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indy-pain 01-14-2011 12:10 PM

Please help with results of my MRI's and EMG
 
Hello, if someone can please explain these results to me without all the big words.
I was in a car wreck in 1996 this broke my C4-C6 and I was placed in a Halo, I removed the Halo myself after 2wks(big big mistake) My C4-C6 actually fused together wrong and there's nothing anyone can do surgically. I'm 41 and in severs pain daily from my head to my toes.
C2-C3 Demonstrates a small posterior disc protrusion with mild central stenosis.
C3-C4 Demonstrates posterior disc osteophyte complex causing moderate impingement. Unconvertabral degeneration results in mild foraminal narrowing.
C4-C5 There is posterior disc osteophyte complex causing moderate stenosis. There is moderate to severe bilateral foraminal narrowinh due to unconvertabral and facet degeneration.
C5-C6 Demostrates mild disc degeneration change but no significate stenosis.
C6-C7 Demostrates posterior disc osteophyte complex causing mild central stenosis and foraminal narrowing.
C7-T1 Demostrates mild left foraminal narrowing and mild posterolateral spinal stenosis on the left due to facet degeneration.

On sagittal view, degenerated disc with disc space lost is seen at T11-T12 Generalized bulge is present effacinh the anterior subaracnoid space and appear to abut the cord but not causing cord impingement. There is overall mild central stenosis.
L1-L2 normal
L2-L3 Mild facet degeneration is seen, minium bulg is present.
L3-L4 Mild facet degeneration is noted
L4-L5 Tiny central protrusion is seen but no canal compromised. Mild facet degeneration is noted.

EMG Impression: This is an abnormal study. There is evidence for a right median neuropathy at the wrist, that is moderate to severe. In addition, there appears tobe an old chronic right C5 Radiculopathy.

Can someone break this down for me please?????
Thank you.

frenchfri1003 01-14-2011 02:36 PM

Did you ask the doctor to explain in terms that you can understand? Ask him to show you on an artificial spine what is normal and what your MRI shows. Ten ask him to explain what that means as far as your pain and possible solutions to you specific problems. I can not explain your results and they should be done by a professional. Sorry Had ACDF C5-6 C6-7 on 12/9/2010

Jomar 01-14-2011 02:56 PM

You can find out the what the medical terminology means on this site-
http://medical-dictionary.thefreedic...and+treatments

Just copy/paste any other word/term that you're not sure of- I started it off with spinal stenosis.

From there look for the terms of small, moderate & severe on the MRI results.

And if you aren't sure about what each level of the spine affects here is a image/chart -
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/al...pictureid=5102

indy-pain 01-15-2011 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frenchfri1003 (Post 734939)
Did you ask the doctor to explain in terms that you can understand? Ask him to show you on an artificial spine what is normal and what your MRI shows. Ten ask him to explain what that means as far as your pain and possible solutions to you specific problems. I can not explain your results and they should be done by a professional. Sorry Had ACDF C5-6 C6-7 on 12/9/2010

I have asked questions like what doe it mean, my PCP say's I have cervical spondylosis, DDD, osteoarthritis and so-on, I ask what that mean he said my spine is dehydrated and I have excessive cartledge loss, My Neuro did sit down with and the MRI results on my Cervical he showed me where the pinch nerve was at and said I have Myelopath, my pain management spc. said my back is not bad enough for surgery but he know's I'm have severe pain, I ask why he said I was one of those case that he would need to put on the black board until they can find something that will help me. This was after the 2nd steriod injection, that didnn't help. IMAGINE THAT! Yes I dio ask questions but they are all giving medical terms. I feel like they are hiding the fact that I will be in a wheel chair by 60.

indy-pain 01-15-2011 12:34 AM

[QUOTE=Jo*mar;734950]You can find out the what the medical terminology means on this site-

Just copy/paste any other word/term that you're not sure of- I started it off with spinal stenosis.

From there look for the terms of small, moderate & severe on the MRI results.

And if you aren't sure about what each level of the spine affects here is a image/chart -

Thank you, I've noticed the medical dictionay on the site and I do have every intention to make use of it, because i have alot if questions.

Jomar 01-15-2011 01:26 AM

My dad has DDD, stenosis, osteoarthritis of the spine and Parkinson's :(
In his mid 70's.
Unfortunately they haven't found a way to rebuild /replace the whole spine yet.

Have they mentioned trying a TENS, or possibly a SCS trial?

SCS is a implanted & stronger version of a electronic pain signal blocker.

WE have a SCS sub forum here-
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/forum118.html

There are also implanted pain pumps that can deliver the meds right to the spinal fluid.

My dad might be looking into these options at some point.

EE03 01-15-2011 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indy-pain (Post 735038)
I have asked questions like what doe it mean, my PCP say's I have cervical spondylosis, DDD, osteoarthritis and so-on, I ask what that mean he said my spine is dehydrated and I have excessive cartledge loss, My Neuro did sit down with and the MRI results on my Cervical he showed me where the pinch nerve was at and said I have Myelopath, my pain management spc. said my back is not bad enough for surgery but he know's I'm have severe pain, I ask why he said I was one of those case that he would need to put on the black board until they can find something that will help me. This was after the 2nd steriod injection, that didnn't help. IMAGINE THAT! Yes I dio ask questions but they are all giving medical terms. I feel like they are hiding the fact that I will be in a wheel chair by 60.

Put in laymans terms, cervical spondylosis is: "Spondylosis is a term referring to degenerative osteoarthritis of the joints between the centra of the spinal vertebrae and/or neural foraminae. In this condition the interfacetal joints are not involved. If severe, it may cause pressure on nerve roots with subsequent sensory and/or motor disturbances, such as pain, paresthesia, or muscle weakness in the limbs." Per Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cervical_Spondylosis

DDD is "Degeneration of the intervertebral disc, often called "degenerative disc disease" (DDD) of the spine, is a condition that can be painful and can greatly affect the quality of one's life. While disc degeneration is a normal part of aging and for most people is not a problem, for certain individuals a degenerated disc can cause severe constant chronic pain." Per Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteoarthritis

Osteoarthritis is "
Osteoarthritis (OA) also known as degenerative arthritis or degenerative joint disease, is a group of mechanical abnormalities involving degradation of joints,[1] including articular cartilage and subchondral bone. Symptoms may include joint pain, tenderness, stiffness, locking, and sometimes an effusion. A variety of causes—hereditary, developmental, metabolic, and mechanical—may initiate processes leading to loss of cartilage. When bone surfaces become less well protected by cartilage, bone may be exposed and damaged. As a result of decreased movement secondary to pain, regional muscles may atrophy, and ligaments may become more lax.[2]" Per Wikipedia again.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteoarthritis

Reading through all of these, you'll get a sense of the symptoms and treatments, prognosis, etc...for all these condiitons. Without sounding dismissive, you'll need to educate yourself regarding all of these conditions and to help yourself deal with them better. I find it easier to take each one a step at a time. As for specific questions, you'll have to bring those up with your doctors. All of this is a lot to absorb for anyone at one time and can be overwhelming. Take care

Hopefully the above, including the link suffices for proper citation.

indy-pain 01-15-2011 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jo*mar (Post 735051)
My dad has DDD, stenosis, osteoarthritis of the spine and Parkinson's :(
In his mid 70's.
Unfortunately they haven't found a way to rebuild /replace the whole spine yet.

Have they mentioned trying a TENS, or possibly a SCS trial?

SCS is a implanted & stronger version of a electronic pain signal blocker.

WE have a SCS sub forum here-

There are also implanted pain pumps that can deliver the meds right to the spinal fluid.

My dad might be looking into these options at some point.

Hello, and thank you for the SCS information I've read about people using this term but I've never really look into it, It's a great thought. The Tens unit I've tried during physical therapy, I had a bad reaction to it, I will have terrible head aches and severe neck pain, I wouldn't be able to turn my neck from side to side for two til three days. So after two times the Therapist decided not to use it anymore.

indy-pain 01-15-2011 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EE03 (Post 735078)
Put in laymans terms, cervical spondylosis is: "Spondylosis is a term referring to degenerative osteoarthritis of the joints between the centra of the spinal vertebrae and/or neural foraminae. In this condition the interfacetal joints are not involved. If severe, it may cause pressure on nerve roots with subsequent sensory and/or motor disturbances, such as pain, paresthesia, or muscle weakness in the limbs." Per Wikipedia
[
DDD is "Degeneration of the intervertebral disc, often called "degenerative disc disease" (DDD) of the spine, is a condition that can be painful and can greatly affect the quality of one's life. While disc degeneration is a normal part of aging and for most people is not a problem, for certain individuals a degenerated disc can cause severe constant chronic pain." Per Wikipedia

Osteoarthritis is "
Osteoarthritis (OA) also known as degenerative arthritis or degenerative joint disease, is a group of mechanical abnormalities involving degradation of joints,[1] including articular cartilage and subchondral bone. Symptoms may include joint pain, tenderness, stiffness, locking, and sometimes an effusion. A variety of causes—hereditary, developmental, metabolic, and mechanical—may initiate processes leading to loss of cartilage. When bone surfaces become less well protected by cartilage, bone may be exposed and damaged. As a result of decreased movement secondary to pain, regional muscles may atrophy, and ligaments may become more lax.[2]" Per Wikipedia again.

Reading through all of these, you'll get a sense of the symptoms and treatments, prognosis, etc...for all these condiitons. Without sounding dismissive, you'll need to educate yourself regarding all of these conditions and to help yourself deal with them better. I find it easier to take each one a step at a time. As for specific questions, you'll have to bring those up with your doctors. All of this is a lot to absorb for anyone at one time and can be overwhelming. Take care

Hopefully the above, including the link suffices for proper citation.

Thank you, EE03, It sounds like you are very informative on all these diagnosis, so I will ask you this hypothetical question; will a person with these conditions at age 41, continue to get worse as time goes on, which make result in the use of a wheel chair?. I know about alll the physical exercises that's suppose to help, but in my case this make the pain increase, which cause me stay in bed for a day or two. My Physical Therapist said, "patient has reach a plateau in progress" and my pain level stay at 4-10out of 10-10, but I still today try those exercises, but it wears me out and the pain is unbearable.

indy-pain 01-15-2011 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frenchfri1003 (Post 734939)
Did you ask the doctor to explain in terms that you can understand? Ask him to show you on an artificial spine what is normal and what your MRI shows. Ten ask him to explain what that means as far as your pain and possible solutions to you specific problems. I can not explain your results and they should be done by a professional. Sorry Had ACDF C5-6 C6-7 on 12/9/2010

Frenchfn1003 That's a good idea, I will do that when I go see the Neuro next week. Thank you.

Dubious 01-15-2011 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indy-pain (Post 735138)
Frenchfn1003 That's a good idea, I will do that when I go see the Neuro next week. Thank you.

MRI and EMG findings can mean or not mean anything and must corollated with your symptoms and findings. What exactly are you present complaints?

indy-pain 01-15-2011 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dubious (Post 735145)
MRI and EMG findings can mean or not mean anything and must corollated with your symptoms and findings. What exactly are you present complaints?

Terrible neck pain and head aches, uncontrollable back spasmas that brings me to my knees and I will need help gettting to a seat or bed, sometimes I even crawl to bed, I can't stand in one position for more than 5 mins without increase pain, walking makes my hips legs and back hurt, I can't bend to look or pickup anything without a burning acheing pain in my lower back, my right arm have pain radiating down to my fingers, my knees take turns going out(feel like they pop out of place) my wrist aches daily with cold, numb and tingling feelings. Sometimes my feet feel like they have cramps at the top and my toes also, it hard to walk and painful to. I feel like I ran a mile when I get up to get a glass of water or answer the door.
It hurts to sit down and getting up from a seat is even harder and painful. I wake up with neck and back pain daily, sometimes I have unbareable pain that prevent me from getting out of bed at all, especially when the migranes, neck pain and back pain are all at the sametime it's the worst. I forgot to mention the finger cramps if I attemp to use a can opener or try to open a soda.

Dubious 01-16-2011 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indy-pain (Post 735268)
Terrible neck pain and head aches, uncontrollable back spasmas that brings me to my knees and I will need help gettting to a seat or bed, sometimes I even crawl to bed, I can't stand in one position for more than 5 mins without increase pain, walking makes my hips legs and back hurt, I can't bend to look or pickup anything without a burning acheing pain in my lower back, my right arm have pain radiating down to my fingers, my knees take turns going out(feel like they pop out of place) my wrist aches daily with cold, numb and tingling feelings. Sometimes my feet feel like they have cramps at the top and my toes also, it hard to walk and painful to. I feel like I ran a mile when I get up to get a glass of water or answer the door.
It hurts to sit down and getting up from a seat is even harder and painful. I wake up with neck and back pain daily, sometimes I have unbareable pain that prevent me from getting out of bed at all, especially when the migranes, neck pain and back pain are all at the sametime it's the worst. I forgot to mention the finger cramps if I attemp to use a can opener or try to open a soda.


The most pronounced findings in relation to your complaints would seem to be:
C4-C6 actually fused together wrong

C3-C4 Demonstrates posterior disc osteophyte complex causing moderate impingement. Unconvertabral degeneration results in mild foraminal narrowing.

C4-C5 There is posterior disc osteophyte complex causing moderate stenosis. There is moderate to severe bilateral foraminal narrowinh due to unconvertabral and facet degeneration.

On sagittal view, degenerated disc with disc space lost is seen at T11-T12 Generalized bulge is present effacinh the anterior subaracnoid space and appear to abut the cord but not causing cord impingement. There is overall mild central stenosis.

EMG Impression: There is evidence for a right median neuropathy at the wrist, that is moderate to severe. In addition, there appears tobe an old chronic right C5 Radiculopathy.
These are very busy studies. Your statement that the fusion healed wrong suggest a sharp kyphotic curve at that level which increases cord impingment issues. There are other frank issue of central stenosis which suggests cord impingment. Cord compression could account for pain in general and your lower and upper extremity weakness and cramping. There are also levels on the MRI that would suggest compression of the exiting nerve roots.

Facet joint degeneration and/or associated spasms could account for your headaches. EMG evidence suggest a rather severe case of carpal tunnel syndrome and an old C5 nerve root injury (controls muscles of the shoulders and arms)

There are of course other complicating issues or contributory problems not addressed by the MRI and EMG that could exist. MR myelogram would be helpful. I think you need a really damned good neurologist or neurosurgeon to walk you through this!

indy-pain 01-17-2011 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dubious (Post 735284)
The most pronounced findings in relation to your complaints would seem to be:
C4-C6 actually fused together wrong

C3-C4 Demonstrates posterior disc osteophyte complex causing moderate impingement. Unconvertabral degeneration results in mild foraminal narrowing.

C4-C5 There is posterior disc osteophyte complex causing moderate stenosis. There is moderate to severe bilateral foraminal narrowinh due to unconvertabral and facet degeneration.

On sagittal view, degenerated disc with disc space lost is seen at T11-T12 Generalized bulge is present effacinh the anterior subaracnoid space and appear to abut the cord but not causing cord impingement. There is overall mild central stenosis.

EMG Impression: There is evidence for a right median neuropathy at the wrist, that is moderate to severe. In addition, there appears tobe an old chronic right C5 Radiculopathy.
These are very busy studies. Your statement that the fusion healed wrong suggest a sharp kyphotic curve at that level which increases cord impingment issues. There are other frank issue of central stenosis which suggests cord impingment. Cord compression could account for pain in general and your lower and upper extremity weakness and cramping. There are also levels on the MRI that would suggest compression of the exiting nerve roots.

Facet joint degeneration and/or associated spasms could account for your headaches. EMG evidence suggest a rather severe case of carpal tunnel syndrome and an old C5 nerve root injury (controls muscles of the shoulders and arms)

There are of course other complicating issues or contributory problems not addressed by the MRI and EMG that could exist. MR myelogram would be helpful. I think you need a really damned good neurologist or neurosurgeon to walk you through this!

You're so right, I didn't mention complete reversal of lordosis, this is another one of my diagnosis. I will be sitting down with my Neurosurgeon this week, I think it's time I ask more question, especially about the MR Myelogram. This time if I don't understan his answer, instead of blowing it off or trying to figuard it out on my own, I will ask him to re-explain it in a way I can understand. Thank you so much, I understand now.

Leesa 01-21-2011 03:03 PM

Indy-pain ~ Yes, degenerative disc disease, and degenerative arthritis, will both continue to get worse. There is no way to stop them. I also have both, and to be frank, it stinks! LOL It's pretty darn painful, and I'm now on SS disability due to that and due to the 2 surgeries I had.

I hope your pain is being controlled adequately. If not, find a doctor who will precribe what you need. God bless and take care. Hugs, Lee

indy-pain 01-31-2011 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leesa (Post 737158)
Indy-pain ~ Yes, degenerative disc disease, and degenerative arthritis, will both continue to get worse. There is no way to stop them. I also have both, and to be frank, it stinks! LOL It's pretty darn painful, and I'm now on SS disability due to that and due to the 2 surgeries I had.

I hope your pain is being controlled adequately. If not, find a doctor who will precribe what you need. God bless and take care. Hugs, Lee

Yea, you're correct, this will only get worse, I've been warned back in 2004, byt he Physical Therapy, and as usual hard-headed, wouldn't do my therapy like I was told to and as time went on completely stopped. Now here I am years later feeling like I broke my neck and my back all over again. I have plenty of pain medication to ease the pain, but never completely stop the pain, I've gotten use to it now, but it still get overwhelming on the bad days which seem to be increasing more and more....now. I have a great Neuro!!!
I haven't had surgery as of yet, but I've had a couple of steriods injection in my back and recently one in my left wrist, I should be getting a call from the hand surgeon office to schedule my carpal tunnel surgery for my right wrist. The neuro said since the Lyrica is helping with the pinch nerve in my neck, he's gonna put off the surgery for that and come see him in the next three months, and we will review the option to have C5 surgery done.

rfei57 01-31-2011 07:51 PM

Pain Doctor
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by indy-pain (Post 740245)
Yea, you're correct, this will only get worse, I've been warned back in 2004, byt he Physical Therapy, and as usual hard-headed, wouldn't do my therapy like I was told to and as time went on completely stopped. Now here I am years later feeling like I broke my neck and my back all over again. I have plenty of pain medication to ease the pain, but never completely stop the pain, I've gotten use to it now, but it still get overwhelming on the bad days which seem to be increasing more and more....now. I have a great Neuro!!!
I haven't had surgery as of yet, but I've had a couple of steriods injection in my back and recently one in my left wrist, I should be getting a call from the hand surgeon office to schedule my carpal tunnel surgery for my right wrist. The neuro said since the Lyrica is helping with the pinch nerve in my neck, he's gonna put off the surgery for that and come see him in the next three months, and we will review the option to have C5 surgery done.

Do you have a good pain doctor they can help a lot I live in Indy and have a great one it makes a deference

Dubious 02-03-2011 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by indy-pain (Post 735138)
Frenchfn1003 That's a good idea, I will do that when I go see the Neuro next week. Thank you.

Hi,

I've poked around this site for a month or two now. There are many posts where sufferers have cut and paste thier MRI findings and asked for interpretation.

If this has not already been stated, everyone needs to do this with an incredible grain of salt! Unless the responder is trained in reading MRI's, it is all mystical rhetoric. And even then, MRI's are rarely exclusively diagnostic and are ordered to verify and substantiate clinical findings. They are supportive in nature. I do understand the impulse to throw ones findings out there for the masses, but you mine as well throw out an adjacent question for someone to "describe the universe using examples."

I only bring this up as I have watched very few threads evolve into anything that was helpful and I've seen some that could potentially hurt the poster. Please, just wait for your doc to explain your MRI findings at follow up AND relate those findings to your clinical exam findings and history.

Please do not misunderstand my intentions, I just hate to think that someone may get hurt!!!!


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