Memory Loss At Time Of Concussion
 

Just curious about others experiences here.

I fell off a horse and was diagnosed with a moderate concussion. I don't remember the hour leading up to the fall or approximately 2 hours after the fall. The only exception to this is that I recall the sound my helmet made when it hit the ground. I remember thinking, "oh that was my skull" and then nothing again. (I did not lose consciousness or at least not for longer than a few seconds, its unclear, everyone else was getting their horse under control after my fall).

I've heard from many this is common and most people say those memories have never returned. In many ways, this is lucky, I don't need those memories.

However, having those memories would also make me more afraid to ride again, which given that I"m still having symptoms 15 weeks later, would be a good thing.

I have no association between riding horses and my fall at all. I've not been back riding, but I'm really starting to want to. I have to keep reminding myself that I can't go just yet.

Anyone else lose a chunk of time before or after or both after their concussion? How much time? Did anything ever start coming back? Lost forever?

Starr

Those memories just before and just after the impact are lost because they did not get stored into memory. They were in immediate memory which is volatile (easily lost).

It is like you had a flood of cleaning chemicals coursing through your brain from the impact. It washed away the memories from just before the impact. It was still flowing through your brain for a while after the impact so it kept washing those post traumatic memories away. Once your brain settled down and shut off the flow of cleaning chemicals, your memories started to get saved into long term memory banks.

I hope this makes sense.

I doubt you will get those small bits of memory back. Consider it a blessing that you do not remember the trauma.

My best to you.

Hi Starr. My TBI was classified as moderate to severe, GCS was 11. I had an epidural hematoma with midline shift and subarachnoid hemorrhage, requiring an emergent craniotomy, all that a little over 18 months ago.

I have retrograde amnesia going back about four days prior to the accident, and approximately 5 weeks of post traumatic amnesia. Other than bits and pieces (along with some strange confabulations I sort of remember from the hospital) nothing has come back, my clinical neuropsychologist assured me it won't. I think it's kind of a blessing in disguise; I don’t have any symptoms associated with PTSD that could have been there if I did remember the accident. Hey, I still ride the light rail train from time to time… :cool:

Thanks Mark for that description, that totally makes sense! :)

Lightrail1, wow! I can't even imagine what you went through! Not remembering certainly IS a blessing for you.

My ER visit falls into the 2 hours after my fall, so I have almost no recollection of it other than bits and pieces. Like standing in the ER waiting room after I was told I could go home, wondering why I was there, how I got there and why I was wearing my riding boots in town. I was left "unattended" for a few moments upon leaving and almost re-registered myself by asking a nurse these questions.

I've had many falls off horses in my life and I have always remembered each and every one, the sensation of falling, the impact, I've always been able to play them back over and over. I've had to deal with fear and nerves upon returning to riding.

While its definitely a blessing that I don't remember this one, I think the replaying it over and over would not be good! But, I'm also not afraid or worried about riding again.

That combined with my new found impulsiveness, I'm finding it difficult to stay on the ground. The one thing so far that's helped, is I definitely need a new helmet and I tried some on a few weeks ago and they just felt all wrong on my head, so I didn't buy one.

Not having a new helmet is one of the only things that stops me... going helmet shopping is unpleasant, the noise, the lights, the 40 mins drive to the tack store, the fitting them on my head. (I'm sure its psychological, but they hurt when I put them on!)

Its like a constant struggle with myself. Reminding myself that I got here from a riding accident and that I'm not well enough to ride. Impulsiveness, poor judgement and bad memory... not a great combination to keep yourself safe.

What a weird journey this is!!
Starr

Starr,

Please try to consider whether a helmet is going to prevent another worse concussion. They prevent or reduce skull fractures but are not very effective at preventing concussions.

Maybe you can take less risks with your riding.

We'd hate to have someone sign on to NT and ask, " How can I help "Starr" make it through the day? She is not anything like the person she was before her recent fall. "

I have friends who had to give up riding and sell their horses after her last fall. She has recovered mostly but knows how close she came to a much worse outcome.

My best to you.

LOL! Yes, a weird journey indeed. Best to you on your continued recovery.

I like your comment on poor judgement; I keep reminding myself that I should have listened better to my mom when she would tell me "Make sure to look both ways before crossing the street". :o

I hit my head falling off of a horse too. But I was not wearing a helmet, as I was completely unaware of the risk I was taking. I fell off of the horse and I now have no memory of the half-hour before I fell and the 8 or so hours after I fell. There are a few short memories, but even more there are sensations that I remember. Such as being embarrassed because one of the guys I had been riding with was carrying me to the car. I do not remember him carrying me or why I needed to be carried, but I do remember the sensation of being extremely embarrassed and the sensation of being carried. About a year and a couple months later I went in for a CT scan because I had gotten another concussion and the sound that the CT scanner made was surprisingly familiar even though the only other time that I had had a CT scan in my life was just after my first concussion and to this day I have no memory of the hospital or anything that happened there.

The most frustrating thing to me is that I had been riding with only guys that day and none of them felt that remembering details was important. But it is the details that help me to remember little things. Such as when 2 years latter I found out that I had been carried to the car, the feeling of embarrassment made more sense to me, and a little piece of the puzzle fell into place. I have begged each one of them individually to give me details, and only every once in a while does one slip out of them. I am so hungry for the details.

About 10 hours of my life is missing and it still bothers me 3 years later. It is also frustrating/funny because almost that entire semester is also very fuzzy in my memory. I was a second semester freshman and I remember very little of that time. A friend of mine jokes that she can tell me that anything happened that semester and I have little choice but to believe her because I truly do not remember. I have had over 10 concussions since the first one and I have not lost any significant memory since then (that I know of :P) But, my memory is very poor and that is almost as frustrating.

Anyways, good luck! Wear helmets, but most especially
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!DO NOT GET A SECOND CONCUSSION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Margarite,
I'm sorry to hear your accident was horse related. Was riding a one time thing for you or had you ridden before?

I understand the "hunger" for details surrounding the incident. My husband has the most info, being as I fell right into the path of him and his horse, but even with that, there are things I'd like to know that no one in the group could answer. I'm trying to come to terms with realizing I will never know all I want to know. Tricky.

Lightrail, I'm glad you've kept your sense of humour. :)

My judgement before the accident was pretty good, but since... meh, not near as solid. We live rurally and it doesn't come up that I need to cross roads, but I know in parking lots etc, I have to remind myself to stay out of the way of cars and such.

Mark, I know helmets don't prevent concussions, but I figure they are still very worth while. I'm positive I would be way worse off or dead had I not had mine on. You can't fall from 9-10 feet, land with 200lbs+ right on the back / top of your head, at speed onto hard frozen ground without a helmet and walk away. (Walked away in a daze with no memories, but walked away!)

I get the suggestion of taking less risks and I appreciate the caring behind that. I'm just not sure if there is a less risk way to keep riding. I had already "retired" from breaking, training and competing and was just pleasure riding on safe, well trained horses.

The day I fell was really just a fluke. My horse did act up, but nothing that should've been an issue, I'm stuck much worse. But a bad combination of the horse's attitude, a branch that I ducked to miss and getting my foot hung up temporarily in my stirrup lead to me falling on my head. (I was wearing proper footwear etc).

I'm just trying to figure out if a life without riding is a life worth living. If you can't pursue your passion, it seems.. empty, like what's the point? That's the trouble with obsessions/hobbies/passions.

Starr

Starr,

Many of us have had to find new passions. We are not limited to one passion in our life.

Here is Idaho, we have a huge riding community. The horse to person ratio is one of the highest in the country.

I know there are some fabulous 'bullet proof' horses. They tend to be older horses that have long since lost their fears. The recent hay shortage caused many to be put up for sale or even given away. It was sad to see these families needing to sell their trusty steed.

Another opportunity is riding mules or even mammoth donkeys. They are much more able to tolerate startles. They tend to stop to think before they react. The donkey breeding of a mule creates a more thoughtful animal. Their stubbornness is more of a "I don't think this is a good idea" thought than blind stubbornness.

From what I have learned, horses are more prey/predator reactive.

I am looking forward to the day when I have the space and $ to feed and care for a mammoth donkey. There are some beautiful animals around here.

Have you ever seen mule races? We have a stable here that cloned a racing mule a few years ago.

The stories I hear of mules and donkeys protecting their owners or even other animals are great. A mountain lion attacked a dog that was along on a back country ride and the mule kicked and stomped the life out of the mountain lion.

We have mules days on Labor Day where they bend poles and barrel race, etc. with mules.

Maybe a bullet proof mule with break away stirrups can fill your passion.

btw, My daughter is CHA certified and wrangled at stables that catered to inexperienced summer camp riders where bullet proof was mandatory.

Thanks for the suggestions Mark. I've always wanted a mammoth donkey and hadn't considered that now (soon) might be the time. I always thought it would be my retirement mount... but maybe I'm just about there?

Trouble is, the only donkeys that are common around here are the minis and standards. Might have to bring one up from your neck of the woods, if they are more common there.

Things to consider. Thanks :)
Starr

It was my first time riding outside of an arena and the horse that I normally rode had to be highly encouraged to even walk let alone do anything dangerous. But I went riding for my first time out in the fields on a completely strange horse in the middle of spring and he has a funny gallop that I was not used to. I have not been riding since because I seem to be so accident prone that it is just not worth it.
I understand what you mean about it being difficult to give up. I have refused to give up skiing and dancing even though it would be easy to get another concussion doing either of these sports. Dancing raises my spirits like nothing else. I could be having the worse possible day, and the dancing could make me feel even worse physically it raises my spirits so much that it is worth it.
Good Luck!

My Experiance
 

You story is similar to mine. I was involved in a serious head on collision a few weeks ago.I had a concussion. It looks like I never lost conciousness but I was out on my feet. I can not remember 10 seconds before my collision till about 8 minutes later when the rescue was putting me on a back board. I got out of the vechicle on the other side of the car and had my car keys in my pocket ????????????????? They found me sitting in a puddle of oil in front of my car. No matter how I try to remember, I cant. It is eating me up alive. I am waiting for the accident report from the police. From the evidence the other car came in my lane and totally destroyed our cars. The police said I should not have survived but here I am! I thought I was responsible until a few days ago and it was hard to live with. Anyway we are both still alive. :) I am hoping my memory comes back. I am pretty tough and I have to know the details of what exactly happened. The doctor said there is a name for this (Post-traumatic amnesia) and is described in several places online. If anything comes back I will let you know. Thanks for the post. At least I am not alone. George

I was asked the usual question "What do you remember about the accident" when I replied about the "facts" the person replied to do you actually remember it or is it what someone has told you happened ?

I never though about it before, but is an interesting thought that because we have a memory gap around the event we may subconsciously accept what we have been told and fill the gap.

george,

Welcome to NeuroTalk. Glad to hear you made it through a head on collision.

I doubt you will recover the 10 seconds before the collision and probably not those 8 minutes after. The 10 seconds was still 'in process' of being transferred from immediate memory to short term memory. Immediate memory is very volatile. If the neurochemical process is interrupted, the information never made it from the immediate (very volatile) to the short term (longer lasting) to be available for consolidation into long term memory during your next sleep cycle.

Think of it as spilling water on letters painted with latex paint before it has cured. The smudging and blurring will never be undone.

When someone relates what happened, it can help the smudged letters be understood making it so it appears that you remember the time period. Think of it as the comments from others was retracing over the smudged letters in the victims mind so they are easily read.

Memory is more volatile during times of stress. The most intense part of the event can be written in stone while lesser events are never transferred to longer term memory. It is like the intense event overshadows the lesser parts of the event.

I have long believed that the flashing lights of emergency vehicles are actually counter-productive to getting good and valid information from witnesses. The visual processing path in the brain uses a vast amount of the brain's processing capability.

Whenever someone asks me what happened, I always tell them, "I have no idea, but I can tell you what I was told happened, if you'd like." For some reason, its really important to me that people understand the distinction.

I've not recovered any memory of my fall, not surprisingly... if anything, I've discovered more gaps in my memory subsequently... events and things I normally would've remembered that I just have no recollection of ever happening... sometimes if someone reminds me of them, I can get fuzzy memories, but sometimes its as though they are making stuff up, its so foreign to me.

Given that I don't remember my fall, I still have no fear of riding again and am planning to ride again soon, hopefully my doc and physios will get on board.

I'm tired of all this crap and just want to get on with my life... enough already.
Starr

When people ask me "what happened" I just refer them to YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kixEZEhrSdY

:eek:

Holy hell! :eek: What an awful thing to have on youtube Lightrail!! :hug: I complain about not knowing the exact details, but you have it worse, having video... on youtube! GAH!! :hug:
Starr

Since I have no memory of the accident I just find the video interesting... plus I don't have any PTSD symptoms and I still ride the train from time to time.

Thanks
 

Thanks for the reply. I think you are right. I will never get my memory back on this incident. For whatever reason greater powers than us are at work. I guess we should just cope and get on with our lives. I am also a firefighter/Medic and I will try to turn of my front lights when I respond to an accident when I can. I have never been on this side of and accident but now have an all new outlook. Thanks Again George