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-   -   Ketogenic Diet (https://www.neurotalk.org/traumatic-brain-injury-and-post-concussion-syndrome/250680-ketogenic-diet.html)

chasann 01-19-2018 09:23 PM

Ketogenic Diet
 
I recall mention of this diet as possibly being beneficial to folk with sustained brain injury, or neurological issues. Comment wanted from folk who tried it or are living by it, as to the efficacy of it.
Thanks

JBuckl 01-19-2018 09:41 PM

Great diet if done right
 
It was AMAZING for my brain, but tough on my kidneys. I was doing it wrong though. Not enough vegetables and not supplementing with alkalizing foods/drinks, such as apple cider vinegar, and sodium bicarbonate.

I should say that I have had a kidney stone in the past.

I'm apart of a forum on Facebook. A lady there said she had severe symptoms for 8 years after a TBI. Misdiagnosed with Alzheimer's, put on meds, etc.

ALL of her symptoms are gone.

It's incredible. But should not be a full-time thing. It's best to do it as needed.

Currently, trying to get back into it. I'd be happy to point towards research or books on the diet and TBI.

JBuckl 01-19-2018 09:43 PM

It basically brought my functioning up from like a 20-60% range depending on the day, to 60-80%. Sound and light sensitivity were about normal. I came out of a brain fog I didn't know I was in.

It feels great to have mental clarity.

chasann 01-20-2018 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBuckl (Post 1257923)
It basically brought my functioning up from like a 20-60% range depending on the day, to 60-80%. Sound and light sensitivity were about normal. I came out of a brain fog I didn't know I was in.

It feels great to have mental clarity.

Would appreciate your pointers/suggestions, on books, references etc that you found helpful.

Am listening to a current series by Dr Mark Hyman on the Broken Brain, and merit is made mention of Mediterranean and Ketogenic Diets.

Mental Clarity, what's that? can hardly remember what it's like!

Thanks.

JBuckl 01-20-2018 08:48 AM

I'm trying my best to get to that series myself. Glad to hear they're promoting good info.

I have to head to work soon, but will get a list of resources hopefully later today.

JBuckl 01-22-2018 07:31 AM

A really good resource is this site:

What is the Ketogenic Diet? A Comprehensive Beginner's Guide

A great book, which I only got to a few pages of and skimming before borrowing to someone else:

The Ketogenic Bible: The Authoritative Guide to Ketosis: Jacob Wilson, Ryan Lowery: 97816286146: Amazon.com: Books

I would start with those, but as far as support groups and other places to get good info, there's Keto for Neuro on Facebook, where members have some neurological diangosis/condition, including brain injury.

Electrolytes (and their ratios) and water are huge as the body excretes them quickly. So look into fairy/electrolyte dust by this site, which I like though they promote lots of dairy, which is not good for all people and has to be of good quality (or as good as a person can afford). Do not overdo electrolytes either. I had way too much pink salt my first go and I think that contributed to my kidney pain.

Vitamins and supplements for Keto - Impulsive Keto

I did read a story on a TBI/PCS Facebook forum that a lady had rather severe symptoms after a TBI, was diagnosed with Alzheimer's, put on meds, tried loads of therapies, but is now symptom free after going and staying keto. Pretty neat.

There's lots more out there for info, including supplementing with something like MCT oil (only get C8/C10 triglyecerides if you do) or ketone salts, but I don't want to overwhelm you and give you too much that you don't give the diet a shot.

Basically, keto increases lots of good things in the brain and body (antioxidants, BDNF, GABA, mitochondrial health, etc.) but it CAN go very wrong if people don't do it right (keto flu, kidney stones, etc.)

chasann 01-23-2018 04:05 AM

Heads up on following through, I will explore this. Was not aware of it until I read of it on here.
It is always helpful to know the WHY - for me anyways - which is part of reason why I am enjoying Brokenbrain series.

For many of us it is sleep, rest, released from hospital and then you are pretty much on your own, or at the mercy of Insurance Companies, complimentary or functional medicine ignored.

Omegas were never been mentioned by the medical profession when my father, and later my son sustained TBI. Nor was it for me until neuro physio and chiropractor mentioned it and on finding I had put myself on fish oil suggested I up my intake.

Best of and gratefully yours.

todayistomorrow 01-28-2018 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBuckl (Post 1257954)
I'm trying my best to get to that series myself. Glad to hear they're promoting good info.

I have to head to work soon, but will get a list of resources hopefully later today.

How bad was your brain fog? I know a lot of people use the term brain fog, but it’s almost hard to believe anyone could improve this aspect having lived it for 6 years with no relief.

I’m on day 6 of Keto and currently miserable. I’m supplementing electrolytes and counting macros.

How long did it take to notice difference? I know they say 1-3 months to get fat adapted.

I’m very happy it has helped you.

Mark in Idaho 01-28-2018 05:34 PM

I'd sure like to see some Keto proponent address the possibility that the improvements from a Keto diet may have nothing to do with ketosis and more to do with the many foods that are eliminated from the diet when going Keto.

The effect of sugars and other things consumed in a contemporary diet are very suspect and studies suggest they are a key part of the struggles people have. The improvements many claim and report are long before they have achieved a state of ketosis, if they ever even reach that state. Using MCT oil as a pick me up goes against all of the keto science.


Can we achieve the benefits by just cleaning up our diets?

JBuckl 01-28-2018 07:42 PM

*How bad was your brain fog? I know a lot of people use the term brain fog, but it’s almost hard to believe anyone could improve this aspect having lived it for 6 years with no relief.

I've been doing some testing the last few days with a simple blood glucose meter. I find if I eat carby foods, I get lots of fog and fatigue and it correlates with a higher blood glucose. But if I eat low carb foods, I don't get the fog -- or at least as much.

Ketosis is more for healing and for an added level of clarity. I did it wrong the first time. Not enough vegetables, hadn't been low carb for long, too acidic, etc.

*I’m on day 6 of Keto and currently miserable. I’m supplementing electrolytes and counting macros.

I'd suggest doing a little more research. Take some time to be low carb if you hadn't and be real clean with your diet, and then try again.

*How long did it take to notice difference? I know they say 1-3 months to get fat adapted.

There's fat adapted and being keto adapted. You can be one without the other.

JBuckl 01-28-2018 07:45 PM

*Can we achieve the benefits by just cleaning up our diets?

One can ponder that, but the truth lies in trying it.

Ketosis is great for some, horrible for others.

Mark in Idaho 01-28-2018 11:09 PM

But, if you try going Keto, how do you know you are getting into ketosis vs just being free of the junk?

All of the claims appear to indicate the benefits start before any ketosis has taken effect.

I've read so much of the literature, mostly promotional, some claiming to be science, that has contradictory claims.

As the saying goes, Follow the money. Data is manipulated for profit. Claims made often refer to published reports. But, when you read those reports, there are issues that are ignored that speak against the claims made.

MCT oil promoters are the worst at selective reporting to support their claims.

jbuckl, You state that if you eat carby foods.......then eating low carb.......

Everything I have read says that ketosis does not work that fast.

What glucose reading do you see at different carb levels?

todayistomorrow 01-28-2018 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark in Idaho (Post 1258359)
I'd sure like to see some Keto proponent address the possibility that the improvements from a Keto diet may have nothing to do with ketosis and more to do with the many foods that are eliminated from the diet when going Keto.

The effect of sugars and other things consumed in a contemporary diet are very suspect and studies suggest they are a key part of the struggles people have. The improvements many claim and report are long before they have achieved a state of ketosis, if they ever even reach that state. Using MCT oil as a pick me up goes against all of the keto science.


Can we achieve the benefits by just cleaning up our diets?

MCT oil is definitely recommended for Keto. I do bulletproof coffee in the morning, tablespoon of grass fed butter, MCT oil, and blend it up with coffee.

I’m no expert, but as I linked in an earlier post, listen to Dom dagostino on joe rogsn podcast, he talks about the changes that occur in Ketosis and why it’s beneficial for people with mTBI.

kiwi33 01-28-2018 11:56 PM

I think that this is an interesting discussion.

In adults glucose is the preferred source of energy for the brain. It can use what are called ketone bodies (derived from breakdown of fatty acids) as an energy source when the storage form of glucose (glycogen, found in muscle and liver tissue) is depleted or under more severe conditions like starvation.

From the link to the ketogenic diet above, much of it seems sensible to me; emphasising eating a wide range of minimally-processed foods.

However, its stricture that grain foods should not be eaten does not seem rational. Wholegrain foods like brown rice and wholegrain bread are rich sources of many nutrients as well as glucose. They are also a source of fibre, which is protective against bowel cancer.

The glucose in wholegrain foods is released slowly during digestion which means that there is not an insulin spike, The contrast is with processed grain foods like white rice and bread; glucose is released rapidly from them during digestion, with a corresponding insulin spike. This can lead to insulin resistance which is a risk factor for Type 2 diabetes.

In summary, I can see no rational grounds for avoiding wholegrain foods as part of a healthy diet.


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