting assaulted to the head. falling down stairs. walking into a wall or overhead beam.

Everyday bumps are well within the tolerance of the head and brain.

A more important risk is the long term effects of living with anxiety. That can effect your heart, raise blood pressure and other things.

There is a risk stepping out your front door. But, we have been adapting to these many risks since we first learned to walk and fell down.

You will be fine. Give yourself a break and move on with your life.

Alright thanks! I actually saw a neurologist today and she gave me the same reassurance you did and said she thinks my risk for cte would be very low so that made me feel a bit better.

However I have one last question if you don't mind, I've noticed that any time I do any form of moderate exercise (20-30 minute walk, exercise bike, light weight lifting), it causes me this weird queezy feeling and makes my brain fog much worse for around an hour or so after I stop

This is definitely very concerning for me as I have to walk quite a bit every day so if you had any insight on what this could potentially be indicative of it would be greatly appreciated.

Back off on your exercise to a level that does not cause this feeling. Slowly, over time, increase your exertion level by small amounts. Do not exert to levels that cause symptoms.

Thank you!
Have another question regarding sub concussive impacts. Specifically what it takes to cause a sub concussive impact since it doesn't seem to be very clear and there is a lot of contradictory information on the internet.

Say during an average work day which involves stuff like bumby train/car rides, sudden braking, walking, occasional bumbs, hugging/"other" activities, quick head movements, slap in back, etc.

Or what about with more vigorous stuff like running and jumping on a basketball court, dancing with jumping and head movement, jumping rope, working out, jumping on trampoline, diving in a pool, non contact hockey, rough housing with friends, roller coasters/bumper cars, horse back riding, etc. Would these activities be accumulating sub concussive impacts through the sheer act of doing them or does it take an actual bad fall or hit to the head?

If you could clear this up it would be great since I think a lot of people are curious about it also given the recent discovery that cte has more to do with repeated sub concussive impacts then it does with concussions.

Where did you read this "Say during an average work day which involves stuff like bumpy train/car rides, sudden braking, walking, occasional bumps, hugging/"other" activities, quick head movements, slap in back, etc.

Or what about with more vigorous stuff like running and jumping on a basketball court, dancing with jumping and head movement, jumping rope, working out, jumping on trampoline, diving in a pool, non contact hockey, rough housing with friends, roller coasters/bumper cars, horse back riding, etc."?

This information is TOTALLY WRONG. Those sources need to be corrected. They are reporting negligently. Remember that a lot of 'news' is designed to over-dramatize issues to draw more emotional response to gain a following. The internet is the worst source of this bologna. The reporters/writers often do not have any understanding of the concepts they are writing about.

A subconcussive impact would be heading a soccer ball, banging helmets on in a American football game or practice, banging heads playing rugby, strong body checks in hockey, head banging to music where the goal is to alter mental state, and other impacts or strong jarrings.

Sub-concussive impact means an IMPACT that did not cause concussion symptoms but did have a brief effect on brain function, even for a part of a second. Some would call them a 'dinger' as in 'I got my bell rung.'

The research on subconcussive impacts goes back a decade or more. It is based on the discovery that American football players who have never had a diagnosed concussion were developing cognitive problems. They did research by putting sensors in helmets and found that players, especially linemen and running backs suffered 800 to 1000 of the measurable impacts in a single season. Kevin M. Guskiewicz, PhD in sports medicine and Julian Bailles, MD started this work almost 20 years ago.

The movie Concussion over dramatized the issues. Dr Omalu was only a small part of the research. The well publicized suicide of NFL linebacker Junior Seau after his struggles with cognitive function thrust this issue into the public.

These examples that are reported are about people who played violent sports for a decade or more. They did not get their CTE from bumpy car rides.

Thanks once again. So you don't think anything I mentioned would be something I should worry about?

I actually never read anything suggesting they would be from an actual medical website, only from people on other forums. I've read things like "a roller coasters ride is worse for your brain then a concussion", "basketball players could get cte from constant jumping and stopping" and "kids could be getting cte from rough housing and wrestling" (which I always thought was natural behavior).

I guess I should probably stop spending so much time online researching this stuff it's just obviously very scary and it's hard to tell if I should focus on my education, getting a good job and eventually starting a family or if all that is pointless since my brain may not even work anymore in a few years. Like I don't wanna get married and have kids if I'm just gonna end up being a burden on them in the future, you know?

It sounds like you should go learn how to live as a homeless person. Your irrational obsessions are far more risk that any risk of CTE. Go take a class on how to build a home out of an appliance box and how to pack all of your belongings into a stolen shopping cart. With your overwhelming anxiety and inability to use rational thought to overcome false ideas, you will likely become a burden on others. Of course, it will not be CTE. It will be purely anxiety and irrational thought. Are you getting my point?

The few who develop CTE don't usually see any serious symptoms until their 40s. The biggest area of study with CTE is regarding why some get it and others who have had more concussions and sub-concussive impacts live to ripe old ages with no dementia.

You have a risk of developing Alzheiner's Disease, too. Nobody knows why some people get Alheimer's except for a few who have a genetic predisposition.

You are reading pure trash about basketball and kids rough housing. None of it has any validity. I have corrected your wrong ideas and you keep asking the same question a different way.

btw, I have loved and enjoyed roller coasters all my life. We had a 20 year tradition of spending New Years Day at an amusement park in Santa Cruz California. My daughter and I would ride the Big Dipper over and over.

I loved Space Mountain and the Bob Sleds at Disneyland and the roller coasters at every amusement park I have visited on both the west and east coast.

So, please let me know when you have decided to believe me. I have followed concussion research for longer than you have been alive.

If you look for concussion symptoms, I guaranty you will notice them. When somebody posts about headaches, I get a headache just responding to their post. The brain is extremely responsive to suggestion. Yours has proven to be one of the more responsive to suggestion.

Do you have access to psychological counseling?

Alright thanks, I appreciate your bluntness. I will focus on my education and not look for symptoms and yes I will most likely start cbt again.

Ben getting your neck checked as mentioned above is a good idea. There are practitioners that do gentle adjustments like NUCCA Chiros. My son had that done after his concussions.

Also I suggest you do some further research. **There are some good recovery stories there and some from hockey players like you also.

Get your hormones checked in the event they have been disrupted from the concussions also. **

Ben

*administrative edit per NeuroTalk Guidlines*
Here's the link to an individuals story and how his treatment helped him. Its his personal post letting others know about how he got help through the medical system ... no promotions going on here...

Concussions & Mental Health in Hockey | Canlan Ice Sports Oakville

To clarify that poster is not my son but a similar story of treatment and recovery I found on the web.

Would testosterone levels show up on a routine full panel blood test done by a gp?

I dont think they normally test for it. You will have to ask for it specifically. Be firm and state you want it done.

I'm not sure the saliva tests are accurate from what Ive read online. ypu will need a blood test for it.