Back surgery or no back surgery?
 

I am a 21 year old female trying to decide whether or not to have a lumbar laminectomy at the end of this year. Here's a little bit about what I've already been through…

My whole life I have ridden horses competitively, played golf, and played volleyball-all things bad for your back. But at 17, I took a fall off of one of my horses. Everything was fine after the accident until about 2 weeks later when I began to have sharp pain in my buttocks/hip/upper thigh. At first, it was bearable, but it got increasingly worse. It was always worse after exercise. With a few months time (about 4, I'd say) I finally caved and went to an orthopedic doctor. Since my only real complaint was "hip" pain, she x-rayed my hips and said they were fine. I walked out with a diagnosis of SI joint dysfunction and a prescription for physical therapy.

Well, I decided to take my therapy into my own hands, still continuing to play sports and ride horses. It got worse and worse. Finally, I caved again and went to a sports chiropractic and physical therapy clinic where I began having trigger point massages, doing hip exercises, and having spinal manipulation. My doctor encouraged me to exercise as much as I could as long as I wasn't in pain. Well, I took that, ran with it, and joined a cross fit gym. I lasted in cross fit for about 3 months when I began to develop sharp shooting pain in my lower right leg and buttocks and numbness and tingling in my foot that never seemed to go away. My chiropractor ordered an MRI and found that I have one 9 mm herniated disc at L4/L5 and one 5 mm herniated disc at L5/S1. She considered them severe for someone my size and told me that most people with herniations like mine would not even want to get out of bed.

This is when I began spinal decompression and totally backed off the exercise. Exercise was too painful at this point, but I continued to ride and play sports at first. Eventually my chiropractor convinced me that I needed to stop everything if I was going to give it a real shot to heal on its own.

After a few months of dry needling, physical therapy, icing, spinal manipulation, massages, tinge units, and decompression, I eased back with some core exercises and stationary bike. I had to learn my limits. Slowly the leg pain, numbness, and tingling started to become intermittent, and I began to figure out the exact things that would flare it up. The back pain eased a bit, but remained fairly constant. The last symptom to improve was the sharp dullness in my hips (worse on the right side).

Continuing to go to the chiropractor for another year to "manage" my symptoms, I realized that it was silly to keep paying for something that only made me feel better for a day or two afterwards. There weren't any more drastic improvements to be made. The therapy helped me a lot initially, but it was starting to plateau.

I haven't gone to a chiropractor in at least 8 months now, and I have been easing back into lifting weights. I am extremely careful and do not mess with anything that strains my back or compresses my spine. I stay away from jumping, running, and lifting things above my head unless it's very light. I opt for more yoga than I used to. It helps keep my muscles loose when they want to tighten up. I am pretty strong, but I could afford to lose about 30 lbs. (I have also developed hypothyroidism which makes this very challenging, but that's another discussion! :( )

My current symptoms are persistent back pain that gets worse with sitting or standing for long periods or overdoing it in the gym. My right buttocks hurts pretty consistently, but it's not near as bad as it used to be. I have some pain on the side of my upper right thigh and tightness in my right hip flexors. I still have intermittent pain, numbness, and tingling in my lower right leg. This is my biggest concern as it gets worse if I do anything differently in the gym, ride a horse, play a round of golf, or play volleyball. When the leg stuff flares up, I know it's time for me to back off. It's an indication that my back is extra inflamed.

Anywho, sorry for the excessive details. I just feel like I've hit a wall and am curious if anyone out there knows of anymore tricks to try! I'm giving it until the end of the year. If the nonsense doesn't stop by then, I will be having a lumbar laminectomy with no fusion by Dr. Stanley Jones in Houston.

Also, if any of you have had a lumbar laminectomy-how did it turn out? Are you still in pain? Have you had to have more surgeries down the road? Did you opt for laser surgery or regular discectomy? How long was the recovery?

Thanks for any help you can give!

Hello aewatts,

Welcome to the NeuroTalk Support Groups.

I'm sorry about your back problems and pain.
You do like to overdo it by the sound of it... ;)
I'm pretty sure I'd not be weight lifting with 2 herniated disks. :o

I just wanted to say hello and to leave you the link to the
Spinal Disorders & Back Pain Forum

take care of yourself.

Welcome aewatts. :Wave-Hello:

What kind of horses & riding do/did you do?
I took a header off my horse at age 15 and had a minor concussion from it..
Probably messed my neck up a bit too...but didn't bother me toil I hit middle age..and had repetitive job for many years....

Have you tried IF stim, or maybe even better, some low level laser treatments..
Some chiros have both of those types of machines.. mine did.. He also did upper cervical adjusting..and soft tissue work..

I really loved the results from the laser tx,, and I bought my own home version IF stim, lasers are quite high priced yet.. but when they come down I plan to get one as my L5 slips in & out , due to hyper mobility and possibly many of my tomboy youth activities and some of the other horse falls.. or stacking hay n the barn...:(

I did 2 years of 4H, but rode a lot around the fields & woods out in countryside where we lived.... * photo - 1970 me 15 my horse 3*
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/pi...pictureid=8003

Well, those are pretty big herniations...

As you already know, surgery is a big deal. It often does not fix problems like existing nerve damage that presents as numbness, tingling, weakness or pain. It can, however, prevent further nerve damage if the discs continue to slip and put pressure on nerves. Unfortunately, age and extra weight almost always makes existing problems worse.

I can say without hesitation that my fusion took away the instances of my back "going out," which meant my lower lumbar muscles would spasm like crazy and keep me in horrible pain and in need of muscle relaxants. My nerve issues in my affected leg didn't completely resolve, but I was prepared for that probability going in.

Good luck, and if you decide to seek out a surgeon, get 2 or 3 opinions first!

Great to meet you!!
 

:Wave-Hello: Hello and welcome, happy to see you have come to be with us, it a great place to be. As you can see we have a great number and caring fellow members here, where you have find a supportive and relaxing place. Have fun looking into the different forums. Our shoulders are here for support in many ways.

Please keep us up to date on your condition. Again welcome, looking forward to seeing you around. My thoughts and prayers are with you. :smileypray:

Darlene :hug:

I've lived with back issues since I was 18 and I'm 77 too soon...I danced a lot and exercised most of my life and got thru my life with no back surgery. A hip replacement in 2010, set me back big time in many ways...I work with all the complications from that every day.

I never had major falls or accidents in my life and did a lot of alternative work for my back and everything else and still do. Working with KT taping now and so far I'm impressed with what I'm feeling.

A Prolotherapy MD here who does both PRP and Stem Cells, forever says: do the LEAST invasive work for everything. Unless an emergency of course.

I've heard good stories and heard not good stories from back surgeries...So good wishes on whatever you decide....can't reverse surgeries. I've heard often that one fusion surgery leads to another, etc. A friend I think went thru 3 in a two year timeframe.

I have shown quarter horses in showmanship, halter, horsemanship, western pleasure, western riding, trail, hunt seat equitation, hunter under saddle, barrel racing, pole bending, and stakes racing. I still compete in barrels and poles when I can! :winky:

The accident I was referring to was on my barrel horse. He tripped while running, and I fell off on my right side, almost getting stepped on. Sorry about your accident, I also have a bulging cervical disc that gives me some problems too. :/

I'm not sure if there's a difference between using IF stim and using a TNS unit. I have used the TNS before. It gives me temporary relief from muscle aches. I have also had some cold laser therapy that didn't seem to do much. I've been adjusted every which way possible-neck, back, and hips. But like I said, the chiropractor wasn't helping past a certain point. Everyone responds differently, I suppose.

Hi aewatts,

I'm sorry to hear that you are having back problems my husband just got done having his 3rd back surgery he had 2 lumbar laminectomies done and then just this past March he had surgery for spinal stenosis. I also have 2 herniated discs L4, L5. SI so I understand how the pain can bother you. Both my husband and I have had the same pain as you have described with pain in the lower back, hip, buttock and legs that area could be the siatic nerve acting up on you. I would advise you to see a neurosurgeon and get the surgery done because if you don't it can often get worse to the point you can't stand the pain anymore. After my husband had his surgery this past March he had to have water therapy where he did exercises in the pool and that did wonders for him and he's much better now. Try to walk a little each day and if you have a pool do some swimming that helps out a lot. My husband was put on Tylenol with codeine after his surgery for a short time along with Neurontin but the Neurontin really didn't help at all. Cut back on caffeine and sweets also because that will cause more pain in the long run. I wish you the best of luck and May God Bless You!

Sue

Hi aewatts, if I were you I would do everything you can to avoid surgery. I would only do it as a last resort. Surgery is always risky. Although it may help your condition, it may also leave you worse off than you were before.

Why are you still lifting weights? No matter how careful you are, it is going to put at least some strain on your back.

If you are 30 pounds overweight, this is also putting strain on your lower back. If you can lose the weight, it may help alleviate some of your symptoms. Hypothyroidism can make it more difficult for you to lose weight, but it can easily be treated with synthroid (levothyroxin).

Before deciding on surgery, I would definitely get a second opinion. If you decide to go that route, be sure you choose an experienced surgeon with a sterling reputation. There are also patient reviews of most doctors available online. As others have said or intimated, if disc surgery is botched, the resulting damage can be permanent.

I agree LAST RESORT and changing what you do would be key. Putting stress on back does not help. You are so young and starting with surgery like this, wow, I can't imagine. There is so much one can do to help the back. Emergency is another thing.

There is a Spine section here and a lot of personal stories.

Hi aewatts,

Having had serious spinal injuries starting in my teens, and now the primary cause of my inability to walk any distance - along with the excruciating pain, direct and referred, and numbness - I would urge you to take every step, personal and professional, to fix, strengthen and maintain your spine at optimal health.

That does not mean dive blindly into surgery, but seek other opinions and gather references as advised. I wish I had been given the option before it was too late.

Dave.

New to site
 

Hi all I'm seablue:cool: I'm 53yrs. old and from Maryland,I have had 42 surgery's and counting my next on e is a double Disectomy L4-L-5 and L5-S1 kinda of worried and all had a heart attack (Widow Maker) have hep C frm a patient diabetes type 2, now cirrhosis of liver,hearing loss, some neuropathy, rt sm. toe amput. lt foot amputated ball of foot and up,and now 2 huge hernia's in my back my neuro doc is great always looking into trying to help me I trust him doing the surgery, but scared to death in what my results will be

Hi seablue,
Welcome to the NeuroTalk Support Groups!

That's a lot of surgery you have been through already. I'm sorry you will be having more. You must be in a lot of pain.

When is your surgery? I hope you have some support there at home to help you now and also with your recovery.

You could post over on the
Spinal Disorders & Back Pain Forum

take care there.

Hi seablue,

That is a lot of surgeries, but you say you have faith in your Dr, so that really is half the battle. Can you talk to him before your op to allay your fears further?

Of course, we can talk here as much as you want - it is what we are all here for.

Dave.

Howdy
 

Hi AE
Hi Sea

I sure side with those who write urging surgery as a last resort. I was a car wreck injury. Funny, I guess, reducing who I was to an event traumatically producing harm. Injury or not, degradation of the spine produces one HECK of a lot of Pain. I am with you on that, and efforts to SOMEHOW gain control over the pain Drove me......nearly berserk.

I do understand work to regain strength may, through the delay it interposes, allow the body to heal itself. One of my herniations Did resolve thusly. The physical therapy I did, though, was ever under the guidance of my physical therapist. The wise guidance provided and hours spent in the therapy gym/therapy pool both allowed careful healing to occur where it did, AND strengthen my core toward the ultimate surgical gauntlet I did have to run.

Like Sea, I know the surgical suite nearly as well as the professionals who served me. 38 times I have been in the OR for surgery required by the wreck.

I am glad to have had the help of surgery. This is NOT an endorsement of cutting for every patient. Physicians must consider the evidence, recommend course of care, and hope the patient so informed gives appropriate consent.

The first of my major surgeries did come to pass because cauda equina syndrome had taken hold. I lost ALL control below the waist. Could not void bowel or bladder. Screaming out of pain was my lot. It was absolutely necessary.

I have had laminectomies. Some with fusion, some without. Each with the course of treatment did hit the goal. That was for me, though, and surgical outcome is Always patient and circumstance specific as Dave does share.

Another of my majors was for implant of my spinal cord stim. Without it, I would be living on morphine and incapable of working in my profession. For my sake, I am Blessed to have had these helps.

Cervical fusions came as necessity because beyond PAIN the neuropathy produced inability to even hold a pen to sign my name or a fork to feed myself. Through this, I did regain use of my arms and hands. And I have gotta say trying to use a computer program to type my contracts and letters was NOT going to work in the long run.

Has surgery cured all? Decidedly not.

I do still experience pain....and sometimes those meds DO have to come out of the safe to manage breakthrough pain.

I have no feeling below the knees...unsteady on the feet, so use a cane from the collection I have assembled, and the nerve damage overall left me with ticks, jumps, some bladder issues, and DO use one or the other wheelchair to go TOO far. This being said, I do not jump at the idea of another surgical appointment. It has served important purposes for me under specifically necessary circumstances....and it nearly Always hurts like Hades.

I wish and hope the very best for you in your needs, and will gladly chime in if I can be of any help.
M56 :grouphug:

Hi aewatts,

Many years ago, I took a spill off of my horse when he went left of a tree and I went right of it. Off to the ER unable to feel anything from my waist down. Immediate thought was, "Oh, NO, I am paralyzed and won't be able to ride any more." After many hours in the ER, paralyzed, feeling began to return. At THAT point, while I was glad to begin to have hope that the paralysis was not permanent, the PAIN was beginning to emerge.

Not only did the docs decide to take a wait and see approach and postpone surgery, but I was a very lucky person. My back has been a source of pain ever since but at least I was able to WALK out of the ER. Well, of course, they put me in a wheelchair, but I was able to walk from the car into my home.

That was the "beginning" of my back issues. There have been many more back issues since then and totally unrelated to the equine accident.

At another point in time, I was told I needed lumbar back surgery. I declined and later discovered that the proposed surgery would NOT have alleviated the problem for which they were going to operate.

Within the past two years, I was told that I needed thoracic spinal surgery immediately or could be paralyzed. I declined once again and have been very happy with my decision.

I keep escaping paralysis and am very thankful for that. I do, however, suffer with back pain to various degrees in both the thoracic and lumbar regions. And of course with age, I have developed more and more spinal problems but I am still happy to decline surgery.

There may be a point in time when I may change my mind and opt for surgery but as long as there are other options for me to control the pain, I will stay away from the operating room.

With my other health conditions, any type of surgery is very risky, and a high degree that I would not survive a surgical procedure so that plays a big part in my reluctance to go under the knife, not just for my spinal issues, but for any surgery that is not essential for life. At this point in time, I would rather deal with pain and be alive than take the risk of not coming out of the OR.

Surgery is a very individual decision. It is up to you to weigh the pros and cons and with the guidance (not push) of your medical team, you will decide what is right for YOU.

Don't feel pressured into a surgery if you are not sure about it. It is YOUR decision, no one else, not even your doctor.

I hope someone that has gone through the surgery you are considering will offer guidance and their experiences.

Wishing you the best.

PS. I rode and competed in hunt seat. Loved it. Those were the good old days. Also ponied horses to post at the race track. I had several horses, one was a thoroughbred that raced, an American Saddlebred that I showed in hunt seat events, and a few pleasure horses that I rode around in the pasture. Oh, I had a bad spill at the race track, too, but did not hurt my back that time, it was my foot and ankle that sent me to the ER then.

Sure hope you can find a way to avoid surgery.

Herniated discs do not always require surgery. Some heal with time.

Would you be willing to share your MRI report with us?

I am glad to hear that you are not rushing into surgery and are taking your time to make that decision.