Inflammation, any tips to reduce
 

Hi all.

I'm way too sensitive to medications, allergic to many and scarred to try yet another new drug so I'm back to taking ibuprofen to try to keep the inflammation down. I don't drink coffee or alcohol and try to eat a well balanced diet.

Do you have any tips or treatments that have helped to keep the swelling down that you could share here.

Many thanks

MsL

Has anyone here been able to find any

Hi,
My daughter is also very hypersensitive to medications. Because of this, we had little option but to continue searching for alternative treatments. We finally discovered that hyperbaric oxygen treatments helped her immensely, actually to the point of stopping her pain. It is a good treatment for inflammation, so I just wanted to share that with you.
I wish you the very best in your search for help!!
Jeanne

I'm sorry that you have to deal with inflamation and that you are so sensitive to medications :hug:

I haven't really found anything that helps with the inflamation unfortunately. I have heard from a lot of people however who say that Epsom (sp?) Salt Baths can be really good in reducing inflamation/swelling.

I hope you find something that helps you real soon. You are in my thoughts and please keep us all updated when you can.

Alison

Inflammation, what to do.
 

Hi Mslday,
Here are just some of the things I have come to known about inflammation. One of the best way to stop it is by taking enzymes. Proteolytic enzymes and your diet. Eat more anti-inflammatory foods an the food that cause inflammation. You start by getting Dr. Leo Gallands, M.D. book called the fat resistance diet.
You also can go to
The reason you would want to take enzymes like Bromelain, Papain, Amylase Pancreatin and Lypase is when our body becomes depleted of these then the immune system can not keep up with the inflammation that has been triggered off because of some injury or disease.
Every body system needs these to function well. If we don't get enough of these enzymes then over time inflammation grows out of control.
There are studies that show that these decrease pain and inflammation.
Hope this gives you a place to start.
By the way just thought I would tell you that is my real name. I like to just let everyone know that because they usually ask.
These things really work My husband and I have already have been doing these things and we know they work.
Take care Mslday and others.

I am not sure where you have RSD, but mine is in my right limb, hand to shoulder. I too am extremely sensitive to medications so I have had to find other ways to cope with the swelling.

1. One of the best techniques for me is to use compression on my arm if I have swelling. I grab a scrubbing brush or a towel and slowly scrub my kitchen counter back and forth in a rhythmic movement. This seems to really help hault the swelling most days.
2. I also elevate my arm (slightly) for short periods of time throughout the day. I alternate this with movement every 15 minutes in order to keep the limb warm and not so stiff.
3. I also use Epsom Salts baths quite a bit for inflammation when it gets bad. I fill up the sink using water that is 105 degrees and soak for about 10 minutes.
4. I will also drink a regular cup of coffee (I know, it sounds so wrong) but for some reason, it helps with swelling for me.
5. I also will get in a pool at a rehab center (it is warm water) and just slowly move about. I never notice the swelling gets better right after the water, but a few hours later, it really seems to kick in. I think the compression once again helps.

So these are my tricks I use and I use them daily because inflammation is a big problem for me. My fingers are always so swollen and stiff every morning. If it is bad, I start my day with an Espom Salts soak, this justs really helps sooth the arm and helps it move, which I think then helps with swelling for me.

Good luck to you. I hope some of these things will help.

Thank you very much to each of you for your suggestions, you have all inspired me to get back to what we know works like Epsom salts and to try new things. Jolaine you have inspired me to do more research and I'm going to the library tomorrow to see if I can locate a copy of Dr. Gallands book. A search on the internet also lead me to this article http://www.care2.com/news/member/818150751/439742 about an anti-inflammatory diet.
After reading this I realize that I need to make some adjustments to my diet especially since I eat way too much red meat.


Thanks again

MsL

this thread..
 

has some ideas for you:
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/thread1105.html

Hi Jolaine, pretty name by the way. I've been reading the book you suggested. It won't be a big change for us since we eat many of the suggested foods already. I mainly need to cut down on my red meat and add a few more veggies. I had never heard of the enzyme's before and I'm doing some research on that as well.

Since following this diet and taking the enzyme's to you find your pain is significantly reduced. Do you still need to take the RSD medications? Thank you for the tips.

Laura

Sorry to get in late here, but I was advised some time ago by a prof in the Dept. of Neurobiology at UCLA that the best way to control inflamation - and specifically sympathetic tone as modulated by the insular cortex in the brain - was through a diet rich in Omega-3 fatty acids. He said that approx. 2,400 mg./day should be about right. To that end, please see the following abstract:

Modulation of inflammatory cytokines by omega-3 Fatty acids. Kang JX, Weylandt KH. Subcell Biochem. 2008; 49: 133-43.

Department of Medicine, Massachusetts General Hospital, Harvard Medical School, 02114, Boston, MA, USA.

Many human diseases have been linked to inflammation, which is mediated by a number of chemical molecules including lipid mediators and cytokines. Polyunsaturated fatty acids (omega-6 and omega-3 fatty acids) are the precursors of the lipid mediators and play an important role in regulation of inflammation. Generally, omega-6 fatty acids (e.g. arachidonic acid) promote inflammation whereas omega-3 fatty acids (e.g. eicosapentaenoic acid and docosahexaenoic acid) have anti-inflammatory properties. Omega-3 fatty acids dampen inflammation through multiple pathways. On the one hand, omega-3 fatty acids inhibit the formation of omega-6 fatty acids-derived pro-inflammatory eicosanoids (e.g. PGE(2) and LTB(4)), and on the other hand these fatty acids can form several potent anti-inflammatory lipid mediators (e.g. resolvins and protectins). These together directly or indirectly suppress the activity of nuclear transcription factors, such as NFkappaB, and reduce the production of pro-inflammatory enzymes and cytokines, including COX-2, tumor necrosis factor (TNF)-alpha, and interleukin (IL)-1beta. This chapter focuses on the evidence from recent studies using new experimental models.

What's also of note is what may increase inflammatory processes. While we all know about stress, there's been recent work done that shows the mechanism of "Association of catastrophizing with interleukin-6 responses to acute pain," Robert R. Edwards at al, Pain epub 2008.07.24, a copy of which is attached for anyone who's interested. It's a very interesting article that can probably be read on a number of levels, but it basically demonstrates that “catastrophizing” produces inflammatory cytokines in and of itself.

Ironically, it's also been established, at least in the context of arthritis that SSRI antidepressants may actually increase the inflammatory processes. See, "Alteration of central serotonin modifies onset and severity of adjuvant-induced arthritis in the rat," M.S. Harbuz et al, British Journal of Rheumatology, 1998 Oct; 37(10):1077-83, a copy of which is also attached. For what it's worth . . . (I know they drove my RSD induced spasms to insane levels.)

Mike

Hi fmichael,
Thank you so much for the information and attached files. My internet in down now, so will get the information later. I'm looking forward to reading the info. I have full body rsd 12 years. I'm hoping to reduce meds with following healthy eating and building up my immune system. I also have fibromyalgia. How did you get rsd? Mine came the day following surgery. Misdiagnosed for several years and now with a very good Dr. and wanting to reduce meds if possible. Thank you again. Loretta

Dear Lorreta -

I wish I could have gotten rid if my RSD. Alas, I've just sort of learned to live with it. There have been a few times along the way when I thought I was about to get a major new treatment, only for it not to pan out at the end, whether it was a ketamine coma in Germany (disqualified with less than 2 weeks to go because of pre-existing glaucoma) or more recent electroconvulsive therapy - using ketamine as the general anesthetic - which my doctors were willing to do but the psychiatry dept. at their hospital/medical school is now requiring be it approved as a formal invetigative study by medical school's institutional review board, something that will take another year at least.

What "saved me" was getting into a Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) class that combined meditation and yoga with a sense of general acceptance for just what was going on in the body. Not acceptance in the sense of anything fatalistic, but just learning how to pick your battles, and not struggle with pain that's just going to be there anyhow: you either take something for it or you let it flow through you. In the words of my teacher Shinzen Young, suffering equals pain times resistance. Sometimes you can't do anything about the pain, but resistance is always under your control. Jules put up a nice post about Shinzen and his book, Break Through Pain, the other day, the sixth item in this thread: http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/thread54819.html

Finally, you asked how I got RSD. In a fit of self improvement I went to the gym and hired a personal trainer, in an attempt to have more focus in the office. Long story short, he put me on some equiptment (1) I never would have chosen for myself and (2) people with flat feet had no busniess being on. I ripped tendons in both ankles and that was that. Now, I should say that at the time there was a lot of stress in my life, and there's some evidence that there is a greater chance of developing RSD when folks are injured who are already under significant stress, whatever the immediate tauma happens to be. I know a few people on this forum for whom that was their experience. (And there's another aspect of the RSD/inflamation puzzle.)

Mike

Meds
 

Did you have a scare one time where you where allerigic to a med or is it something else???? I'm afraid that RSD is a long disease and you will eventually have to try some of the medicines we have to take to get through the day in order to make it.

Try soaking in a hot bath for now. Good luck to you.

Patches

Thank you for the very interesting articles Mike, I believe you can always be counted on for your sound and interesting contributions to the board. I had read the information about Omega 3 fatty acids that you posted previously and embarked upon an overhaul of my diet as soon as I read that, just prior to my surgery. I don’t eat fish so I started to take Omega 3 fish oil supplements, which is most likely the best in the case of trying to modulate the inflammatory cytokines. I'm also exploring the recommendations from Jolaine regarding enzyme and Dr. Galland's book “Fat reduced diet” which really should be called the anti-inflammatory diet.

It will be a bit challenging to know if any of this makes a difference because my PM doc has stepped up my treatment and is being more aggressive giving me lidocaine weekly alternating between IV and the subcutaneous treatments. He also slotted me in for a series of 3 lumbar sympathetic blocks. He finally understands me when I tell him I can't tolerate a medication as I was hospitalized recently for another serious reaction to a new med.

As you say Mike there is no harm in trying and the cost of omega 3 fish oil is fairly negligible, certainly a healthy diet is always wise.

Loretta when I was in Germany I heard the term centralized RSD used in association with full body RSD. I don’t know if there is a difference but to me centralized RSD seems to makes sense for what its worth.

MsL

Hi All,

I thought I would follow up on this thread since I've seen some significant improvement since I started to follow a few suggestions made by many of you.

A month ago I started taking an proteolytic enzyme called Serrapeptase after researching the suggestion made by Jolaine earlier in this thread. I chose the Serrapeptase because some research suggested that Serrapeptase induces anti-inflammatory and anti-edemic (prevents swelling and fluid retention) activity in a number of tissues, and that its anti-inflammatory effects are superior to other proteolytic enzymes. It is also suggested the besides reducing inflammation, one of Serrapeptase's most profound benefits is reduction of pain, due to its ability to block the release of pain-inducing amines from inflamed tissues. Because of the anti-inflammatory and pain-blocking benefits of this substance some are using it as an alternate to ibuprofen and other NSAIDs.

The brochure that came along with the enzyme I bought at a health food store claims the following :

Serrapeptase is thought to work in three ways:

1)It may reduce inflammation by thinning the fluids formed from injury, and facilitating the fluid's drainage. This in turn, also speeds tissue repair.

2)It may help alleviate pain by inhibiting the release of pain-inducing amines called bradykinin.

2)It may enhance cardiovascular health by breaking down the protein by-products of blood coagulation called fibrin. Conveniently, Serrapeptase is able to dissolve the fibrin and other dead or damaged tissue without harming living tissue. This could enable the dissolution of atherosclerotic plaques without causing any harm to the inside of the arteries."

There are many claims out there on the Internet made by the companies producing/selling this enzyme, most refer to a few of the same clinical studies, but it was hard to find the actual studies themselves, everyone just quotes the same source. That being said according to wikipedia "A systematic review by the evidence-based health care medical journal Bandolier stated that the evidence on serratiopeptidase being effective for anything is not based on a firm foundation of clinical trials." I believe they reviewed 34 studies to reach this conclusion.

Everything I read about this indicated there was very low risk of any side effects so I thought what the heck it can't hurt, I cleared it with my doctor and started to take it. Within a few days of starting this I noticed an reduction in the swelling in my rsd foot, an increased range of motion and a significant reduction in pain. So much so that my dr. & I decided to cancel my scheduled lumbar sympathetic blocks and I've been returned to my regular schedule of IV Lidocaine infusions from once a week to once every 3 weeks. While lidocaine infusions do improve my range of motion it typically wears off and I'm completely stiff by the time I'm due again for another infusion. Not anymore, I'm now able to walk without a limp and don't need my cane. If this is due to all of the aggressive treatments I had following my surgery or a result of the Serrapetasse itself I will never really know. I still get some deep cold burning and bone pain and need to continue to manage that, but it is no where near what it was. I've been able to reduce my use of Ibuprofen and Tylenol 3 quite significantly as well. It appears as though the scar tissue has also diminished significantly and my PT is now able to do full massage and traction on my foot. We were both amazed that she could touch my foot like that. What ever it is I sure hope it stays. I was originally only going to take this seappetasse for a month but now I've decided to continue on, why switch a winning team.

Patches, to answer your question I did have had severe reactions to medications, one made me neutropenic destroying my white blood cells and landed my in isolation in the hospital for a week while another gave me a severe case of tinnitus and partial loss of hearing, permanently. Over the past 6 years I've tried the majority of the prescribed meds for RSD and my doctors have had to take me off most of those meds because my sensitivities and allergies. That being said a good long hot bath is always a great way to make one feel better.

Thank you all for your help and support!


MsL

Hi Jeanne,:hug:

I am so happy for you and your daughter. How great is that! There is one lady on here Diana A that has a home hbot. I'm going to ask my Dr. about that next week. Your daughter must be thrilled. How old is she? and How long has she had RSD? and where? I don't even know how they work, or what you do.

Jeanne, I tried writing you back, but it didn't go thru. I'll try again. Take care, Loretta

Hi Mike,

Thank you for all the information and research.I'm sorry you have RSD too. I've always felt stress at the time of the injury or surgery or whatever, plays a part in those who get RSD and others that may have same surgery or injury are not effected. I was going thru a very stressful time when I had the surgery and the RSD showed up the very next day. I didn't know if for 4 years. The next day my entire arm swelled up and then next thing was frozen shoulder. Lot of PT and massage therapy. and on and on. That's been 12 years ago.

I've been to Bio Feedback and practice meditation also. I'm so relaxed, can go into the MRI for an hour without any meds, and just put myself on the beach in Maui.The pain thing is a lot more difficult. I use music, scented candles, massage, various essential oils, family vacation albums, talking to friends on the phone, especially giving encouragement to friends that are experiencing tough times, of course trying to be balanced about that.

Thanks again, Mike, for listing the references. I'm going to pick up the book and start on the anti-inflammatory diet. I alread take the Omega 3 fish oil. My Dr. has really helped me, I'm out of the deep deep depression I experienced for a long time. I did start Cymbalta 60 mg. about 6 weeks ago, but it's more than that. More like, came to acceptance, and grateful for a lot of things instead of looking back and missing all that I can't do. Was really involved with all kinds of sports.

Have you checked out HBOT? A couple of friends here have really been helped with it. I'm going to ask my Dr. Monday. Take care, Loretta

Hi MsL,

Sounds like you are doing something good for yourself! That's great. I'm taking the Omega 3 fish oil too. I'm going to try and find the book this week. Ask my Dr. abut the Serr.

I had one neurologist call my condition generalized RSD. That and centralized make sense, Thanks. Would you mind telling my about your experience in Germany? I know a study was done here at the Mayo, about a mile from our home. Arizona. Dr. Swartzman, Dr. Harbut, a German Dr. and a couple others were involved in the study. They don't do the procedure with ketamine at the Mayo here anyway. I tried to get scheduled in Penn. but was put off a couple-three years.

So happy again to hear you are responding to either the pt or Serr. I had a lot of good months after initial RSD and good therapy. Then it started in other shoulder and more PT. Then several months of no symptoms till nerve pull in left hand while water skiing. Never any relief since then. They used to call this shoulder-hand syndrome. Take care, Loretta