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10-14-2011, 10:35 PM
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#31 | ||
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There are two kinds of Continuing Disability Reviews. One is a Work CDR and the other is a Medical CDR. SSDI benefits can be ceased because of either one.
A person may not have any medical recovery, but may be ceased if they have used their Trial Work Period and are engaging inS Substantial Gainful Activity after a Work CDR. For example, a deaf person or a paraplegic person may not have medical recovery, but are holding down a job and are fully earning over the SGA amount for that year. Still medically disabled, but still ceased on SSDI. On the other hand, a person who has agoraphobia or severe depression may have medical recovery that is evidenced by their ability to attend college full time and do all that is expected of a full time student. That person may be ceased during a medical CDR because they have demonstrated by their daily activities that their disability is no longer severe enough to prevent them from engaging in SGA, even though they are not working. Also, getting a degree or a certification can improve your vocational profile and make you capable of doing a different kind of job than you did before you became disabled. A former ditch digger who graduates from law school may now be able to work even with a bad back. These examples seem pretty clear to me. If you have other types of conditions, the decision becomes less clear and more muddy. There is no definitive answer to the question of what happens if you go to school. |
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10-15-2011, 08:44 AM
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#32 | ||
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Junior Member
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I didn't pull it out of thin air. Both articles (Sorry, no links) said they were lawyers. You know lawyers do disagree. I am not giving bad advice. I am just repeating what I have read or was told.
There are different terms. Substantial Gainful Work Substantial Gainful Activity Maybe Substantial Gainful Income (That is more ssi, not ssdi) They can change the rules after you are disabled but if you are grandfather in. They have to go by the old rules. In my sons case, they have to go by the old rules. Otherwise, he wouldn't be getting SSDI. A lawyer really needs to find out if Social Security Change it from Substantial Gainful Work to Substantial Gainful Activity. If they didn't. There is a good chance for a class action lawsuit. There is another option. You take classes at home on a computer, that shouldn't be considered Substantial Gainful Activity. |
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10-15-2011, 10:00 AM
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#33 | ||
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Member
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SSA uses the term SGA, Substantial Gainful Activity. This is not new at all. Decades old terminology. There is no change. Here is the definition: https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0410501001 May want to read the entire chapter. The Activity does have to be Gainful. So if you are not making any money, you are not performing SGA and can't be ceased because of SGA. But the ability to do substantial activity all day could mean you have medical improvement and are no longer disabled, no longer incapable of performing Gainful Substantial Activity. Ceased due to medical improvement, as opposed to being ceased due to work. And for SSI, any income can be used to determine payment. It doesn't have to be substantial. It doesn't even have to be activity related. Any money an SSI recipient gets can be used to determine SSI payments - inheritances, free rent, pensions, wages, gambling winnings, dividends, gifts, etc. |
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10-15-2011, 10:26 AM
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#34 | ||
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Member
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2. Define what you mean about education "counted against your disability". Vocational factors are used at steps 4 and 5 of sequential evaluation of disability. A person who was only able to do unskilled manual labor may become educated enough to be able to do a sedentary job at a desk that pays alot of money. So education can make a person more marketable, more capable of many kinds of work, which can result in a denial or cessation at steps 4 or 5. 3. You disagree with the amount of public assistance (welfare) that is paid by SSI. You change that by voting in legislators who are willing to raise your taxes or take money from other places where it is being spent now. SSDI is based on money paid in payroll taxes. Actuaries predict the system is already unsustainable and many 20 year old believe they will never get a penny. Increasing SSDI will hasten the insolvency. But perhaps you believe SSDI should also been needs based and only paid to people who did not, could not, or would not save their own money. Again, change that by your vote. 4. Social Security does not claim that going to school is substantial gainful work. As I said in another post, SSA uses the term Substantial Gainful Activity. Going to school is not gainful. No change. The other places you looked for answers gave you an incorrect term - substantial gainful work. No such thing in SSA. |
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10-15-2011, 11:28 AM
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#35 | ||
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Junior Member
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When you turn 65, you are eligible for SSI benefits based on income not disability. The mistake was SSI should of put it in his name when he turned 18 or 21.
SSDI should not be needs based. I am talking about ending poverty. No one should be in poverty anywhere. It is kind of sicking the way the U.S. doesn't really help it is citizen. Like for example. Norway. No homeless, No poor. You get help with one program, but it could count against another. AARP, Said Social Security is fine. I am taking about SSI or SSDI raising it up higher so no one will every be in poverty. If congress mess it up-I am worried that my son will be homeless, it keeps looking that way. I don't think he could handle being homeless. He has had nightmare. I said he is very unsecure. |
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10-15-2011, 04:15 PM
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#36 | ||
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Magnate
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Janke has provided you solid information, as have others. Since you seem unwilling to believe anything other than your own interpretation of SS's rules and regulations, then the next step would be to make an appointment with either an attorney or a local non profit advocacy service that has extensive Social Security Disability experience and take your son to discuss all the legal questions you both have regarding his disability. |
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10-15-2011, 06:03 PM
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#37 | ||
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Junior Member
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LIT LOVE. You are misunderstand my post, you are twisting them and putting word into them. Please don't do that.
SSI & SSDI are two different programs. He is not eligible to draw on his own. I told him if he really wants to be his own payee. Wait tell he is 65. This way he will still be able get SSI on income only because he wouldn't get SSDI if they determine he is no longer disabled. I also told him other options from reading other post & info from the web. Moving out of the country would not require a payee. The reason. There are no payee agencies in other countries. Plus a payee in the U.S. couldn't pay bills in the country he living in. There are locations in the U.S. where there is not a Payee agency close by. He could move to a city, where a payee would create a hardship. |
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10-16-2011, 01:12 AM
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#38 | ||
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Member
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You seem to believe there are only three choices: 1. He becomes his own payee and will be automatically determined not disabled. Wrong. Many, most SSDI recipients do not have payees. 2. He can give up SSDI at age 65 and opt for SSI instead. Wrong. 3. He can leave the US in order to get away from having a payee. He still has to establish that he is capable. If he has this severe mental problem that keeps him from being able to work, just how will he manage in a country in which he doesn't speak the language like a native, have a support system or be comfortable with the culture? Leaving the US doesn't take away the issue of capability. But it would seem to me that if you think he can thrive in Ecuador, it means his disabling mental problems just may not be that bad because he can deal with this kind of major change. Or perhaps your family has been vacationing for years in Ecuador or have extended family. I am sure there are ways of a person in the US paying bills in another country, especially in this online banking era. Geography doesn't determine whether or not a person needs a payee. Turning 65 doesn't determine whether or not a person needs a payee. I am also confused about your statement that he is not eligible to draw on his own. Isn't he currently getting SSDI based on his own earnings? Or are you referring to the payee requirement. If he is capable of being his own payee now, why are you opposed to it? Why do you not want him to live as indepently as he can and to practice managing money while you are still around to bail him out if he messes up and gets conned or swindled or makes a foolish choice? |
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10-16-2011, 09:26 AM
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#39 | ||
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Junior Member
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I am not saying to waive SSDI. He doesn't get his own SSDI. He was disabled before he was 18. I told him to wait tell his 65 and ask not to have a payee then. Then if they say he can be his own payee but would lose his SSDI. He would have SSI to fall back on. The reason SSI becomes income based at age 65. He did work when his was 16, that not enough to get his own SS or SSDI
Anyone can get conned disabled or not. What a foolish choice to you, may not be a foolish choice to me or him. I already let him manage some of the stuff as I said in other postings. Everyone makes bad choices and still do. Should everyone have a payee because they made foolish or bad choices? No. We both still make bad choices. I buy lottery ticket but don't go overboard. That bad choice for some people. I let him have a credit card, that was a bad choice. I made him close it but still owes on it. I did let him open up a wal-mart credit card, I am going to let him keep that even if it gets upgraded to a discover. So, he can have food while he deals with SS & my estate. He has to tell Wal-mart to keep the credit limit at $1,000 & no higher. The reason to move to Ecuador the cost of living is very cheaper. Social Security(Not ssi). My main concern, I want him to live a better life. Otherwise, I don't think he would be able to handle it. He is already worried with congress trying to cut this. Not to get political, he changed from independent to mostly democrat. This fall may be his first straight party vote. This is how worried his is & can't get good sleep. Which is not healthily. I am worried too. I did tell him, He & I could also move to another country that gives foreigner a living allowance. |
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10-16-2011, 03:06 PM
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#40 | ||
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Magnate
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Being able to use a debit card time does not prove he is capable of paying the rent and utilities on time, and making smart decisions about the small amount of money that is left over. Unless he's getting food stamps, or whatever they call it these days, groceries would be an important part of the budget he'd be responsible for.
Why not do a small test. Give him a week's worth of the grocery budget and see what type of choices he makes. Having a debit card would allow him to withdraw all his benefits in cash for the month, the first day it is deposited. Can you trust him enough to give him the cash for your rent and that he'll get it to your landlord? Last edited by LIT LOVE; 10-16-2011 at 05:52 PM. Reason: removed a section. |
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