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Old mercury fillings, tooth decay and cracks!
I hope you read this Bryanna!
Tooth #3 extraction site is now 3 weeks old and healing well. Now I have a couple of other tooth concerns and questions, please. :) My upper last two teeth on the left side have old mercury fillings with decay and cracks in them. I don't really have any pain, but I did notice that I have a black spot on the gum, near the teeth - the under side. (I have one of those little mirrors for teeth). My dentist wants to drill out the decay and old fillings and put crowns on them. My question is, with all the decay and cracks, is this the best solution to the problem? Is this just a temporary solution to the inevitable extraction of these teeth? I don't want anymore root canals. The two teeth look normal in the front, but the bottoms and under sides of them are very black from the mercury and decay. I don't see how she can even save much of the actual teeth once they are drilled. Your opinion is very valuable to me. Do you think I should get the crowns or go ahead with extraction? Thanks as always, Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
Glad to hear that the site of #3 is doing well!! Two important things to know before having this other dental work done... 1) When removing mercury fillings it is imperative that the dentist use the proper removal protocol to minimize your exposure to the mercury. Not all dentists take these precautions because they are lazy.... however without any question these steps are necessary. This is the protocol used only during the actual removal of the mercury fillings, not during the placement of new composite fillings or crowns... a) Use of a rubber damn to isolate the tooth/teeth during the removal... b) You should be breathing oxygen via a canula during the removal.... c) The assistant should have her high speed suction directly over the area of mercury being removed... d) The assistant should rinse your mouth with copious amounts of water after the removal which should be vacuumed up with the suction and never swallowed.... e) There is usually an air vac system (looks like an elephant ear coming out of a large hose connected to a box on the floor and sounds like a vacuum cleaner) that is placed in front of the patient that pulls the mercury vapors towards it and into the filtering system during the removal. f) Most dentists will wear special protective masks, similar to gas masks. 2) Many times there is little tooth structure left after the fillings and decay are removed and the only way to restore them is to place crowns on them. If the teeth are healthy and the fillings and decay are not deep or near the pulp.... then the tooth should be fine after the crowns are placed providing they fit well. If the decay is deep or there is concern about exposing the pulp during the preparation, then the risk of injury to the nerve is elevated. Once the pulp is exposed or the nerve is injured the only options are to extract or do root canal. If you chose to extract a tooth that is in this condition rather than root canal it, the bone is still healthy which means that sometimes an implant can be placed at the same time as the extraction... or a few months there after and the success rate of that implant is excellent. Does that information help a bit?? I hope so! Bryanna Quote:
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Thank you for your reply Bryanna!
I've had this dentist remove other teeth with mercury and I think she basically follows this protocal. I am glad to know that this is what I need to do and don't have to worry about more extractions, at this time. One question: do you know what the black spot on my gum near the teeth could be? It doesn't hurt when I press on it, but I just can't imagine what it could be. Thanks again for your sharing your knowledge! Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
Sometimes a small, non painful, black or purplish spot on the gum near a tooth is either a nevus (a benign overgrowth of cells like a birthmark) or it could be a mercury tattoo. These tattoos are the result of a piece of mercury getting in underneath the gum tissue during the placement or removal of a mercury filling. Because the mercury gets so embedded in the fibers of the gum tissue, it can be impossible to remove all of it without removing a piece of the gum as well. Also.... sometimes when a tooth has decay near the gum line... the decay can actually travel down the root of the tooth, below the gum. This will appear as a black or dark area on the gum line or lower into the gum. Hopefully your dentist routinely follows the mercury removal protocol. The dental offices that practice this way on a daily basis will have cleaner air which means the toxins in the air will be lessened for ALL of the patients and staff to breath every day! Hope this helps!! Bryanna Quote:
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Hi Bryanna
Glad to hear what the protocal is involving removing old fillings. No dentist I have had that replaced old fillings did this. Not one. Old fillings and composites have been replaced, and now I wonder if this had done additional damage to my immune system. I had crowns put on a number of the teeth. I still can't believe that I never was protected in this way. Thank you for the information, though I cringe to hear it. ginnie
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Bryanna, Thanks for the explanation of the black spot! That doesn't sound too harmful, now I won't worry about it.
I will admit that my dentist follows some of the mercury removal protocol, but not all of it. She doesn't give me oxygen to breathe, that's for sure. I'm getting a permanent crown on Wednesday and may ask her about the precautions she uses for mercury removal. I know she'll ask me why I didn't get a reroot treatment on tooth number 3, she's all about "saving the tooth". I tried to tell her that I didn't want to have an active infection going on in my body. She said that my bite will be off with the tooth gone and seemed very upset about that. What???? I'll keep in touch! Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
Dentists are taught to "retain" teeth in most circumstances. After all, the more times they fill a tooth... root canal it... and crown it, the more revenue! They only have a brief education on the systemic risks of oral health and they associate infection with periodontal disease, rarely chronically infected teeth. But due to abundance of public information now available on the internet, the old mindset of "retaining sick teeth" is going to be questioned more and more by the patient! I just want to warn you about something that you mentioned..... If your dentist is pro root canal and she is more disturbed about your bite being off than she is about retaining an infected tooth.... she may be a bit careless when preparing your teeth for crowns. What I mean by that is if she has a nonchalant attitude regarding root canals, then she isn't going to be too concerned about over prepping the tooth, because she will just root canal it if she goes too far. Therefore, it is imperative to make your concerns very clear to her, that you do not want any more root canals. It doesn't matter what she personally feels about that.... it is your mouth and you make the final decision. Hopefully everything will go okay and you won't have to be concerned about dealing with any of that! Keep us posted! Bryanna Quote:
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Hi Bryanna,
She was definitely more concerned about retaining my bite than the infected tooth! In fact, when I told her I was worried about the infection spreading from my sinuses into my brain, she said she's never seen that happen in her 20 years of practice. My thought, if it's only happened to ONE person, that's too much for me! Anway, I'm not sure if she's the one I want performing the work for my last two crowns. I just wish I had more of a choice where I live, which is a small town. I don't even know where to begin to find a good dentist! I've switched several times already because of bad experiences. Any suggestions? Have a good day and thanks again! Gretchen |
Re: question that dentist
The infection is more important to deal with than the bite. If you don't correct the infection, no bite, the tooth is lost for sure. I guess thats how I would deal with it. I am starting to question all proceedures before I sit in the chair. I wish you all the best. No RC's for me. ginnie
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Ginnie, I agree, who wants to have an infected tooth! The bite should always be able to be corrected, in my opinion.
I never want another root canal either. That's why I need these 2 teeth to be prepped without "going too far". I've become quite suspicious of dentists in general in the last 6 years because of bad experiences, including endodontists. My current dentist is a very religious woman, even has Christian music playing throughout the office. I like her and she has done good work, except one time, when she gave me an inlay instead of a whole crown. It came off, about a year and a half later, and had to be replaced. She made good on that. I'll see how she reacts Wednesday when I go in for the permanent crown, and I bring up the mercury removal protocol and tell her how I feel about getting anymore root canals! Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
To be blatantly honest with you.... your dentist does have MANY patients who have chronic sinus infections and other health conditions that are related to or exacerbated by their root canaled teeth. She just has yet to make the systemic connection... which when she does, she will have to alter her sales pitch on root canal therapy. Most of my 35 yrs in dentistry as a chair side assistant and patient advocate ... whether it was welcomed by the dentist or not, the majority of the time I have been the one to point out the systemic risks with clear evidence via the patient complaints, their medical history and their radiographs .... pretty crazy huh~?? You would be flabbergasted at how uneducated many dentists really are when it comes to systemic health. That's why I always say.... all dentists should be medical doctors first. Early in my career, I was fortunate to work several years for a periodontist who was a great teacher and he had a passion for pathology. He was into every detail of every aspect of his patients care and he understood the systemic health connection to oral health. He would feed me as much information as I wanted to learn... and I wanted to learn it all! What I learned from him, some others since then, and my professional experiences.. have changed my perspective on dentistry forever. I will continue to share what I know irrelevant of who likes it or doesn't like it..... I can see that dentistry is going to have to change it's antiquated ways of thinking because people are getting more confidence in questioning their dentists ... which is a great thing!!! As for the oral infection and connection with the brain..... that's a no brainer! Sorry, I couldn't resist. That organ is only 3-4 inches from the mouth and shares countless bundles of nerves and blood vessels. Ask your dentist this question.... if the bacteria from our mouths can travel to our hearts, our lungs, our kidneys, artificial joint replacements.... which are all a lot further than 3-4 inches ... then how unlikely is it that the bacteria wouldn't travel to the brain?? The bacteria travels via the blood stream.... what there's no blood going to the brain??? I'll bet she will tell you that the oral infection wards itself off to just the tooth ... as you know first hand, this is definitely not true. But if it were true.... then how does it get to these other organs???? Be brave Gretchen.... ask her :) I got on my soapbox.... getting off now.. :) To find a new dentist is not an easy task. I would start with the IAOMT organization and see if there is someone not to far from where you live. You can pm me your location and I can try to help if you want... not sure I would know any more than what you would get from them though. Thanks for having such an open mind about all of this... you have learned so much and totally get it!! Bryanna Quote:
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Gretchen...
Even religious people can be misinformed .... she is not doing anything maliciously... just with blinders on. Bryanna Quote:
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I love your honesty, Bryanna!
I'm not sure if I should "tick" a dentist off who may hold the life of 2 of my teeth in her hands. LOL! I never know what I may say if the mood strikes me though! There is another dentist I remember who may be a better choice than the one I have. She was going to do a lot of crown work for me years ago, but I chickened out. At that time, I had already had 2 root canals and some bad dental experience, so didn't want to "mess" with things. Bad idea on my part, I know. By the way, I still have 2 root canaled teeth. However, she did take films to see if the root canals had failed, I remember this part of it. So, she seemed to know that root canals did not always work. I remember wondering why she would even be questioning the root canal work. I didn't even think that they could become infected. Now I know better! I am going to call her office on Monday and see if I can get a cleaning, which I need, and have her go over their mercury removal protocol. If I like what she says, I will probably have her do that work. This would give me a clean slate and no emotional garbage or ill thoughts, so to speak. I'll keep in touch! Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
Irrelevant of where you go for dental work, it is imperative to make the dentist aware of your concerns. I can tell you that the patient who is forthright (in a friendly and non antagonistic manner) with their concerns and their boundaries will be treated more carefully and will most likely be given more information by their dentist .... as compared to the patient who comes across shy about their concerns and gives the impression that they will just go along with whatever their dentist chooses for them. Also, to save yourself some time.... you can call different dental offices and ask what their mercury removal protocol is... if you get what's that?? as a response, you know they have no clue about the toxicity issues and you'd want to avoid them completely. If you get... oh we follow the protocol.... ask what it is because it can vary a lot and not be as protective as it should be. An inside tip....dentists can be very frugal and they tend to take short cuts wherever they can to minimize their costs. Okay.... let us know how you make out :) Bryanna Quote:
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Hi Bryanna :)
You are right about being forthright about your concerns, it shows that you are an informative consumer. I just had a similar situation with my dog's Vet about vaccinations. She was amazed that I knew so much and was trying to give my "baby" 2 shots that were just not needed. That's a great idea about asking over the phone about the dental mercury removal protocol. I will do that tomorrow. Thanks again for all the much needed information you share! Gretchen |
Gretchen,
I had a similar situation with my cats and a vet that insisted on vaccinating them... over and over again. I sought a new vet who was willing to do serum antibody titer tests on my animals .... and bingo... no more vaccines needed! Here is a great link about titer testing for you and any other pet owners reading this... http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/titer-testing/ Bryanna Quote:
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Bryanna, That's good information to know, thanks for the link!
My dog doesn't react well to the tick and flea applications either and I hate giving them to her. I usually only use half of the tube a month, which is better, but anything is toxic. Just the thought of using a pesticide on her makes me feel very bad. I know they have oral medication, but that also has side effects. I'd like to use something more natural, but it would have to work. I don't want fleas in the house either! I'll keep you posted on the dental stuff. ;) Gretchen |
Gretchen...
We got off track a bit here but what the heck! Because you are so open to learning... here is a great link to protecting your dog against ticks and fleas...... http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites...k-control.aspx The video is a bit messed up but all the information is written in great length! Perhaps this product is something you would be interested in trying...?? Bryanna Quote:
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Hi Bryanna, Sorry for the delay in replying!
I will look up the ingredients in this spray to see how they could react on a dog. It's very nice to have alternatives though! Thank you very much for this link. Dental app. for crown tomorrow and will discuss other two areas to be done. I'll check back with the information! Thank you! Gretchen |
Hey guys,
What a day at the dentist's today! First I was drilled by one of the assistants as to why I didn't follow the advise of the endodontist to get a retreatment on tooth 3. I told her that it was my choice to rid myself of the infection instead of prolonging the inevitable and possibly making it worse. She just went on and on about the actual dates of extraction and who did what, then finally I had had enough! I asked her if there was a problem and that she was being very judgemental and could we get on with why I was there - to get my permanent crown put on! I told her that I thought I would get a little more sympathy for what I had been through! Boy, that felt good. :p She then backed off and got on with the reason I was there. My dentist soon appeared and asked me how I was, to which I replied that I was feeling a little bit judged. Since they have cubicles there and not separate rooms, she said she had heard it and tried to explain why they were asking extra questions about procedures and making sure everything was down in writing. I really like this dentist, as she always sticks behind the patient and reassures them that their choices are right, and no one can make that kind of decision for them. She thought that I should have a "bacterial removal cleaning and xrays" before doing anything else, and I agreed. Of course I got the permanent crown on today. Next Wednesday I go in for the cleaning. After seating the crown, I loosened up some and felt a lot more comfortable, plus I had a different assistant at that time! I told the dentist about the extractions and how easy one was, and for the other one I had IV sedation because it was a little more complicated. I told her that I never wanted to have another root canal! She then told me that she had a retreated root canalled tooth, and I asked her if it felt better now. Her honesty really struck me. She told me that it felt okay only some of the time, and that it would eventually need to be extracted. I could tell by how she said it, that it was very hard for her to admit that. Anyway, I'm feeling good now about staying with this dentist and am ready to move on to the cleaning, then the rest of the crown work. I think that having a human interaction, something you can relate to with a doctor is so good for improving professional relations. Sorry for being long winded! I'll be in touch.... Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
That dental assistant obviously has limited education about oral infection.... which is unfortunately typical because it is not part of the curriculum in the dental assisting courses .... none that I am aware of anyway. I offered to teach it at my local community college.... but the advisers are concerned it could start a frenzy with the dental community. Since when does knowledge cause a frenzy?? Only when it rocks the system :) I believe that this dentist was truthful to you about her own root canaled tooth because by you stating so emphatically and rationally your resistance to root canal therapy.... she knew you were open to this information. I feel like you just won a million dollars!!!!! :) So glad your visit went so well today ..... :) Bryanna Quote:
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New crown sensitivity
Hi Bryanna,
I felt very good about being open today and expressing some feelings and thoughts on the matter, even if I did ruffle some feathers! That assisant has always been very vocal and over the top with her opinions on "not doing exactly as one should" with their dental hygiene and cleanings. She comes across as being very judgemental and I don't think it's a good attitude to have in that profession. Anyway, now I have another question for you. :) My new crown is on the back upper molar, tooth #2, right next to an extraction area. While it was being cleaned and prepped for seating today, it was very sensitive. I did ask the dentist if she got near the nerve when drilling, and she said yes, but hopefully not too close. Now that it's on, I still have sensitivity to cold and hot fluids, even the air! So, my question - Is this normal and for how long could this last? This is why I hate getting crowns, I'm always so worried that the dentist will drill too much and get too close to the nerve. Again, what's your experience with this? Thank you!! Gretchen |
Hi Bryanna
Knowledge has rocked the systems since the time of Newton and all those great men of the times. Many went to jail to expand our knowledge. Lets hope the dental community changes their teachings, so we can all move forward with better dental health. thanks Bryanna, wish you could give those classes! ginnie
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Hi Gretchen,
Is this a permanent crown (made in a dental lab), a cerec crown (a permanent crown made in the office), or a temporary crown? Bryanna Quote:
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Hi Bryanna,
It's a permanent crown that took about 2 weeks to get in, so I'm sure it was made in a dental lab. By the way, it's a gold crown, which I've never had before. The dentist said they are stronger? I just noticed today that it doesn't cover part of the top of my tooth near the gum. I find that very strange! Thanks for any advice you can give me! I don't know how I'd be getting through all this without your help. :) Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
If a crown is cemented on without the patient being numb, the tooth can feel cold sensations during the cementation. It is also not unusual for a newly crowned tooth to be temperature sensitive for the first few hours after it is cemented. Occasionally this sensitivity can linger for a day or so but it should become less and less... not stay the same or increase. Gold crowns are very durable but not necessarily stronger than other types of crowns. They are frequently used when the patient has a tight bite, meaning not much room for a thicker, porcelain, type crown. I don't recall but by any chance do you have mercury or other metal fillings in your mouth? The reason I ask is because one important piece of information that is rarely shared regarding metal (gold) crowns in patients who still have other metal (mercury) fillings in their mouth is what is called galvanic current flow. This is an electrical current that occurs between dissimilar metals when they are either in contact with each other or when there is a physical conductor to transport the current. In the mouth the saliva can be the conductor. So some people who have various metal fillings/crowns who also have chronic or sporadic sensitivity in their mouths may be experiencing this condition. The sensations could be sharp, occasionally throbbing or just feel temperature sensitive. The remedy to the galvanic response is to "properly" remove all of the mercury fillings and replace them with gold or non metal porcelain restorations. I know...... OMG :/ Another issue that could be contributing to the temperature sensitivity is the open margin along the gum line, that you mentioned. If that part of the tooth was shaved down, meaning the enamel portion was removed during the preparation of the crown.... then that area of the tooth is going to be vulnerable to temperature changes and plaque accumulation. Did you experience any sensitivity while you had the temporary crown on? Bryanna Quote:
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Hi Bryanna, I had the temporary crown on for about 8 weeks, due to appointments with specialists, the 2 extractions 3 weeks apart, then a few weeks of healing time before getting the perm crown, which is right next to the last extracted tooth. I don't know if that makes any difference, but I thought I'd tell you.
Anyway, the temp crown was sensitive for a few days, as I recall, but then drinking hot coffee or cold drinks didn't bother it. I didn't chew on it at all, and still don't, because the tooth next to it and the tooth below it are both missing. Those are the 2 extractions I had. So, I have this lone tooth, not connecting or connected to any other. It feels weird! I do have 2 teeth left that should probably be drilled and crowned that have mercury in them, but they are on the opposite side of this newly crowned tooth. I am very worried about getting this done now though, because of the chance that they will be prepped too much, thus needing root canals, which I don't want! My dentist likes to get every bit of mercury and decay out of a tooth, so I'm sure she probably gets a little too close to the nerve in preparing a tooth. Today is the third day of having the new gold crown on, and it is less sensitive than it was originally, but still reacts as a sharp pain when drinking hot or cold fluids. It doesn't linger though, so I'm hoping that's a good sign. Thank you for all your help, as always, Gretchen |
Hi Gretchen,
It is a good sign that the sensitivity is lessening. Generally cold temps would be bothersome when there is an opening where a portion of the shaved down tooth is uncovered by the crown, sensitivity to hot temps indicate nerve pain, and either cold or hot sensitivity can indicate the galvanic response as I mentioned previously. Give it a week or two and see how it feels. You may always have some sensitivity sporadically or it may go away completely. The fact that it is next to the recently extracted tooth is not causing this type of sensitivity. I understand your hesitation on having work done on the other two teeth. But keep in mind that all mercury fillings break down after a couple of years and bacteria gets in the cracks and fissures causing decay underneath the filling which is not always picked up on an xray. It is better to remove the filling and do the crown before the bacteria gets too deep...meaning the longer those fillings are present the more breakdown will occur. I know... it never ends!! You can only do what you feel is best for you at this time...just take this information and use it to the best of your ability :) Take care, Bryanna Quote:
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Wow, I found this thread particularly fascinating and informative... thank you to all who are participating, especially Bryanna! I've been a member of these forums for year and am always amazed when I come across this type of support and knowledge!
I must admit I have been very remiss in visiting my dentist regularly - my life spiraled downwards (depression) and the last thing I thought of was my health (duh!) for 5 years. This last year has really changed for me... so off I went to the dentist. (I have an excellent dental plan so money wasn't my excuse). The cleaning had to take place over 2 sessions. I was told that I had the start of gum disease. The dentist looked at a tooth that has been causing me off and on pain for years but didn't do anything about it. She said I had a few cavities and being who I am, I didn't get them fixed (yet). She also wanted to send me to specialist to fix a tooth which had had both a root canal and crown because the crown had fallen off and there isn't much tooth to build it back up. I will follow up with this. During my camping vacation, a few weeks ago, my mouth became horribly infected with pain - an upper molar was the cause - its been causing me pain off and on for about 2 years. I was once prescribed an anti-biotic to bring the swelling down and then... nothing. No follow-up ... but the pain continued to occur regularly - it just didn't flare up again so I figured it was just something I would have to deal with. WELL, this was not a good decision as my mouth swelled up as if I had Bells-Palsy! Honestly, it was horrible... throbbing..and so, I went to a dentist who prescribed double anti-biotics and told me to visit my dentist as soon as I get home. The swelling is down and the pain disappeared... I got busy and left it a week... here I am, now, 1 week off anti-biotics and the pain is back.... so... off to the dentist I go, tomorrow! I'm concerned about gum disease and whether or not this tooth will be played around with for a while or whether or not it will be pulled. Anyway.... just wanted to thank you all for this most enlightening thread! I'll be back!! thanks! |
Hi Addy,
Well thank you for the kind words... it's always gratifying to know that others are reading our posts and gaining help from them. That is why we are here :) Your story of not seeing your dentist for awhile and putting your own needs aside for whatever reason is all too common. I see it, hear it every day at work. I too have been guilty of doing this exact same thing and I do know how difficult it is to get and stay motivated to get things done once we get into a rut. I also know that God..... or whatever.... will throw us a curve ball to get our *** in gear and when we dodge it....he throws it again. So sooner or later we have to catch the ball and run with it! Quote:
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