[cmullen]

I am currently seeing a spine surgeon for back pain involving the L4-5 and L3-4 areas of my spine. In the past 2 months I have had 2 epidural injections to this area of my spine to obtain relief from my chronic pain (on a scale of 1-10 my pain is 7 - 10) making it difficult to walk any lengths. After being on my feet for an hour I must sit down to lessen my pain and continue my activities (i.e. cooking in the kitchen or light cleaning). Throughout the years my chronic pain has worsened to the point where I am seeking surgery as an option to lessening my chronic pain. I mentioned to my surgeon, how to tell if I am a candidate for the X-stop procedure. After discussing what movements decrease my level of pain i.e. bending over forwards, sitting, and lying down) he replied placing this device at L4-5 level would be worth considering. He also said that it's a 50/50 chance of success for some patients, but no guarantee. Over the past decade, I have had many types of injections and other outpatient procedures (to widen the spinal canal) with little relief. I would appreciate hearing from others regarding success/failure of X-stop placement.

[Leesa]

I'm so sorry you're having such pain. I have the same problems in the same area, plus it has spread.

I must caution you about surgery. Do NOT expect pain relief from surgery. Surgery ONLY repairs mechanical problems. It is NOT intended for pain relief. If you happen to get pain relief from surgery, it's just a bonus. Doctors should NOT tell you that you WILL get pain relief because most of the time you will have the same pain or worse after surgery. There are times when the pain IS relieved, but that is not the rule.

I've had 2 open surgeries on L3-4 & L4-5 and each time the pain was worse. Those were 25 years ago, and the pain is still awful. I had a Spinal cord Stimulator implanted, but due to problems I had to have it removed -- that was unusual. Perhaps it would help YOU. Usually they are GREAT for pain relief, but only if you have neuropathy. Do you have pain in the legs/feet? The stimulator isn't great for just back pain -- but it's great for the legs/feet pain. Ask your doctor about it if you experience that.

As for the back surgery itself, I'd try every single thing out there that is conservative treatment before I'd go under the knife. And then I'd only have surgery if I was in danger of being paralyzed or permanent nerve damage. Recent studies have shown that people who have surgery get NO BETTER RESULTS than those who have had physical therapy!!!

Get several other opinions before having surgery from Neurosurgeons. I wish you the best of luck. God bless & take care. Hugs, Lee

[cmullen]

Dear Leesa,

Thank you for your quick response regarding my spinal stenosis. Yes, I am leary about surgery, but I don't know what to do next. I'm not too excited about pain pumps or taking morphine to relieve my pain. Right now, I take 500 mg Hydrocodone or 50 mg. Tramadol and 400 mg. Ibuprofen. I should get another surgeon's opinion and delay any surgical intervention. Other surgeons I have seen in the past never recommended surgery as an option to cure the pain. This surgeon seems to think that the X-stop is worth a try and that it is easy to remove should it not help in relieving my pain. He also said the decision is up to me. I've gone to many pain management clinics for procedures, but haven't had much success in relieving the pain for any length of time.

I too, am a cancer survivor since 2001 for Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma and have been in remission since that time.

I appreciate your reply. Thanks.

Carolyn Mullen

Originally Posted by Leesa

I'm so sorry you're having such pain. I have the same problems in the same area, plus it has spread.

I must caution you about surgery. Do NOT expect pain relief from surgery. Surgery ONLY repairs mechanical problems. It is NOT intended for pain relief. If you happen to get pain relief from surgery, it's just a bonus. Doctors should NOT tell you that you WILL get pain relief because most of the time you will have the same pain or worse after surgery. There are times when the pain IS relieved, but that is not the rule.

I've had 2 open surgeries on L3-4 & L4-5 and each time the pain was worse. Those were 25 years ago, and the pain is still awful. I had a Spinal cord Stimulator implanted, but due to problems I had to have it removed -- that was unusual. Perhaps it would help YOU. Usually they are GREAT for pain relief, but only if you have neuropathy. Do you have pain in the legs/feet? The stimulator isn't great for just back pain -- but it's great for the legs/feet pain. Ask your doctor about it if you experience that.

As for the back surgery itself, I'd try every single thing out there that is conservative treatment before I'd go under the knife. And then I'd only have surgery if I was in danger of being paralyzed or permanent nerve damage. Recent studies have shown that people who have surgery get NO BETTER RESULTS than those who have had physical therapy!!!

Get several other opinions before having surgery from Neurosurgeons. I wish you the best of luck. God bless & take care. Hugs, Lee

[Dr. Smith]

Originally Posted by cmullen

I'm not too excited about pain pumps or taking morphine to relieve my pain. Right now, I take 500 mg Hydrocodone ....

Hi Carolyn,

Whoa! I think that's prolly more like 500 mg. acetaminophen (paracetamol/APAP/Tylenol) w/ 5 (to 15) mg. hydrocodone, right?
Hydrocodone is available only in combination with other ingredients¹

¹ http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000014/

Nobody in chronic pain is ever excited about having to take narcotic medications. Unfortunately it's the only/best option for some.

I was just about to type something about the "lesser of 2 evils", but that's not right. I almost got caught up in the exact stigma I was about to rail against!

Pain is not evil - it just is. Neither are narcotic medications when used according to directions and under the supervision of a doctor; that is a stigma born of ignorance and misinformation. It's the stigma and resultant fear, guilt, and harm caused by un-/under-treated pain that are evil.

Unrelieved pain has many negative health consequences including, but not limited to: increased stress, metabolic rate, blood clotting and water retention; delayed healing; hormonal imbalances; impaired immune system and gastrointestinal functioning; decreased mobility; problems with appetite and sleep, and needless suffering. CNP [Chronic Nonmalignant Pain] also causes many psychological problems, such as feelings of low self-esteem, powerlessness, hopelessness, and depression.

Undertreatment of CNP often results in suicide. In a recent survey, 50% of CNP patients had inadequate pain relief and had considered suicide to escape the unrelenting agony of their pain. Unrelieved pain also leads to requests for physician-assisted suicide, another indicator of pain's harsh impact on the quality of life of many patients and their families.
....
CNP patients with severe, unrelenting pain from permanent structural damage to the neurologic or musculo-skeletal systems are often subjected to expensive and unnecessary surgeries and other painful invasive procedures. Arachnoiditis and reflex sympathetic dystrophy are the most common causes of severe CNP. Other common causes include: post-trauma, adhesions, systemic lupus, headaches, degenerative arthritis, fibromyalgia, and neuropathies.
http://www.cssa-inc.org/Articles/Chronic_Pain.htm

Not wanting to take heavy meds for pain is fine, laudable - it's even normal and healthy. Fear and guilt about taking (or having/needing to take) them is not.

Your post is the first I've heard of the "X-Stop" procedure (by that name, anyway), but I'm going to look into it further (have my own issues down there - L4-S1). Thanks,

Doc

[Dr. Smith]

Originally Posted by cmullen

I've gone to many pain management clinics for procedures, but haven't had much success in relieving the pain for any length of time.

Forgot about this part...

You've had this for a long time. If you wouldn't mind sharing your experiences of things you've tried, someone here may know of/suggest something you haven't tried yet(?)

Doc

[ginnie]

Welcome to Neruo Talk. I am glad you found this site. Lots of opinions and information here to talk about. Make sure that there is no other option before you do the X proceedure. I did look it up and did some research before I replied here so I know what it is. I just don't want you to do this less invasive surgery before all options have been dicussed with your doctor. It is very true, that this is less invasive than lamenectomy. I am fused C3-7 and had multipal problems. My surgery was successful, and there is less pain. There is not 100% relief, but all neruo problems are gone. Surgery can be the right option, but only after every other thing is done first. I do wish you all the best in what ever you decide. Take care, and keep posting any questions you might have. ginnie

[Lindaky]

Originally Posted by cmullen

I am currently seeing a spine surgeon for back pain involving the L4-5 and L3-4 areas of my spine. In the past 2 months I have had 2 epidural injections to this area of my spine to obtain relief from my chronic pain (on a scale of 1-10 my pain is 7 - 10) making it difficult to walk any lengths. After being on my feet for an hour I must sit down to lessen my pain and continue my activities (i.e. cooking in the kitchen or light cleaning). Throughout the years my chronic pain has worsened to the point where I am seeking surgery as an option to lessening my chronic pain. I mentioned to my surgeon, how to tell if I am a candidate for the X-stop procedure. After discussing what movements decrease my level of pain i.e. bending over forwards, sitting, and lying down) he replied placing this device at L4-5 level would be worth considering. He also said that it's a 50/50 chance of success for some patients, but no guarantee. Over the past decade, I have had many types of injections and other outpatient procedures (to widen the spinal canal) with little relief. I would appreciate hearing from others regarding success/failure of X-stop placement.

Your story sounds a lot like mine. I have been to several Drs and so many meds I cant even remember them all. My quality of life has diminished severely but I am not sure I would succom to this before I investigated it thoroughly. I have found that , None of these things are going to take all our pain away. Even though our bodies may be a candidate for something does not mean it will necessarily work for us, know what I mean. I wish you the very best!