Question about using syringes with Flexpen
 

Here's a good one for you all. I use the Flextouch. Pen needles are very expensive. I have loads of syringes in my house. I thought to myself. Why can't I use the syringe, stick it (of course using alchohol swabs first), stick it in the flex pen and get the insulin out that way.


Then I found this video on youtube which made it even easier.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjOtTuh1BCU

Anyone ever do this? This will save me lots of money.

Thanks much

Melody

Why not get your insulin in a vial in the first place?

The flex pens are just for convenience.

I thought the needles for the pens were covered by Medicare part D or supplemental plans?

https://www.bd.com/us/diabetes/page....=7002&id=19007

I thought so too. But they want $33.00 for the pen needles. That was last year. It seemed simpler to just get them online from ADW (whatever the initials are). the thing with the FlexTouch is that you can leave it outside on the table. Vials have to be stored in the fridge.

When Alan was in the hospital I could carry the pen around. The pen makes it more convenient but I pay $19.00 for a box of 100 pen needles. with all the syringes I have in the house, before I have to buy another box of pen needles I figured I could use these syringes. And I have two more boxes of Flex Touch pens in my fridge so I'm good for awhile with the insulin.

But my insurance company really screwed me up bad by telling me that because I have EPIC, once I hit the deductible of $600 (all my prescription co-pays), EPIC would take over. Not the case. EPIC is not counting my $225 layout for my insulin since January because I got my insulin through mail order (being doing this for years). They only count your copay if you bought your drugs from a New York Based pharmacy. I asked this question last year at the meeting of all the people who are on my insurance plan. I made sure to ask that question. And I was told "Absolutely, once you have paid the deductible EPIC takes over". I have appealed this, made complaints, all to no avail. This is what I told the rep of my insurance plan over the phone last week (because I just found out I have to lay out over $250 toward my next insulin purchase).

I said "You better believe that in November when you have the next meeting of all of us to discuss the changes that will come in 2016, you better believe I'm going to stand up and rake all of you over the coals for lying to me.". The rep said "You wouldn't do that would you?" I said "Watch me". then I said "I will probably change insurance companies"

She had no response because EPIC IS WHAT EPIC IS. I would never have continued to get my insulin from an online pharmacy (even though it's through my insurance) if I had been told "you have to buy it from a New York Pharmacy for EPIC to kick in"

So anyway, what's the verdict? Can I do what this guy did in the video. I'm pretty good with stuff like that. My hands are steady and I can absolutely follow what he did.

So I just wanted to make sure that the insulin in the Flex pen is the exact same insulin in the vials. So if I take 10 units in the a.m. I would just take a syringe, do what the guy did and I'd be good to go.

Is this do-able?

Thanks Mrs. D

Melody

I would call your pharmacy and discuss the insulin and dosing...
or go into any one and talk face to face.

Take your pens, and whatever and compare contents, there.

Sounds like a plan. Thanks much.

Melody

I Watched it
 

Hi Melody,

I watched the video. I do not see anything wrong with transferring the insulin from the pen into a syringe and then injecting. It appears to me that this method will actually SAVE you from the 2 units of insulin that get wasted priming the pen needle each time you inject.

As to the alcohol swabbing of the pen stopper ??? Why?? Isn't your syringe needle sterile? Do you plan on using the "SAME" syringe and needle more than once? Seems to me if you are using a sterile syringe and needle each time you "transfer" the insulin from the pen to the syringe, you should not need to swab the pen stopper.

The more pertinent question is the compatibility of the dosages that you spoke of in your later post. Since you have been prescribed the pen and the dosage to use with the pen, then the video shows you just dial in your dosage and transfer it to the syringe for injecting. You are not trying to reconcile or equate the dosage of vial insulin to pen insulin.

It is my belief from your post that you are just adding a second step to change the delivery system from pen to syringe for injecting for the purposes of using the insulin needle rather than purchasing pen needles.

I use pen insulin and buy the pen needles. I do not find them expensive. I get 300 pen needles for about $25 without insurance. It is the $500 I pay for the pens that deplete my funds. Also, wasting 2 units of insulin for every injection, adds up in insulin waste and cost. The pen needle needs to be primed each time. With 3-4 injections per day, I am wasting 6-8 units of insulin which I have already stated is a BIG cost.

Maybe I should adopt the method in the video to save me all the wasted insulin for priming the pen needle. The syringe needle is primed when transferring the insulin from the pen to the syringe.

To be accurate about dosing, if you are using pens, use the amount prescribed by your physician for the pen. If you are using vials, use the amount prescribed by your physician for the vial. The delivery system should not matter but the CONTENTS do. Do NOT use the vial AMOUNT from a pen and vice versa. Do NOT use the pen dosage AMOUNT if using vial insulin.

The contents may be different. Not just the storage.

If you are prescribed say 30 units of the flexpen as the proper dosage, if using the contents from the pen, set the dial to 30 as indicated in the video and put in the syringe and inject.

If you are prescribed say 10 units of vial insulin as the proper dosage, if using the contents from the vial, use only the 10 units prescribed.

Transferring contents from the pen to a syringe should not have anything to do with the dosage. Do NOT use the markings on the syringe, use the pen dial to select the proper dosage from the pen.

Hope I made some sense to you.

NO, the insulin in the Flex pen may not be the exact same insulin in the vials. You would need to check with your pharmacist or physician first to be sure they equate and that the dosage would be the same.

I am a little confused here. If you have been prescribed the Flex pen and have changed FROM vials TO pen, didn't your physician tell you if the dosage would be the same or not?

If your physician had you using 10 units of vial insulin, have you been using 10 units of the Flex pen so far?

You need to check with your doctor about dosing amounts but as far as how you deliver the proper dose, is a matter of preference.

If you are using the CONTENTS from the pen and just transferring the PEN dosage to a syringe for injecting, the pen dosage is the amount you should transfer.

How you get it into your body is not the question. The question is what is the proper dosage. Only your physician can tell you that.

Yes, the pens are more convenient to carry and do not need refrigeration after they have been placed in use.

I find it a little more comfortable to inject room temperature insulin than the cold refrigerated insulin.

The temperature of the insulin may also have a slight effect upon the speed of action within the body just as the injection site may also have a slight effect upon the speed of action within the body.

I don't think either of these are very significant, temperature or injection site location, but it has been stated that there may be a slight delay in action.

Just to clarify. I do not use vials. Have not used vials for almost 9 years. Only the Flex Pen (which is now called the Flex Touch). My problem was the cost of the pen needles. I watched this video and saw him dial the amount, stick in the syringe, transfer the insulin to the syringe and that was it.

I think I phrased my question incorrectly. I should have said "I want to use a syringe and get the insulin out of my flex touch and inject myself. I now realize this has nothing to do with vials. I will still be using the flex touch, only I will be tranferring the insulin via the syringe (as the guy in the video did). I have all these syringes in a box that someone gave to me. By doing this, I will be saving money on pen needles. Some people can't give themselves a shot with a syringe. They need to use pen needles. Doesn't matter to me. I have a friend who absolutely won't use the vials and the syringes anymore because she hates needles. I said to her "But the Flex Pen uses a pen needle". Her response?" No, it's like a toy, I just dial it up and press into my stomach".

Different strokes for different folks.

And you are correct, you don't have to prime the two units. I will be saving my insulin and making it last longer.

I think tonight I will do it that way.

Will update

Thanks much
Melody

Here is a consumer safety site for pens...

http://www.consumermedsafety.org/too...lin-pen-safety

Notice that even temperature changes may cause leakage with them, changing the concentration of the insulin itself.

I also have a concern about puncturing the membrane often.
It may not be designed for this and it may begin to leak or inject some air in there.

These devices are very complex, and somewhat like asthma inhalers. To get accurate doses each time, the device is designed a certain way for accuracy. If you alter its use, it may defeat the process and change the dosing.

This is why there are no generic pens, and few if any generic inhalers. It is just too tricky to get the engineering to conform to the product. It costs alot and requires specialist mechanical engineers to design these things.