[angelrsd]

has anyone seen the documarty called sicko by michale moore ? me and dh wathced this tonight and boggled my mind to say the least if you are able try to see this . very informative. i m not the biggest fan of his but this hit the nail on the head so to speak wanted to know if anyone else saw this and there opoins

[dreambeliever128]

I haven't seen it. But would like to.

Could you tell us a little about it? I think the reason Michael Moore is unliked by many is that he researches and tells the truth.

I have heard on Fox News that in the Stimulus packet there is going to be someone overseeing the health industry to make sure certain treatments aren't done on people due to the insurance. One newsman said that HMO's were already doing that. They said it would make it so much harder for people to get the help they need.

Ada

[angelrsd]

should of explained huh lol
ok he goes to other counrties ie great britain and france canada and even cuba . when he was in these countries he went to the hospital in those countries and asked what were the cost for most treatments and even surgical treatments. there is not any cost for medical treatments that he showed in france. and even if you are pregnant and after deliver of your child the GOVERNMENT sends a person to your house to help you with chores around the house so that you can rest.


the government also will pay for time off after a major illness algon side your employer so that you can rest and get well. in america this is not even heard of. i have state medicaide and still have problems with them paying for certain blocks that i need or certain meds can you belive that they wont pay for erthromaycin at all . also alot fo universitys are free of charge and this a hugh thing for me with small child and the rising cost of state university. i know here that in the last 10 yrs that the cost of college for state has raised at least 10-15% a year.

i guess that is about it. i was thinking how nice it would be for us that is sick chronically how nice it would be not to be turned away and treated like a human being , and not have debt out of our ears for medical expenses


-carrie

[llrn7470]

While this might sound great-be careful. Michael Moore is also known for filming what he wants to film and not generally being fair. People fly here for treatments because most socialized medicine countries have ridiculous wait lists for care and surgery. They can actually say you have to wait weeks to months for interventions such as cardiac surgery that are done here right away. Why? The doctors are paid for providing care. When doctors are paid flat rates, they limit the number of procedures they are willing to do in a day.
I personally know of no government run agency that I would call efficient. I can't say that socializing medical care would be more effective. You may find that people who actually live in these countries aren't as thrilled as you think they are. Remember that even if the benefits sound great, you know someone has to pay the bill eventually You could obtain any of these services if you wanted them, but would have to pay for them. Socialized medicine is the same-you will pay in one way or another for services.

[angelrsd]

that is true but its sad to say as the biggest country minus our problems now why is it that we as americans pay 100xs as much for meds. while in other countries the price for med for any amount of any meds is sometimes a set price. i just wish that our government would see how much normal people and sick ppl are having to fork over for meds. which is crazy. it opens your eyes to how much money every company and government makes off us each year. that is all i meant by this post. and how hard for us that are uninsurable how hard that makes our lives just tryin to get the right medical care period. i know this is a touchy subject. wasnt tryn to be way out there on this at all. just wanted to see how anyone else felt about this subject or those that live over seas what there experiences were thats all


carrie

[dreambeliever128]

we are headed that way.

Our meds are priced to high. Some are out of reach for patients who need them and I hear of so many people who can't even find PCP's around here. The PCP's seem to be getting less and less.

I feel they should have to take any insurance you have and if you have to pay a little different then so be it. They paperwork seems to make Drs. turn away from certain insurances such as Medicaid.

Carrie, I don't remember what state you are in but Co. has some of the best Medicaid programs I have seen. Ky. sucks big big time for helping people. The hospitals can turn you away down there.

Here they go by your income. When I first got sick, I paid 10. for the ER and 10 for the surgeries. It was the Drs. that you had to pay and deal with. When I needed surgeries though, a lot came forward and did them free or at a minimal price.

When I finally got on SSI and Medicaid it paid for everything. Meds and all. Co. also has a home care program. I have a caregiver to help me out. They helped pay for my new furnace. We have free food programs and so much more here. I do notice most states don't have as much.

Now I am on Medicare and they don't pay for my meds so I had to find a secondary insurance to help pay for them but Co. helps me pay them.

I am afraid that things are going to get worse with this economy like it it. From what I am hearing with the Stimulus packet, no doubt. As I told you, I do know that they are going to be able to pick and choose what treatments we get for illnesses.

Unfortunately health care is now becoming owned by the Gov. such as everything else so we can't seem to talk about it without crossing over into politics.

Ada

[Chemar]

just a caution here for this thread please not to turn political as we have a "no politics" rule at NT

also be careful about spreading rumor about health care plans that have not even been unveiled yet. there is a lot of misinformation around, both pro and con.
better to wait for the facts first.

[Mslday]

Originally Posted by llrn7470

While this might sound great-be careful. Michael Moore is also known for filming what he wants to film and not generally being fair. People fly here for treatments because most socialized medicine countries have ridiculous wait lists for care and surgery. They can actually say you have to wait weeks to months for interventions such as cardiac surgery that are done here right away. Why? The doctors are paid for providing care. When doctors are paid flat rates, they limit the number of procedures they are willing to do in a day.
I personally know of no government run agency that I would call efficient. I can't say that socializing medical care would be more effective. You may find that people who actually live in these countries aren't as thrilled as you think they are. Remember that even if the benefits sound great, you know someone has to pay the bill eventually You could obtain any of these services if you wanted them, but would have to pay for them. Socialized medicine is the same-you will pay in one way or another for services.

Here in Vancouver Canada we have a 3 - 4 year wait list for new patients to get into the the pain clinic in Vancouver. The doctor only has 4 beds for treating the whole province, the government will ultimately fly in patients from remote areas for treatments that can't be offered in their communities. The only reason I got early treatment (finally after a 6 month wait) was because I knew somebody who works with my PM doctor and I got bumped ahead. Otherwise I would have been waiting like everyone else while the rsd got worse. While our medical health care premiums are relatively low $78.00 per month for a family, our taxes are very very high here!!!! There are pros and cons to universal medicine. If your income is low most medications are fully paid for, but there are many restrictions especially for off label use.

Some very good sides to our medical system...well I've lost a couple of family members to terminal illnesses, through it all they were very well cared for by the doctors and nurses, including allowing us to have in home palliative care programs and and it didn't bankrupt our family. And yes we can pick our own doctor, (that is if you can find one taking new patients, we have a shortage of doctors especially primary care physicians)

Switzerland seems to have a terrific medical system, not socialized rather it is a "consumer driven" medical system where it is mandatory for everyone to have insurance but the people can purchase it from a number of insurance companies, most employers offer it as a benefit and the government will help those who have lower incomes. Doctors are fairly well paid, not quite as much as American drs. though. I'm reading an interesting book right now called "Who Killed Heath Care?" by Regina Herzlinger. where she discusses this in detail.

Michael Moore uses sensationalism to drive his point home, but on the other hand so do many of the right wing opponents who use fear and rhetoric to maintain the status quo.

There are no doubt some very interesting points of view out there.

MsL

[angelrsd]

i agree with everything said i just think that something has to give for the american socitey regarding healthcare.

ada in tennessee we do have what they call it tenncare its a mixture of medicade and state insurance also . when our new govenern came in they trimmed the fat so to speak alot who were sick or even trached lost their coverage there was alot of of ppl who didnt need to be on the insurance in the first place . but it does help but i have trouble with them approving alot of common meds even for my lil ones it does get redundit also there are alot of things for my rsd they wont pay for


but socialised i wouldnt be happy with that at all. and like i said michale more isnt my favorite i just happen to change the channel to that and watched it just enlighten me on some things that is all.

[angelrsd]

i am sorry if i offend anyone