Levaquin
 

I have taken Levaquin in the past for bladder infections. I saw where this was posted on their site.

"Rare cases of peripheral neuropathy have been reported in patients receiving quinolones, including levofloxacin. Discontinue if symptoms of neuropathy occur to prevent the development of an irreversible condition."

Does anyone think that levaquin, or this group of antibiotics, caused their PN?

Honest anything is possible,but I would suspect you would be taking
a lot. In the wonderful world of meds. it could work either way. If it
worries you telll your Dr. you know longer want it. There are other things
that they could give you. A lot of us and can not take cholestrol
meds. I don't know what tests you have had. But I looked for everything
I could to find out why..I don't think a lot of Neiro's know why,our
I think there would be more answers..Please list the things and meds.
that bother you and speak up. This is a slow time because of the
holidays..Things will pick up soon then look out,it's a busy forum. hugs Sue

Elsie, Levaquin most definitely can cause peripheral neuropathy. I had a very serious adverse reaction to Levaquin in 2006 and had horrible nerve pain in my entire body. None of the doctors would believe that Levaquin was to blame. It begain approximately 4 days after starting the Levaquin. I had symptoms for 6 MONTHS FROM THIS ADVERSE REACTION AND STILL HAVE SOME OF THE SYMPTOMS OVER 1 YEAR LATER. IT DEFINITELY CAUSED SOME SORT OF IRREVERSABLE CONDITION having to do with my nervous system but have tried without success to find out what the drug manufacturer is referring to in the prescribing instructions where it says "could lead to irreversable condition." Now have such severe thoracic outlet syndrome and blood clot in my left chest/shoulder area. The thoracic outlet syndrome symptoms got much worse when Levaquin reaction happened (nerve pain in arms and hands so severe could not sleep, etc.). I don't think I will ever get anywhere with the Levaquin reaction and getting answers. There are literally thousands of people who have had similar reactions. Just do a search online and you will see! Also, your doctor should tell you to NEVER take another quinilone antibiotic again since you could have same reaction to other similar drugs. I will not take one unless I am on my death bed and this is the only type of antibiotic that will save me!

Levaquin:
 

This is a link to a website that publishes the Medwatch reports on drug
reactions. It demonstrates clearly the neuropathic potential of Levaquin and
also tendon ruptures. (I suspect tendon issues as well, even if they don't reach the rupture stage)

http://patientsville.com/medication/...de_effects.htm

The family of fluoroquinolones has been very rocky medically. Originally, they were supposed to be not FIRST line drugs...but to be used when others fail.
But doctors were encouraged to use them by the drug reps (who represented the drug companies eager for more $$). There have been 4 of them removed from the market by the FDA for serious toxicity issues.
Statistically that is a lot. Only NSAIDs have similar FDA recall situations.
Over the years I've looked for reasons for the toxicity and details always ellude me.

Here is an article from 2001:
PNS= peripheral nervous system

Have you visited here?
http://www.geocities.com/quinolones/

http://www.fqresearch.org/

There have been people who visited here from time to time about this subject.
It seems the medical community is rather deaf to the reactions to these drugs.
If I could find some link as the mechanisms causing these reactions, there might be a way to heal them. But so far I haven't found good info on them.

The only thing I can suggest is Thiamine and B12 to help the nerves restore themselves. And the tendon issue is just as alarming.

I don't plan on ever taking one again. My neurologist never ask me if I had taken any of the fluoroquinolones. I just happen to stumble across it on my own. I will bring it up at my next app. in about 4 weeks.
Another question about a drug. I know drugs like neurontin are used to treat nerve damage but I noticed anticonvulsants are also listed as drugs that can cause it. I have taken neurontin for almost 10 yrs. for a bladder condition called interstitial cystitis. I did ask my neurologist about this and she said absolutely not, that neurontin does not cause nerve damage. However, when I first started taking neurontin, my feet began tingling.
Here is a study I found:
Abstract The risk that antiepileptic drugs may cause damage to the peripheral nervous system led us to investigate 12 patients on carbamazepine and 12 patients on phenobarbital with the thermal threshold test. The heat and cold thresholds were measured at the ankle and wrist and, compared with those in 30 healthy subjects, they proved to be significantly higher. When the two groups of epileptics were compared separately with the controls, their thresholds were always higher. These findings are consistent with a toxic effect of both drugs on fine peripheral nerve fibers

toxicity...
 

Back when I was young... carbamazepine (Tegretol) was only used for
seizure control, and Trigeminal neuralgia. It was toxic then and remains so.
It can cause agranulocytosis, and also hyponatremia. The latter is a reduction
in sodium levels and sodium is involved with nerve transmission.

The use of antiseizure meds in neuropathy does not cure anything or heal anything. It just reduces activity in the nerves. If it is too high a dose for you, it will rear its hyponatremia head and become a problem.

Our medical community uses alot of drugs that actually cause what they are supposed to treat. This has always remained an enigma to me.

Antibiotics can cure one infection, and give you another (this is called noscomial).

Some Chemo drugs may put you into remission for YOUR cancer, and down the road cause leukemia.

Amitriptyline can help with peripheral and chronic pain, but it is listed as a causative agent in axonal damage.

Diuretics can lower blood pressure, but the constant loss of potassium and magnesium leads to elevated blood pressures in the end. A vicious circle.

SSRI antidepressants (eg. Prozac) over time cause the brain to downregulate dopamine to help balance the brain. And then we give other antidepressants to upregulate the downed dopamine-- Wellbutrin is an example of this.

Amphetamines are used to treat ADD, but with time they can cause reactive depression which makes ADD worse.

Many of the new antipsychotics actually can cause mania and rage, which are sometimes symptoms of psychosis.

Tourette's patients are given antipsychotics for tics which cause a tic behavior called tardive dyskinesia.

Chronic use of phenobarbital for seizures actually lowers the seizure threshold. So it is slowly being phased out of treatment for children. Previously infants and children with febrile seizures were chronically maintained on phenobarb, only to discover
in adulthood when trying to wean off that their seizure threshold was permanently lowered and they became REAL
epileptics as a result! (febrile seizures are benign and not treated commonly today as a result of this tragedy).

So you see, medicine is a bit mixed up, some of the time.(or alot of the time depending on your point of view).

We know some things about nerves. But many of the biochemical actions in nerves and the growth factors and repair molecules remain elusive.
Until more research brings that understanding we are left with crude attempts to change things. It is important to realize that drugs do not heal nerve problems, they just mask them. I am hopeful that the nutrient approach to nerve function, will continue to REPAIR them.
Omega-3 fatty acids
Thiamine
B6
Folic acid
B12
CoQ-10
Carnitine

These all show improvements to nerve function. They do not hide symptoms.

Mrd D,
Where does one find carnitine(L-carnitine?)?
In what form?
What products/foods?
What dosages seem to be of help with PN sufferers?
(Inquiring minds want to know!)

Bob,
 

in ideal circumstances, carnitine is made in the body...but that is subject to
failure.

Drugs...Depakote mostly and most HIV drugs seriously impair carnitine synthesis in the body. The HIV community has used carnitine for over a decade for
their drug induced neuropathies.

I buy mine at iherb...the NOW brand. It tends to be expensive. But it is worth a try...since it does not do harm unless you get to over 15 grams or so, and then diarrhea might develop.

I used it alot when I was working out alot...it helps with muscle fatigue and pain also. But now I am truly a slug... since my leg injury...and planning on getting back to my old workout routines, soon.

I read a website devoted to mitochondrial disorders years ago. And on it was this theory:
That while it takes 2 copies of a gene from both parents to manifest as serious in childhood, that one copy ~~the recessive may be responsible for disorders in later adulthood. Since the mitochondria run our cells providing energy..we are dependent on them for everything we do. Muscles, nerves, everything. Carnitine and CoQ-10 are carriers for fatty acids into the mitochondria to substitute for glucose, to maintain energy.

You can get a blood test for it. I believe someone here has done that.
Or you can try it and see if you respond. We had a long discussion on our old board about it...which was really great. But of course it is lost with all the other good stuff in that crash. I don't believe we will see one word from all those archives! (but that is another issue).

You need alot of carnitine and it is not cheap. I got away with 1 gram for a long time. But some need 2 grams or more depending. Since I use SAMe and that is pretty expensive, I tend to not use other really expensive things unless there is dramatic payoff for me. My PN is pretty stable now, does not progress and even the burning improved from this summer. (it was getting terrible, the burning on vacation! Whew).

If you try the l-carnitine buy a very good brand like NOW. They are quality and affordable. Online is much less $$ than in stores.

This is the one I use when I use it:
http://www.iherb.com/ProductDetails....1&pid=316&at=0
The acetyl form is better absorbed, so you may get by with lower doses.
It also provides the acetyl group which is used to make acetylcholine in the brain. I used to use the plain l-carnitine, but switched the the acetyl later.
It worked as well. If you choose large doses, space them, as there is a ceiling for absorption for each dose.

My doctor has diagnosed me with Antibiotic related Neuropathy. Yes, it was the same antibiotic you are taking. My neuropathy has become irreversible. I do not have diabetes so at first it was ideopathic. I had two internal meds and tw Neurologist confirm my conditon from UCLA.

Hope that helps,

Steve

For the last 6 years i have gotten many respiratory infections, often spaced shortly apart, which is what i am going through right now actually. IM allergic to any cillins so I have been mainly taking biaxin which is very effective for me. In 2002, i was given levaquin at times to switch off from biaxin. It has never been as effective for me as biaxin or zithromax. I know levaquin did not cause my pn since i already had it at that point though i did not know what it was yet. I have never noticed an exacerbation of PN symptoms on levaquin. The pain increases anyway when i get a respiratory infection but got no worse after levaquin use. Then in 2004 in the midst of a cluster of respiratory infections i was prescribed avalox, which is also a quinolone. I had a very bad reaction to avelox, my PN pain went off the charts, it made me nauseous and i was totally out of it. I was hospitalized at that time because of the severity and longevity of infection, wheezing, coughing, etc. and when i went off avelox in the hosptial, the pain returned to its normal level. Since then i have taken levaquin a few times and it has been ineffective but again did not cause additional pain. I have also taken cipro a few times and had no adverse reaction. At this point i wont take any quinolone antibiotics. The point of all this is that i am sure that a particular quinolone can have an effect on peripheral nerves depending on the person.

Steve how did they come to the conclusion that your PN was caused by Levaquin? I have experienced the opposite from doctors, they deny , fudge, or wont make the most obvious cause and effect relationships, even when they see the same thing over and over.

Thanks, Steve for that interesting information. I am also curious in knowing how the neurologist concluded it was from the levaquin. Is there a way to tell for sure, or is he just assuming?

Cipro is the least obnoxious
 

of the quinolones. It is not a once a day treatment either.

Levaquin and Avelox are once a day tablets. All of the ones recalled were
also once a day. In general with the exception of Zithromax, once a day
antibiotics tend to be more toxic. There was a once a day sulfonamide called Kynex by Lederle that was taken off the market many years ago.

Cipro still does cause the tendon ruptures however. And those typically happen after the drug is stopped, and months pass. Whatever it is doing takes time
to damage and for a while the ruptures were not connected to Cipro. But when a few doctors had that happen to themselves, it was finally admitted to.
It can happen 6mos after the treatment.

I have really tried to find out how this happens, but I have never seen the mechanism printed out anywhere. I suspect the PN damage is similar, not understood yet.
The fluoroquinolones are very active in the nervous system, so they are doing something there. Floxin was causing seizures for some patients. And the elderly are not recommended to use high doses of any quinolone for this reason.

I read somewhere the other day that all drugs starting with 'fl'; are either fluoride based or have a significant amount of fluoride in them. I haven't clarified this yet. Can anyone confirm or deny?

Also some theories abound that fluoride may be responsible for the underpinnings of conditions such as CFS/Fibromyalgia. Again I haven't pursued research on this - however I believe empirical evidence must be scarce on the ground - as it is still mandated for usage? :eek:

yes, fluoro--
 

means a fluoride is there.

Prozac is fluroxitine... and there are several articles on the net about
brain toxicity from fluoride and Prozac.

example:
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/...uorophenyl.htm

Since I last looked, there have been many articles added about fluoride affecting thyroid hormone levels. :yikes:

"Cipro still does cause the tendon ruptures however. And those typically happen after the drug is stopped, and months pass. Whatever it is doing takes time
to damage and for a while the ruptures were not connected to Cipro. But when a few doctors had that happen to themselves, it was finally admitted to.
It can happen 6mos after..."


Hmmm... Maybe if we had doctors acting as controls in drug testing, we would have a few less toxic medications and ultimately dangerous medical devices rushed to the market... I can think of a few I would like to nominate... :)

Cathie

I wonder if the FL drug referred to on a post is Flagyl (metronidazole). Flagyl is known to cause PN. It was also widely used in the treatment of Lyme. I don't know if it still is. I knew some folks who took huge doses of it.

I think with any drug it is dependent on your own individual blueprint for metabolism and also is dose dependent.

I can understand PN being irreversible, but I wonder if it is progressive from toxins once they are stopped. I imagine a case can be made that it remains static after discontinuation, or that is can be progressive.

It makes you think twice about treating Lyme with long term antibiotics. It is a catch 22.

I got sick on Cipro once and discontinued it after a few days. It made me goofy and ill. (Bad combo for me.)

I did take amitriptyline and found it the most disagreeable substance I ever took. Interesting IT is linked to PN.

I am beginning to wonder it the only thing one should stick in one's mouth is their thumb....or their foot. Both seem better natural alternatives.

Question for Mrsd
 

Relating to Levaquin.

Finished my first round of antibiotics for my brinchitis.
While we were away it kind of came back but more as a sinus/ear infection.

Doc put me on Levaquin. 5 days.

I am on day 4 and this morning I have tingling and pn like syptoms in right habd.

I have only one day more to take this. Should i call the doc?

I can't say...
 

Best to call the doctor. His advice depends on how informed he is, however.

Zithromax is a better choice. Also for sinus and ear, Cefzil works well.

Sometimes ear pain is just pressure and noninfected fluid. So an antibiotic
doesn't help that. Carefully inflating the eustachian tubes may help reduce fluid pressure. Drink alot of water and use guaifenesin in Robitussin or Mucinex may help get the congestion down.

To inflate the tubes, close off your nostrils and gently blow to pop your ears.
Do not do it hard, or if you feel pain.

biaxin works well for me with respitatory infections as well as zithromax, i would call the doctor.

I called the doc and they told me to stop the levaquin.

I have twice asked about the zithromax but PD did not prescribe.

Tomorrow morning I am going to the ENT doc. See what he says.

Ears still stuck

Thanks for advice.

Today's news:......
 

FDA Sued Over Antibiotics Warnings
Consumer Group Sues Federal Drug Administration Over Cipro, Levaquin Warnings

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...aca1e1bf89.htm