Pain and Cold Temp?
 

I need some suggestions. I have noticed and before my pn in my legs how sensitive I am to cold. When I developed the pn I noticed how in cold the temp goes directly to my painful areas and how my legs ache. I also have frozen feet regardless of layers and my feet seem to ache more too. Now the past winter was just start of my pn and I was super bad but now even on cold mornings I feel more in pain and my feet feel cold. Even the cold wind hurts me. I live in MI so the winter here is brutal. I have been thinking of relocating to a warm climate. Now my fear though on my own living my mom is my huge support and I know I sound like a baby but can't imagine being away in this much pain.Just seeing her lifts my spirits and makes me feel less alone. I know we could visit and talk but not the same. Like I said I currently live on my own though. Also if something happens out of state. Though I'm not happy with my docs now anyway and my mom said I would just fly home or she there. I fear the loneliness and not being able to do much. At least if I were going for work or knew more people but really its just cause of the pain issue. These legs and my own and off symptoms are so trapping. I feel like I'm retiredand just want to live like a normal person. On that note though as a positive I was so busy this weekend. I got to go to a Farmers Market and even in pain I'm able to do at least. The reason I need to decide where I move is cause I'm trying to sublet my apt because its horrible so when I move I need to figure this out. Any ideas?

I have one for you. Wherever you move, try and involve yourself in some activities that are not related to a PN group. Not that there is anything wrong with a group, but it would be good to focus on some other things and try to put your health issues in the background as much as possible.

We are your PN family and will always be here for you to help you or support you as needed. So don't think for a minute that I believe you should stay away from us. We want to know how you are doing and where you are and we want you to have every opportunity to get better and healthy again... We care what happens to you. I hope you know that...

Cathie

One problem
 

I lived in Mi. right now with temps of 109 you are in air because it's
hot. So your cold parts are still cold..Also i was a mama's girl as well.
I glad my kids,now boy do i miss them don't get me wrong are
independent... There are times i want to say yes and move by one.
Someday i will have to,oh Dan we are in reverse if you get what i mean.

I really agree with Cathie,your young,you need to live your life. It
will be hard but dueable...I was job and family,honest i thought this
would be all fun time..But i'm doing many of the things i still like,
if it wan't for Drs. screwy up i would be learning something new.
And please don't take this wrong,cus i adore you,maybe mom needs
a break. If you move to somewhere warm how neet,nice place for her to
visit.. Besides get your idea on where you would like our commune to be.
Think it through,maybe in a warm climate you could get out more.
:eek: i wish we did live closer but we would be in our jamies,bit--ing.
Did i say that.. naww it was MeL. :hug: Sue

Daniella:

There are two places that I know of that will help you with your pain. One is Arizona where the sun shines 360 days a year. The other is Nevada. My husband went there for a week and he had no pain anywhere. Nothing hurt him, he couldn't believe it.

Now I know it's scary and we have our comfort zones, but if you can afford to move, is it possible to bring your mom along???

If not, that's why they invented webcams. I make videos all the time. I have friends and family in different states. That's how they can see a new gadget that I just bought, or I show them a plate of my muffins.

If you move, just put a webcam on your computer and (this is, of course, only if your mom is computer savvy). If she's not, she can be. You can teach her how to use a laptop.

Just make sure she has a laptop with a webcam. The you and she can share videos. It's the next best thing to being in the same room.

And the climate will really benefit you.

So if you do move, I wish you the best.

Melody

I can't
 

go out in Az. i would be burn't from held to toes. My neightbors let
me see my grandson on there Webcam. Couldn't stand it,oh boy
he's got hi mama's eye's,there so cute at 3 months,going to get
one... Just gotta...:D Sue

Sue:

That's why they make SPF 50 or better sunscreens. So you don't get burned. And you can carry an umbrella.

Today, here in Brooklyn, you never saw so many people walking in the street carrying umbrellas (for the sun, not the rain).

I have never done that.

Maybe someday I"ll be like the gals in the 1890's. Carrying a parasol.

Now that would be some sight.

lol

We don't have such cold winters in Atlanta, but here's what I do. I have a small space heater that I keep by my side whenever I am sitting or lying down. And I wear down booties.

not me
 

I'd advise that you not leave your mother. You have a comfort space there with her. You also have someone to help in case of an emergency. And who is to say what your health is going to do in the future. If it got worse and you were alone somewhere far away, what would you do? There are at least one or two of us who live alone without spouse or family. They have a difficult time. You need the emotional support if nothing else.

As Dakota says, wear down booties and use a small electric space heater in your vicinity. There are some other tricks too. Like the little chemical toe and hand warmers that you put in your shoes and gloves or pockets. Liza Jane uses them in NY.

I live in Texas and it is 100+ here. I find it really makes no difference to my pain. I still freeze, shiver and have chills. All of this while I am sweating. I've found that on the whole, my pain is better when it's cold. But it really doesn't make that much difference.

While you are still living where you are, or perhaps staying with your Mom briefly, you could take short trips to the other regions to see if it makes any difference in your pain.

Whatever you do, think this out and don't make rash decisions. There is something to be said about having family near.

Billye

Thans for your reply. The issue is I don't want to leave my mom but I can see how the cold makes me ache so much more. The past 2 mornings have been so cold and my feet never warm up and the inner ankle hurts even more.My legs feel so tight. I feel so trapped and confused. My mom said she would be there in a few hours if something happened. If I move it will be near my gramps in FL which its looking like I will maybe. I'm scared but my pain level does go up with cold. Here in MI it can be 0 in the winter. I have been crying about this issue cause I feel so lost. As for my mom moving. She loves her home in MI and my gramps who is a millionaire offered to buy her a huge house there and she doesn't want it. I'm the bad seed so that doesn't apply to me. I'm blessed though on finances but nothing like him. Were not close at all which is hard. Thank you guys so much. I wish I felt young and was able to get a job,school,hang free with people but my pain and legs though progress are limited. I feel so trapped in my mind and body. I will say before this pn issue I had issues leaving my mom though live on my own since 18. I worry about her too which is an issue. My mom has very few people in her life,she chose to get divorced though,a eating disorder though slightly better,I feel depressed. I don't want her to feel I'm leaving her which I think rationally she knows how hard this is for me. She has been my strength through this and everything in my life and I don't want her to feel I don't appreciate it yet I can't live in agony of cold. We talked about this too. I would never take things harsh you guys say. I know its from the heart and your all so caring. Like my "adopted" moms and dads I guess. Thank you

I think what Billye says makes good sense. Before you make a major committment to moving down around your grandfather, how about waiting until it cools off a little more and then flying down and seeing how your body reacts to the difference in climate? If you all are not close, perhaps you could stay at a hotel for a week or so. Then you are not out a very long move and a lot of money getting set up in a place that might not work out for you.

What do you think?

Cathie

Thank you. I'm so back and forth. I'm going to look at a rental here with my mom later. I may call my gramps again later. The issue is I know I feel worse in the cold. Even before the pn dx I was so sensitive. My feet froze and felt like no circulation and the ache and pain is worse. Maybe I would adjust or just stay in the house. Yet I'm so torn of moving by myself and feeling sick or in pain. Even when I was in bed most days I was able to do all my own care. My mom comforts me and makes me feel safe. She said I could just move for the cold months and then come back. My wish is she would just move too. I wouldn't want her to though cause she would be unhappy. I know she would though if it would fix me. If she moved there my gramps would buy her any house she wants. Will see I guess. Thank you.

Hi daniella,

I agree with Silverlady, your mom is so important in your life, it may be an extreme shock and therefore very stressful for you if you move away.

The temperature thing is really a problem, though. I agree.

For instance, my house has been around 70 degrees inside. Outside it's been in the 90s.

So it's surprising to me that if I'm in bed watching telly without my feet under the covers they begin to ache.

I think that somehow the PN affects how quickly our feet can adapt to temperature changes. That doesn't seem to follow, the way that I've written this, and I can't think how to better explain what I mean right now. (I'm just sooo tired... the dang stress!)

Last winter what I did was order these 60 degree below zero socks and I cut the tops off them so there wouldn't be any restricting elastic.

I also got some 20 below ones which were not very much help.

I don't keep my place very hot in the winter, I hope to keep it above 50 but don't always succeed.

I have a fleece jacket I can wear in the house on the cold days... when it's 9 degrees outside, then I have a hard time. And then if I get bone cold, I tend to have serious nerve repercussions.

One thing that's been really important for me is staying well enough to be able to get a bit of exercise.

When I exercise in the morning, it improves my metabolism all day long, and with my metabolism chugging along at a little higher rate, it keeps me warmer...

:)

(so I wonder if that means I should exercise late in the day during the summer???????)

((((((((((daniella)))))))))))

(My mom was seldom any help to me, so I think you are very fortunate.)

I like your gramps. :)

(Think he would adopt me?)

:rolleyes:

Thanks your funny. He is one of a kind that is for sure. I will say money doesn't buy happiness or health. My mom did say she would come for a few weeks and I talked to my ex step dad who was thinking of moving near. I have always been sensitive to cold and hated MI weather before this pn. With this though I'm scared of it. Even like this morning and yesterday being cooler I noticed. Maybe I would adjust but to the 0 I don't know. It will be stressful and even trying to decide is. I feel either way will be wrong. I do know that staying in all winter will not be a good thing either. I know I'm a mommies girl and also under this pain issue makes things hard but even before this my gramps had offered for me to move down there. I didn't want to. Most people would jump at this. Even though he is emotionally hard on me. He has so many fun toys a big yacht,fancy cars,huge home. You go to this club and they have tea time. Its so weird for me as I'm used to though lucky living cheap cause before my pn I wanted to be on my own financially so I worked and went to school full time. I watched all my pennies. I felt good though about being self responsible. It still is a shock though going from an apartment and driving a focus to a mansion and a bentley if that makes sense? I just want to be fixed,healthy,and happy and go back to being on my own even if that means having to cut coupons. On a seperate note I got a call from u of m pain clinic that the anastesolgist referred me to from ohio. I have a meeting with them next month. I may move up the apt if I can though but was waiting to make more a choice on the treatment and now since its in both legs. Thanks again.

:)

I'm glad I made you laugh a bit. :)

Bentleys are not that thick on the ground...

I can see that you've worked really hard for yourself. That's really a strong characteristic for you.

I think if he's a bit hard on you emotionally, that ... it would be a challenge.

I forget what state you said he was in.

Are you sort of keen for the vacation from scrimping?

I can see that would be really possible. And I could sure identify.

If you're going to stay with him, how about just going for the winter months?

(Before I ran so low on money I was thinking of going to Greece for the winter...)

Going there for a vacation would be a lot less stressful than a full fledged move.

Do you have a lot of things to put in storage for while you are gone? or could you sublet?

I think the high life might be fun for a bit.

But for me, I have to be really careful of stress... so the emotional thing could be tricky to deal with, if I were you.


Have you tried taking masses more Methylcobalamin and seeing if it helps?

I have cyanocobalamin shots, and have seldom been able to take 6 of the 5mg Methylcobalamin for more than a few days ... you'd think I'd love taking them because they are so fun-flavored. They are like my favorite candy... only of course they aren't candy....

I need to post some info from one of my web pages that could be useful... but I have to do a few of these stressful things here, first.

((((((((((daniella)))))))))

Thanks, I don't know if I would move near him. I just talked to him to see how I feel and I always cry after talking to him. Its a long story and in his own way he loves me but is so not caring. My mom is his princess and I'm the failure and will always be. He always used to say my mom is perfect and I'm not and have been screwing up my whole life. You do things his way or its wrong. He said its up to me about the move but also had to add his 2 cents about what I should be doing for pt. He always compares to him ok he is 84 and his issue is the muscle. I'm 29 and mine is nerves. Way different. Like I should be fixing myself or be better already.Through this he never called me in 6 months only calling my mom to see. I called a few times and sent cards and then finally we talked. He says to my mom he doesn't know what to say. He makes me feel so lonely and sad. This is such a sad day. I always feel so lonely like no one understands. My friends are too busy with there stuff,my step dad is gone,and my gramps is well I told you. Thats why my mom is so wonderful. I'm so sick of fighting pain,depression,eating disorders,loneliness,fear,I could go on.I feel fortunate but at the same time for being 29 I have been through a lot. SOme by my own doing but some not. I'm sorry for being so down. It will pass and I will try to be more hopeful. Thank you for all your guys caring. It really helps more then words can say. Your special people!

Oh my gosh... you are so right to be doubtful in that case.

When I'd only read that you always cry after talking to him, I wondered for a minute if he was a man I used to go with... ;)

The guy had a lot of money, and I liked to travel with him... but he was a complete drain... (we broke up a couple of times, and I noticed I'd be much sadder when we got back together than I had been when we broke up.)



I sure agree that it is completely different. Nerves need a lot of rest, muscles love to be pushed.

push nerves and is just destroys any hope of moving around.



I'm so glad you know yourself so well. That helps to protect you from him and his opinions.


I'm pretty much entirely alone, so I can understand what you are saying.


Except you are so young. My goodness, even though I had a lot of stress at your age, I was still basically healthy most of the time, and able to have some enjoyment...


You may have already told me this, but do you take very much B12? And, what form are you taking it in?



After I lived in the hydrogen sulfide for a couple years (I didn't know about it, obviously) I bumped into stuff so often that my arms were always full of black and blue marks. And I was always breaking things because I'd misjudge distance.

It was after that, that I got the darning needle broken off in my toe, and didn't feel it.

But I am soooooo lucky, because although it gave me tetanus, which is pretty horrible, I was not only one of the lucky 40% who survive, I also started using some of the HUGE B12 prescription for injections that my holistic MD had given me...

After a shot or two a day for some months, the PN began to be much better...

So... maybe you would be lucky and a LOT of Methylcobalamin or B12 shots would help you a LOT.

((((((((((daniella)))))))))))

oh dear... I was just thinking, I didn't mean exactly that you should tell me how much you are taking.

It's none of my business.

What I meant was more like, that's something to think about...

((((((((daniella))))))))

Daniella:

You wrote:

"You do things his way or its wrong. He said its up to me about the move but also had to add his 2 cents about what I should be doing for pt. He always compares to him ok he is 84 and his issue is the muscle. I'm 29 and mine is nerves. Way different. Like I should be fixing myself or be better already.Through this he never called me in 6 months only calling my mom to see. I called a few times and sent cards and then finally we talked. He says to my mom he doesn't know what to say. He makes me feel so lonely and sad. This is such a sad day. I always feel so lonely like no one understands."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Your grandfather reminds me a lot of my mother. I never felt so good as when both my parents moved to Florida when I was 24. This is how they told me they were moving. "Melody, we bought a house in Florida, if you want to come, come". Now I didn't need to be a brain surgeon to know that if I went, I would never be out from under her domination.

So I elected to stay, got my own apartment (I was 24, had a good job, even a boyfriend or two). And I visited them on holidays. Every single time I went and returned and my friend picked me up at the airport, she would see me crying and she would say "Oh Melody, why do you continue to go there and be abused"???

But in your case, it's a completely different story. I dont' care how rich this guy is. He comes with strings. (and I mean no disrespect, but I did go through this). These strings are called Emotional Blackmail.

STRESS STRESS STRESS.

And the fact that he calls your mom a princess and you a screw up, and the fact that no one fully understands your physical problems, well, you might move there, but honestly, what would you achieve. Warmer weather, and a living arrangement full of stress.

I would rather live in the North Pole with a bunch of heaters, sweatshirts, warm clothing, AND BE AT PEACE, then even have a conversation with my own son. That's what he did to me, and that is what I now know contributed to my health woes. Of course my son did not cause my diabetes. But his behavior contributed to my closing myself in my room at night and eating myself into oblivion. How nice that I no longer have to do that. I choose peace and caring. My husband and I do not go on trips, or out to dinner, or any place special.

But do we do out to Dunkin Donuts for breakfast a few days a week. We smile at our neighbors. They smile back. We stop and chat. We know everybody. My husband calls me the Mayor of Brooklyn. At each night, I go out and sit on neighbor's or friend's porches with my muffins, and I play with the babies or we just sit and chill.

But there is no stress.

If I knew then, what I know now, (and if I had applied that knowledge), I can only imagine how different my life would have been.

But we have to go through stuff and learn. And learn, and continue to learn.

So you do whatever you need to do to survive. But don't let anybody talk down to you, beat you up about it, etc.

You're a human being and you should be respected.

Next time Gramps hits your with something that you know is inappropriate, just quietly say "Grandpa, why on earth would you say such a hurtful thing to me???" See what he answers.

Melody

Considerthis I don't mind. I'm an open book and we can learn from others. ANyhow I don't take b12 anymore. I stopped with my dizzy issue and my b12 levels being so high. I know I know but just seeing what will happen. As for my gramps, I agree and why I worked so hard before this to be independent. Before that he had me doing what he wanted. That meant school,job,so on. Before I got pn to put myself through school I waited tables and he thought that was stupid. I said it makes me happy and he said your too smart for that job. I said he should just want me to be happy and if that makes me happy it should be fine. He said thats stupid. That I have been screwing up all my life. He specifically said if I don't do as he says for job so on that I'm out of the will. Thats fine I said if I'm healthy and happy I don't care. He really compares my mom and I her being perfect and me not. My mom never makes me feel that way though. She is my role model though. You know he is 84 and won't change. I love him and that is hard and when he was sick I even offered to come take care of him like full time. He can afford the best of care but I said its important to have family. You know I have been in the hospital many times in cardiac units so on and yes it was because of my ed and my fault but never a call or a card. I always send him little notes. Even now he can't give me credit for my recovery of anorexia he just brings up how I'm behind in school so on.My grandma was the best. Melody she reminds me of you so loving and caring. Also a talker. She passed away years ago. Always in my heart though. Anyhow I just went to look at a cute rental here so will see. I saw my mom too who made me homeade soup. Yeah and I'm feeling a little better. Thanks guys.

Hi Daniella,

Boy, recovering from anorexia is a HUGE accomplishment. That is BIG. You have done a dynamite thing. I sure hope you are really proud of yourself.

(((((((((Daniella)))))))))))

When I was your age and waited tables, (well a few years earlier) I compared how much I made to how much I'd made when I was in management at AT&T. I made no less, maybe more waiting tables; and it's a much healthier job.

****

so have you not been dizzy since you stopped taking the B12?

*****

in terms of your level being high... I'm pretty sure mine must be in the thousands... I think it's important to remember that the "normal" levels are arrived at, as far as I know, in relation to healthy people.

*****

Because there are so many things on telly all the time about dangerous this and that... and herbs get much longer coverage if the news is bad than say VIOXX... I used to worry a lot if I had a shot a week, before a doctor put me on that amount.

I think we are encouraged to worry about taking vitamins...

But in reality thousands of people die every year from over the counter things, and the number who die from prescription drugs is astronomical... but not covered by the news all that much.

((((((((daniella))))))))

Thanks. I don't know if I would say I'm proud but know I had to if that makes sense? I hope to be proud. As for the b12 I have not had the severe dizzy but I have had an out of it still sometimes. The dizzy though has lessened since I stopped it. If it does come its not for so long. My symptoms have been so weird. I often get a flu out of it feeling. All my tests don't give a why though. I'm hoping at u of m for more direction and pain relief for my legs. The only reason I stopped the b12 was because it was after I had started taking it I got the dizzy.Also my b12 levels range from 1500-2000 the 2000 was before the b12 and after I started it went down to 1500. In my dream world I would take nothing. I mean no vitamin ,med,so on. That is not possible but I always worry about side effects.Can pn cause dizzy symptoms? I think if I don't get better soon I may look into holistic. I will wait till after my neuro apt,pain clinic at u of m and anastesolgist though.

Hi daniella,

one thing that comes to mind is Teflon... do you cook with it at all?

I used to have some really nice pans, but every time I sauteed garlic I got the flu thing...

So I replaced all my pans with plain steel ones.

...

Yes, I know... taking nothing, just eating well... :)

I don't see me being able to do without B12, though...

Maybe? I don't know what my pans are. Why would that be though? I think if you found something that works and its healthy then you should stick with it. My issue is I try things and then not only have the pain but other issues. I need to start eating healthier. I gained the weight and eat a lot but not the best choices. Thanks your a sweet lady. All you ladies and gents are!

Daniella:

I think she means that when you use a cheap teflon pan, the teflon coating can come off and go into your food. Not healthy at all.

The stainless steel pans are better. Just use Pam or PUR, or some healthy no stick alternative.

I hate food when it sticks, Drives me nuts.

And the fact that you overcame anorexia is a major cool thing.

My friend is battling Stage 3 lung cancer (doesn't look good) but what's doing her in is her anorexia. She's 59, and has it since she's about 19 or so.

Cost her her marriage, her kids, her whole family can't stand her. They blame her for everything. They think "why can't she just eat".

I once tried to explain that it's a disorder, but they just wrinkled their noses.

Yeah, I know, some people get it, and some people don't.

She has been in and out of eating disorder clinics many many times. Not one of them ever took. I never understood why.

She would be riding in the car with me and ask "Melody, how many calories are in a piece of lettuce"??? That one really got to me. I just said "we are not going in that direction today, we are going out to dinner".

She actually ate a swiss cheese omelette with lettuce and tomatoes. I was thrilled. I had actually never seen her eat anything in my life.

But now, with her illness, she's not eating anything. She must have some strong heart to have lasted this long.

So you pat yourself on the back. It's not easy, I fully understand this.

Melody

I've been inundated doing the court things today, and only now checked my messages and saw the notification for this topic.

Actually, even if you have the most expensive Teflon pans, for instance I'd paid nearly $70 each for mine back when I was a Realtor, the fact is that when they heat up to a certain temperature, as for instance that to sautee garlic... they give off fumes, and the fumes make you/me feel like we have the flu.

I mentioned this to my therapist back when I first found out about my brain damage, and she said she'd lost dozens of love birds from Teflon heating up like that. Just once... after that she got rid of her pans.

I saw an investigative piece on it on telly, and then I googled it, this is several years ago, now.

Teflon is not good for our health.

*****

Melody, I'm so sorry to read about your friend.

Did you ever see the quite good program Oprah did on anorexia? There was a clinic someplace, I forget where, that focused on giving people a lot of love and positive reinforcement. Just a huge amount of warmth and love, and they had a tremendously good result. But I think it was pretty expensive because it was intensive people to people care.

Thanks guys. I'm going to buy some new pans today. I don't need any other issues. I feel I'm becoming narotic though on all my worries but better safe then sorry.
Melody, I'm sorry for your friend and I remember. I thank you for your praise. It has been the hardest thing of my life but I hope to write a book of my 12 year battle. When someone has a severe ed it effects there brain. You see how destructive you are rationally but the fear of changing is so scary. Its like your addicted to self destruction. Really to recover you have to be willing to do what ever it takes and sit with the anxiety and fear. The longer it goes on the harder it is to get through because you loose more through the ed and it become a lifestlye almost. I know many of my past docs thought I would never recover but a year and half ago I began to use the tools I learned and realised I had to get physically healthy to have a chance at a life. Don't give up on your friend but really there is only so much others can do. I had the best of care, my parents sent me to prgrams that costed 1500 a day and I always fell back. Not until two years ago almost did I commit and use the tools I learned. Its a daily battle to make the right choices but I do it cause I know being physically healthy and nurished is the start to a better life. Its not about food or weight but the reasons so when people say why don't you eat to her it doesn't help. She has to work on the reasons behind the ed and face them but being nursihed is a must. The best for others to do is encourage her to get support in therapy and nutritionist. You can tell her about me and my long history and how I lost everything but before the pn I was rebuilding my life with school,friend,job but I had to gain and reach a healthy weight to get to that. Its a hard adjustment getting used to a new body,lifestyle,and coping mechanism but its the only chance for better.She can email me too. You may think she won't but if you give her the address she just may. You would be suprised deep down I'm sure she wants to recover.
Todays goal to buy pans and figure out my move issue because now it may be CA where I was planning on moving after my treatment cause I knew a few people and like the area but will see. Just wish my mom would be closer for support. I'm not big on change which was an issue before and the pn has forced me to have to which is hard. Not only with the move but other issues.

Hi daniella,

(((((((((daniella)))))))))))

Boy, your message is quite inspiring. Thank you for writing that.

I don't know what "ed" is, though. What is that?

I feel as if you are talking to me because it's so hard for me to keep doing this court stuff. It all seems hopeless and like a stressful, traumatic waste of my time.

Yet, like you, I know that there are things that if I do them will make an improvement. Only it doesn't seem like it. It feels almost the opposite.

So your post really helped me... I'm almost finished correcting my appeal brief, and NT people have helped me SOOOO much.

You included. Thank you!

((((((((((daniella))))))))))

Oh, after I turned out the lights last night I realized that I'd written that about Teflon a bit wrong...

I'm not sure it's "fumes" as much as it is that something in the Teflon vaporizes at certain temperatures... and you can't really smell it if you're sauteeing garlic or onions. But it causes a flu feeling.

The problem I had was that because of my disability and memory problems, I'd almost always let the garlic get just a tad too hot... I'd try to remember but I'd forget. And then the garlic would get just a little burned and that's when the vaporizing happens I think... I think that's the temperature where the Teflon vaporizes out the stuff that is bad for us.

So I'm REALLY glad you're going to get some different pans. :)

Happiness!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am throwing out all my teflon pans today!!!
 

And buying new (not teflon) pans. So thanks much for that tip.

Daniella:

No one can help my friend. Not at this stage of the game. She has Stage 4 lung cancer now, spreak to everyplace. All they can do is give her drugs and more drugs. She now has an attendant 24 hours (which she hates) but she refused to go into a hospital because she knew they would put a feeding tube in her. I asked her mother "isn't she bad enough, that they can do this for her own good??" and the mother said "you won't believe this but no, they can't, she is able to say no to everything, and she has refused all therapy, all EVERYTHING.

I was there the day the nutritionist came to her house. She paid this person $70.00. I have no why she did this because I knew she wouldn't do a single thing the nutritionist said that she should do and this was 18 months ago. Because she did not do what she was supposed to do (follow the menu prescribed), she did not feed her body and you can't do chemo, and fight cancer, if you don't get nutrition, right?

No one can speak to her. Like I said, since she's 19. In and out of eating disorder clinics. It's a mental illness. I know this. She became bulimic and had to have a stomach operation. She then took laxatives. Her goal is never to go above 100 lbs. I remember the day she told all of us her diagnosis. She has been just diagnosed with Stage 3, and we all went to her house and we did the motivational thing and we (gently) explained that she had to start eating a bit more. Not that she had to balloon up or anything, but just that she had to start drinking ensure and eating greens, and protein, you know common sense stuff.

She would go "oh, absolutely, I completely agree, I do eat". Then we all found out she never ate a thing. People would bring her cooked foods, chicken soup, broth, simple things. She would take two sips and that was it.
Her mental illness and depression (forgive me for calling this a mental illness, but I did watch a special on the discovery channel and that's how they referred to it). Well, in her mind, nothing clicked. She didn't relate to fighting the cancer but eating properly. She would not allow herself to pick up a morsel of food.

So her mother visits her but won't let her move into her apartment, her children completely gave up on her. Her daughter caused a scene in the hospital room when she went in for the removal of the tumor on her aorta. Her daughter started to scream at her in front of everybody. "do you know you're gonna die??? and you refuse to eat???" Well, the brother had to carry the sister out bodily.

The grandmother (my friend's mother), won't talk to her own grandaughter. There is depression that runs down the line in this family. Everyone is on anti-depressants. There's a relationship between anorexia and depression, right?? The same way with compulsive overeating (like I used to be). I self-medicated with food. That's how I used to cope with stress.

I had to learn (or shall I say un-learn bad eating habits). and replace these bad habits with good eating habits. Have you seen the new abc series "Fat March???" They have a bunch of people way over 400 lbs and they are just walking off the fat , walking 500 miles. And by the end of the show, they just might succeed. But their food choices were absolutely fascinating.

They had already marched 150 miles and most lost up to 40 lbs. So they were at the end of the day and there were two tables of food. One table had grilled chicken, grilled salmon and salad. The other table had fried chicken, pizza, etc. Well, you would not believe it but some of the obese people (who had lost 40 lbs or better), actually went up and got the pizza and fried chicken. They said "I want to eat". They walked 8 hours that day, and could have eaten a very nice grilled salmon or chicken but they made a different choice. One 430 lb guy took one look at the salad and said "that's nasty, it has oranges and almonds in it". The nutritionist said "so take out the almonds and oranges and just eat the salad". The guy was determined to eat his pizza.

I find this thinking absolutely fascinating because I once thought like that. I could put away 4 slices of pizza in 5 minutes. It's all a habit and I had to learn the hard way to change my thinking process.

And, you generously offered to email my friend. I thank you so much for that.

She has two computers in her house and never learned to use either one of them. I tried to put her on my computer and do a video for her grandchildren so they could always have a video of her. We made the video but she would not send it. I once printed out a list of support groups for people with her condition. I told her "maybe if you hang around with others who fight the same problem (like I go to gam-anon groups), then maybe you might find an answer??" She would not go.

Anorexia has disturbed her mind as well. It's not going to change in her case because she is so sick. I plan on visiting her this week but I'm sure she will sleep through the whole visit because of all the medication she is on. I do speak to her nurses and to her mother. This is very hard for her because she has to deal with the obnoxious grandaughter.

I don't want to even think what is going to take place when she passes on because her daughter will go absolutely nuts in the funeral parlor. Oh brother.

But we do each day as best we can.

Daniella, you have accomplished great things. I am very proud of you.

Hi Melody and daniella -

I just read Melody's post and it reminded me that when I was in the ER with the seizures from tetanus, there was a young girl in the cloth cubicle next to mine who had tried to kill herself.

And from what I could hear she didn't eat and had an eating disorder.

The blood tech was having a hard time drawing blood from me, so we talked, and I was telling him how B12 helps in depression.

He said, yes, and of his friends who took B12, there were those who began to eat more.

I understand that your friend is dying. I think that is the desired result of many eating disorders... Sadly.

Daniella, I think you are incredibly brave. My daughter has been treated for an eating disorder. She learned so much during her therapy and has really done well, but I know it is a daily stuggle for her. I am proud of you both.

Dakota -- it was nice to read your message... hopeful feeling from it.

I was looking to see if daniella had found some pans she liked...

I was wondering how her day was...

hugs to you both!

:)

Considerthis sorry "ed" is short for eating disorder. Both of you I thank you for your praise. Considerthis I'm sorry about your stresses and know how hard it is to make life changes but they won't do them by themself. In my recovery I kept saying for things to change I have to do things in a different way. I will feel more anxious,stressed,but in the long run makes life better. Try to take 1 day at a time. Lists,goals and schedules help me.Also positive self talk even if you don't believe it now otherwise you set yourself up for failure. For me it was so hard to see things different but reminding myself they can be but setting goals.
Dakota thank you and I'm happy your daughter has gotten well too. Its suprising and sad how many people do share this issue.Its tue you do learn so much about yourself its like becoming a different person.
Melody first I know you battled weight issues and you deserve praise too.Whether you overeat to an extreme I mean or under its for the same types of issues and not wanting to cope with something. It can be also a slow suicide. I was inpatient with compulsive eaters,anorexics,and builmics and we all had a common bond of self destruction. I know for me therapy and support helped but I had to do the work. Your friend has to eat and her goal has to be a healthy weight. Its a hard transition but I had to think of food as my med for life. Its true there is little as she is an adult others can do to force her. I do know when inpatient an adult had her rights taken away but that takes awhile. I know before I got well the docs thought I would die or couldn't recover but I did so don't give up hope. Like I said though its going to be hard and scary but she can do it. Depression and anorexia are very connected. I often say I used to show how I felt in the inside on the out. I will say though that when I really began fueling and getting healthy for a brief time my depression was worse because I was looking at my life that had fallen apart,dealing with feelings after being numb through the anorexia for awhile,changing inside and out but in the long run the depression does get better. I think a helpful book for families and friends is surviving an eating disorder for families and friends of suffers. They suggested that for families when I was in treatment, For your friend Divorcing Ed and the something fishy website. I also mean it I'm here anytime.
Now I'm off to obsess about my move issue. I really have no idea and feel so caught. Like I said now it may be CA. I have to really weigh if the cold is going to just kill me and that would make it a must to move or is there a way I would adjust. Those 0 degree temps in the winter are brutal.

Hi daniella,

(((((((((daniella))))))))

OH... eating disorder. I'm soooo dense!

(ed)

You sound very good. Did you have a good day?


Oh... I know about doing the work. I sure am not wanting to do this appeal thing or other court stuff. I'm exhausted with it.

But I can't give up.


You are soooo right about doing positive self talk.
When I get scared I don't do it at all and I get myself more and more scared.

I used to read Creative Visualization by Shakti Gwaine... not sure I have the spelling even remotely right... and it was soooo great.

but then I got so familiar with it that I wasn't paying attention in the same way anymore.

Last year I did my Angel of Divine Love in the cool corner of my garden under my ponderosa pine... but then the neighbor cut down a part of the "roof" of tree boughs and vines and all of a sudden the road noise came in, so I haven't been sitting there and raising my mind to the Angel of Divine Love like I did last year.

(((((((((daniella)))))))


so where do you most want to move?

Have you been checking places out on the internet????

Loosing my mind
 

I'm so conflicted and I know I'm beating a dead horse with you guys. I need to make my decidsion on the move. Now for example today is rainy and colder and my pain is so much worse. If I stay here in MI I will be confined more to the house and even going out for a short time will make me feel worse. So moving sounds right BUT. If I need treatment or want to do a procedure at the pain clinic that will be hard though I know my mom will come. I was suppose to go to u fof m but could go to ucla clinic or Fl clinic I guess.Or maybe if I move to Fl though my gramps is ? at least if I need a procedure he could drive me. Right now though in pain I'm not willing to do more procedures because I have seen progress and fear going back. If I stay like this though I will have to try so that is why I may want to do something later. Then the issue of my mom and being alone that is going to be hard mentally and she is so wonderful. It could just be for 6 months of the cold,rain,snow and then could come back. I can't decide because I know the cold makes it worse but fear leaving and dealing with this on my own. I feel trapped. I'm 29 and can't make a choice. This sucks and its rainy today and cold and I hurt so much. Please any advice. I'm loosing my mind.

Daniella
 

If the cold is causing you that much pain...then you need to go. Go live close to your Grandpa. Even tho you don't get along with him well, I'm sure he would take you to the hospital or for medical treatment. Good luck Sweetheart. Take care of you.

Billye

Hi Daniella,

(((((((((((((daniella))))))))))))))

When I moved from Wisconsin I'd been living in Green Bay and it had been 30 degrees below zero for three weeks. I went to the Ice Bowl Packers' game and you couldn't even see the people in the stadium across from you because of all the breath rising.

Even at that it was stressful leaving. And I was healthy. At that time I couldn't imagine not being healthy, though as I child I was very sick a lot of the time.

For me, moving has always been good.

Moving to England was good, then I wanted to move back here soooo much but couldn't figure out how since I had my small son and my mother had said never to return to Wisconsin since I had not married.

Finally one night I had a dream in which I swam back.

Since I have a fear of water, well, I knew I was going to get back to the U.S.

But now I'm so fed up with this country... the abysmal and continual lies ... it's just so disappointing.

I find it inconceivable now that I was going to kill myself in 1997 rather than leave this country because I thought it was the best in the world...

So things change.

I think your health will improve if you aren't so worried.

Is your grandfather in a part of Florida that tends to get the hurricanes? or not. That could be stressful...

I wish you felt better so you could look forward to your move as an exciting step, rather than a step to avoid some of the pain.

I have a quote on my weight loss page that goes, "It's so hard when I have to, so easy when I want to."

(((((((((((daniella))))))))))))

Do you have something you can do today that is fun?

:)

I don't know what you all think about this, but what about starting with the pain program at the U of Mich and then after you begin to get some relief, making your decision on where to move then? Perhaps this might also help in keeping down some of the stress in moving, since the pain might improve... Or maybe you would not even have to leave if they could get your pain under control...

About the pans... My friend lost 3 large Macaws due to the fumes of Teflon pans, because the respiratory sacs in birds are highly sensitive. Strange they don't seem to offer and warnings about breathing these fumes to humans...

Cathie

Hi Cathy,

How are YOU?

You sound good...
I hope that reflects how you feel!!!!!!!

(I think you just had surgery... but I'm not good at remembering things... if I don't think about something every day, it fades...)

Yes, the Teflon pans are a bit shocking once you hear some of the stories.

Your poor friend, she must have been just devastated!

(((((((((Cathy)))))))))))

Hugs and thank you to all. Let me tell you whether a fluke or part due to the weather it has been the 24 hours from you know what. My pain is like before I went to the clinic as in crying pain. It has been rainy and colder for yesterday and today and the outlook is rain for a few days. I can't imagine though it could cause this much more pain. Not only is my inner ankle kill but the leg bones in both ache if that makes sense and the foot is cold. The pain clinic issue is a hard one. Now I have an apt here on the 29th but I go back and forth on what I'm willing to do but can't live like this. Now I'm hoping for a miracle but realistic is my pain going to be that much better to tolerate cold,snow,and rain which is what MI is after Sept. So if I move to CA which I feel I would like the best from fl and found a place I could do monthly rather then FL. Yes my gramps but I feel it may add mentally. I give you ex three years ago I wanted to kill myself so I called him crying as no one else was home. We started chatting and I was crying he said he had to go to Home Depot and would call me back. When he did it was 3 weeks later. I love him but he makes me feel so lonely. If I move I wonder if it would be better to get a referral to the pain clinic at that place then stop and start with more new docs after so many. Any thoughts? I hate stopping and starting and everyone on a different page. I'm going to call the anastesolgist I saw in Oh to see of a referal. I guess my fear and confusion is the option they gave me in OH was the catheter and I'm scared. If you guys remember before when I was starting new meds and the tests I thought I was dying from weird dizzy,pain,so on and no one did anything for me. I even told one doc I thought I was and he just looked at me. One gave me nasal spray. If I move it will be just for the thought of 6 months to get through the cold,rain,snow and my mom would visit in between. Ca I did treatment at so I do know a few people and can go to support groups. Just was hoping if I did the pc here and was better I could stay but in reality I don't think I will be able to cope with this cold. Before this whether it be because of the pn starting I can remember my feet going numb and the aches. This is just too much for me. I give you guys so much credit. The pain and making choices is so hard especially with nicken poop docs. I feel I would rather go to some of you guys for treatment help then a neuro who spent years in school. You guys are the best mental support that is for sure. Thanks and hugs to everyone.
P.S. Don't I sound like I have a mixed personality? I go back and forth with staying here,moving to FL,or to CA,pain management options. Ugh!