Resigned to living in pain for the rest of my life....
 

I know this is a board for MS, but you are all my friends and I know some of you suffer from back pain too. I'm so sick of being in pain I could puke. I won't write a book about it all once again, but I need some advise if there is anyone who has had a DISCOGRAM or Surgery.

My current doctor is not real agressive. He is a good pain manager however, which keeps me 'in line'. He seems to have no other plans for me. This to me means I must suffer the rest of my life in pain. I don't want to. Just makes you want to check out sometimes.

I'm now on Vicodin, Zanaflex, Celebrex and Lidocaine patches. It is one spot that causes me the most pain (L-4) and I just want it fixed. Thats all. Is it too much to ask for?

I vaccumed today...and it requires extra pills and rest. I want to go outside and work on my flower bed and rake the yard. I could, but I'll be in so much pain later that I'll be in tears. It's also ruining my sex life. I'm always so tired, drugged or in pain that I'm not in a good mood, I don't feel pretty, I feel angry and many other things.

I know it may be too much to hope for, but maybe someone here has some words that would make me feel better or recommend a new step I've not tried yet.

I did get a second opinion and he said my current doc is doing all the right things (though not agressive in his opinion). He said he would do a different kind of injection in two of my discs and then do a Discogram. I think this may be a procedure that is done prior to surgery and metal being put in my back. I'm scared. If I go with this new doctor, the old doctor will drop me and I won't get any more pain meds as the new doctor is not a pain manager and refuses to give medications (????!!!!)

So I go with the new guy and suffer until he fixes me, IF EVER, or stay with the old doctor and my medications that at least help to some degree.

My pain manager doc told me to get off my butt and exercise (I'm only 160 lbs) but could use some exercise, so I ordered some exercise videos that I'm going to start.....but I KNOW it won't fix me. I know because I tried it before. In fact I'm afraid I'll hurt myself more...after watching them, lots of twisting, leaning forword, punching, etc....

I've had a steroid shot, 7 weeks of PT, meds....if the pain was going to leave on it's own, it would have done so by now. 4 years is a long time for something to heal........

Okay, there I did it...a book anyway. I'm probably talking to myself more than anything.....I know you all don't mind if I vent....

Have you fully researched these procedures, GJ? That is what I would do first, and make a decision on your options. If you decide to do the procedure(s), then switch to the new guy.

I know how difficult back problems can be, but fortunately I have only suffered for periods of time (not years!) when things are really rough. Four years is too long to keep going living like this, I think. :hug:

Cherie

Have you checked out the Chronic Pain forum, GJ? There is a sticky at the top of the forum with Useful Links and information. Just a thought....

http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/forum10.html

:hug:GJ:hug: I'm so sorry you're having such a hard time with your back pain. I know that constant pain just wears you down and tires you out....I wish there was something I could say or do to make things better for you. The only advice I have to offer is to just keep on looking and researching and maybe you'll find the right doctor, clinic or treatment that will work for you. :hug:

"People just can't see what you feel."

You can say that again. :rolleyes:

Your comments are rather intolerant . . . since none of us can help how we are. That would be like me saying “don’t you just want to slap those wimps who cry over a broken bone or something insignificant like that?”.

There are definitely major disadvantages in being over-tolerant to pain as well.

For people who do not feel pain the same way as most, we can be nearly dead before we even realize there is something wrong. For instance, I was feeling brain-incoherent for several weeks as a teenager, which my doc blamed on stress. When I got to the point that I couldn’t hold a beat dancing (I was a competitive dancer) and I didn’t know whether “green” meant “stop” or “go” while driving, I steered the car directly to the hospital.

Turned out I had broken my nose at some point (didn’t feel it) and I had a sinus infection causing severe pressure on my brain . . . which is a very dangerous situation. The first thing they said was “don’t you feel any pain??”, which I did not. Within 30 min of giving me pain relief though, the confusion went away.

In fact, I have had several serious situations/complications because I don’t feel pain the same as others....

Trust me, we all become “wimps” when things get too rough for us . . . no matter what our tolerance level. It’s not as if people with a high tolerance don’t feel pain at all, it just gets or almost gets out of control by the time they do. When this happens, it takes twice as many meds, for twice as long, in order to get it under control again.

Like when we have surgery, and the nurses keep us pain killers every 4 hrs (and we don’t think we need them). The reason they do this is it is much easier to keep pain in control, than try to deal with pain that is out of control. People with a high tolerance (or messed up communication channels in this regard), often don’t hear those messages until things are really bad. The recovery can be much, much worse too.

So, I hope you have a little more understanding the next time someone “brags” that they have a high tolerance.

Cherie

I have posted there in the past and there are not many members. I hate posting and getting no responses....but I'll check the links of info...I think I missed that. Thanks

Thanks Cherie. I've done alot of research, but until today it didn't click about the discogram. I've spent the past few hours reading about it and I think I really need to do this. Apparently, this test is painful but will identify my pain so the doctor can SEE it and then will know what to do. This was offered by the second guy...but I went to my first guys web page and they have the procedure available. I'm going to call him and ask for it...point blank. I guess tears in the disc are not always seen on the MRI and the only way to see it is with the Discogram. I think if doc number one says no, I'll go to doc number two and I'll just have to give up the meds. HE BETTER FIX IT if thats the case :D

Thanks Brain,
You are so right. What happens is I go in to see doctors and everything I was thinking goes out the window, I freeze and sit there and smile and nod my head. Since back pain is not something that can be seen I have a hard time convincing doctors. It's really a shame. I've been doing alot of research today and think I'm prepared to go in and (nicely) demand that we move to the next level. I have 100% coverage on insurance now so I want to use it up before I get laid off in October. Worse case scenario I get surgery in October too after I get laid off but before the insurance gets cut off.

Thats my plan and I'm sticking to it :D LOL!!

I feel for you GJ. :hug: Cherie is quite right when she said.......


Severe pain is extremely difficult and sometimes impossible to treat. Regular pain relief "whether you need it or not" is the only way to prevent those highs and troughs in pain management. If pain is left to get to a stage where it's almost unbearable, it can take hours and double or more the analgesia to ease it. If this makes sense at all, you may understand why it's important to keep popping those pills, even though you might hate them

I'm sure you must be scared stiff about the prospect of surgery, especially with everything else happening medically wise recently. I have to agree that researching your options is very important at this stage, as you need to make a truely informed decision about this.

If you haven't already done so, you could possibly ask questions in the spinal forum. Maybe some-one over there has been through what you're considering. Just a thought.

Please let us know how it's going GJ, and I do hope you get some relief soon.

Give me your hand.

If you are alive, you are in some form of pain. Could be you stubbed your toe or you're still nursing a broken heart.
That is not a valid reason to stop living.

I need you to fight back Jeanie. Giving up let's it win. IT is any obstacle in our way at any moment.

You have not exhausted all your options yet.
And there are always options.

Find a doc willing to listen. Go "Doc shopping", if you will. There are many positive things out there to ease suffering. I turned to liquor after the MS diagnosis.

I busted my L-4 too.
And my hip.
And my pelvis.
And shattered my ankle.
And my tibia and fibia.
Broke four of my ribs.
Had a concussion.
Coma for 6 days.

And until I lose 50 pounds... I can't get my hip fixed. (Never healed right. Ossification and now avascular necrosis. Laymans terms: Body produced too much bone at the break. Now that bone is dead and dying).
The irony of losing the weight? If my hip was OK, I wouldn't weigh this much.

All this happened in a car wreck 3 weeks after my wife left me. (Good riddance, bee-yotch!)

Please understand beautiful. I'm not trying to compare scars here or even dumb it down with "everybody hurts", or downplay what you are saying. I only tell you my story so you know I'm not blowing smoke up your [pick an orrifice];).

FIGHT BACK.

Get mad.:mad: Get mad enough to say, "I am not going to live this way". And then realize you must take action against your oppressor. In this case, pain.

You are not alone.:)
You are one of us.:hug:
And we are here to help.:grouphug:

My parents and I all have back pain of differing severities. My mom has it the worst and uses a TENS Unit when it's really bad. She hasnt had to take as many pain pills since she started using the TENS and she's actually not using the TENS as often as she was and still hasnt started popping the "good" pain pills (oxycontin) as much as she used to.

I hardly ever take anything for my back pain, maybe some ibuprofen, but I dont think I'm near as bad as my parents are. I dont like how narcotic pain meds make me feel. The masochist in me would rather feel the pain and be able to think than be totally stoned out of my gourd and not in pain. I just dont like strong pain meds and their side effects. I'm sure eventually I'll change my mind on that tho.

I still dont know what causes my back pain. It's either spasticity from the MS, or it's being caused from a back injury I got in a car accident and a second back injury that I got in a fall. I'm guessing it's from the accident or the fall.

Hopefully you can get something done that will take care of the pain soon that will keep you pain free forever and still keep you mobile.

Oh, as for not being able to vacuum without making the pain worse. I have a solution for you. Get a Roomba. All you have to worry about with a Roomba is emptying it and not tripping over it as it's vacuuming.

Also, keeping any pets you have from chasing it across the room while it's working. I couldnt get a Roomba while I had my dog, because he would have eaten it. I'm looking into getting a Roomba now that I'm dogless.

and a nice book it is jeannie,

sorry no so far those procedures I have not had, wish I could give you more insight, other than a supportive :hug: try to take it slow I know u want to do more but one step at a time, slowly get your back strength back to normal:hug:

Thanks Anne :hug:
I tried posting on other forums here, like I told Cheryl, but the membership is so light and not alot of experience there. I did go to a health board today where the traffic is much heavier and I see lots of them have gone the entire route to include surgery (Success and failure).

I guess what I was really doing here is reaching out to friends who would comfort me, like you all did :). Enough can't be said about community here. I've been good and not posted here about my personal pains as much as I feel it because it does not compare to a chronic illness like MS. I have seen some speak about back pain unrelated to MS so thought it was worth a shot I guess.

What I can relate to all of you is this though: I can't do what I used too and I miss me. I'm not much of a complainer in real life and hate feeling like a burden to anyone, esp my loved ones. I know they see it, but I never speak of it. I just needed to vent about it today.

Moose :hug: You are one hell of a man. I cherish you so much! I suppose one of the reasons I don't talk about things so much is because of stories like yours. My problems seem so small and petty compared to some of you here. But you make me feel like my problem is worthy of attention and like I said, I guess that's what compelled me to moan outloud today. I've become inspired and so I don't chicken out with the doctor, I called and left voice mail asking for the discogram so first thing Monday things will be rolling in that direction. If he does not want to do it, the other doctor does and I'll call him. I'll then be without refills and I pray that if I do go that way I'll get relief quickly.

I'll start fighting for my life
:grouphug:

LOL Erin :)
I have 3 cats and 2 dogs....bet it would help with all the hair on my wood floor :D I was like you for the first 3+ years. I didn't take anything. Then I eventually got to the point that I was taking some 12-15 Ibuprophens a day. When I heard that could be bad, I went to a doctor about it. Once I had my first few days of vicodin...OH MAN....Yeeeee Hawww! I found that managed pain (Like what Anne was saying) was a God Send.

Now that I've been on them 6 months, I find no pleasure in taking them anymore. It hit me that this could go on forever. Is this how I want to live? Yes for relief, no forever. I did try the tens unit a few years back at a chiropractor. I went for adjustments, but instead he put me on that DRX-9000 and the tens. I was worse after this, so I quit going. I've since heard that Chriopractic in my case is a big NO-NO!!

FRANK: Love you man!! Thanks so much for the good thoughts...you just have that attitude to keep on keeping on....its what I needed today from all of you.

Thanks all of you for taking the time to reply today...it really meant alot to me and I feel better mentally now (and I put a patch on :D LOL)

You asked for things you haven't tried yet....biofeedback and meditation. With both, you will still have pain, but you can control your response to it so it doesn't ruin your life. I learned biofeedback from a pain therapist (he was also my health psychology professor). It was a computer program that we learned to adjust our biorhythms with. Very cool. One of his patients who was in chronic, uncontrollable, suicidal type pain is now able to have a life again.

LOL..I think the civilian term is "blowing rainbows up your skirt"..:D

I'm keeping everything crossed for you, GJ..Let us know what you find out!

gj...it takes time to build a forum. don't give up on it. some of the lurkers may decide to join if there are more posts.

i bet some of the old timers..ok...only throw choccy :D can tell you there were times that the ms forum was slow for days and days.

same goes with the spinal forum. i have severe back problem and have been in constant pain since i was 12. some days i would rather have a baby out of my nose than endure the pain. i tend to shy away from the spinal forum. :o guess it makes the pain and what i have to live with more "real".

yup. i'm one with a high pain tolerance. could be a learned thing, since i do not tolerate pain meds. i also have had my heart stop 2 times during surgery...so that isn't an option. there are alternatives. you just have to do what is best for you.

yeah...the comments about not looking like i have anything wrong and should be able to do everything...well...i just shrug and forget them. not worth my time to try and change someones mind. i do what i can.

hang in there toots. venting and getting support...you are not alone.... is wonderful medicine. :hug:

I understand :) Maybe I'll post there a few times a week and see what happens (GRIN) I can take a hint after 3 of you asked me too :D

I'll go post there now.....

I hear you and can relate. I take a bit more meds than I would like to
if I want to get out of bed. I have severe pain in my left hip and leg
and both of my heels.:( I used to be a figure skater and walked 4 miles
every day. I just want to do that again. Im sick of the weight gain
and sick of being a lump in pain.:mad:

Ive tried so many different things. Casts, cortisone shots, nerve block,
boots, night splints, gel pads, heel cups, custom orthodics, pt, ice
and heat. The only thing that gives me some relief is my combo of
meds. I take zanaflex, percacet, gabapentin and ultram. We are
going to try lyrica so Im dosing down with the gabapentin. I HATE
taking all these meds but I HAVE to have some quality of life.:(:confused:

I sit here with a hot pack on my hip and dream about getting up
and moving.........

Sox

hehehe..gj..i might just reply. :D

:hug:

Doc wanted to start me on the Lyrica too, but so many gain so much weight, I turned that one down. After my Nerve Study showed normal, I felt it was actually a good choice for me not to take it. I've already gained 20 pounds on the meds I do take :( I do the ice too.....I'm dreaming of cleaning out my flower beds today. I'm going to do it....regardless of the consequences. Just hope I can walk at work tomorrow :p

I posted at the Chronic Pain thread...maybe I'll see you there....

pain
 

bj,
If you deside to go for the other doctor,please be careful about surrending all your pain support meds.as you probally know, you just can't stop them suddenly or your body will protest greatly. you'll need to wean off them ,tapering down the doses.
I went through a drug withdrawel all on my own, and it was terriable and so very hard to live through,but i did!! I did this cause the meds i was on were making me sick, but i couldn't get the pain center to listen to me.
i suffer from daily,constant pain in my head and face,with no answers yet, and into my second and a half years with this.I hate the meds i need, hate needing them,keeping count ect, i think i know how your feeling, and i just want you to know you'll be in my prayers tonight,
humming

So sorry I just now saw this post, I had been out of town.

I understand how you feel, after my last visit with my Dr I felt the same way. I KNOW I'm going to be in pain the rest of my life and there isn't much I can do to make it much better.

3 years ago I was on some many meds I felt drunk 24/7, that's when I said NO MORE to all those meds and started getting off of them, I just knew there had to be a better way to deal with all this pain. I'm not sure if my over all pain is better now because of the supplements or if it's just because I was in a long fibro flair than and am just doing better now on my own. I still have awful 24/7 pain and headaches that I almost never get a break from but I just deal with it hour by hour and don't even think about how I "might" feel the next day. I do my best to keep my mind off of the pain.

I don't want to say your Dr is right about the exercising, I just can't do much, I walk, OK, I walk IN Target 4 times a week, LOL, I LOVE my walks, DH doesn't because it hurts our bank account, LOL. Anyway I was 180lbs 2 years ago and have now lost 60lbs and I felt my worst at 170-180lbs pain wise. I don't have all that weight to carry around so moving more is easer on me.

I wish I could take all of your pain away. :hug:

Hey there MX7! I was wondering where you were....glad to see you're back.

GJ - I hope things are getting better for you. Constant pain can take its toll on the best of us. Hopefully your new doctor can make a difference for you and you can get off the pain meds and finally get the relief you deserve. :hug:

Thanks, just been really busy at home and than DH and I got away for the weekend. :D

Monday isn't over yet, but I would like some feedback on the Docs and phone calls you made. Basically, how you are proggressing.

*No smiley or picture available to show me in the drill instructor hat.
Yes.
I do have one.*:):D;)

How 'bout this one..............:cowboy2:

Well the nurse called and left voice mail, I returned the call but she was already gone.

Now...buried in work, even cancelled my hair appointment, just too beat to move after I get home.

It's sunny and warm and just took an extra pill today :rolleyes:

Looks like the 11 hour days, 6 days a week starts after this week at work....so I'm going to have to put it off, and just not complain....

Yeah, thats a BIG GIRL ;)


Funny, when you have the time, you don't have the cash...when you have the cash and insurance, you don't have the time. Life always playing tricks on us.

I'll update y'all when I make something happen....I so appreciate the kind concern from all of you though....it actually is a good pain killer...does that make sense :)

Hugs,
J

Oh carp Jeannie! I'm so sorry I didn't post sooner. :( I wouldn't give up your access to pain control. I understand how you feel about the pain meds. If I didn't take them I wouldn't be able stand by the end of the day. I'm not willing to give up standing just yet :). I do hate the fact that I have to take them at all. :( I've tried pt and non-narcotic meds but notihing else works. Along with MS I have spinal stenosis and a couple of compressed discs on my neck. My famiily has a long history of back problems. Can't you just see the doc kind of as a second opinion and not give up your regular one? I really hope you feel better SOON! :) Higs headed you way.

Just wondering - have you tried yoga? I have had problems with my back for over 20 years now. I've noticed that when I do certain yoga stretches it makes my back feel SO much better! Since your dr wants you to exercise this might be an option. There are certain yoga workouts designed especially for back pain relief. You should probably check with your dr to make sure this would be ok.

Thanks for resurrecting this page msarkie, 'cos I was wondering how GJ was going with that rotten pain too!

Please check in GJ......we worry about ya! :)