Need Ideas Please
 

The director of the mental health clinic in my county and I will be meeting to discuss how the mental health system can change. I have some good reasons why I am unhappy with the mental health system in my county but would like to hear any complaints you all have with your system that I may also find wrong with mine that I can discuss. My goal is to improve the system for the better of it's clients.

barbara king

Hi befuddled2

Well i am giving you my UK version of this, but i guess its pretty much the same the world over.

The saddest and most obvious problem with mental health care is
1. the sufferer is unwell, confused, debilitated, anxious, isolated and desperate for a cure,
2. the health professionals [not all i hasten to add] are usually healthy, logical, in control, mindful and hyper alert, probably to busy to be anxious, Specialists in their field, and try to fit each individual into a text book pigeon hole, [whoops cynical me]

When patient and doctor can be given a level playing field,,,,mental health care may improve,

I have often seen doctors who barely look at you whilst writing their notes down, offer little or no bed side manner, and strangely enough for such a sensitive medical spectrum, have little or no...EMPATHY.

In the USA it may be better, but then you pay hard cash for a the understanding you may or may not receive.

PATCH ADAMS got it spot on.....treat people with care kindness, understanding and humour....and it would go along way in stripping the taboo of mental health

and it may also help the patient. Kindness goes along way in health care

far further than egotistical patronising arrogance that a lot in this medical field suffer from.

Rant over good luck in trying to shape the future even if its just your county health care system [from acorns to oak trees i say loudly]

David

Thank you David. I am going to use what you said as to the state of mind the patient is in compared to the health care provider. It is like that here also in the USA.

barbara

one of my clients was locked up for 30 days because her pdoc thought she was manic because she was talking fast.
She said she was not manic. 30 days!!!!!
and the scarey thing is that her pdoc IS MY PDOC!!!!!:confused:

they let my neighbor out after 6 days following a suicide attempt....talked her way out, no therapist no antidepressants.....then they canceled her follow up appointment one month later....insane!

my girlfriend was over medicated and had been treated for bipolarism for 7 years following a suicide attempt. they kept giving her more meds to counter act the side effects of her meds...she was up to 8 pills...she finally got off everything when she decided to have a baby....
She is not bipolar! her suicide attempt was situational depression.

rebecca riley died at age 4 from overdose of psych meds from her parents...
most kids who are in the foster parent system are on medications...
anti psychitic meds are the number one drug seller.
WE can even use seroquel for depression....excuse me it is sedative!
lets sedate someone who is depressed!

sorry for my rant
bizi

Hi Bizi If I got locked up for circumstances like that,I'd turn into hot vapor with anger. That would really get my goat!:mad: I'd certainly would not pay for it if it was forced on me.

The payment where I go,has gone up 3,to 400%. I'm already angry looking at,and trying to figure out these bills.

Why do they raise the billing when you get on Medicaid? :mad: Venting,venting,venting. BF:hug::hug::hug:

Two years ago i suuported a Heroin addict at work.

He went to see his GP to say he was feeling depressed and was getting fuzzy head feelings as he said [fell a sleep for several minutes at a time but thought nothing of this]

He was conerned that he had been to the doctor on several occassions but could not convey his concerns as the Doctor just SAW+TREATED a heroin addict and subsquent Methodone addict.

He said the doctor was brash and cold towards him, dismissive of anything he tried to say.

So i wrote an introduction letter that he could hand the Doctor as he went into his appointment. The letter just stated that my client was concerned about other aspects of his life and health and found it difficult to talk about it. I also included that this person was feeling sterotyped and not seen from a holistical view point.

The letter was not rude, or innappropriate and my client was delighted that his view would be relayed.

The outcome was for this doctor to blow is stack.....He reported me for the construction of the letter claiming he Had mental health as his primary background in medicine. He was irate that i, and his patient had dare to question his style or proffessional behaviour.

Well the complaint went absoloutely nowhere, he recalled the complaint but chose his doctor patient right...to withdraw service. [he removed my clint from his GP list]


My client changed Doctors [but now felt guilt ...so still did not convey his issues with his new doctor]

He left where i work into his own home about three months after.

He was there eleven weeks, and was found dead in his flat face down.
He had died of an epelctic fit apparently. [were these the fuzzy head feelings he described i thought?]

TREAT THE PERSON AS A HUMAN BEING AND NOT AS case diagnosis

David

I mistakeingly went to an orthopedic doctor about my shoulder injury. and had a list of all of my hospitalizations down on a piece of paper instead of having to write them all out. it was a long list.
So when she came in for the first meeting and exam...she spent more time quizing me about my drug induced hospitalizations than assessing my shoulder.
It infuriated me but said nothing, she did not listen to my concerns and formed her own opinion, I asked about an mri and she said there was nothing wrong with my shoulder, but after the exray it showed something was wrong so she ordered the mri, she could not have waited 5 minutes after an exray to make her diagnosis????? I left her office knowing that I would never see her again.
I had my mri and went into her office to pick up my erays and saw another ortho. I did not list my diagnosis nor my meds...I figured I would share that info later if I needed a surgery or other treatment.
bizi
hurumph....:mad:

Hi,
 

I remember you writing about this at the time Bizi. :hug:

Norsk10
 

Dear all,

I am new on this site and not greatly computer literate so I do not know how to "jump around" these sites.

The thing problematic about medicine, all fields of it, is that the causes of diseases are not known so treatments are more or less trail and error, even if modern clinical trials are used to determine if this or that chemical helps a certain problem. They are all disease altering drugs (or even surgeries) so not too much can be expected of them.

Physicians, by their training, are associated with fairly reputable mentors and physicians learn from them. No one questions them. That is not bad, but the mentors do not know the causes of diseases either, but that conditions new physicians to think more of themselves and the knowledge they have than is true. That makes them not feel guilty when they are paid...just works out that way. They are truly doing their best, usually, but the level of medical knowledge "out there" is not so great...not as much as we give the medical community credit for.

Think this way: in 1850 physicians did not know the cause of one disease: unless a person had a laceration, fracture, or sprain. Then the microbiological revolution was started in Holland with van Leewenhoek, but it took until the 1850's for the Germans to start learning about bacterial diseases. By the early 1900's the cause of most bacterial diseases were figured out and antibiotics were invested in the 1930's, but thereafter there has been no great insights in medical science. None!

All the stuff done since the 40's is the development of high-tech things, surgery and chemical therapy to alter diseases. No one seriously thinks about "thinking about" the causes of diseases so that new cures can be developed.

You neurological people...are in luck though, because I have figured out that there is one cause for most neurological and other conditions, from sciatica, to carpal tunnel, to Guillain-Barre' to MS, etc., and all rheumatic conditions have neuropathies as do gastrointestinal problems so you see, all these diseases, and many more, are connected by one underlying cause. I will have a paper published in a few months and when it is I will notify you on this site.

Those who have individual questions can contact me on this site if you want. I am busy finishing the paper and a book, but I will look at the site from time to time.

Yours, Norsk10

Hi DMACK This is very sad. His former doctor sounds arrogant,and cold hearted. The poor person didn't have a proper check up for the fuzzy head feelings,and his doctor wasn't listening.

This is so sad. His life will be remembered by your kind heart. I wish that I could have talked to him. I've been through some dark periods of pain in my life,and have survived. You have a good weekend. Like I said,I'm very sorry for your former client. He deserved to be treated like a human being. BF:hug::grouphug::hug:

Thank you all for your ideas and stories. I have one recent story to tell. I am having a hospital investigated for bogus pych treatment. In the process of filling out the form I am finding out how hard it is to get the information. I am being told that it is up to my pysch doctor as to whether or not I can get the records. I am not with that doctor anymore and I resent him having the say as to whether or not I can get my hospital records.

barbara

dismissing other ailments in presence of mental sx
 

like others, i have had bad treatment outside of mental health care, by practitioners who couldn't get past even very simple mental health/state and investigate other problems. i have to wonder to what degree, even within a mental health setting, patients' other troubles might still be underestimated, or interpreted as "emotionally based" or psychosomatic.

i was dismissed from a neuro exam for migraines. i came in having an anxiety attack - fairly mild but i was visibly nervous when i entered (shaking, talking jerkily). i also had a migraine going on, due to which i was feeling very jarred/disoriented by the type of lights and bleepy noises and general ruccus in the center. this was a follow up exam - i had had an MRI which i was to bring. she looked me upside down, said what's wrong with YOU? and no sooner the words anxiety attack left my lips she was no longer listening to me tell her i also had a migraine ongoing, with all the doozy effects from light/sound, no, she was yelling at me that i "belonged" in pdoc's office not hers and that my migraines were all emotionally-based. thank goodness the ativan took effect at some point i was able to stand up to her somewhat but still, she

- would not look at the MRI,
- did not want to hear about the types of symptoms i have
- did not narrow down the TYPE of migraines i have (with some kinds you can't take certain meds, so it is important to know! :mad:)
- did not discuss treatment options with me
- finally shipped me off with a med suggestion (not script!) in a NOTE to my PDOC.

pdoc read it and said what she suggested was used specifically for PSYCHOSOMATIC PAIN.

i had migraines BEFORE i ever had any mood episode, and their course did not vary with my moods or within episodes. :( and my mom, who doesn't have any mood disturbances, also had migraines. it's genetic. :mad:

~ waves ~

i am aware
 

that in the US doctors are reticent about giving psych patients their records and it is not standard practice to release them. however,

1. they WILL release them to another doc (so for instance, you could request them sent to your current pdoc and that should NOT present any problem).

2. i am not sure if there is any legal difference with psych records specifically. If not, you have a right to those records. you might want to call some place like NAMI and find that out.

I had wondered also about releasing them to another doctor.

Not sure why exactly they wont release them to you the patient.
But in some cases I personally can understand this.

Donna

Hipaa
 

HI,
Those lazy jerks are supposed to give you your records -- with some exceptions:


http://www.privacyrights.org/fs/fs8b-MedFAQ.htm#2
also:


http://www.privacyrights.org/fs/fs8b-MedFAQ.htm#2

Contact the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services Office for Civil Rights. They have a procedure:
http://www.hhs.gov/ocr/privacy/


M.

Mental Health problems
 

I have Bipolar I (rapid cycling), OCD, and have attempted suicide twice in the last year in a half. I still do not have an actual doctor. I have a nurse pract and a therapist. The therapist is wonderful and I see him for an hr every week. My practicing glorified nurse I only see about once a month when she needs to write my klonopin script and all of the others. She does not seem to care to listen to any of my problems so I do not tell her any. She is unapproachable and cold. She intimidates me! All she is concerned about is getting through all of my prescriptions and getting me out of her office in the 15 minutes that the front desk has set aside for my appt. I feel that my problems warrant an actual doc and one that will listen.

collinsc

That is unusual for a nurse practioner to be this cold...
usually they are more wholistic in approach.
I do know that it is the "pdoc's job to get the meds right and the tdocs job to do the counseling...so that is really normal.
My pdoc has counseled me and has a great memory...she has taken time to understand my circumstances. I can email her when ever I need to...her staff usually gets back to me by the end of the day if I have a concern.
I have seen her for 7 years.....am afraid of her though.
Don't tell her when I am manic, afraid she will commit me.
bizi

Thank you for the information. I was told by someone else to get my family doctor to get my psych records for me. I will look into it more when I've had more sleep and my neck and shoulder don't hurt so bad. Today I mailed the forms to have the mental hospital investigated for bogus hospitalization. I am anxious to see the results of that investigation.

barbara

Need Support and Ideas
 

I got a copy of the report of the shrink's notes from my bougus psych hospitaliziation last year. I've copied and pasted this so as to keep typing it over and over. It seems like my shrink really believed I was pychotic by the report so to me it's the hospital's fault then for admitting me on less.
--------------------
I don't know whether or not you remember about all the trouble I had in the old neighborhood last year that I moved from just this past January. Well, my ex-next door neighbor made my life hell harrassing me and then my landlord seemed to join in because I had taken him to court for flea infestation. I was admitted to a pysch hospital within a regular hospital for bogus treatment instead of being treated for high blood pressure like I had gone there for. The shrink did not believe me when I told him about my old neighbors and the landlord harrassing me. The shrink thought I was delusional according to his notes. I had made the joke, well, just put me in Tuckers, the psych unit. So next thing I knew I was being asked questions by an intake nurse like if I was suicidal or had thoughts of hurting anyone. I told her no and then she asked me if I have ever had any fleeting thoughts in the past of hurting myself and I said, "well, I suppose I have." Next thing I know I was in the psych ward. Since then I have been billed $1,100 for an over night stay. Now I am fighting back and have an organization that may investigate it. I also am still busy collecting evidence in my favor like a police record of the old neighborhood, court record of me taking my landlord to court and such which resulted in harrassment by the landlord. In the shrinks nortes he talks about how I told him I was being harrassed by my landlord because I complained about fleas the previous summer. I also told him how my apartment was almost broken into and such which it was. This is whe the police record will prove I was telling the truth. The shrink stated in his notes that what I was saying I kept insisting it was the truth like he didn't believe me.
------------------
Since typing that I have received by email a police report of 911 calls to my old neighborhood in the past year. In just one year there were around 176 calls made to 911 from the small apartment complex where I lived. Ten of those calls were made for breaking and entering. I had told the shrink that my apartment was almost broken into and he didn't believe me. My shrink made me out to be paranoid and delusional in what I told him when in reality it was all true. I will be picking up the police report of the time my old apartment was almost broken into.

I know this is long but the thing I want to bring out in the open is how when someone is labled with a mental illness that they are not taken seriously. And in most cases that is usually all the time. Because my shrink had taps on my disagnosis he jumped to conclusions that what I was telling him were nothing but delusional thinking. It resulted in a $1,100 bill to me that I don't believe i should have to pay when they didn't act in my opinion with a real reason to admit me. And from some of the responses in this post I can see that not being taken seriously is not a problem only I have experienced. What in the world can we do to stop this kind of injustice?

barbara

Barb
I don't know if there is anything you can do to stop them from not
taking you seriously. I have found that its not just the mentally
ill that the doctor's are not taking serious.

I'm sorry to say.

Donna

Hi Donna,

Do you mean physicians as well as psychiatrists don't take people serious or just most the psychiatrists that don't take anyone serious?

barbara

hi barbara
I am so sorry that that happened to you.
You did not have any one to help support you.
1,100 is not bad for an overnight stay....my bill was $8,000 for a 3 nite stay in arizona...10 years ago that I am still slowly paying off.
I hear your voice of frustration and no I don't think you should have been admitted.
where are our advocates?????

like I said before my client was locked up for 30 days against her will for talking too fast on the phone.....that was my pdoc!!!!!!!:mad:

you have to be very careful what you say...
another example, my 80 year old client made a comment about slicing her throat in frustration over something....
ended up in the psych unit for a week.....
sigh

Hi Bizi,

The $1,100 that I was billed was the part that Medicare did not pay so the total cost was higher.

Your right, I had no support on this because I was ashamed that it happened. I didn't want anyone to know in my 3-D that I even am Bi-polar. I honestly believe it happened because I am Bi-polar and once they found out I was an easy target. I kept it all to myself until recently. I've told my bf that the hospital had done me wrong and some other tidbids of information but scared to tell him the whole story. I guess I tried to just sweep the whole issue under the rug but feel different now. My credit rating was ruined because of the bill being reported to the Credit Bureaus and now they are threatening to get a judgment agaisnt me. I've had enough and want to fight them now.

barbara

WOw!!!
That is crazy.
I am sorry that the system failed you. My health insurance only pays so much per day for psych inpatient....much much less then if I were on a medical floor.
unfair!

Check this out!
 

Mine too Bizi.

I was doing a search on this subject on Google and this is what came up.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...=&oq=&gs_rfai=

Dear Barbara,
This should not have happened.
I don't even know what to say except I am sorry you had to go through that.

Generally we are taught to trust the folks in hospitals who care for us.

Mari

Thank you Mari.

My link to the Google page has this thread the on the 2nd one down. I thought that was interesting to do a search and see my post.

barbara

Dear Barbara,

A little while ago I heard about a pssch hospital in Texas that over admitted patients and kept them too long.
They had more admissions than other psych hospitals.
Eventually law suits were filled.

But that is all I remember.

There are patient advocacy groups.
The first one I might look into is nami.
Nami claims to do advocacy work.

It is best to be connected to other people so
that we have people supporting us.


M.

eeeks
 

the first from that list is: Wikipedia - The Rosenhan Experiment
:eek: that is CREEPY! :(:mad:

i just remembered something...

i once wanted to seek outpatient services at a particular hospital. now i don't remember the hospital. but my pdoc at the time asked me please, NOT go go. he said even though i was well clear of needing hospitalization, my mood was just off enough that that particular hospital might try to detain me involuntarily. he had had other patients land in there and had had a terrible time trying to get them out! even as their doc!!! :(

~ waves ~

This all raises doubts in my mind of the system.

barbara

Barb

Yes I am talking about physicians not taking the patient serious.

I can think of many situations. But the biggest for me is that
it took me way to long to get my gall bladder out. I was beginning
to think I was going to have to die first.



I also know that right now. My daughter-in-law like has got to
find a new physician, hers isn't taking what she is telling her seriously.

SO its time to find someone, that will help with her migraines and
other things.

Donna

My old lawyer talked to me like I was stupid or something after finding out I am Bi-polor.

barbara

Maybe its time to take the lawyers out to dry too. At times I think
so.

I really like Derrick's lawyer or our lawyer we are using for Derrick's
things.

I hope your new one if good for you.

Donna

Yes Donna, my new lawyer treats me like I have some intelleigence.

barbara

Very smart person

:Trapeze 2::You-Rock:

Donna

Thanks Donna. You made my night. While eating an Italian sausage Sunday morning some of the hot grease splattered in the eye I had the surgery on. That eye is hurting tonight so I'm going to call the eye doctor in the morning.

barbara

oh what rotten luck!
do call tomorrow.
bizi

Dear Barbara, :grouphug:
Are you ok?


M.