Tinnitus, Serotonin and other thoughts....
 

My tinnitus is out of hand for now, making me crazy. The cicadas are in rare form in my head. Anyways. I was reading about tinnitus and it says that serotonin levels can cause the tinnitus to worsen. It also states that tinnitus is a central nervous problem, which serotonin is a huge part of.

So, my first question, do you think that some of us are just predisposed to have neuropic problems? I have had tinnitus for as long as I can remember. I also remember learning to crochet and my hands always hurting, my mom just said it was because I didn't do it enough. But, was that nerves acting up even then?

In the central nervous system, serotonin is believed to play an important role in the regulation of body temperature, mood, sleep, vomiting, sexuality, and appetite. Low levels of serotonin have been associated with weight disorders, namely clinical depression, obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD), migraine, irritable bowel syndrome, tinnitus, fibromyalgia, bipolar disorder, and anxiety disorders.[citation needed] If neurons of the brainstem that make serotonin—serotonergic neurons—are abnormal, there is a risk of sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS) in an infant.[1]Reading about serotonin makes more sense out of my life. Of course, having celiac disease, I had a vitamin and mineral deficiency, which I do not think has corrected itself, even after almost 6 years of gluten free. I was taking B complex vitamins, B12, and a multi vitamin and my sister told me I was just wasting the B vitamins, that my body doesn't retain them anyways. Is she right? Should I be taking B6 along with my 2400mcg of B12?

Will I ever figure this all out? I know you have to eat the right combinations of food for a good balance, yet I can't. I have too many intolerance's. So, what do I do? Any ideas?

I feel like I just go in circles. I have neuropathy because of vitamin deficiencies because of celiac's and because of celiac's I can't eat properly so I have vitamin deficiencies which make the neuropathy progress. Circles!!!

I need a :grouphug:

Oh Deb! The tinnitus...?
 

Somehow, after reading years of posts, I'd almost given it AS a 'Given'!..
Yes, when BP is hier [stress, infusions, what eaten, meds...whatever] IT is worse. Somehow, docs seem, to me, to dismiss this s/x as a 'nothing' issue. Like you the 'noise' is constant, ignored and seemingly totally unrelated. I dunno.... it does seem to be one common issue among many of us.

I would NOT give up the vites! Not at all! Since you seem to have a gluten issue [especially], the possibility of/for asorbtion issues especially is always present. IF you take excessive vites, well, some may go 'out w/the trash', but, your odds of 'getting' what you may NEED is far more important that not getting anything at all..

I'm sure Mrs.D or Rose will speak soon, but, a prudent choice of supplements certainly can't HURT your overall health. You just have to be careful in your choices. Example, Vits C and B-12: excess simply goes out...If you provide your body [which may have issues asorbing ONE pill a day] well, giving the body 'opportunities' more often during the day to 'get' that needed stuff, is well, harmless in the long run, and super-helpful in the overall. So, the question remains...are you HURTING or HELPING yourself in which choice you choose? It's your choice. I too go in CIRcLES about which 'what's to take and when...and HOW much. It can turn the brain to MUSH! Hard enuf to try and understand PN! Not to mention the variables? I DO trust Mrs D and Rose to provide the sources for the better, safer options for supplements. I do believe THEY ARE THERE...OR HAVE BEEN THERE...

As for SSRI's...for me, like Neurontin...they are DISASTROUS for me? I count my blessings in some ways...at least, I can take opiods for pain in what I feel are real-beyond real situations. Some folks can't. Geesh! What are the options-if any...then?

Hugs and good thoughts for now - j

NSAIDs (Non Steroidal AntiInflamatory Drugs) such as aspirin, ibuprofen, and naproxen sodium (Aleve) increase my tinnitus.

You can look up the side effects of all the medications you take, including over-the-counter. That way if a weird symptom turns up, like tinnitus, you'll know what caused it and let your doctor know. There are often alternatives without the same side effects. I check drugs at www.rxlist.com .

Grapefruit potentiates some drugs. There's a short article about it in the new National Geographic Magazine. That kind of interaction is included in the rxlist "Side Effects" and "Patient Information" sections.

Thank you both. I did forget to mention that I take Celexa, which is suppose to help with serotonin--maybe I do not take enough. I have had tinnitus most of my life, right now is the worst it has ever been and for so long.

So, about the grapefruit, does that mean I shouldn't eat it?:( I love grapefruit, yet I do not eat a lot of it and it is one of the few fruits I can eat.

Tinnitus
 

has many causes; not all of it originates from the CNS.

One example: cervicogenic tinnitus is caused by dysfunction in neck muscles, which often accompanies stress, bad posture or TMJ.

I also love grapefruit. Most days, I peal and eat a whole one. Grapefruit has the effect of preventing some stomach and intestinal enzymes from breakng down some drugs, especially some of the statin drugs. Taking a statin drug with grapefruit has the effect of greatly increasing the blood level of the affected drug in an unpredictable and possibly dangerous way.

So, look up each drug you take at www.rxlist.com . Check the "Side effects and interactions" section and the "Warnings" sections to see if that drug interacts with grapefruit. I checked all the drugs I take, and none of them interact with grapefruit.

Thanks David, so I am thinking it's ok for me to have my grapefruit. Thanks!

And Steve, cervicogenic tinnitus is caused by dysfunction in neck muscles, which often accompanies stress, bad posture or TMJ.I was thinking about this too. I honestly didn't connect the 2, but I do have a lot of trouble with my neck and shoulders. My doctor told me he thinks the nerves are part of my problem. My shoulder react like a pinched nerve--it all starts on one side, usually my left shoulder, crosses over pass my neck, then into my right shoulder and down in my arm. A friend mentioned TMJ to me the other day because I also clench my teeth, especially in my sleep when I am over stressed, which is often. Some times, I even realize I am clenching my teeth when awake now. And, you know, just life alone is stressful, then you throw in all these aches and pains, celiac's, neuropathy--of course I am overrun with stress!!! I had never heard there was a connection with tinnitus and your neck. Thank you--more research for me to do. Every little bit of info helps.

Darlindeb,

I wrote something on your other post and just saw this one.

I TOTALLY agree with your doctor! The symptoms you are having and describing are exactly what I had with the C5/C6. Again, a cervical MRI is in order. And, I just had that level fused in September. Anyway, look at a dermatome chart of the C5/C6 as well as the C2, C3, and C4. It wouldn't hurt to read up on Cervicogenic headaches and Occipital Neuralgia. Oh, and by the way, my shoulders are aching as I sit here and type and I have SOME pain in my forearms. I have had this checked out; it is all part of the fusion process and I DID irritate a nerve root. So, that just goes to show you all of this can be coming from your neck. It also wouldn't hurt to post on the Spinal Disorders board at the Old Braintalk. There are a slew of us there that have had identical problems.

If your cervical spine is fine, then maybe working on stress, posture, etc. would help. Supplements too.

An Update
 

I was very discouraged the other day when I read someone in the forums say that once you have the constant ringing in your ears, the damage is done and it will never go away. I am hoping that is not true all the time.

As for the shoulder and neck pain, I had my nerve conduction test, which showed no pinched nerves. I was told by the tester that maybe I am suffering from muscle spasms. The person who actually reads the test has not gotten back with me yet--tomorrow I call. When researching muscle spasms, I found that spasms can be caused by a calcium deficiency problem, which is also associated with celiacs, of course. I ordered the calcuim carbonate that Hey Joe mentioned and will start on that soon. Al (aka Aklap) suggested that maybe it's imflamation I am dealing with, so I did start taking Aleve. I have taken it 2 times a day since Tues and it does seem to help. If I miss taking it, the pain comes back with a vengence.

The ringing has not gotten worse, yet has not gotten better either. Anne said that 81mg aspirin has been known to cause ringing too, so I have stopped taking it, just to see if it helps.

Researh, research, research!!!!

I understand your frustrations?
 

It seems to be a common thread among us w/any sort of neuropathy. Kind of like the high arch/foot issue.. I don't know about you, but I've had both these problems to varying degrees LOOONG before I 'found" PN! I think It's just that the meds we take [& their s/e's] and all the other stuff in our lives attune us to this stuff much more than we'd like. I've found that my state of 'ear-ness' varies w/new medical issues and my IVIG treatments [lots more goes into me, than comes out?] Even tho my BP doesn't rise, inside I feel like it has, ergo my ears roar more.
I will leave it to Mrs D and Rose to address the calcium types [I feel a dummy and ALWAYS have to look it up all the time!] and the potassiums, magnesiums and anti-inflammatories...
I hope dearly you sort out what YOU need for YOU! I'm still tinkering w/mine?
Super good thoughts! - j

Just popping in quickly to say that tinnitis is NOT always permanent.

And, yes, among other things, aspirin can cause or worsen it temporarily.

Mine went away after months of B12 therapy, which I had needed desperately.

rose

Thank you Rose, but I don't think it can be my B12 this time. I have been taking B12 for over 2 yrs now. First I was taking 1200mcg daily and got my level up to 1277, then I started taking 2400mcg daily and that has been over 1 yrs now on the 2400, so I should beable to rule B12 out as a problem--right?

Dahlek--I do not take meds for my neuropathy as of yet, my doc has agreed with me that we will keep me off meds until I can't take it anymore. The only prescription med I am taking is Celexa.

Deb,

I just wanted to pop in and say that I am having muscle spasms as well. Or, so I think. I just recently had another cervical MRI done and I do NOT see anything wrong based on the report. Actually, it reads much better than any of my previous reports. However, my Neurosurgeon is going to look at this tomorrow. The only thing helping at the moment is a smidge of Valium. I take Klonopin but my Neurologist told me I could add Valium on occasion. So, since that is two benzos, I am very careful. I am on an extremely low dose of Klonopin, so just 1/4 of a tablet of Valium, when I need it, kicks those spasms out.

I have yet to find out what is really causing this but my spinal pain management doctor, my Neurologist and my Neurosurgeon all seem to think that it is spasms coming from OUTSIDE of the spine. In other words, the muscles are clamping down on nerves. But I have yet to get it really figured out. Also, know that my EMG's are always normal. And evidently the signals from the spinal cord are fine. My PM mentioned that I may have irritated a nerve root and my NS said that I may need some physical therapy.

Know too, that for me, sometimes various meds would cause my ears to ring. The majority of those being the anti-convulstants to treat neuropathic pain. I have noticed it too with anti-inflammatories like Celebrex, Vioxx, etc.

I will post back tomorrow to let you know what the NS said.

It may be something else, but, no, you can not rule out B12 deficiency because of the time you have been treating.

Repairs can go on for several years. Some of my most outstanding improvements came after the length of time you mention.

No guarantees, but here's hoping.

And, of course, aspririn can cause it too.

rose

you can not rule out B12 deficiency because of the time you have been treating.I'm not sure what you mean Rose--I am not saying I didn't have a B12 deficiency, I know I did. I know I will always have to take B12, I simply meant I do not think the B12 is causing the ringing. Personally, I do not think this body of mine will ever absorb properly.

Hope I cleared that up.

I didn't say it very well. :o I meant that you cannot rule out past B12 deficiency as the cause because of the time since you began treating it.

If you were deficient, it is almost surely due to malabsorption, and when the body malabsorbs it seldom begins absorbing normally again.

Thank goodness you can keep on treating it safely, and treating it for life is of course the standard.

rose

If you were deficient, it is almost surely due to malabsorption, and when the body malabsorbs it seldom begins absorbing normally again.

I believe this too Rose. I do not think my body will ever absorb properly again. I was sick for too long, with no answers and the #1 answer was, "It's all in your head!" As I mentioned in another forum, with what I can eat now, I do not think my body can ever return to normal. Celiac disease wrecks havoc with your metabolism and I am thinking that may not repair either.

I feel like I am in a hole that I have no chance of climbing out of!

Here's just another thought
 

I read in an theraputic touch news letter that there was a small study done with Melatonin 3mg at bed time for 3 weeks cured the participants. I was going to give it a try. It doesn't cost a lot and may help sleep happen to boot. I too clench my teeth in sleep and this "should have been retired Dentist" said my jaw would disintegrate in 10 years if I didn't get implants now. He did order an MRI of my jaw to prove his point. Unfortunately for him my jaw and joint were exactly normal for my age. For me the ring is all about PN which he really knew nothing about. I saw a physio last month who gave me some excercises to work on for my scapula. They help.There is also a lot of info about how to actually sit at your computer the right way. You can get a dentist to make a mouth guard so you don't wreck your teeth at nite. Sometimes I get a trigeminal neuralgia type pain on the rt side esp. after talking on the phone for an hour. It's a great excuse to not talk to the inlaws. My father in law has tinnitis as well and they gave him a hearing aid to help him hear above the hiss and bells. He thinks that helps him but it would drive me to drink, I think. I can't use stethoscopes or ipod plugs or anything that vibrates in my ear. I use moulded ear plugs to swim.
Just some thoughts. Maybe something will help, I hope so and wish us all well.

Here's just another thought
 

I read in an theraputic touch news letter that there was a small study done with Melatonin 3mg at bed time for 3 weeks cured the participants. I was going to give it a try. It doesn't cost a lot and may help sleep happen to boot. I too clench my teeth in sleep and this "should have been retired Dentist" said my jaw would disintegrate in 10 years if I didn't get implants now. He did order an MRI of my jaw to prove his point. Unfortunately for him my jaw and joint were exactly normal for my age. For me the ring is all about PN which he really knew nothing about. I saw a physio last month who gave me some excercises to work on for my scapula. They help.There is also a lot of info about how to actually sit at your computer the right way. You can get a dentist to make a mouth guard so you don't wreck your teeth at nite. Sometimes I get a trigeminal neuralgia type pain on the rt side esp. after talking on the phone for an hour. It's a great excuse to not talk to the inlaws. My father in law has tinnitis as well and they gave him a hearing aid to help him hear above the hiss and bells. He thinks that helps him but it would drive me to drink, I think. I can't use stethoscopes or ipod plugs or anything that vibrates in my ear. I use moulded ear plugs to swim.
Just some thoughts. Maybe something will help, I hope so and wish us all well.

hey deb... sending you some strength to get out of hole you are in..hopefully there will be some answers soon....peaceful thoughts for your night..pm if you want or need to talk..the big Depression bug is biting me big time the last few months... lots of :hug: being sent your way----linda

Melatonin was a miracle for my aunt. She's a small woman and I gave her a bottle of 1000 dose. Worked great!

It seems that 3000 is pretty standard.

rose

I'm new to the list and am not sure how to post a new thread...no new thread selection is showing up on the screen here for some reason. I'm interested in what you all are saying about tinnitus and c-spine problems. I've had a herniated disk/compressed nerve at the C5-6 level for several years now, and it's worsened a bit. This loud tinnitus started up after a neck sprain in January. The docs look at me like I've seen aliens when I tell them I think it's caused by my back spasms. I've been trying various remedies and seem to be getting some relief...not sure which one is working though.

Hi, on the main peripheral neuropathy page, the list of thread page, at the bottom of the list of threads is the new thread buttom.

Suzeq,

I am glad to see you posted on the spinal disorders board and will answer you there. It is very common when there are cervical spine issues. :(

Liver Storage of B-12
 

" Example, Vits C and B-12: excess simply goes outwith the trash..."

This is an old post, so this py not help the original poster, but for the record;

I was told that B-12 unlike other vitamins, gets stored in the liver and it is that fact that makes it possible to benefit from periodic B-12 injections.

So I get one just on principle whenever I go to my Doc.

Ten percent of Caucasians have a gene mutation that does not allow them to metabolize serotonin re-uptake inhibitors. I am one of them. I see a few other people can not take them either.

Docs make the assumption that serotonin always needs to be increased.

I check the Cytochrome P450 chart and if it is metabolized by the 2D6 family of enzymes, I don't take the drug. I have been sick too many times.

I am on the least amount of medication in a long time, and I feel OK. I am still sick but now I know when I am sick from disease versus meds. Sort thru your meds, and decide what you have to have...keep that...what you feel you don't need, talk to your doc about stopping.

Everything we stick in our body affects us....even stuff on our skin. My husband can take anything....he took benadryl yesterday to stop sneezing and fell asleep for a few hours like a baby....I take benadryl and tic and twist for 3 days and nights solid. We are all different. Someday they will be able to do our pharmacological blueprint before they prescribe.