Long term care insurance
 

Wasn't sure if this belonged on the MS type forum or over here since it pertains to both. I was reading an article last night on the myths of retirement and it said that although we may think we have enough saved for retirement, many don't. It also talked about the importance of long term care insurance. So that is my question. Does anyone have it, what is the average premium. I googled long term care insurance asking what the average premium is and I couldn't believe it is as high as it is. It suggested that you start this in your 40's. Whoops, I'm 64 and hubbie 65, almost 66. Premiums for people in the 60s are less than those in the 70's where it is the highest so I figured i better get some info on this. Does medicare not pay for any long term care if there is a medical need for it??? I know that it completely covers something like 5 weeks but no coverage at all after that. Medicaid would not be an option for us because of our retirement savings which we have worked hard to get to where it is and thought that we were doing OK.

Doydie, I had it through my employer and it was $1.12 per pay period! I never thought I'd need it but it was too inexpensive to not have. Boy, am I ever thankful I got it when I did. There is no way I could afford it now. I've told both of my boys to get it now....while they are young and healthy. I'd rather them pay for a long-term health care policy than life insurance. If your employer offers it - GET IT! You can always have your own private policy, too. Mine lasts through 2027 so I have to plan for the day when I won't have it but it sure is a blessing now.

I applied twice BEFORE getting dxd with MS and was denied due to the possibility of having MS.
I offerred to pay top premiums if they would cover me, but I was refused.

So we are saving for the possibility of me needing loads of medical help when I get older. I insisted on DH getting covered; he wasn't denied, although his premiums are high due to the fact that his brother passed from colon cancer.

If medical costs were more tightly regulated I wouldn't be so worried, but they are runaway in our country, so we who are chronically ill have to be prepared for huge bills later in life:(

When I was younger, I, almost, wasn't excepted on my DH's policy, because
My Doc had written MS on my med record. At that time, it was only a question
and I hadn't been DXed, so they had to cover me (according to Ohio State Ins.
Rules).

Later on, when I was in the hospital being DXed, the same insurance co tried to
deny coverage, due to pre-existing condition and they couldn't do it....so I was
covered.:D

I suggest checking your State's Insurance Board, to see what the rules are for
Ins,Cos doing business in your state. That goes for other types of Insurance
too. I also got them to cover a Homeowner loss..I used to be a fighter...LOL

There are lawyers who specialize in Elder Care. I contacted one when my mom had to go in a nursing home. I knew she'd be there several years, and no way could we afford it. He got her on MediCADE legally. She already had Medicare. The nursing home got all but $30 of her SS check, MediCADE paid the rest. She got the care she needed, that I couldn't do at home for her.
It's worth checking into, I'm sure all states have something similar. Eases your mind, and all your hard earned $$ is spared.

You have to have pretty limited assets for medicaid to take over before depleting them as I recall. Or establish a trust fund to hide assets 5 years beforehand?

I have no idea why trust funds are so popular with the rich!

i signed up for a private insur co LTCI many yrs ago. that was well before i was dx'd with all my issues now. i pay about $1200/yr. but, like i said, i've had the policy for many yrs.

So in other words you guys are saying that since I have diabetes and MS, my husband has heart disease and Parkinsons, there is a good chance we won't be able to get any??? Maybe we need to check into doing something special with the automatic payout Charlie is required to take out of his funds at age 701/2 that could be ear marked toward long term care. I think we are close to $150,00 in out investements right now and they gain an automatic 4.5% and he has an additional Jackson fund that is confusing to me. It isn't gaining much but the death benefit is guaranteed. I don't care what the death benefit is. I want something that is going to cover us in life time. We have a small pension through where we worked and then Social Security and who knows how long that will last. My check is a ice one since I was an RN but DHs is not. I wish my pension check was larger. It would have been if I had been able to wiat until age 70 to start drawing it. But DH retired before he was 65 and My Social security check was the only income then. So we both started out pensions. I was something like 60??? Sure was smaller than I was counting on. But I wasn't counting on him having a melt down because of new computer system at work that he couldn't learn.

We didn't do a trust fund. Mom didn't have a lot of assets, it was all turned over to me as her caretaker. That's why an Elder lawyer can help. This was 10+ years ago his fee was 700. I thought it was worth it. They know the laws for your state, no rumors.

I would make sure my 401K is well-stocked and watched after...people who are against Medicare and Medicaid don't understand how quickly one can drown in debt from suddenly getting ill...that's why we all need to take care of ourselves financially, IMHO.

what about a consultation with a financial planner. it may cost some money but might be well spent for the future and your peace of mind.

It is my understanding that once you have a diagnosis like MS if you could find a company willing to give you long term care insurance it would be cost prohibitive...that said I haven't been able to find one willing to give it to me, even through employers.

I do have 2 small modified plans that cover respite care in a nursing home for like 3 weeks a month or something silly but I figured it would be better than nothing.

DH and I also have decent assets so unless we have to go into long term care we will be fine. If we have to go into long term care I guess we will just use our assets to finance what we can cover and apply for Medicaid when we are broke, right?

I'm not big on trying to hide my money, for what?, I worked for it and although I'd much rather spend it on vacations and cheap thrills if I have to pay someone to bathe me I guess that's where the money will go. :o

Long Term Care
 

I came across some interesting info on long term care costs. It was on AARP's site:
http://www.aarp.org/relationships/ca...nter/LTCC.html

You can plug in your own area for estimated costs for your area. I'm in Georgia so this is what it estimates for me:

Nursing Home (Private Room) for 5 years
2014 cost: $ 69,350
2018 cost: $ 81,130
Total cost for 5 years: $ 375,622

Nursing Home (Semi-Private) for 5 years
2014 cost: $ 67,525
2018 cost: $ 85,249
Total cost for 5 years: $ 380,645

Home Health Aid 40 Hr(s)/Week
2014 cost: $ 36,400
2015 cost: $ 36,764

Nursing Home (Private Room) 10 Years
2014 cost: $ 69,350
2023 cost: $ 98,707
Total cost for 10 years: $ 832,624

Nursing Home (Semi-Private) 10 Years
2014 cost: $ 67,525
2023 cost: $ 114,082
Total cost for all 10 years: $ 890,033

* Home Health Aid does not include: groceries, heating, electricity, cable, water, telephone, insurance, medical needs, transportation

Karen

I don't want to think about it...:eek::eek:

Thanks Karen, that is awful. I would have to arrange to die somewhere within that 5 years. Between both my husband and me we don't have that in all our retirement accounts. Of course we have our pensions and social security but I'm not sure how secure the former is.

I hear ya but think it is so important that everyone, MS or not, consider these facts and make plans that we can be comfortable with. :(

Why can't they just put us down, as our choice, at our time to go?
Don't we deserve the same humanity as do our fur babies?:) The plan is,
I move in with DD and go to hospital if needed and then hospice and out.:D

I agree 100% and part of my strategy is to refuse all treatment, except pain meds, which should at least hasten my death. :(

Yes, I'm not afraid of death, when it's my time.
It's the dying I'm afraid of.:eek:

Lol, SalPal that is what my Mom always says. "I'm not afraid of dying but I am afraid of how I might die."

:hug:

I read just a headline the other day that was about how hospice care is letting seniors die...uh, in my experience, that is what they are hired for-to make a terminal situation comfortable for the dying without any extraordinary measures...

I am going to stop drinking liquids when I feel it's time to go. You can last for weeks and weeks without food, but not so long without liquids.
I know that when FIL stopped drinking and eating he only lasted a few days...same with MIL. It was against my instincts, but they were "leaving" anyway...a water-dipped small sponge kept their lips and mouth from discomfort. It was still so sad:(

I will never forget my Mom's time in hospice. It forever changed my veiw point on the dying, as a nurse I was supposed to take care of patients, keep them alive, not help them die. These nurses were saints. They nursed Mom and they nursed me.

Very sound strategy but make sure your family knows your wishes and don't allow artificial nutrition or hydration.

I swear if anyone comes near me with a feeding tube or intubation equipment I will rise up from the grave and snatch them bald headed! And that has been in place since I was in my early 20s!

Yikes, Karen!!! I just checked in my area and it's a little lower than yours but man...:eek: Just having someone in my home is just under 3 times my annual income. That's just crazy! I am on my state's medicaid program, for now, but should they make changes who knows what will happen. Of course, in a skilled nursing facility, I would end up with such high medical bills that I would qualify for state aid or something.

I don't have any long term care insurance and apparently don't qualify for my states program right now. I don't know what the qualifications are for that.

Sadly, when the time comes, like Sally, I will live with one of my DDs and just go to the hospital as needed. :(

I know that I would have to give up everything entirely to get Medicaid if I ever had to have long term care in a nursing home but I just don't want to give up my children's inheritance. We own our home fair and square, nearly own our second car and the other car ha been paid off for quite a while. Yes, our cars aren't new. We have worked hard to be able to give our home and all possessions to our girls and I just don't ever want to give that up. I know that neither one will probably live in it but they cans ell it and have the profit. We paid $58,000 back in 1978 and have made improvements. I know my husband just wants to give up and die if it ever comes to that time. But we don't get that choice. Well he could decide to go like out next door neighbor did but I an still remember the sound of that gun shot to his head. I don't want my kids to have to live in a home their dad commited suicide in.

I'm not eligible for the federal government's LTCI program. Item number 4 in small print - MS diagnosis is not eligible.

Tom

Have you asked your children what they would prefer? I personally don't want one dime from my parents. I hope they have spent everything they earned on themselves and would much prefer they are comfortable in their last days.

My Dad says he did his job as a parent by raising us to be independent and self supporting so if there is any money left over he will donate it to charity. (I'm hoping its an animal charity. ;))

Lol, that was one of the reasons I jumped through all the hoops to secure a federal govt position a few years back. Much to my surprise they now do a fairly standard 403B for retirement and I was ineligible for long term care, thanks to MS.

Heck if the government isn't offering LTC insurance to us I'm pretty sure no one will. :confused:

Jules, I'm sure if I asked my girls they would tell me that they would say that they would ant me to be taken care of. But they also love this house. I know my oldest daughter wouldn't move here just to live here but I know at this particular time my youngest sure would. She has 3 dogs and they would love our yard vs her postage stamp size yard. But she would have to buy her sister's half. Of course I don't think the older one would mind at all if younger one didn't. That's the kind of kids they are. If one needs something and they can help, they do it freely. Or if it's like I was with my Mom and Dad's things, I really didn't want things. I wanted my parents.

Doydie, the hospice nurse that cared for my in laws said the same thing you did...she used to work in a hospital. She said, "We all were taught to keep people alive no matter what. When I joined the hospice group, I found out how wrong that can be for some people."

She was so great...helped us help FIL go peacefully and made sure he didn't suffer...she was on vacation the week MIL passed, and we had a tough time with one of the nurses refusing to give her morphine for pain. We made sure she didn't come on duty for us again:mad:
Once we made sure we wanted MIL to be comfortable, they made sure of it, and she also passed peacefully.

That's the way we all should be allowed to pass on. FIL used to say, "We treat animals better than we treat humans when they're dying." He was so right...

I get you Debbie. I would report that nurse that wouldn't give the medicine. That's the whole purpose of hospice. And I think a big part of that purpose is not only easing the loved ones pain but the families pain while doing it. That was 3 tough weeks I had with my Mom and I am so glad for those high does of medicine. My Dad was in ICU behind those sterile walls and we couldn't see him that often. But it was a blessing to see both of them as they finally joined the Lord in heaven.

I sometimes wish I could be a volunteer in a hospice but I know I couldn't handle it. But they gave so so much to me as a person and a nurse in those 3 short weeks. My brother has been a chaplain in a hospice now for years. I don't know how he does it.

Future wishes - Do it now!
 

Jules, you can't guarantee what the med system does to you as to your final medical wishes unless you have it in writing. Yes, definately tell every family member of your final wishes - and put it in writing.

But also fill out your state's Advanced Directives for Health Care (it used to be called a Living Will) forms. That is free to do - simply Google them online for your state's forms and print out blanks, or ask your PCP for them. Often, no Notary is even required, only two impartial witnesses. Give copies to everyone including your family, your signature witnesses, your PCP and your neuro.

Keep your original somewhere safe at home - - not in a bank safe deposit box. Others will need immediate access to it especially if you don't want the things done to you that the hospital may do automatically upon your entering an ER or hospital , thing like CPR, breathing tubes, feeding tubes, hydration, blood transfusions, dialysys and other expensive, unwanted procedures.

I added an Addendum page to mine to put my wishes into my own words, as well.

Also, if you love your family, have a Will for after you're gone. The Will doesn't outline your health preferences; only property and minors' care.

MsBluIs

We both have a will and a trust. Having a trust ensures that our heirs won't have to go through probate; a will does not protect you from that.

I do need to fill out an advance directive form. DH is my power of attorney for health. Good idea about having a copy at home...I need to do that and let one of the kids know where it is.

Yup, got it all! And I want NOTHING, except lots of pain meds, even today at 50yo.

But thanks for the great advice and I love that you used the term safe deposit box instead of "safety deposit box" which for some reason drives me batty. :D