brain supplement
 

ne1 no of any good brain suppliments?

choline is good for the brain, so is vit b12. jarrow formulas makes a cdp choline, and natural factors makes a phosphatidyl choline.

omega 3 fish oil obviously.

a product called focus fast has all those ingredients, i may try that...

i was just looking at that, some questionable ingredients including vinpocetine.
and if you're taking any pharmaceuticals like SSRIs. st johns wort or 5-HTP could interact with that.

here's the link so people can check it out.

http://www.focusfast.com/info.php

products like that
 

with LONG lists of ingredients typically provide very low subnormal amounts of the listed ingredients which provide
little support or help.

The only thing missing from that ingredient list is the "kitchen sink".

Vague questions like "brain supplements" are basically
not specific to the problem.

You have to KNOW what you want to accomplish, and avoid
shot-gun huge supplements like this with very little and poor accountability and who charge you ALOT of money.

Never choose a supplement that has huge lists with lots of ingredients, and those ingredients and not detailed as to content/ AMOUNT. When lumped together this way, the supplier can put whatever they want in that mixture. For example, acetyl-carnitine is an expensive item...how much is really in this product? That appears to be a "secret".

The only things listed properly are the vitamins. And for what they charge for this product--- you are vastly overpaying!

Depends on what the brain problem is. If the brain problem is actually due to disturbed sleep, then that is hat should be addressed. Different things are good for attentional problems, etc. also, age matters. Also, hormone levels matter and whether or not you need thyroid or adrenal support.

Jaspar

I agree with mrs. D she's right about long list of ingredients being shotty, cause i always look on iherb and see plenty of these items/supplements with long lists of ingredients. surprisingly source naturals-a trusted brand, makes most of these concoctions, and I'm starting to be weary of them. another thing I looked into which seems to be a good product for circulation is vinpocetine or whatever it's called, I have to look this product up cause I'm not sure of the dangers of it and haven't heard of it before?? any info would be cool.

and most of these items with big lists of ingredients have ginormous pills size, and you end up having to take like 5-6 pills a day which no one has the time to do anyways. At most for me I usually only take supplements with small amounts of ingredients and ones that i don't have to end up taking more than 3 times daily.

The brand I've been into lately has been natural factors, it has many types of supplements of good quality coming from canada, or are canadian made. jarrow and now products makes some good products as well.

I don't endorse these products, but I'm just a regular guy telling you that these products worked well for me.

vinpocetine
 

increases bleeding. For people using SSRI drugs...like Lexapro
which also increase bleeding you should consult your doctor
before using.

also found this excerpt from wikipedia:

Vinpocetine is also a phosphodiesterase (PDE) type-1 inhibitor,[9] (with an IC50 of approximately 10-5 M.) leading to increases in intracellular levels of cyclic guanosine 3'5'-monophosphate (cGMP), an action that has been attributed to the vasorelaxant effects of vinpocetine on cerebral smooth muscle tissue.[10][11]

Increases in neuronal levels of DOPAC, a metabolic breakdown product of dopamine, have been shown to occur in striatal isolated nerve endings as a result of exposure to vinpocetine.[12] Such an effect is consistent with the biogenic pharmacology of reserpine, a structural relative of vinpocetine, which depletes catecholamine levels and may cause depression as a side-effect of the cardiovascular and anti-psychotic effects.[13]

Side-effects

Vinpocetine has been implicated in one case to induce agranulocytosis,[14] a condition in which granulocytyes - an important type of white blood cell, are markedly decreased. Some people have anecdotally noted that their continued use of vinpocetine reduces immune function. Commission E warned that vinpocetine reduced immune function and could cause apoptosis in the long term. [15]

Dosage

It is recommended that first-time users ingest only 2-5 mg of vinpocetine with meals to make sure they are not hypersensitive to it. Users may then increase the dosage to 10-40 mg a day (which may, although very rarely, cause some light side-effects).

no one of respectability has taken this, or no one has anything good to say about this supplement online, so i think i'll pass for now. people on erowid used it for a test. another supplement I am interested in is huperzine A, which seems to have a bunch of side effects listed on wikipedia which leads me to not considering taking it.

I don't think
 

a young person would need Huperzine A. It is mostly targeted
to older patients with cognitive decline.

If you have side effects from drugs, this is not the way to
minimize those.

Dr. Sahelian MD often has interesting medical info and warnings on his pages. For huperzine A this it:
http://www.raysahelian.com/huperzinea.html

Another good source of information (they do not have huperzine listed however) is:

http://www.umm.edu/altmed/

While Wiki is good sometimes, sometimes it is not complete or does not cover all issues to the topic completely. It relies on donations of info, and as such is only moderately useful.
I am very careful with it, myself.

yah generally wiki is good, becuz people scour the net for information from reputable sites to add on there. but every now and then you get a few whacky bits of information, but the people that keep the site up generally sort through that information, or delete unwarranted information, there's some people that actually wait and check out the updated information links to correct and revise them when posted.

Thanks for the information everyone... I see your point about those long lists of ingredients, and it got me thinkin too... But, it seems that most of these products have it so i might as well try this out... I'll keep everyone posted... I ended up purchasing it from (i cant post the link directly bc of my low post count lol)

Whats a comparable product you recommened??

I would really suggest buying separate products.

I'm not sure, omega 3 fish oil from iherb.com is good.
or try some vitamin b12 from jarrow formulas over at iherb as well. that's what I use.

Yeah, but buying a separate product for 10 different ingredients is probably more costly and annoying!! lol

What do you want to accomplish?

How old are you? Health status?

If you are interested in keeping your brain as healthy as
possible, Dr. Daniel Amen MD has a book that may help you:
Change Your Brain, Change Your Life.

http://www.amenclinics.com/
http://www.amenclinics.com/store/ind...=index&cPath=1

He is on PBS during pledge times, try to catch his lectures.
I have seen two of them, and they are very very good.

mrsD: I really like Dr. Sahelian's info.

I'm new here but wanted to share this.

I recently went through a period of one traumatic event after another. (Grand baby died, lost 95,000 at IndyMac, etc. etc.)

I had such severe depression and anxiety that it just ate my brain. I was no longer just a little spacey like my normal self, my brain was totally scrambled and just did not work. It was so bad it was having an impact on my business and my MD wanted to send me for an MRI.

So anyway I started experimenting with lots of different brain supplements and finally found one that works for me.

Neuro Optimizer by Jarrow - Ingredients:

# Cognizin (CDP-Choline)
# Phosphatidyserine (PS)
# Acetyl L-Carnitine
# Alpha Lipoic Acid
# L-Glutamine
# Taurine + Folic Acid

Every supplement works for different people so not saying this would be the best for others. But when I forget to take it my brain goes back to mush so I def feel a difference. iHerb has a couple pages of reviews about it. That's where I research most products I buy, because they have so many reviews.

Warning, not sure if anyone else mentioned but if you take Acetyl L-Carnitine you need to be sure it also has Alpha Lipoic Acid.
Can't remember the problem but I've read warnings several places that ALC should not be taken alone.

Hope this helps someone else!

Yes, I like Dr. Sahelian's information too.

But alot depends on AGE, health status, and other factors, such as drug use, whether a person has insulin resistance, etc.
mental illness etc. Just using a statin for cholesterol may decrease brain functions considerably, for example.

People can have reduced brain functions just from having poor sugar control in the brain.

Poor food intake of choline (not eating eggs or enough veggies with lechithin) will also lead to poor functioning.
The poster here is not being very specific. And so I personally would like to know more.

Many young people today are into "smart drugs". If they paid more attention to healthy lifestyle...they wouldn't need smart drugs! "Smart drugs" tend to make alot of money for those who advertise them.

There is an improved version of alpha lipoic acid, called r-lipoic. It is much more potent in lower doses and therefore costs less.

If you have alot of anxiety I'd also recommend inositol. This is very effective for this problem. Start at 500mg a day for a week and increase by 500mg a day up to about 1-3 gram.
You don't need the very high doses typically. 500mg a day may do it for you. Inositol combined with the taurine you take already, is very good for insulin sensitizing issues.
The taurine in your product is low. And so is the ALA.
You'd need at least 1000mg taurine a day (sold separately) and 250-500 ALA to be therapeutic. ALA is a racemic mixture of two forms of lipoic acid. One of them is inactive biologically.
r-lipoic is the purified active form.

Mixtures really look good on paper, but it is rare to find one that is really effective for all the listed ingredients.
http://www.jarrow.com/product.php?prodid=188
Notice you must take 4 capsules to get what is listed on that label.

Folate is good for depression-- 800mcg would be better than 400mcg IMO.
Also depression often responds to l-tryptophan, + some B6.
Tryptophan at night on an empty stomach 500mg will support synthesis of serotonin (and hence
melatonin). L-tryptophan has now become available again. People who do not sleep well, may
be low in melatonin due to low B12 levels. B12 is the cofactor for converting serotonin to melatonin.

Choline supplements provide the basis for acetylcholine manufacture. But this is only one neurotranmitter of many. They also provide some support to cell membranes.

Lions Mane Supplement
 

I personally don't know...but I looked around for you:

also this:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...ubmed_RVDocSum

on cholesterol:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...ubmed_RVDocSum

I find this last one interesting.

I don't see any harm in trying it at this time.
It would depend on what was going on to need improvement.
Increasing cells(growth factor) is somewhat different than enabling specific functions.

There are many papers on PubMed using this keyword:
Hericium erinaceus

I think the mushroom thing might be cordyceps.

You can take ALC alone, it might not be as effective. I take the R-Lipoic acid, and i know that the neuro-optimizer might be good, but you have to take like 4 capsules what's with that?

and also what is dr. sahelian's info?
is that the daniel amen doctor for change your brain change your life

Dr. Sahelian MD
 

http://www.raysahelian.com/
He sells stuff tho. I typically read his comments about supplements, and he often puts up studies which are useful.
But he is not my first and only source of information.

He is not Dr. Amen.
Dr. Amen is a psychiatrist who specializes in Brain imaging.
He uses supplements at times for treatment of mental illness, but is not primarily a supplement specialist or expert. (he started out as a specialist in ADHD and Bipolar).

Thanks mrsD, you really know a lot about supplements!

I've been thinking about trying Inositol and will probably order some this week.

FYI re: NeuroOptimizer, I only take 2 and feel a big difference.

re: Tryptophan - be very careful - if you are taking anti-depressants you should probably not take it. There is the possibility of Seratonin sydrome, especially if you take it along with SSRIs. In fact my Lexapro has a warning specifically about Tryptophan.

If I was NOT taking any depression meds however, I would definitely give
L-tryptophan or 5HTP a try before getting on meds.

The warnings about SSRIs and tryptophan are slowly changing.
The blanket warnings for the general population remain in place, because SSRIs are serious drugs and should be used with caution. But some doctors (esp in Europe) are using l-tryptophan with antidepressants now to reduce doses of the drugs. This is done with medical supervision.

Some people with mild to moderate depression can avoid use of SSRIs altogether with proper attention to nutrients that work in the brain. Folic acid, and DHA (a fatty acid) and l-typtophan, B6 etc may not even need an SSRI.

Just an update for anyone that cares - i've been taking focus fast for the last several days, and it's definitely helping keeping me more alert and concentrated on certain tasks... they actually lowered their price so thats why i bought it, lol (49.99)... no way was i paying more.

my doctor always advised against combining meds and supplements together because there is hardly any research (plus they want to cover their asses, lol)

Supplements
 

this is also a good resource...
 

http://www.umm.edu/altmed/

Click on "interactions" and/or depletions.

The most severe interaction is bleeding. Taking herbs that increase bleeding with blood thinners is one of the most important ones to recognize.

Also some herbs like St. John's Wort increase metabolism of some drugs.

In general if you add up all the potential problems, more nutrients are negatively impacted with drugs, than vice versa.

Many doctors have no clue as to what to do...so they just say a blanket "don't take anything". That is their typical solution to a question.

Supplements
 

Increasingly, children are being treated nutritionally to help with symptoms that formerly would have been diagnosed in the DSM-IV. Especially for sleep (although really - a sleep study should be done to try to figure out what is going on, but the U.S.A. insurances seems reluctant to pay for them). The supplements can either augment pharmaceutical medication (thereby reducing the amount needed which thereby reducing side-effects), or replacing the pharmaceuticals entirely.

Some cases really need a collaborative team of specialists who know multiple fields including Integrative medicine.

Sometimes it is frustrating obeying the psychiatrist's command "Thou shalt not use melatonin" and "thou shalt not use tryptophan and suffer for a decade trying med after med only to go ahead and try the supplements ten years later thinking how everything else the psychiatrist did was random and trial and error and find... gee... a simple supplement worked better than everything else... and now you can lower or eliminate the other meds that didn't work well anyway and were giving a bunch of side-effects.

Excellent post - Many doctors shy away from nutrition products, because they do not make any money as they would by selling prescriptions... Just like any other business, profit is put above people's health in this sick world... I was going to see a doctor for the way I was feeling, but held strong and took a gamble with nutrition products... I narrowed it down to brain quicken and focus fast... i settled with the latter and im more than happy with it

Supplement Industry
 

They do have to prove their effectiveness - They can't make claims without defending them so if you do see a claim without any scientific studies, you can bet the product will be investigated...

To put this in a bit of perspective:
The annual sale of Lipitor (one drug only) for 2007 was 6.8 billion dollars.
Supplements remain fairly low on the dollars spent, compared to drugs.

Coca Cola?
from http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23143415/

Absolutely, there is no doubt about it that plenty of money is spent on drugs and all the rest. I never said that there wasn't lots spent on drugs and all those kinds of things. I was just making a statement. I don't drink pop/soda either so they aren't making any money on me. :)