Question regarding the use of R-Lipoic Acid for lousey blood sugar numbers
 

I am a 52 year old male who is 68" (5'8") tall, weighs 180 pounds, and is moderately muscular (I did weight lifting for many years).

Over the last five years or so I have unfortunately noticed my blood sugar numbers creeping up. What started out prior to age 45 at a fasting level of 80 to 85 has now in my latest fasting blood test risen to 115. My two-hour glucose challenge number, in-turn, has now risen today to 189. My A1C numbers, though, have been averaging around 5.5 or so since my sugars began rising five years ago.

What is very unfortunate is that I finally got a fasting insulin test done the other day for the first time, and my number came in at 114 (the reference range is 0 to 25). My internal medicine doctor, in-turn, said that this is the highest insulin number that he has ever seen!

I also tend to carry my weight around in my belly, have a total cholesterol number of 309 (off statins), HDL of 72 and LDL of 190. My triglycerides are 235.

All this said, I am obviously pre-diabetic which is disappointing (and likely due in large part to my genetics). This said, I will now go back on Pravastatin 40 mg per day (I went off it out of fear that it was contributing to my SFN) and try to loose a bit more weight. I will also increase my daily aspirin dose from 162 mg to 320 mg per day.

I am also interested in using R-Lipoic Acid in an attempt to stabolize my blood sugars and insulin. I purchased a bottle of "Doctors Best" R-Lipoic Acid in 100 mg capsules that are not time release.

Could I please get some suggestions from those knowledgable about using RLA for blood sugar control about what the optiminal dose would be? Also, because these are non-time release capsules how often should they be taken per day?

Indeed, is there a time-release version of R-Lipoic Acid? Finally, how much time should I allow after beginning my test of R-Lipoic Acid before re-checking my sugar and insulin levels to see if it had a positive effect?

Many thanks!

I would really reconsider that Pravastatin! Anyone with PN really should avoid statins!

Following the Zone diet plan may help. Your A1C is still good, which is an overall average of your daily blood sugars.
This thread is a recent discussion of the Zone:
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/thread158200.html


That is a high insulin number. Mine is 34 and my doctor thought THAT was high! If you exercise at all before that insulin reading is taken...it will be high... a false high.

I did not find that r-lipoic 100mg did anything to my fasting readings, at all. So it does not affect everyone equally that way.
( I test each morning).

Stress will raise morning readings too in some people. This is called the dawn phenomenon, and is based on increased cortisol levels when you wake up. Having a small snack at night with protein in it, may change that reading.

Mostly to sensitize insulin at the receptor level, chromium picolinate is used. 200-400mcg tablets, once a day.

Avoiding sugar and starchy carbs may just be all you need to do.
Keep meals moderate in size and don't overeat, and have small servings of nuts for snacks instead of carbs, and you may find things settle down.
Just eating a bit more conservatively, can do wonders.

Hey, my fasting insulin level was 25--
 

--and even that is considered high.

Unfortunately, I don't know of any timed released form of lipoic acid on the market as of yet. You could try taking 50mg twice a day--once in the morning, once in the evening--and see how that works. We're all experiments of one in this regard.

I do agree, though with your self-designation as prediabetic--your insulin numbers, even if skewed, are indicative of insulin resistance in your bodily tissues, even if your pancreas can still make enough to keep your glucose levels relatively in check. As Mrs. D says, eating more conservatively and more carb/fat/protein balanced might be enough to keep it controlled; I would also recommend weight-bearing/muscle building exercise to the extent you can tolerate it, as muscle is more sensitive to insulin than most other body tissue and increased muscle mass can help the body reduce its overall insulin needs. Fat is harder to sensitize, so getting rid of some also helps.

Lowering that insulin may change your lipid numbers.

Fish oil is really good for lowering triglycerides.

The LDL... well... there are two LDL's. One is less problematic than the other. Also there is a test for Lipo-a.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35058896.../#.Tow95XLYX-s

http://labtestsonline.org/understand.../lp-a/tab/test
( I had this test to get the doctor off my back, with my borderline LDL's--I refuse statins at every visit.)
Lipo-a, is a genetic condition, if you test normal or low you don't have to repeat it. When low or normal there is less risk.

Many thanks for the feedback and a couple of comments.


1) I am already taking two fish oils capsules per day of 1200 mg each.


2) I also taken the appropiate magnisium, Vit. B-12, and D-3. I also take a low dose of Armour Thyroid (30 mcg per day giving me a TSH of 1.12).


3) In the past I used 1800 mg of regular Alpha Lipoic Acid taken several times per day. That, in-turn, seemed to reduce my fasting and 2-hour sugar numbers by 10 to 20 %.


4) I then noticed the same thing when I took 600 mg of R-Lipoic Acid daily about a year ago.


5) That being said, Mrs. D, I thought that you mentioned that your sugar numbers came down by 10 points when you were using R-Lipoic Acid. Is that correct and / or am I missing something? I thought that ALA and / or RLA were natural and effective ways of tackling blood sugar?


6) With a blood insulin level of 114 should I be concerned about some type of malfunction with my pancreas itself (I also did not exercise before the test)?





Thanks!

... this is what I found at the top of the Google list when researching Chromium Picolonate which does not make me want to run out and take it:


http://www.vanderbilt.edu/ans/psycho...picolinate.htm

My sugars have fluctuated greatly since I started doing daily morning readings.

I've had many lows in the morning, and I might have attributed it in the beginning to the r-lipoic which I take at night.

But after this summer getting 103-109's without metformin OR lipoic which I did not take up there on vacation, I am totally stumped as to what makes me have higher sugars at home!

I had a gall bladder attack up there this summer and stopped just about everything, and had the best readings I've had in a year! go figure.

I've been taking the lipoic now here at 100mg at night, and don't see much effect. I average about 110 here now without the metformin. (I was getting about 135 to 139 WITH metformin previously! )

What really is working for me so far is the theanine (surprise surprise!)... that is the only new thing I've been on since early August. Theanine is supposed to have cortisol lowering properties, and if my fasting is a dawn phenom...and cortisol driven, it might be a factor.
I started the theanine based on a post here quoting Dr. Blaylock MD who suggested it in his newsletter for PNers. I am taking 150mg a night, and when that bottle is gone, I'll up to 200mg (because the Swanson's brand only comes in 100mg sizes).

The doses you were taking of both ALA and r-lipoic are far higher than I have ever tried. R-lipoic sort of makes me jittery, and I had to start at 50mg because of that factor.

Chromium picolinate is used in my area by several endos for their patients. That is why I suggested it to you. It is supposed to sensitize the cell receptors, or help the pancreas make insulin. As far as weight loss goes, that is always a gray area IMO.

Vanadyl sulfate:
http://www.raysahelian.com/vanadiumvanadylsulfate.html

Chromium:
http://www.raysahelian.com/chromium.html

Since you had good results with the R-lipoic in high dose, why not just go back to that? It looks expensive however to do 600mg of it.

I post frequently on a different diabetes forum, we feel ALA my help your nerves regerate as you bring your glucose down. It does not help with your glucose levels. IMO, you need to be testing frequently during the day to see what each food does to you, I test a minimum 8 times a day.