Service Dogs for RSD/CRPS patients
 

I recently started doing some research trying to understand the legal difference between Emotional Support Animals and Psychiatric Support Animals. In the description of the use of crowd control for someone with PTSD, the author mentioned how the same technique has been used for RSD patients to keep people away! Here's the link: http://www.iaadp.org/psd_tasks.html

I've become a bit of a hermit and because I'm so sensitive to environmental stimuli like noise, lights, and vibration, I'm not sure that having a Service Dog would make me terribly more functional, but there might be some of you out there that it would. Certainly for issues like with balance or learning to retrieve certain items, there are many ways in which a Service Dog might be life changing!

More info on Service Animals:

http://servicedogcentral.org/content/

If anyone is interested, I have posted a few times here about my service dog.

I recommend people look at the website for the International Association of Service Dog Partners. http://www.iaadp.org

My dog is not trained to keep people away. However, she is trained to "work" on both sides of me. My left side has more sensitivity, and by having her on that side, she automatically creates a barrier to being bumped by people.

She does many, many tasks for me. I drop a lot of things, as I also have some neuropathy. She picks them up. She steadies me walking, like you could use a cane (but pushing down hurts me to much so I can't use a cane). Helps me with clothing, puts laundry in the basket, pulls it to the washer, hands the clothes up to me. Even knows how to find the car for me if I forget where it is.

It's not all peaches and cream having a service dog. You MUST take the dogs health and safety into account at all times. Be careful of hot pavement, salted sidewalks in winter, always having fresh water to drink. And then the employees in stores can be a real hassle, and the public can be downright rude. I have been asked really prying physical questions "what exactly is wrong with you that you think you need that (bad word) dog in this grocery store?" "you look just fine. What is wrong with you?" "if you would lose some weight you wouldn't need that dog in here. Your as bad as the people riding scooters"...and they often won't take simple answers. I have been followed by weird people, my dog has been tackled and taken to the floor by a toddler that I never did see parents for, people have thrown food at her, all kinds of things.

The expense is another thing. Service dogs are usually big dogs if used for mobility. The food I buy is $50 for 30 pounds and lasts about 6 weeks. Add in treats, harness and other equipment, flea and heartworm treatment, license, vaccinations. The IAADP has sponsors that help with some of the medications and give discounts on equipment if you become a member.

However, I do a lot more with my dog than I used to, especially on bad days.

I've been training my dog to act as my service dog. I haven't had any issues when I have taken him out (yet) as I expected because he is a pit bull. There have been quite a few stories of stores refusing to allow service dogs that were pit bulls access.

He has an in training badge on his vest as he is still learning that when he is working he needs to 100% focus on my needs and not try and get attention from everyone wherever we are!

This week I am going to bring him to the grocery store. Normally I have to have someone take me to push the cart. He has been to other stores with me and pulled the cart... so time to try the grocery store. I really need to shop and no one has had the time to help.

If you want to PM me, I can put you in touch with others who have Pit or Pit mixes as Service dogs. I can also point you to some excellent resources for owner trainers.

It's not legal for them to question specifics about your disability, and if it's random customers being rude, I wouldn't respond. If it's cOming from store employees, then their putting their employers at risk for a lawsuit.

If anyone would like specifics on the law, please let me know and I'll post later. I'm headed out into the jungle myself shortly... ;)

I know the laws. But, people are people. I'm working with one grocery now to educate their employees. Two other stores in town I have never had a single issue with. But one store - the employees are always asking me things. The public has no idea, generally, about the laws about service dogs.

Not responding is one way to handle it - but I see myself as part of the overall service dog partners community. Sort of an ambassador - most service dog users feel this way too. If I am rude to them - it sets the tone for other service dog users they might meet other times. Sometimes a few words of explanation can change someone from skeptical to amazed that a dog can do all the things they can to help people with disabilities. I try hard not to be rude to people, even when I am in a lot of pain. If I am really short on time, I just say she was trained to help me, and I don't know what I would do without her help.

I was just pointing out that having a dog out in public can be - umm - difficult.

Most people are just curious or are dog lovers. They don't think about what they are asking.

I stopped in the local grocery the other day for milk, OJ and bananas. Sounds like a quick stop, right? I was stopped by 4 employees wanting to pet, talk to, ask about my dog, and 7 customers. One of the employees wanted to give my dog a tootsie roll from her pocket. And, I try hard not to make eye contact or encourage people to come up and chat.

Just wanted to make people aware that although it sounds good to "be able to take your dog with you everywhere you go" - that there are responsibilities and challenges that come with this.

I have been at this for 4 years now. Just when I think I have heard every comment or question, someone out in public comes up with something new.

The ADA gives the disabled the right to use a service dog, and gives many specifics. Each state has laws too. The US laws "trump" the state laws, but the state can add to the US law. For instance, the US law does not recognize dogs that are in training, yet some states do allow for dogs in training to be taken into places dogs are not normally allowed.

To make things even more complicated, housing and air travel are not covered under the ADA, but under separate laws. It can be tricky to understand the laws for different situations, different states etc. It's a hot topic on many of the service dog forums I belong to, and I've been to many service dog seminars where understanding laws and access were a big part of the event.

The IAADP that I referenced above helps members with access issues and with knowing and understanding laws.

LitLove, if your considering using a service dog, there might be things it could be trained to do to help you with your individual issues. For instance, mine learned on her own to alert me to muscle spasms, also when I am starting to become tired, and am pushing myself, my pain goes up and she alerts (nags me, really) till I stop and rest. They can do all sorts of things.

It's one thing to speak to employees, but I personally have a problem with people feeling they're entitled to my medical history because I pre-board a plane for example.

I understand that having a service animal brings attention as well as expense, and a whole host of other issues. It might help some become more functional.

I've considered it for various reasons over the years, and don't think it makes sense for me at this time. But when I was forced to spend more time in public years ago when I was raising my son, it would have helped... ;)

Interesting post. I am considering getting an assist dog. My family would like me to have one now. I think I would train my own starting with a pup. Still wondering, as one with CRPS, what benefits a service dog would have for me? I have read the assists above. I especially like the help with balance issues since I too have that difficulty. I usually use my electric wheelchair when I go out. I do find many doors that are difficult to open because they do not have the automatic openers installed on them.

Thanks!

How many on this forum have assist animals?

They can carry items, pick up things that you drop, open and close doors, cupboards, etc. Turn on and off lights.

What they can do - well it depends. First thing you have to figure out is what things YOU have problems doing. Such as the doors. The next thing is what size dog it would take to do those things. My dog is only 50 pounds, so she is physically unable to pull me up from the floor, fully pull a loaded shopping cart, balance me if I had to put weight ON her, she could not open heavy entrance doors to stores.

If you need a dog to perform tasks that take physical strength, like the shopping cart, pulling you up from being seated or after falling - your going to need a large, sturdy dog and they should be 2 years old before you even begin to have them do any of those things, so their bodies are mature.

I'd recommend joining a Yahoo Group called "OC-Assist-Dogs" and one called "assistance-dogs" Each one of those groups have owner trainers - but they also have people who train service dogs. I joined them when I was looking into it and they helped me figure out if a dog could learn to help me, given what things I have trouble doing.

The key is, that the tasks the dog knows have to "mitigate" your disability for them to "count" under the law. A dog only needs to do "work or tasks" to help - they don't say they have to do 3 things or 10 things... just "work or tasks" although most people think they should do at least 3 things. Take a diabetic alert dog though - it can be a service dog if all it does is alert to to high or to low blood sugar. However, it's much better if it knows how to bring you medication or snack or a drink if your crashing, bring a phone, even to use a "dog" phone to auto dial 911. A diabetic alert dog could also be trained to go get someone else in the house if you become non-responsive to the dog's alert. Now, if your a diabetic, and you have a dog that knows how to tell you the oven buzzer is going off, yet you have no problem hearing - then that would not be counted as a task.

Another example - my dog alerts me with a nose nudge if I start to become over tired (which will mean my RSD pain will be spiking shortly), or if my muscle spasms are going to get worse. She started to do this all on her own, and then I trained her to do the nose nudge. However, since I have no pain meds or spasm meds that work - her alerts don't really help me. They let me know that I will be getting worse, so I should go home if I am out somewhere - but her alerts will not allow me to do anything to prevent the condition. So they do not "mitigate" the RSD in that instance - so I do not count those as "work or tasks" that she does.

Now, as far as opening doors. Household interior doors most dogs can open as long as they are - say - over 25 pounds - if you change the handles to lever types and tie bandanas on or something so they can reach them. Heavy doors in stores - they make a hook like thing for the person to attach to the handle, then the dog pulls with it's teeth -- but this takes a STRONG dog, and often leads to injury to the dogs teeth, or to it's structure over time. Same with pulling shopping carts (especially if they don't have a proper harness that fits correctly), pulling wheel chairs. Some can do it - but it's not really good for them. My dog knows how to hit the handicapped buttons (anticipating I might be in a chair some day while I still have her). But, you are able to do that yourself right now. An example of a breed of dog used for this type of work would be a Great Pyrenees.

For anyone thinking about training their own dog, the type training that I'd really recommend is Sue Ailsby's Training Levels - Steps to Success. Sue is a service dog user, service dog trainer - and even though I've been training dogs for over 40 years, I learned a lot following her methods. It works on one basic small step at a time. The next step builds on that one. It is very methodical and really a great way to train any dog - not just service dogs. She says after you complete the two books, you can go on to train a dog to do practically anything and I believe that is true. Sue also has a list on Yahoo Groups, called "traininglevels" and if you look her up online, a lot of the info in the books can be found on her website.

The BIGGEST thing if your going to train your own is selecting the right puppy or dog to train. You don't want to get 2 years into training and find out your dog is not going to grow large enough, or has fear issues, or some other problem.

Here is a woman's YouTube channel who does Sue's training method. She is a Service dog trainer in Canada and does some of the best training videos. I learned how to train my dog to do a lot of the things she does by watching Donna's videos. She has a second channel for teaching tricks and other dog stuff, but this one is more for service dog work.

http://www.youtube.com/user/supernat...ow=grid&view=0

This is a blog done by a woman I have met who has now trained her second service dog. She is in a wheelchair, and even competes with the dogs in agility for fun. This blog goes from picking a puppy, training all the way to graduating the dog to "service dog" and would really help you understand all that is involved. I see she has started a second one that takes over where this one left off. I didn't know that, so I know I'll be reading that blog and catching up on her dogs later on tonight.

http://www.frompuppytopublicaccess.b...1_archive.html

Hope that helps!

I just applyed for a service dog 2 weeks ago for my epilepsy but also for my RSD. I have an interview in 3 weeks. We dont know what its going to cost $$$ wise but its important for my well being regarding my epilepsy. I would like to be able to stay home alone again. But the reason we are also counting in the RSD is because when my pain gets to high then it can cause me to have a seizure because thats a trigger.

I hope everything works out and you are able to get a dog. I'm sure it would be nice to get some of your independence back.

Thanks fbodgrl and daylilyfan for the tips. I had not thought about all of that. Daylilyfan you've provided quite a lot of useful information. Seems you are deeply knowledgable and involved in the dog assistance area. Thanks again for the wonderful tips and links. Looks like I've got some interesting reading ahead.

I hadn't thought about all the possible things an assist dog can help with. For instance, the knobs on the doors. Living in a newer condo, we do have the lever handles on all the doors for an assist dog to use. Also, turning the lights on and off. That is another very useful one I hadn't even thought of at all. There is a lot for me to learn and consider before actually getting a pup. Right now my 16 year old dachshund Frank is top dog. He is not an assist dog. He is a bit short height wise to help with the lights, and weighing about 10 pounds, he isn't able to help me with doors either. We are leaning toward a labradoodle but haven't really thought it all out just yet.

Hoping for you the best of days ahead.

Would I still Qualify for a Service Dog?
 

I was reading through this thread and really appreciated all the amazing research and information provided. I was wondering do any of you have a spinal stimulator and a service dog? I am getting ready to have a permanent device implanted soon but I know it's not a cure it's just a blocker really. I have balance and walking issues and while the trial helped, bending over and balance still tend to be issues. I was just curious.

Hi! I am new to this forum. I have been diagnosed with RSD/CRPS following BiCep Surgery last December. I have a German Shepherd that I am training (with a trainer) to be an Emotional Support Dog. I could use all the advice out there! Thanks...

i've been wanting to get an emotional support certification for my dog. i would also like to look into getting a service dog to help me when i have trouble walking and bending to pick things up. i also get alot of emotional support from my dog which helps me deal with my rsd and fibromyalgia and endometrisis pains and my panic attacks from all the pain i am constantly in. dogs have a calming effect on me. thanks to everyone for the links. i talked to my pyshciatrist i see to help me deal with my rsd and he didn't seem to understand the benefits of having an emotional and/or service dog. i would like to get a prescription from him for this but need to educate him more on this subject. does anyone know of any other dr who can do this? maybe my pm dr? thanks again for your info and i hope that all of you trying to get a dog succeed! take care.

I've been reading these threads for years and never mentioned this but I co wrote a book with someone who's a well-known author, dog trainer, and who has trained and used service dogs for years. Her name is Carol Lea Benjamin. She has Crohn's disease. She uses the dog for emotional support, to alert her to an oncoming attack, and also to identify the area of pain and lie against it for comfort. She takes the dog with her everywhere. Another pup from the same litter ended up as a service dog for a girl who has panic attacks and diabetes. She alerts her to both the panic attacks ahead of time and low blood sugar, and has allowed her to go out in public with more confidence.

My part of the book was not about training for a service dog. However, the dog I write about, a littermate to Carol's, has ended up being my service dog. Mostly for emotional support. She's very sensitive to my emotional state. I don't take her places. (I rarely leave the house anyway.) She'll also lie against me in areas where I hurt, which is surprisingly comforting as endorphins are released by this interaction along with the comforting heat of her body. If interested, you can search the book on Amazon under her name. You'd probably skip my parts since it doesn't pertain except in early raising of the puppies. I'm only putting the information out there because of her part.

After I needed a service dog, and fortunately had one already that worked for me, I found Carol's insights extremely helpful. Perhaps you will too. One thing that's important to note is not all dogs are suitable for this work. Starting with a puppy can be rewarding if you find the right type but getting a puppy may not always work out.

Denise

hi cd. may i ask the name of this book and if it explains how to get someones dog to become an emotional support dog. not a service dog yet for me, but one that i can take with me to places if i need to go out like to the dr, or apts. thanks for all the great info.

Yes, I think there's a lot of explaination of how to prepare a dog to go out in public as emotional support. It's called do border collies dream of sheep. You can find it at amazon, barnes and noble and iTunes. It's in book or kindle form.

The ADA just came out with a Frequently Asked Questions Publication to update and clarify the laws about Service Dogs.

I think it would help people understand the differences between task trained Service Dogs and Emotional Support Animals.

Here is the link to the PDF.

http://www.ada.gov/regs2010/service_animal_qa.html

Hope this helps.

I had just adopted a French bulldog a few months before I started this thread. I had a difficult landlord at the time that had never allowed tenants to have a dog in one of his properties, although several tenants had them anyways. He allowed me to have her because he didn't want to lose me as a tenant. I certainly could have claimed she was an ESA, but it was easier to handle it the way I did.

I moved out of the area about 6 months later, for a variety of reasons, but being able to have a yard for her was one. She is very sensitive to my flares and is absolutely careful with my bad limb. In 2 and a 1/2 years she has never bumped into my bad limb... --She even provides desensitization exercises by licking my original CRPS site, lol.

When you're hypersensitive it's very easy to avoid touching other people. I simply can't avoid it with my velcro dog, and I do think this helps with depression from isolation. I was lucky that my mom found her at the pound and allowed me to have her when she realized how sensitive she was, and the perfect fit for my needs at the time. I do feel that a dog that's at least a few years old is a good idea, because their personalities are already formed and hopefully you can get an idea if they'll be a good fit for you with limited interaction.

So, in short, Service Animals, ESAs, and just plain old pets can enrich our lives substantially.

Gsd
 

I have a GSD I am training as my service dog for my CRPS and can use any information out there.

Great Information, Daylilyfan!
 

Hi daylilyfan,

It's very nice of you to cover so much information. :)

There are differences, as you have pointed out, between states re: service animals and housing regulations. Not every state has laws which support, or are in compliance with the federal ADA/HUD regulations. Since this is the case, a landlord can challenge a service dog on the premises in the state without laws/regulations in alignment with the ADA/HUD regulations, etc.

It can be a big job to bring a state into compliance. If anyone has this as a goal, I'd strongly suggest using a team approach to getting this done in your state. For the most part, disability law projects will support these changes, as these changes benefit the disabled. Thus, disability law projects are a great resource for legal support/legal strategy in meeting this goal.

You had mentioned educating people in stores you frequent, etc. What a great idea. Some of the service animal organizations have had brochures which have been helpful for this.

When I had my service animal, which I had also trained to service tasks, I took her to area malls and restaurants, etc, to educate the staff in these places. It was critical to make sure the mall security office and security force was up on the service animal laws. I would make appointments with the store/restaurant managers. I had literature and my dog. I was not paid to do this. I had wanted to help to pave the way for people just starting out with service animals.

There is a great deal of information out on the internet.
There is a lot of misinformation, as well. I hear therapists ill-advising their clients, telling their clients about their absolute rights with service animals, with companion animals, with emotional support animals. It's rare such absolutes exist. Please be sure to do your research before you get a dog to train, if training your own. I have seen too many people get erroneous information, including from ill-advised psychotherapists, and then have to give up their dog, which has been devastating.:eek:

Regarding housing issues, if you rent your housing, please check your state laws regarding whether or not landlords must accept service animals, emotional support animals, companion animals-- and under which circumstances and in which types of housing, etc. It's more complicated than it appears at first.

Federal regulations trump Service Animal Public Access/Public Accommodations issues.

Federal regulations do not necessarily trump any state housing regulations, etc. Again, please check your state's laws/regulations.

Daylilyfan has also mentioned the IAADP. Great organization. Great resource for anyone interested in Service Animal training, laws, regulations, etc.

Nice job, daylilyfan, sharing so much information.
You are quite an ambassador. :D
You have made it easy for me to simply fall in behind you and support you.

:grouphug:
DejaVu

Litlove, Thanks for this thread
 

This is an interesting thread.
Thanks so much for starting this topic.

I agree with you. Our relationships with animals can assist with our daily coping and our healing. While people tend to focus on Service Animals, it's true ... ESAs can be so very helpful. While ESAs often do not enjoy the public access protections of laws protecting the rights of service animals to enter stores, restaurants, public places, they can be adequate and so very helpful in the role of an ESA or a companion animal. :D

I've had a friend be suddenly convinced, by a very unbalanced therapist, that my friend had needed a Service Animal, immediately. As I was talking with my friend, I had asked why she'd felt she'd needed a service animal? This friend had come to talk with me about this, as she knew I had trained service animals in the past, etc. I had been friends with this person and this person had no limitations in traveling, in public places, etc. In fact, this person travels nationally and internationally with no problems at all. She has so much fun on her trips. This was all very strange. The therapist had convinced her she'd needed the service animal as a companion (?) on these trips and had additionally convinced my friend the airlines would have to remove a seat for the dog on international trips, etc. It was clear to me the therapist was not only confused about the definitions and roles (and laws) pertaining to the various roles of support animals, this therapist was also making the person much more dependent than the person had ever been prior to meeting the therapist.:(

The therapist was clearly misinformed and was also misinforming her clients. In this state, a doctor, a therapist, a social worker can write a letter qualifying their clients for either a service animal or an ESA (if in some types of rental housing and not allowed to have animals on the premises). However, it's not a free-for-all. The therapist had no clue as to the state or federal laws/regulations and seemingly no clue as to the needs of her own clients' true needs. I had been asked to meet with a few people after they had been misinformed by some local therapists. It can set someone up for ongoing hardship to prescribe a service animal, when an ESA is truly adequate. Some people lose their animals because they have been very misinformed. Sad.

I spent a lot of time explaining the differences in the capacities, and the training of the animals. Lots of extra costs and extra responsibilities can come with Service Animals. I had strongly encouraged my friend to settle for an ESA, as this was in her best interest and fully serves her needs.

This is a very important topic. It's critically important everyone does due diligence in researching the truths about the laws and regulations, both federally and within their own state of residence... before securing an animal.
Do not fully trust the (mis)interpretations of some of the people serving in roles where they are allowed to prescribe/verify the need of an animal acting in a given capacity. You may be in a position of having to give up your animal if you don't make sure you fully understand the truth about the criteria, the roles, the laws/regulations.

:grouphug:

DejaVu

Hello,
I would love to get some more information from you, as well as your input to help point me in the right direction. I have a fantastic, sweet hearted pitbull that I rescued as a baby and I really think that she would be perfect.She is 4 now(we think), solid muscle and is nicknamed my shadow because where I am she is. My White Sheperd/Lab Mix has been my service dog for over a decade now but shes getting up there in age. And is extremely protective of me ever since I became completely wheelchair dependent, I just don't want to push her, I'd rather her enjoy her last years and start training my pit to take over. I appreciate your information and time. I look forward to chatting with you.
-KNottYwHeeLz