not a happy camper
 

i have really turned reclusive. to make matters worse, i have spent most of my time reading or sleeping, that i can hardly walk a block without getting tired. My doctor suggested a lung doctor but I am too afraid to go. I have pernicious anemia but my doctor said the b12 shots should have kicked in by now. I also am deficient in vitamin d which makes you tired and supposedly the vitamin pills take a long time to take effect. Both p.a. and d deficiency can make you feel depressed. I switched to zoloft and it is too soon to see if that is working better than prozac.
the last two nights i have had disturbing somewhat recurring dreams that i wasn't going to graduate from college(I did all my course work for ph.d. in pyshcology in reality) and that i failed in another huge project that i was working out except there was some praise that went along with it. it was the weirdest dream. i was happy to wake up because in the dream my parents told me that was the last straw and i had to go find a job which i thought was impossible. I am battling in accepting the limitations of being bipolar. I am rehashing my life and seeing all the bad decisions i made because i am bipolar and functioned and probably still function like one, even with insight.
ugh. what pain
bobby

Bobby, I hope you will feel more up to things other than sleeping and reading soon. I know the comfort of sleeping though as I'd had my share of it too. I got over it for the most part. Try to take baby steps in what you want to accomplish.

barbara

hi bobby,
thank you for checking in.
I am sorry that you are isolated :(and wish it was easier for you.
The rehashing of the past does not serve us a purpose and I suggest that you try to not do that to yourself. IT is not helpful at all.
Remember we are supposed to take it a day at a time....jsut concentrate on today. that is all we really have any control of and I know that you know this.
I am hopeful for you that you regain some energy and that the zoloft may help...it will take a while to reach theapuetic levels...if i remember correctly.
(((((HUGS))))
beth

hi there
 

Dear Bobby,

i dont' know if you are titrating up on the zoloft or what, but it takes one week at each dosage in the titration period, to reach steady state for that dosage. then, once you reach target dose it takes 2-6 weeks to see an effect.

I just want to mention, since you are actually switching between two SSRIs, that your 5-HT receptors are probably a little "confused" right now... and relate that, when i was tapering from Zoloft, especially towards the end, i was having disturbed sleep and recurring/repetitive dreams, often with troubling content. i am hoping the dreaming and the sleep issues will subside in at most a few weeks as your brain gets used to not having the Prozac. I figure that wasn't tapered since it is long acting enough it sort of self-tapers... plus you were adding the Zoloft.

i have not had problems generally starting an SSRI. but they are different molecules... replacing one with the other does not completely exclude the possibility of some withdrawal symptoms... and the changes in sleep quality/dreams could be a type of withdrawal. remember that SSRIs also help with obsessive/repetitive thinking, so imo, i could easily see a link between withdrawal from an SSRI and the emergence of dreams with repetitive qualities.

you are facing a lot of difficulties and in a way are in a vicious cycle... the same one i am in but probably deeper. we don't get exercise which would get us in shape therefore we fatigue more easily, therefore we move around less and less and get less and less in shape etc. i would say that if you are not going out for now because it is too hard, that is ok. if you can get outside - even on your terrace, just to get some fresh air, that would be good.

but for "exercise" what about just doing little things in your apartment for now. things that do tire you but only a little bit at a time. even walking from room to room - it might sound stupid, and it might feel stupid, but you will be moving, and yet in a "safe" environment where when you are too tired you can sit. maybe try to do that once a day, as a ritual. or find some other light physical activity that you can do at home where you don't have to deal with both the fatigue and the being outside with stimuli you are not up to facing.

i hope the Soloft works for you. it works well for me. i stopped it because i didn't need it and now changed to Wellbutrin because it only just became available where i live (the Olde Worlde, ya know... :rolleyes:). i did better on Wellbutrin when i had taken it before... it is my AD of choice, but Zoloft is close second. another reason to change for me was that after 5 years on the same antidepressant, the brain gets a bit too used to it and it is less effective.

i am glad you are reading. you are keeping your mind active, and that is good. you are aware of needing to get your body more active and in a way you are working on that. don't be too hard on yourself. do try the doing little things... standing up... allowing yourself to feel tired doing stuff for a while... but not too long... and then allow yourself to rest.

as for the being bipolar... well... that is only one part of you. you have many gifts. you gave me a wonderful gift of insight with your post the other day, just for example.

now, when your mind wanders onto those "bad decisions" you made... and you feel angry at being bipolar ... i think it might be useful to try to move your mind. give yourself 5 minutes to have angry thoughts and then focus on something else. if you need to, make a list of things to think about when you need to change focus. yes, that's right, i'm giving you homework now! ;) consider that can be one of the physical things because i want you to sit up at a table and write out that list. that takes more physical effort than lying down. heck, i should know. i get tired just sitting in the armchair watching murder she wrote reruns. :rolleyes:

the thing is, our meds won't get rid of our fatigue totally - that is partly a by-product of long term depression and unfortunately we have to tackle it behaviorally. that is why i made the other suggestions.

but i really hope the med gives you some benefit soon and that you stop having the cruddy dreams. in the past when i have been titrating zoloft i have sometimes had lucid dreams... and beautiful ones... not on regular basis, and mostly with steep increases. but perhaps your dream quality will morph into a more positive one - those dreams were splendid. ;) i knew i was dreaming and i could choose to do special stuff like (my favorite) fly around or change my surroundings at will.

sending you all the good vibes i can muster.

love you lots.

~ waves ~

Dear Bobby,
I am happy to see you but concerned that you are not doing well.
Those obsessive thoughts sound quite troubling.:( :confused:
M.

I don't know if i get angry or just feel helpless and how i possibly wasted my life. I did a lot of good things for others but I feel so empty. Do you know what I mean? I sometimes wonder if I have a little girl's view of what the world should be. I know intellectually we need problems but i wish there were no problems but just challenges and you could jump off from the challenge whenever you are too stressed. I just bought a few book on aging. I wonder if I am going to follow through and read them. I know a lot of my problem is aging. I feel like such a fool for not exercising the past five years. I make such poor decisions. They are so ridden with emotion. If somebody told me five years ago I was making a mammoth mistake about just reading and not exercising i probably wouldn't have listened lol..
thanks also about why i might be having such powerful dreams. it makes sense.
I think I have to go backwards and rehash my past to allow myself to forgive myself. If I just try to bury it it will haunt me I am sure. Now I have to figure out what is aging and what is bipolar and where is the depression coming from.
I am still reading a lot of junk books so not obsessing that much. I want to read more spiritual books. I just bought some more.
Bobby

I really wish you'd start with daily oral B12.... you will get better faster,IMO.

I have a thread now in the stickies at PN about this subject.
Please take a look at it.

am I ever impressed. there is so much knowledge to digest. thank you so much. what a jewel you are. I will start taking b12 every day. I have it. I had a question while I was reading but forgot to write it down...something about b12 shots giving you more fatigue. I don't know if I read that right.
thank you again so much
bobby

It is reccommended that you use the Methylcobalamin kind for better absorbtion. I have used the sublingual type, tiny small pill that dissolves almost immediately. I originally got this information from Mrs D!:o
beth

Take the sublingual or oral on an empty stomach for best results.
Do you know what your last test number was?

The shots are cyano form and if you do not convert well, they won't work. Also the actual B12 only remains in the circulating blood for 72 hrs. So some feel good for a day or so and then crash.
It is better to take the oral, because it gives steady intake of B12 so the body can use it more effectively.

In nursing home settings when a low result is found they usually give the shots daily for a week or two, then slowly
titrate to once a week or once a month or whatever.
Most physicians do not understand oral use at all.

There are people who cannot tolerate the cyanide portion of cyanocobalamin used in shots.
Also without adequate B12 you cannot make melatonin and therefore may have sleep issues as well.

I think the methyl form is superior at this time. And it is very inexpensive too.

THANK you so much. I have Jarrow's Methyl b-12 1000. I am taking two. Should I take more? I will go back and read what I read. It was either on your posts or on Rose's website about fatigue and the shots. My doctor just started giving me a shot a month starting in October and she said I should by now feel the effects. I lost the paper to find out what my test's results were.
I could ask her when I have my next blood test for diabetes in July if I could have another test.
Thank you so much.
Bobby
I don't know if that was the quote that bothered me yesterday. If true do you know for how long?

When people are severely low in B12, and you flood the system with it with a shot, the body responds by making new red blood cells if you are severely anemic. It is important to realize that 1000mcg entering your body suddenly is a huge amount...when 2-4 micrograms is the RDA it is used to using.

Oral is not absorbed totally, so it is much more gentle.

What happens then in severely anemic people who are low in B12 is that the red cell factory goes into overdrive, and uses up the potassium you have hanging around. This is a survival mechanism so the potassium may become low temporarily. Low potassium gives weakness and severe fatigue, and if really low will result in cramping of muscles. Eating foods high in potassium may help this. Cantaloupe, V8 juice, bananas, oranges, potatoes, meat, are good sources. V8 has more potassium in a 12 oz can than many RX potassium capsules!

This may be the reason for the "fatigue" after the shots.

I really think using the oral route, is more efficient and gentler for you. 2000mcg is okay, but if you know your number is really low 5000mcg daily for a month or two would be better. Try the 2000mcg now, once a day, on an empty stomach, and you should see some response. Some people claim within a week, but I don't see how that can be really. Expect to see some effects in a month or so.

thank you so much for the explanation....now I wonder if i could be deficient in potassium also. My diet has been atrocious. I am going to order some potassium.
you are a goldmine!
thank you again
bobby

Potassium supplements are USELESS. They cannot have more than 99mg in them per FDA rules.

You need to eat 4500mg a day to keep up. Please don't waste your money on potassium pills purchased over the counter.

The RX kind from your doctor may have 600-800mg/tablet.
1/2 cantaloupe has 1200 mg by comparison.

This website can help you choose foods high in potassium:
http://www.nutritiondata.com/

Do not self medicate with high doses of potassium (should you find some) without first consulting your doctor. Food is the best way to go.

Thank you mrs.D, you always come thru with the best information.
beth

thank you so much. I won't buy the supplements. I also read that too much potassium could kill you. that website is fantastic. i noticed there is even potassium in coffee :-) I like cantelope.
Thanks again for being such a goldmine of information. I appreciate it so much.
bobby

When I am dragging and need a pickmeup...I do V8 (low sodium).
I have to do the low sodium for my blood pressure.

You can do the regular-- it tastes better too. about 600-800mg in one can. (I think the regular is 600 and the low sodium is a bit higher closer to 800.)

It is convenient and easy.

thank you so much. i will buy some. it is also low in calories. since i stopped smoking I have gained even more weight. I am so glad I quit smoking :-)
thank you again
bobby

wow!!!!
bobby you quit smoking, I forgot that you did this or did not know.
Congratulations!!!!!!!!
beth

Dear Bobby,

This pubmed article concludes that taking vit D can help with depression.

It's great when you can start putting together pieces of the puzzle.

Also, I hope that oral methylcobalamin helps you soon.


Mari

Dear Bobby,
Here is a link to foods good for potassium content:
http://www.vaughns-1-pagers.com/food...sium-foods.htm
highlights include--dried apricots, carrot juice, prune juice, beans, black eyed peas, lentils, beet greens, spinach, winter squash, potatoes.

M.

thank you Mari. I crashed. I went to Dr.M. today and he doubled the zoloft and put me on tradazone again for sleep. it didn't work before but he said this time it might work. I am sorry it took me so long to respond.
bobby

I am sorry that you crashed bobby, glad that dr.M was there for you.
hope you feel better as soon as possible.
(((((HUGS)))))
beth:hug: