Need some information on custody of a child!!!
 

My friend just called me.

She has a 27 year old daughter who lives with her boyfriend and they have a one year old baby. Not married.

The daughter wants to take the baby and leave and move back in with her mother. Her mother babysits all day while both of the baby's parents work. They do not make a lot of money. The daughter cannot remain in the apartment if the boyfriend agrees to move out. The rent is $1000 a month.

So she will have no choice but to leave the guy, move back in with mom (who watches the baby anyway).

so here's the dilemma. The grandmother hates the daughter's boyfriend and his whole family. He does work, but he is not home at night. He really doesn't have anything to do with the baby. The girl had the baby deliberately after having a miscarriage. She knew that her mom would of course come to her rescue. She's done this countless times before.

The girl told the boyfriend. "i'm leaving you, and I'm taking the baby". The boyfriend countered with "Oh yeah, well if you do this, I'll accuse you of kidnapping my child". She of course got scared and stayed with the boyfriend.

He also told her "I know that you had a nervous breakdown when you were 19 and they put you in the hospital, so if you try and take my son, I'll use this against you in court". So naturally she, again, got scared and now she's afraid to leave the guy.

The grandmother told me "what rights do I have?" I said "is your daughter incapacitated in any way, is she on any meds?" She said "no she's fine, no meds, no anti-depressants, she works all week, I watch the baby".

I then said "I do not believe this guy has any grounds to accuse your daughter of kidnapping his child. I mean, people have the right to leave boyfriends and moms (at least I am led to believe this), that mom's have the right to keep their baby, unless they are proven to be unfit.

This is not the case. The mother works, the grandma watches the baby. the guy works, and at night, he volunteers for an ambulance company. So he's rarely home, and when he is, they fight and he curses her in front of the baby.

The grandmother asked me "Isn't this verbal abuse, wouldn't the court decide in my daughter's favor"?? I said to my friend: "you would be surprised at how many couples curse each other, and then make up at night".

She said: "no, she can't stand him". I said: "do you think your daughter is strong enough to leave him, because this has to go through Family Court". The guy, (after she leaves him ), can go straight to Family Court and he'll try to make a case for visitation, etc. WHATEVER!!!!

She said: "we don't want him to have any visitation and if he does get visitation we want it to be supervised". I said: "On what grounds?" and she said "well, he's not a fit father". and I again said: "on what grounds??" and she said 'well, he never changes the diapers".

I sighed and said "these are not grounds for supervised visitations" You are doing this because you cant' stand the guy". And she admitted this.

I said 'if your daughter leaves this guy, she's going to open up a can of worms, and you better be prepared to stand by her, support her and don't think for one second that this guy's family is not going to do the same for him."

She said (this was last night), she said: 'I know my daughter doesn't love him, and she wants to leave". The grandmother told me she plans to go all by herself to Family Court, ask some questions about her daughter's rights and then, when the stuff hits the fan, she'll tell her daughter what she found out. The girl is 27 by the way.

I said "this really is your daughter's business, it's her decision, but you can go and get the information if you are so inclined.

Well, this morning she had a talk with her daughter and told her daughter about the Family Court and that the guy might possibly sue for visitation, etc. etc. and the daughter immediately said: "I still love him, and I don't want to go to any Family Court".

I told my friend "I told you, she's not strong enough to make the break, she knows you'll take care of the baby, because this is what you have been doing her entire life. She has never stood on her own two feet. She also has another daughter who is 25 and is dating a guy for 3 years who wont' work. The mother is going crazy worrying about the two daughters.

I told her "This is your daughter's business and you really can't say anything about anything".

She said 'what do you mean, I am watching my grandson so I'm making it my business". Then she told me "my daughter also wants to have a second child". I said "good grief". She's not married to the guy, she is not happy with the guy, she doesn't take care of the one she has, and she wants another one? "are you serious??" And she says "I told her not to get pregnant until she's ready".

and the grandmother has MS by the way. Good Lord.

So here's what I want to know. Many of you know young mothers who wanted to leave the guy, right??

What happens when the mother leaves the boyfriend? Does the young mother then have to go immediately to Family Court to get some kind of custody for her own child?? If this were 50 years ago, there would be no problem. The girl left, took her baby and that was it.

but guys have rights today, I know this.

I know he could go to Family Court and try and probably WOULD get visitation rights. But the grandmother wants to know if the daughter, upon leaving the boyfriend, well, does she have to do ANYTHING??

Or can she just up and leave, and move back in with mom?

Thanks to anyone who can answer. My friend can't get through to the Family court by phone, it's always busy. She doesn't own a computer and can't operate one, Neither does the daughter.

In my heart, I don't think the daughter has the gumption to leave this guy. It would be too much WORK for her to do this.

But I'm just curious as to the rights of the mothers in this dilemma.

Thanks to anyone who can answer this.

Melody

The mother can leave and they can decide visitation at the courts. If she leaves the state he can claim kidnapping. He can try to throw whatever up, it wont matter as long as she is a good momma and doesn't leave the state. She told her mom she loves the guy so why does the mom think she doesn't? I agree that it's a mothers choice to help her kids but I also think that parents should step aside and let their kids grow. It's not her business even though she's the grandma. She does have rights though to visitation so that is good.

No matter how much she hates this guy he has rights to the child so long as he's not hurting the child. If it were my friend I would tell her to step back and be there for her daughter if she needs her. I am concerned as to why this mom went to the courts or will be. That sounds a little controlling to me. When her daughter is ready she will ask her mom for help. What everyone needs to remember is it took two to make the baby and this baby has a right to both parents as long as the parents are good ones. It's too bad the parents didn't think about all this when they decided to have a child huh?

I don't know the answer to your question, but my first step would be legal advice. I know in my city we have free legal service. If something like that is available for her, it would be the place to start. Sounds like Grandma needs to take a step back, and let her adult daughter work this out her way. Grandma might be fueling the fire IMO. Still a sad story!

I absolutely 100% agree with the both of you. And I told her this (very nicely though). I said "this is YOUR DAUGHTER'S personal business", "it's between her and the boyfriend".

She disagrees because "IT'S HER GRANDCHILD, AND MY DAUGHTER IS NOT MATURE". Sigh.

Anyway, I FOUND OUT EXACTLY WHAT THE GIRL HAS TO DO. And I'm glad I made the call because you could have floored me with what I was told.

I phoned the Family Court and I was given the Petitions Department. The phone rang over 150 times before someone picked it up. (I gather they get questions like this ALL DAY LONG).

So I told the lady at the other end the whole story, and I asked "what is the next step that this girl must do after she leaves the guy and moves in with her mom".

This is exactly what she said:

"We can't dispense advice, but who has custody??" I said "what do you mean who has custody??, She lives with her boyfriend and they have a baby, doesn't she have custody of her own child??" She said "are they married?" and I said: "no, and the guy threatened to call the cops and charge her with kidnapping if she takes the kid and leaves him (she won't be leaving the state).

The lady said 'if the guy calls the cops, the first thing the cops will ask is "who has custody". I said 'exactly what do you mean by "who has custody"?

She sighed and said: "It's whatever the paper says, if she comes to Family Court, petitions for sole custody, (then she hinted that the guy doesn't have a snowball chance in heck of getting custody because she's a good mom, not on drugs and she's the primary caretaker of the kid, right?? and I said 'well, she goes to work, and her mother watches the baby", she then said "doesn't matter, she's the mother, she's the primary caretaker".

So I then said 'so what you are saying is that it's in HER best interest, right after she leaves, to go to Family Court, and file for immediate custody and to get something in writing, right"???

And the lady said: "I did not say that, I am not allowed to give advice". See, she was trying to tell me this WITHOUT TELLING ME THIS!!!!

I got the picture

I then said: "So it might be a good idea if a girl was to leave her boyfriend and take the baby, then it might be a good idea to go to Family Court and get it in writing that she has custody???" and the girl said "Exactly", then, if the guy calls the cops and says 'she kidnapped my kid," the cops will then go to the grandma's house, knock on the door, the daughter will then produce the document that says she is the custodial parent. etc.etc.

Now the guy is free to do whatever he wants to do. He can petition the court for visitation, etc. But's that on HIS end.

The lady on the phone also said "while she is petitioning for custody, she can get a restraining order out on him". I said "oh no, there's no physical abuse here, she just wants to leave him".

She said: "then if a person wants to leave the guy, it's good to get it in writing that she is the custodial parent"

Isn't this interesting.

I always thought that we had custody of our children, that we didn't need to go to court to declare this in writing.

It's good to know the various laws.

This might only be in NYC. But at least I now know.

Wow!!!

Oh, I don't think this will go any further. I think the girl has absolutely no backbone.

I think the grandmother is very controlling and needs to step back. but this won't happen. She buys the baby food, she buys the diapers, and she watches the kid all day.

She feels this gives her the right to put in her two cents.

Can't really blame her for that one.

Melody

The guy will have to pay child support also - could be one reason he is threatening so she will stay and not leave.

But yes - the gmom should be sure daughter is really for sure ready to leave & end it - or it will end up being a back and forth mess....

the girl is a ninny if she has another baby in this situation!

I would suggest grandma keep her feelings about her grandchild's father to herself. She could also have a little talk with her daughters about what it means to have a baby. It's something that is SUPPOSED to be created out of LOVE, and it's a life-long commitment. The daughter claims to love the man. I hope she realizes that having his child will not make him love her any more or less. You can't hold onto love using a baby - they should never be used as a lasso.

My ex-husband was a horrible "deadbeat father" according to the law, but it was MY decision to have my son. I could have had an abortion or given him up for adoption if I wanted. I was going through a divorce at the time, and my ex didn't want to be a father. My ex was vindictive, though - he would have sued for custody if I tried to garnish his wages or keep him from seeing my son.

I made a point to never say anything bad about my ex in front of my son, but didn't glorify him either. My son could see he was a deadbeat dad - didn't need any reminders. I'm no saint - I did this for a reason. I figured my son's adolescent/teenage years would be rough, so I didn't want him thinking the grass might be greener living with my ex.

It worked out in the end in a way I would have NEVER expected. My son didn't really need my ex back then - he had my husband, who is a very good father. But my son needs him now, especially with his Viet Nam and life experience. They were able to resolve the issues of the past, and my ex has come through for him with shining colors.

I consider my son to be very stable. He's had it rough, but at least he knows who he is and where he came from.

Your friend's grandchild may belong to her, but she does not own the child. The child has a right to know his/her father. The child also has a right to make up his/her own mind about how to feel about the father.

get legal advice, each state has diff laws concerning this issue, one point Kathy made, keep feelings to ones self. I had to fight for sole custody, and as bad as it got, I never talked bad of their Mom in front of the children. Good luck on this Mel, contact a lawyer

Well, I got the information straight from the Family Court. You don't need a lawyer in Family Court. You go in front of an arbitrator. But that's only when two people don't agree on ANYTHING.

Where it stands right now, is they are having a big 1 year old birthday party and the boyfriend's mother's house on Saturday. Everybody will be going.

My friend (the grandmother), won't keep her mouth shut for all the tea in China. She tells anyone who listens exactly what she thinks of the boyfriend.

She also told me "I hate his mother, and I hate his sister".

I don't see any good coming out of this.

I see a controlling grandma, a 27 year old extremely immature young woman who got pregnant on purpose knowing full well that she and the boyfriend could not afford a baby. That's where Grandma rode in to the rescue.

And when she told me "She wants to have another kid", that's when I stuck my two cents worth in.

She agreed, that her daughter should not try and get pregnant until she's in a stable relationship (what the heck ever happened to waiting until one got married to start having kids??). I'm from the old school I guess. I never would have lived with anyone, nor would I have dared to get pregnant. No one would have rescued me, I can guarantee you on that one.

But today, they know that if they get pregnant, there is WIC, and food stamps, and whatever. They have no motivation.

I don't see her leaving this guy. She's too dependant on him right now. I think she's afraid of what he'll do also.

When one has no self esteem, one cannot just "step up to the plate", and become a self supporting single mother. Not if that person has never really taken care of themselves first.

So we shall see.

Thanks for all the good advice.

Melody

i love that mel, and you are not old school you are using what they call common sense, I would like to say its a common thing, but as I look around this world, it doesnt seem to be common at all.

your point is pretty right on target, they have a number of back ups, so there is no thought put into it such as long term, the childs future. good luck on the one grandma, she sounds determined.

friends of mine went through something like this, and i told both of them right off dont play me for a middle person, I like both of them and warn them the first one to try and drag me into their mess i would say goodbye to, they are still working on things, with some luck the big D may not be in their future, which is good to hear

again good luck be careful

Hi.

I just came home from Dunkin and ran into a neighbor who happens to be a police officer. I asked her to confirm what I had been told by the person over the phone from Family Court.

She said: "Not only is it true, this happened to me, with my ex".

Seems she had a relationship with a guy, and they had a daughter. She split, and was working, and the kid was in day-care. One day, the father of this child simply showed up and wanted to take the kid. They called the mother who freaked. She got them NOT to hand over the kid.

She then immediately went to Family Court, they immediately set up a hearing in front of a Judge who said "why do you want to get this in writing". She explained and they immediately ordered a paternity test".

I said "they ordered a paternity test??" and she said "yes, because we were not married, and it establishes paternity".

She then was told to come back in one week to pick up the written custody order. In that time, the ex-boyfriend was served with papers.

He then had to option of filing for visitation, his own custody, etc.

She then told me. "It's vital if you break up with someone to get it in writing that you are the custodial parent".

I HAD NO IDEA. Boy did I learn stuff today.

So when my friend called me this morning, I simply told her what I had been told by the Family Court person, and by my neighbor.

I also said 'listen, you also have the option of standing back, butting out, and let the two of them work out their own problems. Your daughter is 27 years old and she has to do this by herself".

She then said "No way, she is not capable, I don't want this guy near the kid, I dont' like him". I said "you don't have a say in this, it's up to what the Family Court decrees, this guy can get visitation, HE'S THE FATHER"..

It fell on deaf ears. She says "I know my daughter, she can't stand him, she's ready to leave".

I then said 'oh yeah, then why isn't she leaving??"

She said 'I'll get her to leave'.

OH BROTHER!!!

Boy the stuff we learn every day. I bet if this grandma butted out and left the two young parents alone, they might have had a chance.

mel I was getting the same feeling about the grandma, perhaps she is part of the problem, like i said becareful dont get dragged too far into it

Not to worry. We are not that kind of friends. I see her only occasionally when we run into each other. Our kids went to school together ALL THOSE YEARS AGO.

Never figured her to be so controlling, but I guess when you have to step in and take charge, there's nothing else some moms can do. And especially when there's a baby. I mean, if the parents can't afford the diapers, and baby food, and furniture, thank god that some parents can step in and help.

But keeping in real here!!! This daughter SHOULD HAVE NEVER GOTTEN PREGNANT, let alone on purpose. That kind of thinking just boggles the mind.

It's all enabling if you ask me. They know they will be rescued, so they do what they want.