Root Canal Infection-Diabetes
 

Hi,

I am a type 1 diabetic diagnosed 2004, I had thrush in my mouth before diagnosis and unfortunately had a hard time getting diagnosed and ended up in hospital very sick and finally found out what was wronng. A few months after being diagnosed I went to the dentist, I needed lots of fillings as the high sugars had done a lot of damage. Even though I have good teeth and have always looked after them, brushing, flossing, etc. About 4 years after diagnosis I had pain in gums and face, a burning stinging pain and went to the dentist who said nothing was wrong on xrays. That weekend I was in pain so I found another dentist who said he couldnt see anything either but gave me some antibiotics. I felt slightly better, I was going abroad for xmas and on the plane my face swelled up I found a dentist in Spain who ssaid I had a huge abscess on a tooth on my lower jaw and no wonder I was in pain! He removed the abscess over 3 hours, put antibiotics in it and got me to come back a few days later. When I did he put a temp filling and told me to get RCT when I got home. I did this and thought nothing of it.

Over the last few years I have had a couple of what I thought were mild gum infections and taken antibiotics or sometimes they just went on their own.

2-3 weeks ago I started getting occassional burning sensation through my inside cheek, gum and jaw on the right. Gradually the pain was more often and more intense, I went to the dentist who took xrays who said that there was an infection my RCT tooth that needed to be redone.This would cost €850 plus €500 for a crown. I told him i couldnt afford it and he put me on antibiotics and said get it done as soon as.

I live in Ireland and unless you have a medical card you get no help with paying for this dental treatment, I work partime, have a lot of debt and no way of getting this money.

By Tuesday I was now in pain eating, then drinking hot drinks and by Thurs even room temp water hurt so bad. I rang one of the specialist endodontist my dentist had given me the number of and made an appointment for the day after (Friday) by Friday I was in agony, when I explained everything to the endodonist he kept telling me that the pain I was describing would not be due to infection or tooth and sounded more like a diabetic neuropathy in the dental area and face! He wrote up a referral let, I tried to explain tht the pain I was describing was present when I had my abscess a few years ago and went awa once it was treated he ignored me.

Finally he looked in my mouth and with cold sensation test he found that it was actually the tooth beside the original RCT tooth that was causing pain and he did an emergency RCT on that, I had to borrow €300 from my mother to pay and I have to find €300 and go back this Friday to finish the treatment. He told me I needed to have the other one redone as soon as, I said I couldnt afford it and could I get it out and all he kept saying was you will have a gap and thats not a good idea. He prescibed anti infams and told me to stop taking the antibiotics and only take them if my face swelled up.

Anyway I have done lots of research and I am now terrified of what RCT is doing to me and my diabetes. I have felt unwell for weeks with the pain and also run down and exhasuted with blood sugars unstable. I have made an appointment with my original dentist who is a very nice woman but was unavailable the day I went for the xrays 3 weeks ago, Im going to talk to her about getting a partial denture for the first RCT tooth and having an extraction because I can't afford all the work it needs. She can't fit me in until next Wednesday (13th Feb) and Im at the endodontist to finish the second one Friday. Ideally I would like to have them both pulled but I know my dentist will talk me out of that as its just had the RCT.

Anyway sorry for such a long post Im just so stressed, crying in pain last week and terrified of what to do what not do this week, plus theres not much help here in this country all dentist seem to think havig a RCT and keeping your tooth is the be all and end all for all their patients even with autoimmune deseases.

Im looking for some help/advice. Is the burning stabbing pain a neuropathy or am I right that it is an infection connected problem?

If my dentist will take the original problem tooth out will she take the periodontal ligament and infected bone out? When I asked the receptionist at the clinic if I would need antibiotics before extraction she said the infection usually comes out with the tooth but you can discuss it with the dentist, this gives me the impression it would just be numb the area and yank it out leaving everything else in there.

Should I have stopped taking the antibiotics Friday on the Endodontist orders?

There were no xrays taken of any of the other teeth beside these bad ones and Im worried they could all be infected! Is this possible?

I wanted to see my doctor to discuss how this is affecting my diabetes and immune system but she cant fit me in until Tues 12th. So the only health professional Il be seeing in the next week is the endodontist.

I was off work all last week with pain and exhaustion, felt a little better over the weekend after emergency RCT and pain killers, went to work yesterday and by 1pm was exhausted with really bad pain in head and eyebrow and face on right side and was out of breath walking up the stairs. Im 32 and usually quite fit! Also the money situation is stressing me out I still owe €300 and would need €500 to crown it. Never mind the €850 and €500 they want for the other tooth! If I get that one extracted it's about €100 annd could get a partial denture for €120.

Anyway Im rambling again any help much appreciated.

Hi Jeanie,

FYI... I am in the dental profession and think I can be of some help to you. I can at least explain and make sense of what has happened since the onset of your dental problem to why you are in this predicament now. I will post in caps after <<your statements>> to make it easier to follow.

<<I am a type 1 diabetic diagnosed 2004, I had thrush in my mouth before diagnosis and unfortunately had a hard time getting diagnosed and ended up in hospital very sick and finally found out what was wrong. A few months after being diagnosed I went to the dentist, I needed lots of fillings as the high sugars had done a lot of damage. Even though I have good teeth and have always looked after them, brushing, flossing, etc.>>

SOME DIABETICS REQUIRE PREVENTIVE DENTAL CARE MORE OFTEN THAN NON D BECAUSE DIABETES IMPAIRS THE WHITE BLOOD CELLS WHICH ACT AS THE BODY'S MAIN DEFENSE AGAINST BACTERIAL INFECTIONS IN THE MOUTH. SO A SIMPLE ORAL SORE OR BUILD UP OF PLAQUE COULD BECOME A HUGE PROBLEM FOR A DIABETIC AND CAVITIES CAN BECOME RAMPANT VERY EASILY. THRUSH CAN ALSO BE EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO GET UNDER CONTROL AND MAKE YOU VERY ILL. ORAL HYGIENE NEEDS TO BE VERY THOROUGH AND THE DIET NEEDS TO BE GEARED TOWARDS KEEPING THE INSULIN IN BALANCE.

<<About 4 years after diagnosis I had pain in gums and face, a burning stinging pain and went to the dentist who said nothing was wrong on xrays. That weekend I was in pain so I found another dentist who said he couldnt see anything either but gave me some antibiotics.>>

IN A DIABETIC THESE SYMPTOMS ALWAYS MEAN SOMETHING IS BREWING. PERHAPS THERE SHOULD HAVE BEEN A MORE COMPREHENSIVE EXAM DONE AT THAT TIME AS THE ANTIBIOTIC WAS JUST A BAND AID.

<<I felt slightly better, I was going abroad for xmas and on the plane my face swelled up I found a dentist in Spain who ssaid I had a huge abscess on a tooth on my lower jaw and no wonder I was in pain! He removed the abscess over 3 hours, put antibiotics in it and got me to come back a few days later. When I did he put a temp filling and told me to get RCT when I got home. I did this and thought nothing of it.>>

THERE IS NO WAY POSSIBLE TO REMOVE AN ABSCESS FROM A TOOTH OR FROM THE BONE SO LONG AS THE TOOTH IS PRESENT. ONCE A TOOTH IS INFECTED, IT REMAINS INFECTED IRRELEVANT OF WHAT IS DONE TO IT OR THE SURROUNDING BONE. THE ONLY WAY TO CURE THE ABSCESS IS TO REMOVE THE SOURCE OF THE INFECTION WHICH IS THE TOOTH. THE ANTIBIOTIC COMBINED WITH WHATEVER HE DID TO THIS TOOTH SUBSIDED THE EXTREME SYMPTOMS BUT DID NOT CURE THE INFECTION.

<<Over the last few years I have had a couple of what I thought were mild gum infections and taken antibiotics or sometimes they just went on their own. >>

IN A DIABETIC THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A MILD GUM INFECTION AND THEY DO NOT JUST GO AWAY ON THEIR OWN. ANTIBIOTICS CAN TEMPORARILY SUBSIDE THE ACUTE SYMPTOMS BUT INTERVENTION IS ALWAYS NEEDED.

<<2-3 weeks ago I started getting occassional burning sensation through my inside cheek, gum and jaw on the right. Gradually the pain was more often and more intense, I went to the dentist who took xrays who said that there was an infection my RCT tooth that needed to be redone.This would cost €850 plus €500 for a crown. I told him i couldnt afford it and he put me on antibiotics and said get it done as soon as. >>

REDOING THE RCT IS A WASTE OF TIME AND MONEY AND IT IS TAXING YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM. AS A DIABETIC, IT IS DANGEROUS FOR YOU TO HANG ONTO THIS TOOTH. UNFORTUNATELY THERE IS NO WAY TO CURE AN INFECTED TOOTH BECAUSE THERE ARE COUNTLESS TINY CANALS IN THE TOOTH THAT CAN NOT BE CLEANED OUT AND WILL ALWAYS CONTAIN DISEASED NERVE TISSUE. THEREFORE THIS TOOTH HAS BEEN SERIOUSLY INFECTED FOR SEVERAL YEARS.

<<I live in Ireland and unless you have a medical card you get no help with paying for this dental treatment, I work partime, have a lot of debt and no way of getting this money.>>

I UNDERSTAND HOW EXPENSIVE DENTISTRY IS AND MANY PEOPLE CANNOT AFFORD IT. ASIDE FROM THAT, KEEPING THIS TOOTH IS NOT HEALTHY FOR YOU AND WILL CAUSE YOU CONTINUED PROBLEMS. IT CAN, IF IT HASN'T ALREADY, BECOME A SYSTEMIC PROBLEM AS WELL. THE INFECTION WILL ALSO SPREAD TO OTHER TEETH.

<<By Tuesday I was now in pain eating, then drinking hot drinks and by Thurs even room temp water hurt so bad. I rang one of the specialist endodontist my dentist had given me the number of and made an appointment for the day after (Friday) by Friday I was in agony, when I explained everything to the endodonist he kept telling me that the pain I was describing would not be due to infection or tooth and sounded more like a diabetic neuropathy in the dental area and face!>>

THIS DENTIST IS BASICALLY MISINFORMING YOU. YOUR DESCRIBED SYMPTOMS ARE RELEVANT TO AN INFECTED TOOTH AND GIVEN THE HISTORY OF THIS TOOTH, IT IS NOT EVEN QUESTIONABLE.

<<He wrote up a referral let, I tried to explain tht the pain I was describing was present when I had my abscess a few years ago and went awa once it was treated he ignored me. >>

HE KNEW THE ABSCESS DIDN'T GO AWAY BUT DID NOT WANT TO INFORM YOU OF THAT... BECAUSE AFTER ALL HE DOES ROOT CANALS FOR A LIVING AND IS NOT GOING TO TELL YOU WHAT I JUST HAVE. LET ME GUESS, HE SAID THE TOOTH NEXT TO IT WAS INFECTED...??

<<Finally he looked in my mouth and with cold sensation test he found that it was actually the tooth beside the original RCT tooth that was causing pain and he did an emergency RCT on that, I had to borrow €300 from my mother to pay and I have to find €300 and go back this Friday to finish the treatment.>>

BINGO.... AS I SAID ABOVE, THE INFECTION HAS SPREAD TO THE TOOTH NEXT TO THE ORIGINAL ABSCESSED TOOTH. THIS DOES NOT MEAN THAT THE ORIGINAL TOOTH IS OKAY, IT'S NOT.

<<He told me I needed to have the other one redone as soon as>> OF COURSE HE DID.... MORE $$$ FOR HIM. THIS TOOTH IS NOT HEALTHY AND NEVER WILL BE.

<< I said I couldnt afford it and could I get it out and all he kept saying was you will have a gap and thats not a good idea. He prescibed anti infams and told me to stop taking the antibiotics and only take them if my face swelled up.>>

YOU ARE BETTER OFF WITH A SPACE THAN A LIFE THREATENING INFECTION. DO YOU AGREE? DOES HE NOT KNOW THAT YOU ARE A DIABETIC WITH A LONG TERM ACTIVE INFECTION??

<<Anyway I have done lots of research and I am now terrified of what RCT is doing to me and my diabetes. I have felt unwell for weeks with the pain and also run down and exhasuted with blood sugars unstable.>>

RESEARCH IS GOOD AND YOU ARE RIGHT TO BE TERRIFIED OF THE SYSTEMIC CONSEQUENCES ASSOCIATED WITH INFECTION. THE MOUTH IS VERY VASCULAR WHICH MEANS THE BACTERIA FROM THESE INFECTED TEETH IS TRAVELING AND FILTERING THROUGH YOUR ORGANS. I AM NOT TELLING YOU THIS TO FRIGHTEN YOU MORE.... BUT YOU NEED TO BELIEVE THE SEVERITY OF THIS SITUATION AND STOP LETTING OTHERS PUT BAND AIDS ON IT.

<< I have made an appointment with my original dentist who is a very nice woman but was unavailable the day I went for the xrays 3 weeks ago, Im going to talk to her about getting a partial denture for the first RCT tooth and having an extraction because I can't afford all the work it needs.>>

YOU KEEP REFERRING TO THE $$$ EXPENSE OF ALL THIS TREATMENT WHICH IS TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE. BUT IT IS NOT AS SIGNIFICANT AS THE EXPENSE IT IS COSTING YOUR HEALTH.

<< She can't fit me in until next Wednesday (13th Feb) and Im at the endodontist to finish the second one Friday. Ideally I would like to have them both pulled but I know my dentist will talk me out of that as its just had the RCT.>>

WHY NOT REMOVE BOTH TEETH AND GET A PARTIAL DENTURE? SHE CAN ONLY TALK YOU OUT OF MAKING A DECISION THAT IS FOR THE BETTERMENT OF YOUR HEALTH IF THAT IS THE WAY YOU WANT TO GO.

<<Anyway sorry for such a long post Im just so stressed, crying in pain last week and terrified of what to do what not do this week, plus theres not much help here in this country all dentist seem to think havig a RCT and keeping your tooth is the be all and end all for all their patients even with autoimmune deseases. >>

HERE IN THE US, RCT IS THE NUMBER ONE DENTAL TREATMENT PRESCRIBED AND ALSO THE MOST LUCRATIVE ALL OF THE DENTAL SPECIALTIES. WHY? BECAUSE THE AVERAGE PERSON WHO HAS RCT IS USUALLY IN PAIN AND IS NOT INFORMED ABOUT THE SYSTEMIC CONSEQUENCES OF KEEPING INFECTED TEETH.... ESPECIALLY IN DIABETICS.

<<Im looking for some help/advice. Is the burning stabbing pain a neuropathy or am I right that it is an infection connected problem? >>

IT IS INFECTION AND MAY BECOME, IF IT HASN'T TO SOME DEGREE ALREADY, A NEUROLOGICAL PROBLEM. THE LONGER YOU HANG ONTO INFECTED TEETH THE MORE SEVERE AND WIDESPREAD THE SYSTEMIC PROBLEMS WILL BE.

<<If my dentist will take the original problem tooth out will she take the periodontal ligament and infected bone out? When I asked the receptionist at the clinic if I would need antibiotics before extraction she said the infection usually comes out with the tooth but you can discuss it with the dentist, this gives me the impression it would just be numb the area and yank it out leaving everything else in there.>>

IN YOUR CASE, YOU PROBABLY SHOULD BE COVERED BY AN ANTIBIOTIC FOR THE EXTRACTION. BUT PLEASE CONSIDER ALL THAT I HAVE SAID ABOUT REMOVING BOTH TEETH AS YOU WILL END UP WITH THE SAME PROBLEM IF YOU KEEP THIS OTHER TOOTH. THINK ABOUT THE SYSTEMIC CONSEQUENCES.
WITH REGARD TO REMOVING THE PERIODONTAL LIGAMENT... YOU HAVE BEEN RESEARCHING!! ;)) THIS LIGAMENT SHOULD ALWAYS BE REMOVED, NO MATTER WHAT. HOWEVER, IF IN DOUBT AND THERE IS REASON TO BE DOUBTFUL AS NOT ALL DENTISTS REMOVE IT, MAKE SURE YOU TELL WHOMEVER TO REMOVE THE LIGAMENT AND ALL NECROTIC TISSUE.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, IT IS BEST FOR YOU TO SEE AN ORAL SURGEON BECAUSE THESE TEETH MAY BE DIFFICULT TO REMOVE DUE TO THE LONG STANDING INFECTION WHICH MEANS THE BONE WILL NEED TO BE CLEANED VERY THOROUGHLY AND ALSO THE ROOT CANAL THERAPY CAUSES THE TEETH TO BECOME BRITTLE FROM KILLING OFF THE VITALITY. ORAL SURGEONS DEAL WITH THESE TEETH ALL OF THE TIME AND HAVE THE INSTRUMENTS TO TAKE CARE OF THESE ISSUES.

ALSO GET YOUR MONEY BACK FOR THE ROOT CANAL THAT WAS JUST STARTED. YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO CHANGE YOUR MIND IF YOU BELIEVE IT IS UNHEALTHY AND UNWISE TO CONTINUE ON THAT PATH OF TREATMENT.

<<Should I have stopped taking the antibiotics Friday on the Endodontist orders?>>

I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THAT REASONING AT ALL. BUT THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE DECIDED BY THE DENTIST WHO IS TREATING YOU.

<<There were no xrays taken of any of the other teeth beside these bad ones and Im worried they could all be infected! Is this possible?>>

YES, IT IS POSSIBLE THAT YOU HAVE OTHER DENTAL PROBLEMS AND A FULL SET OF XRAYS SHOULD BE DONE BEFORE ANYTHING ELSE. IF IN FACT YOU HAVE OTHER INFECTED TEETH ON THE ARCH THAT THESE OTHER TWO ARE, YOU MAY CONSIDER BEING PRO ACTIVE AND REMOVE THEM AS WELL. THAT WAY YOU COULD HAVE A PARTIAL DENTURE MADE TO FILL IN ALL OF THE GAPS. RATHER THAN PROLONG THE INEVITABLE WHILE JEOPARDIZING YOUR HEALTH.

<<I wanted to see my doctor to discuss how this is affecting my diabetes and immune system but she cant fit me in until Tues 12th. So the only health professional Il be seeing in the next week is the endodontist.>>

AGAIN, THINK TWICE ABOUT CONTINUING WITH THIS ROOT CANAL.

<<I was off work all last week with pain and exhaustion, felt a little better over the weekend after emergency RCT and pain killers, went to work yesterday and by 1pm was exhausted with really bad pain in head and eyebrow and face on right side and was out of breath walking up the stairs. Im 32 and usually quite fit! Also the money situation is stressing me out I still owe €300 and would need €500 to crown it. Never mind the €850 and €500 they want for the other tooth! If I get that one extracted it's about €100 annd could get a partial denture for €120.>>

THINK ABOUT ALL THE $$$, PAIN, LOST WORK TIME, PHYSICAL ILLNESS THAT THIS IS COSTING YOU. ONLY TO BE LEFT WITH TWO INFECTED TEETH.... AND POSSIBLY OTHERS.

<<Anyway Im rambling again any help much appreciated.>>

ACTUALLY YOU HAVE NOT RAMBLED AT ALL! YOU ARE IN THE PROCESS OF SORTING THINGS OUT.... AND EVERY WHICH WAY YOU LOOK IT POINTS TO ONGOING EXPENSES THAT HAVE NO END IN SIGHT IF YOU CONTINUE ON THIS SAME PATH.

Jeanie, you are young and can get a handle on your dental and physical health. Review all that you have been through and make a decision that you feel is in your best interest. NO ONE can tell you what to do. Assert yourself and ask questions until you are comfortable with the answers. Look to the long term of bettering your health and not the immediate fix because that will only cost you more $$, more time, more pain and possible serious health risks. The choice is yours, go with your intuition and the knowledge you have learned through your research.

Come back and give us an update..ok

Bryanna

Thank you so much for your reply Bryanna!

If I did find a dentist who would take the two teeth out, is it ok to remove the one that RCT was started on last week? He cleaned it out and put some antiseptic in and said he would finish it on Friday. So would it be ok for me to just not go back and look for someone to take the whole thing out as it is with the antiseptic in it?

I feel awful at the moment too, would going back on the antibiotics ease things for a bit while I found help?

Im finding it really hard to find anyone who isnt trying to force me into doing this RCT and keeping the tooth!

Thanks again, I really appreciate it.

I'm so sorry. What an awful experience. I have neuropathy (after dental work) and was told that those with certain illnesses like diabetes, MS, etc are at greater risk.

But it does sound like other things are of concern as well, like possible infection. And there is controversy about the overall safety of RCT. I'm so very sorry.

Who treats your diabetes? Have you thought about talking to your doctor about this?

You might also want to consult a neurologist. Don't expect the dentist to help you much or at all if you have neuropathic pain. Something simple like a tricyclic antidepressant might help if this pain continues. Hopefully, it is just a temporary situation.

Has the dentist given you anything to take should the pain become extreme, like a pain medication? If this continues, don't hesitate to ask!

My thoughts are with you as you go through this difficult time, Praying that it is not neuropathic facial pain and that your treatments will end this discomfort.

Jeanie,

You are so welcome!! I am so thankful that you are open to hearing this unfortunately challenging yet factual information!

Yes, it is fine to take that tooth out that had the root canal started on it. As a matter of fact, the "antiseptic" that he put in may very well be formocresol. In fact, formocresol may also have been used in the other tooth several years ago. If you google formocresol.... second thought .... please don't as it will just upset you. No need to go there. Just rest assured that the "antiseptics" used in root canal therapy are generally toxic and cannot be rinsed off or removed from the lining of the tooth. That's why they use them because the "thinking" is to keep disinfecting the tooth for the life of the tooth even though it's toxic ..... which proves once again that the procedure is so fatally flawed.

So taking into consideration your physical condition, the long term infection and the toxicity associated with root canal therapy.... for the sake of your health, the sooner you have those teeth removed the better.

The antibiotics may help to subside some of the symptoms you are feeling but it is never a good idea to start antibiotics, stop mid course and then go back on them again. Some people do okay with that, others don't. So I cannot make that judgement call for you :/

I often refer people to the IAOMT organization when searching for a dentist who understands the systemic consequences of oral health. If you go to IAOMT.org scroll down to "find a dentist" and type in your country. Even if there is no one listed in your nearby area, you can call the office listed for a possible referral to someone closer to you. It's worth a try.

Jeanie, irrelevant of where you live, your choice of treatment is up to you. For an example, another member here Raye who states she lives in Canada (where the medical/dental system is very controlled) has persevered with much determination to fine a group of dentists to work with... and it has been a difficult journey for her. Even here in the US where it's supposedly(!!) an open, friendly medical/dental healthcare system ..... people need to be assertive and must be their own advocate in most cases or we get thrown into the system of convenience and incompetence.

I'm here to provide you the information to become empowered.... if you believe in it and can relate to it... then run with it!

Keep in touch here ... ok
Bryanna

Hi Vowel Lady, thank you for replying to me. Im sorry to hear you're in
pain too. I knew I might have to deal with diabetic nueropathy at some stage in the future (in the legs and feet) and I have always known
since I was diagnosed about the diabetes and gum infection connection but never thought I would be in this position!

The endodontist gave me a prescription for pain killers Friday and I have been taking them but still feeling pain. I tried to get an appointment with my GP to discuss how everything is affecting my diabetes but she could'nt fit me in until next week. I only get to see an endocrinologist once a year if even (I havn't been since last Feb and still don't have an appointment for this year) So Im basically trying to keep on top of it myself by going to my GP every few months and asking for specific bloods and other tests. The medical system here is not in good shape, hospital waiting lists are long, appointments are short and not very productive as far as Im concerned, I got used to teaching myself what I needed to do and trying not to rely on such an inefficient system when it came to my diabetes but I didn't realise I'd have to start doing it with the dental system side of things too :(

Anyway on a more positive note! Thanks to you both I have been productive over the last few hours. I was definately anxious after reading everything Bryanna and I will not be googling that toxin for definite as Iv lost enough sleep the last few weeks! But I did google your link and there is Dentist on there but he is in Cork to the very south of the country, I also managed to find an holistic dentist in Mayo to the west of the country who I rang and got a number for an holistic dentist in the East where I am which is a couple of hours away by train.

I rang and spoke to a lovely receptionist who was very sympathetic, I told her what I would like done and that I was not getting help from anyone else, she said she would speak to the dentist and ring me back. 10 mins later she did ring, told me to start taking the antibiotics again, to cancel the RCT treatment Friday and booked me in for two extractions next Wednesday! She took my address and is sending me out presciptions for more pain killers and antibiotics and told me to write down anything I wanted to talk about. She said that whatever I wanted to do would be fine, that I know my body and whats right for it!

I can't tell you what a relief it has been just to speak to someone so helpful and nice and to have an appointment to start getting sorted!

Again thank you so much for your kindness and for taking the time to help me
to get back on track finally :)

Jeanie,

Have your dentists send all of your xrays over to this new dentist asap. It is helpful for him to see them before you get there.

Bryanna

Hi Bryanna,

I was at the dentist today after 7 days of antibiotics and was ready for extractions. He was a lovely man and agreed completely that I need these teeth out. He said he was going to do an xray and then get things ready.

But when he called me back in to look at the xray he said that the original rct tooth had a huge abscess attached to the end along with infection in the recently rct'd tooth beside it. He said the roots were quite bad looking and he wouldnt touch them and gave me the name of a few oral surgeons. I was told to ring my insurance to see which ones were covered, then contact him with who I was going with so he could email them xrays etc.

I rang my insurance and there was confusion about where I was covered, then thought it was sorted, picked an oral surgeon who is seeing me for a consultation on Friday. But when I rang my insurance back to double check, they said I wasnt covered at all as I was only covered for impacted wisdom teeth. I tried explaining how this is more serious then impacted wisdom teeth but dont think that was much help. I am waiting to hear back again tomorrow for definate from them.

The secretary of the oral surgeon said that he could see me for consultation friday but he had no surgical appointments available until March. I explained that I was diabetic and had been sick for weeks with infection etc and she said well come in and we'l see.

Anyway Im home now exhausted from lots of train travel, phone calls and crying from frustration and stress. :(

Just thought Id update you and thank you for your support again.

xx

Hi Jeanie,

I am glad this dentist did not try to be hero and attempt to extract these teeth himself. He was wise to refer you to an oral surgeon.

Sometimes the insurance company will make an exception when the patient is diabetic and there is a bone infection from abscessed teeth. Ask the oral surgeons office to write a surgical report (after the teeth are removed) so you can send a copy with the bill to your insurance company. This may mean that you have to put the money out at the time of the oral surgery but may be reimbursed by the insurance company.

When you see the oral surgeon on friday... ask him if he feels these teeth are a serious health risk especially due to your diabetes. Tell him you have sought treatment from other dentists but they obviously did not inform you properly and you've been ill and suffering. If he feels you should not wait and he can treat you then or at a sooner date than March, he will.

Jeanie.... stay strong and think positive. To help get yourself ready for the oral surgery, it is a good time to prepare a post operative meal plan of soft foods.... homemade soups, fruit/veggie smoothies, eggs, stock up on filtered water... it is best to be prepared ahead of time so that you do not have to think about any of that when the time comes.

Please know that we are all thinking about you and hopeful that this dentist will take care of you very soon.

Keep in touch with us... ok...
Bryanna

Well they're out!!

I went to the oral surgeon yesterday with a letter from my GP saying my blood sugars are not in control and if he deemed extraction necessary could he do as soon as possible.

He asked me a few times if I was sure I wanted them out and if I wanted him to ring my Endodontist to discuss the matter further. I said I couldn't afford more RCT anyway and there was no point. He looked at the xrays and asked was I sure I didn't want to try and save the recently rct'd tooth and I said Id rather have them both out and try to get rid of the infection. He sedated me and numbed the area and after about 10 mins began to extract the teeth. It seemed to be a general extraction as there was no cutting or slicing which is what I thought surgical extraction would be. When the teeth were out he used some suction device for a few seconds and that was it.

After I sobered up I bit and was chatting to the nurse I asked if they had got all the abscess out and she said yes most came out with the tooth and we sucked the rest out. I'm a little worried now as with everything that was going on I didn't mention the removal of the ligament and think this may not have been done? Should I be worried?

He told me to go to the dentist to get my mould for temp denture and to come back to him in 10 weeks to see how everything was healing and then discuss implants after about 3 months. He said that diabetes can cause implants to fail but thats the worst possible outcome and might not happen.

I thought I might have to leave the area for a good year before even trying for implants..is it ok to try implants so soon? Also are implants safe after having an infection and diabetes etc, am I just inviting more future problems?

I got a missed call from the Endodontist yesterday, he wanted to know why I was not finishing treatment etc. I emailed him last night explaining my diabetes had been compromised and I had opted for extraction for health and financial reasons. he wrote back a long email of questions. Would you have an opinion about any of these questions he asked and answers I am going to give Bryanna..

Did the cleansing and reshaping he did ease pain? The burning pain did ease, and I was able to eat food and drink again, but I still had a sore jaw and face, was rundown and blood sugars were still high.

I had told him that the new dentist I saw did an xray and said there was a very large abscess at the end of the molar. He said that he had examined my chronically infected molar that needed to be retreated and said it was asymptomic and would not be causing me pain or problems with my diabetes? The tooth did not hurt but I feel that any infection/abscess would hinder my blood sugar control.

Did I mention to the oral surgeon that he thought I may have neuraliga or neuropathy and was I goin to go to the specialist he referred me to for this?
I told my medical doctor this idea and she said the pain could be infection and after the teeth are out if the pain comes back we could look into this specialist. But her priority was to deal with the infection.

He said he would have liked to be contacted and consulted by the oral surgeon and other dentist I saw before anything was done and also that he could have helped them with the treatment plan.

The surgeon did ask me if I wanted him contacted to discuss things and I said no as I would not continue rct.

He asked if He could call the oral surgeon Monday? If he likes he can.

Other than the shock of having the teeth out now and the annoying email I think everythings going well so far. My bloods had been around 11-13mml day of and days before the extraction. Lastnight they had dropped to 4.1mml for the first time since December. They have consistently been between 4.8-8.5 for the past 24 hours. It could be some sort of placebo or that stress is less now but I dont think so.

I have been eating yogurts since yesterday and tried some soft boiled egg a while ago which I think was a bad idea as I have food stuck in the extraction sites now!. Going to rinse with some salt water in a little while.

Anyway sorry for all the questions..again!

Just had an email again after I answered the questions and mentioned my blood sugars lowering.

He said that I had had an acute infection in the tooth he worked on, that could cause BS increases but he dealt with this acute infection.

And that the other tooth extracted had a chronic infection and would not have caused blood sugars to rise or cause any sypmtoms at all really...

Does anyone have info about this opinion?

As far as Im aware any sort of infection or stress on my body raises my blood sugars??

Hi Jeanie,

YAY!!!! Kudos to you Jeanie for sticking to your guns and staying focused on YOU and not what anyone was trying to sell you. YOU know what is in your best interest better than anyone else!!

I will answer your questions in BOLD....

<<After I sobered up I bit and was chatting to the nurse I asked if they had got all the abscess out and she said yes most came out with the tooth and we sucked the rest out. I'm a little worried now as with everything that was going on I didn't mention the removal of the ligament and think this may not have been done? Should I be worried?>>

I DON'T WANT YOU TO WORRY BUT I DO SUGGEST THAT YOU CALL THE ORAL SURGEON AND SPEAK DIRECTLY TO HIM AND NOT THAT STUPID "NURSE" AS SHE DID NOT KNOW WHAT SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT. THERE IS NO WAY TO SUCK OUT THE INFECTED LIGAMENT OR BONE. IT JUST DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY. THE LIGAMENT NEEDS TO BE SURGICALLY SCRAPED OUT AND THE BONE NEEDS TO BE SURGICALLY DEBRIDED. THE SUCTION CAN ONLY SUCK UP WHAT IS PHYSICALLY SCRAPED OFF THE BONE. ASK THE SURGEON IF HE INTENTIONALLY REMOVED THE PERIODONTAL LIGAMENTS AND SCRAPED THE INFECTED JAWBONE CLEAN. WAIT FOR HIS ANSWER AND TELL HIM THAT IS WHAT YOU EXPECTED HIM TO DO.

Jeanie.... you know more about the procedure than that "nurse"!!!!

<<He told me to go to the dentist to get my mould for temp denture and to come back to him in 10 weeks to see how everything was healing and then discuss implants after about 3 months. He said that diabetes can cause implants to fail but thats the worst possible outcome and might not happen.>>

DO NOT SEE YOUR DENTIST FOR THE MOLD FOR AT LEAST 3-4 WEEKS. THE SURGICAL SITES HAVE TO HEAL A BIT FIRST. SECONDLY, DIABETES IS A RISK FACTOR IN DENTAL PATIENTS FOR MANY REASONS WHEN IT COMES TO DENTAL IMPLANTS. HE SHOULD HAVE TOLD YOU THAT INFECTION IS THE NUMBER ONE CONCERN. SECONDLY IMPLANT FAILURE OCCURS BECAUSE THE HEALING FACTORS IN DIABETICS ARE TYPICALLY UNPREDICTABLE. THE RISK GOES DOWN WHEN THE PATIENT HAS CONTROLLED INSULIN LEVELS FOR QUITE SOME TIME.

<<I thought I might have to leave the area for a good year before even trying for implants..is it ok to try implants so soon? Also are implants safe after having an infection and diabetes etc, am I just inviting more future problems?>>

ANYTIME YOU ARE REPLACING INFECTED TEETH WITH DENTAL IMPLANTS, IT IS BEST TO WAIT AT LEAST 6 MONTHS BEFORE DOING THE IMPLANTS. THIS ALLOWS ENOUGH TIME TO BE CERTAIN THAT THE BONE HAS NOT BEEN COMPROMISED BY THE INFECTION. IN DIABETICS .... IT IS WISE TO WAIT UNTIL THE BONE IS HEALTHY AND TO MAKE SURE YOUR INSULIN LEVEL HAS BEEN MAINTAINED FOR SEVERAL MONTHS AS WELL.

With regard to the recent questions and statements made by your endodontist.... Bullsh**! He is now concerned about one thing... covering his own behind. Keep in mind that he does root canal therapy for a (lucrative) living and in order to keep his job, he has to convince others that keeping their infected teeth has minimal if any systemic consequences. For him to say that either of these infected teeth were not jeopardizing your health... is totally ridiculous. As your physician even told you differently because infection most definitely will affect not only someone with diabetes but every living being. Endodontists should be ashamed of themselves for misleading and misinforming the public!

<<Other than the shock of having the teeth out now and the annoying email I think everythings going well so far. My bloods had been around 11-13mml day of and days before the extraction. Lastnight they had dropped to 4.1mml for the first time since December. They have consistently been between 4.8-8.5 for the past 24 hours. It could be some sort of placebo or that stress is less now but I dont think so.>>

ABSOLUTELY STRESS IS LESS NOW. BUT SO IS THE BACTERIA THAT HAS BEEN FILTERING THROUGH YOUR BLOODSTREAM. THIS IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE.... IT IS PLAIN OLE COMMON SENSE.

Eat a soft food diet... like eggs, mashed potatoes (yams or sweet are very nutritious), soups, eat vegetable and fruit smoothies with a spoon and put in whatever you want to and blend altogether. Rinse gently with warm salt water today and be a tad bit more aggressive with the rinsing tomorrow. Use only warm salt water... no mouthwash. Brush with baking soda instead of toothpaste... just wet your toothbrush and put a little bit of baking soda on it and brush. Floss all of your teeth! :))

Jeanie... I know this was not easy... but you did it!!!!!!!
Keep us posted ok.
Bryanna

Jeanie,

Didn't see this post when I answered the other one.

The endodontist is mistaken. ANY infection in a diabetic person is a concern. ANY place on the body especially the mouth. The irony here is... any chronic infection in the mouth for any person is a cause for systemic consequences. For example.... periodontal disease which is usually a long term chronic bacterial infection (the same as root canaled teeth) is linked to heart disease, kidney disease, lung problems.... and DIABETES!!

This dentist is a jerk. I'm sorry to be so blunt but he does know better. He is just a jerk.

Don't waste your time on this nonsense. You did what you felt was in your best interest and thank God this guy was not able to convince you otherwise. He's probably ****** because he wants his money for the rct and
he's probably wondering if you are going to ask to be reimbursed for anything that you've already paid!!

Bryanna

Thanks so much for your support Bryanna. Im so relieved to have them out!

Im definatley worried about the ligament not being removed. Im going to try and get some info Monday if I can but I have a bad feeling it was not done. As it was a very short few seconds of suction after the extractions and that was it. I had talked to the dentist about the ligament removal and he said the oral surgeon would do this anyway. And I think when I finally got to the appointment I was so preoccupied with getting him to agree to take them out as soon as possible that I didn't even think of the ligament removal until they were out!

If this is the case what is the likelyhood of me getting rid of the infection completely?? Also how do I know?? Would it just be a case of wait and see when the xray is taken in a few months time?

Its good to hear your views on the Endo because he had me doubting myself for a while, but I think your're right he sounds very desperate. Lying to someone with an autoimmune disease about infections not being a problem! Im so happy I didn't let him do anymore damage.

Also re the implant. I can't actually afford any work in the next few months so I will definately hold off so that I can save some money and get my HBA1C as low as possible before doing anything.

With regard to food im so sick of yogurt and it its only been two days haha. Going to try some soup today and fruit smoothies sound like a nice treat.

Im a bit worried about the bit of food I have stuck in the molar extraction site. I decided to try soft boiled egg yesterday as a break from yogurt and now there is a little bit of white stuck in the middle of the site! Its surrounded by what looks like some sort of clear/white gel stuff that might actually be there for a reason but I can't tell. Should I just leave it alone or try and get it out? Terrified of dry socket so don't want to be too heavy handed..

Again Bryanna I can't thank you enough for your support and guidance :winky:

Jeanie
xx

Jeanie,

There is no reason to doubt your actions.... you did what you knew was in your best interest because you cannot risk infection. The only reason the oral surgeon questioned you about your decision is because he had to be certain that that was what you wanted (for legal reasons) especially since the endodontist had already started treatment. They cover each others back and are careful not to step on each other toes. However, if the oral surgeon did not agree with you and your physician to remove those infected teeth he could have refused to do it.

Most oral surgeons remove the periodontal ligament and debride the bone after extractions. However, what makes me wonder about your case is the "nurse" telling you they suctioned the infection out. So when you speak to the oral surgeon just tell him you are asking the question because of what the "nurse" told you and you know that the ligament and the diseased bone both have to be physically removed. Tell him you dentist told you this had to be done as well as your extensive research on the internet.

It is important for the ligament and the bone to be debrided. If those things are not done then there is a chance that the infection will remain in the bone. If you have lingering pain several weeks to months down the road and/or xrays at that time show that the ligament is still present and/or the bone has not filled in properly..... then you know the debridment was not done at the time of the extraction. That would need to be addressed depending on the severity of the condition. For now... the best thing to do is speak directly to the oral surgeon and ask him. That way you are not worrying about it... you will know one way or the other.

It is best if you can eat a variety of foods. You are going to be on a soft food diet for a couple of weeks or longer. So figure out what you can eat and make sure you have plenty of it. Also drink lots of water throughout the day to help flush out the toxins and keep your kidneys hydrated. Don't worry about a little food debris in the socket. Just continue to rinse with warm salt water several times a day and you can be a bit more aggressive with the rinsing as the days go on. Don't try to stick anything in the socket as you could disturb the clot. A dry socket does not form because food gets in the socket....it forms when the clot has been disturbed.

Hope this is helpful.... you sound like you are doing OK!!

Bryanna

I just phoned the surgeons office, he is not there at the moment, his secretary told me that she did not know if he did take the ligament out but that he had sent a letter to my dentist describing what treatment he had done.

I rang my dentist and spoke to his secretary, she made an appointment for me for two weeks time to have a checkup and xray, she said that she would think that all oral surgeons would remove the ligament. She said that the letter had not arrived yet from the surgeon and might not mention that the ligament was removed, but that she could do some investigation for me if the letter is not clear about it.

If it's a case that it was not removed and there was pain further down the road would the area have to be opened up and ligament taken out then??

I wish I had have made sure before I went ahead with extractions at the clinic on Friday now! :mad:

I think I just thought that things would be done properly as it was an oral surgeon doing it and the dentist had said they would definately deal with the ligament, I was so dozy after the iv sedation I couldn't even think of what I was supposed to ask at that stage..

Jeanie,

How are you doing?? Are you eating ok?

To answer your questions...
The periodontal ligament and all diseased bone is suppose to be removed at the time of the extraction. Unfortunately, we can never assume that the dentist or oral surgeon is going to automatically do this. Most oral surgeons will do it but if they are in a hurry or are lazy.. they do a sloppy job at best. General dentists rarely remove the ligament or diseased bone... they actually shy away from doing that unless they have been educated on how and why to do it. I know.... sounds so stupid. But it unfortunately is the truth of the matter.

It's like that "nurse" who told you he suctioned the ligament out..... that would only be true if he had scraped it loose from the bone first. Which he may have done. But she either didn't know that or didn't want to give you too much information. His surgical report probably will say... extracted #? under iv sedation, patient handled procedure well. It is his clinical notes that would probably be more detailed than the surgical report. That's why I suggested to speak with him directly so he could tell you what he actually did.

It is always best and easiest to remove the ligament and debride the bone at the time of the extraction. When it is done later on.... it can be a bit more complicated. Not necessarily painful, just more of a chore to remove it.

Please do not beat yourself up over this... you were in pain... you were trusting the surgeon and you were sedated!! It was his responsibility to take good care of you and follow the proper surgical protocol. If he is offended by your questions, tell him your concerns and you are not casting judgement you just have the right to know.

Let us know how you're doing.
Bryanna





[/I]

Hey Bryanna,

Im doing ok I think. My jaw is a bit sore still and the gum and mouth are very tender and sore especially after eating and using salt water, but seem to calm down after a while. I had some vegetable soup yesterday along with the usual yogurts and sugar free jelly throughout the day. The salt water seems to be doing the trick with removing the food too.

Im a bit stressed about this ligament removal, Im going to ring the dentist secretary tomorrow and ask her to find out for me for definite. If its yes then that's great, if it's a no Il have to find out if I can get it done. I don't want to go through the healing of extractions over the next few weeks and then have to open everything up again and fix the problem. Plus theres the extra costs this work would be...Its all so stressful!

I think I better stop thinking about it for a while cause im starting to drive myself mad:confused:

Jeanie,

Please try to broaden the food that you are eating. You will be able to eat most soft foods and it's important to eat as nutritiously as possible. Glad the salt water rinsing is helping!

Try to stop stressing over the ligament issue. Again, I would not speak to any staff member at that office because they may not know the answer and just tell you what you want to hear. It also let's him off the hook because he can later say... I never spoke to the patient about the ligament. Hopefully he performed a thorough surgery and all will be well!!

Keep your thoughts positive... and give yourself time to heal. This has been a tough journey but you will do okay!!

Bryanna

Thanks again Bryanna,

Iv graduated to mashed potato and turnip, some hummus and some almond nut butter today. So getting a bit more of a selection.

Today and yesterday Iv had a burning sensation in the gum area around the extractions sites. Also a stinging pain in the inside mouth and into eye again, kind of like the nerve pain I had which made me go to the dentist in the first place but not as intense. Is this something to worry about..maybe to do with infection? Of would this be normal nerve pain 5 days after extraction??

I finish my second course of amoxocillan tomorrow, my GP gave me a prescription for another week if I need it, Im not sure whether to fill the presciption or just stop taking tomorrow when I finish.

The reason Im questioning whether he did a full surgery was because although he was an oral surgeon it was a basic extraction as far as I can tell, very easy and quick, but like you say I was a bit out of it!

I rang his secretary again but I can't get hold of him personally as he's not there today either! Im going to give myself the rest of the week to calm down and heal up a bit, then try to get a straight answer after the weekend. The secretary in the dentists said she would find out for definite for me if it wasn't clear on their notes received so I think she'l have more luck getting direct communication then I have.

Would it be wise if the answer is no he did not do the full removal to ask for it to be done now?? What is the likelihood of a surgeon doing this weeks after extraction at patients request?

Also if it was done would it be the same kind of healing time frame as extractions would take or not so simple?

Also if he was planning on discussing implants with me in a few months time would he have had to make sure the ligament was removed in order to this or would he not think this was an important issue?

Sorry for all the questions, I know you can't tell what the man is thinking! But just appreciate your opinion.

Jeanie
Xx

Jeanie,

Glad to heat that your eating more foods... and they sound yummy too!

As for the antibiotic... that is only something the doctor can prescribe for you to continue. I cannot say one way or the other at this point.

The stinging pain in the gum radiating up into the eye can be a nerve pain. But it does not mean it will become severe or permanent. It is not uncommon to end up with some ulcers on the gum or near the extraction sites about 4-10 days post op the extractions. The salt water rinsing will help ease the pain and keep the bacteria down. These also occur in patients who have been on antibiotics as the lining of the oral cavity becomes susceptible to ulceration from the lack of good bacteria in the intestinal tract. Do you take a probiotic supplement? I know you eat yogurt but unless it is home made non sugar, non fruit yogurt it is not supplying you with adequate good bacteria. Any type of sugar or sugar substitute will kill the good bacteria in yogurt. It is best to eat an organic, plain yogurt and add your own fruit when you eat it.

Yea, I understand why you are questioning the surgeons surgery. To you it seemed too simple and too quick and the nurse said he suctioned out the ligament. You also assume he did these things because he talked about future implants. The surgery may have been a bit longer than you realized and the nurse may have said what she did to avoid the full explanation. Those are possibilities.

If the surgeon tells you he did not remove the ligament or scrap out the diseased bone, then tell him you were told by your dentist that would be done and that is what you expected. Ask him the consequences of not removing those things. He may say... the body will take care of it. Ask him how that miraculously happens? Tell him you want the socket to be clean of infection and any residual ligament. Not only because you may have an implant at some point but because you have diabetes. It is up to the surgeon to decide if he should open the area up after 2 weeks or so. You will just have to see what he says. The healing from a surgical debridement is similar to an extraction.

You're right, I cannot tell you what the surgeon is thinking. I can only tell you what I've witnessed in my lengthy chair side career. I am here to help you be your own advocate... I wish I could do more, but hopefully this information is valuable enough for you to ask him the questions until you get the answers.

Keep us posted.....
Bryanna

Hey Bryanna,

Today was the first day that I was able to eat without stinging and pain in the gum. The salt and warm water is definately doing the trick.

I only started taking probiotics on Monday, Iv been on antibiotics since the end of January and didn't take any probiotics because someone told me they are killed by the antibiotic, then I read one of your posts to someone else saying to take them 2 hours before or after the antibiotic. So Iv been doing that since Monday and bought a better strength one today to start now the antibiotics are finished.

I have a mixture of yogurts in the fridge, organic greek yogurt and some fruit ones too. I checked the fruit ones and they do have artificial sweetener in them so I better avoid them now.

Im taking pain killers for the pain in my jaw and face, I stocked up on lots of vitamins, some soups and soft food, and I was finally able to chew some actual food today! I plan on laying low over the weekend, rinsing with salt water, getting good nutrition and rest and fingers crossed I will get the answers Im looking for Monday when I make my phonecalls. Wish me luck! :)

Jeanie
xx

Hi Jeanie,

Sounds like you're doing ok!! YAY!

Yea, avoid the artificial sweetener as much as possible. I know diabetics search for a "sweetener" but you would be better off with Stevia (the one without the dextrose). Nothing artificial about it :)

Continue on the probiotics <indefinitely> if possible. It is always beneficial to have an abundance of good bacteria in your intestines.

Keep in touch....
Bryanna

Hi jeanie
 

I was following the post. I had my RC teeth removed when I experienced problems. It would have been more money to a profession that does this proceedure knowing it is only a temporary fix. The money they make is outragous. I have a partial in the space now, and no more problems. This is where I learned the truth about RC. I will never have another!!! I sure hope that things turn out OK for you. ginnie

Thanks Ginnie

I hope this will be the end of my dental woes too, glad to to hear you found the truth and dealt with it when you could. Im so annoyed at how we are misled. I had my first RCT a few years after being diagnosed with diabetes I was about 27, I was just glad to have the pain stop, I thought I was in good hands and that would be the end of the matter. It never crossed my mind what was going on below the surface at all kinds of levels.

I feel really vulnerable now as you just never know whats going to go wrong next and there doesn't seem to be many dental professionals with your best interests at heart out there. I will never trust an endodontist again I know that much. They should be arrested for putting peoples health at risk like this.

Im so glad to have found this site though, its been a real eye opener and great support. Im happy to hear you have no problems with the partial, the OS wants me to see him about an implant in few months but Im not going to go there, I dont have the money and after everything thats happened Im not risking more infections on top of my existing problems.

My mother lost most of her teeth by the time she was in her 30's, she has worn dentures as long as I know her and I always felt sorry for her and thought that would never be me, but lately with everything thats happened Iv come to terms with it, she's told me that they dont bother her at all and compared to the pain and expense she had with her actual teeth shes a much happier person with dentures. I changed my appointment for temporary denture fitting in 2weeks to 2 months so I can get a more permanent one done instead. So there will be no more RCT.. its dentures all the way for me from now on!

Jeanie
xx

Hey Bryanna

I saw stevia in town yesterday but thought it may be one of the baddies and ignored it so Il have to check it out now.

I found another bottle of probiotics I had hidden away and forgot about so I have an abundance of them in the house now haha, just have to get them where they need to be and Il be up and running again hopefully.

Again Bryanna I can't thank you enough for your avice and thoughfulness the last few weeks it has been a huge support to me and I really appreciate it.

Jeanie
xx

HI Jeanie,

You are very welcome.... you've been an excellent patient ;))

Stevia is ok to use.... just make sure it does not contain dextrose.

Make sure the probiotics that you found have not expired and it is best to store them in the refrigerator.

Happy to hear you are doing well!!

Bryanna

Hi Bryanna, I'm back again!

Had a check up on the extraction area a few weeks ago and was told that I had great bone growth in the area, that usually there would be a reduction but everything looked very good and was advised I would be a good candidate for implants, as I said before I don't have the money for implants. So the plan was to go get a denture fitted in the meantime and if money appears from somewhere look into implants in the future. I was also advised to have an old mercury filling on the opposite side of where the extractions are removed and replaced with the dentist after I had sorted the denture.

Problem is, I have had a bit of pain in that tooth the last week, which I put down to a lot of extra chewing there to compensate for the loss of the teeth on the other side. Yesterday and today this tooth is throbbing! Hot and cold are also aggrevating it. Also my Blood sugars not so good for a little over a wk.

I rang my dentist, and turns out he is away till next Friday, the dental nurse said it sounds like infection and has sent me a prescription for antibiotics and put me in for appointment next Friday, she said she didn't want to scare me but the fact that I had had an abscess and bad infection on the other side made it sound likely that this was what was happening on the other side.

The plan is to have the filling removed and replaced, she said that if this can't be done it may need RCT, I said I would not be getting another RCT ever again and would have to opt for extraction.

I was just wondering about your opinion on this new dilemma. If there is an abscess on this tooth and a filling won't do I presume I'm right in thinking my only option is extraction if I want to avoid RCT?

Again any advise much appreciated.

Hope you're doing well
Jeanie

Hi Jeanie,

Glad to hear that you are healing well and your bone level looks good!
As time goes on the bone will depreciate some... everyone is different so no one can tell you how much.

Regarding the painful tooth...it could very well be aching from all of the chewing. Hot and cold don't necessarily indicate an infection.... although it could. It could also indicate a fractured tooth and/or a fractured or open filling in the tooth. When a nerve is dying the tooth it is usually sensitive to HOT temps and cold actually relieves the pain. When a tooth is sensitive to COLD temps it tends to be decay or the need for a new filling.

Make sure you take probiotics if you are going to take the antibiotics. :))

Bryanna

Hi Bryanna,

It's been a while now since I last posted, I saw my dentist in May, he filed down the tooth which was hurting me and I haven't had much problems with it since then.

I got a temp partial denture fitted for the extraction sites to wear to a friends wedding in September. The problem is it's very bulky and feels like I'm eating plastic so I don't wear it often, I tried it last week after not wearing for a month but it didn't fit! I went to the dentist and he said the tooth at the back which holds the metal clasp had moved forward and that I really need to wear it more often or get implants sorted otherwise my teeth will keep moving and my bone will become less and less in the area. He filed the back tooth and filed a bit of the denture and now it's too loose. I'm going back to the denture place tomorrow for him to fix it properly.

The dentist advised me to wear it at least 2 to 3 nights per week (but the person who made the denture said not to wear it at night) and to wear it as much as possible during the day, but he also said that he didn't like these kind of dentures because they damage the gum underneath them. I'm confused as to whether it's a good idea to have this denture at all.

I can't afford a new denture or implants at the moment, my plan is to hopefully get implants eventually but not for a few years, I get the impression from my dentist that if I leave it too long I won't be a good candidate for implants? I'm a bit weary of putting anything in the area that was infected previously too, and also have heard some scary stories about the material used in implants being as bad as RCT and mercury etc. Do I really want to put more damaging substances in the area that I had such problems with. But then again I don't want my teeth moving and causing me more problems in the near future and maybe even more extractions.

I grind my teeth pretty bad, have ate through previous night guards (guards tailor made for me by the dentist costing hundreds of euros). A few years ago I got an NTI Device from a clinic, it seemed to do a great job stopping me from grinding, a few months ago the device broke, I showed my dentist and the person who did my denture to see if they could fix it, and they both said that this device was very bad for my teeth and jaw and would cause more damage than good, I stopped using it but have been grinding a lot since stopping. What is your opinion on these NTI devices and what alternatives are there for someone who eats through regular night guards!?

Would love to hear your opinion on implants and any of the above!

Thanks so much:)
Jean

[QUOTE=Jeanie.F;1035454]Hi Bryanna,

It's been a while now since I last posted, I saw my dentist in May, he filed down the tooth which was hurting me and I haven't had much problems with it since then.

I got a temp partial denture fitted for the extraction sites to wear to a friends wedding in September. The problem is it's very bulky and feels like I'm eating plastic so I don't wear it often, I tried it last week after not wearing for a month but it didn't fit! I went to the dentist and he said the tooth at the back which holds the metal clasp had moved forward and that I really need to wear it more often or get implants sorted otherwise my teeth will keep moving and my bone will become less and less in the area. He filed the back tooth and filed a bit of the denture and now it's too loose. I'm going back to the denture place tomorrow for him to fix it properly.

The dentist advised me to wear it at least 2 to 3 nights per week (but the person who made the denture said not to wear it at night) and to wear it as much as possible during the day, but he also said that he didn't like these kind of dentures because they damage the gum underneath them. I'm confused as to whether it's a good idea to have this denture at all.

I can't afford a new denture or implants at the moment, my plan is to hopefully get implants eventually but not for a few years, I get the impression from my dentist that if I leave it too long I won't be a good candidate for implants? I'm a bit weary of putting anything in the area that was infected previously too, and also have heard some scary stories about the material used in implants being as bad as RCT and mercury etc. Do I really want to put more damaging substances in the area that I had such problems with. But then again I don't want my teeth moving and causing me more problems in the near future and maybe even more extractions.

I grind my teeth pretty bad, have ate through previous night guards (guards tailor made for me by the dentist costing hundreds of euros). A few years ago I got an NTI Device from a clinic, it seemed to do a great job stopping me from grinding, a few months ago the device broke, I showed my dentist and the person who did my denture to see if they could fix it, and they both said that this device was very bad for my teeth and jaw and would cause more damage than good, I stopped using it but have been grinding a lot since stopping. What is your opinion on these NTI devices and what alternatives are there for someone who eats through regular night guards!?

Would love to hear your opinion on implants and any of the above!

Thanks so much:)
Jeanie

Hi Jean,

Nice to hear from you!

Regarding the NTI appliance. This appliance is prescribed based on the individual case. Some people do really well with it while others do better with the full mouth guard. It is not something that is automatically bad and will make things worse..... it is a suitable appliance for certain people.

If you are biting through your night guards, then you may need to have one made with a stronger more rigid material. That is something your dentist would have to discuss with the dental lab that fabricates the appliance.

Regarding the wearing of the partial denture. It is true if you do not wear it often enough, the adjacent teeth will shift towards that open space. This movement causes the affected teeth to become misaligned and possibly loose. It could also result in bone loss as the teeth move, the bone breaks down to allow the movement and it does not grow back. It is important that the partial fit properly and comfortably to avoid damage to the other teeth. Other than immediately after the removal of teeth, partial dentures as well as full dentures should not be worn while you sleep. A thrush like infection can develop underneath the appliance due to the areas always being covered and it can be difficult to get rid of. It is best to wear the appliances during the waking hours.

Regarding the placement of dental implants. There is no evidence that titanium or zirconium dental implants are in any way similar to root canaled teeth or the metal mercury. Implants are a foreign material and do not require the nourishment of blood like teeth do. Therefore they can be placed in viable healthy bone in someone who is moderately healthy for a lifetime without any systemic consequences. The metal used for dental implants is not toxic and is considered a bio-compatible material....unlike mercury which is highly toxic. People who have a known sensitivity or allergy to the metals used in implant dentistry obviously should not have them done.

Regarding the time frame to place dental implants. So long as the bone is healthy it is ideal to have the implants placed within one year of the extractions. After that time bone loss will occur and it will progress as time goes on. Everyone is different... some lose bone sooner than others.

Hope this answers those questions.

Bryanna

Great thread - am in the same boat
 

Rotting pulp caused pain. A dentist removed most of the pulp and left the tooth open. Food got in and the next appointment was not so good. It felt like there was more bad pulp in there. And I felt some nerve tissue. (No injections given).

The doc put in antibiotics and closed the tooth. This triggered severe swelling. Now it spread from the side of my face to under my chin, making opening the mouth and eating difficult and swallowing is not fun either.

Will ask to pull that tooth.

Thanks again for the professional's advice to pull your tooth!

Chris