[Alffe]

An excerpt from Kay Jamison's excellent book:

I long ago abandoned the notion of a life without storms, or a world without dry and killing seasons. Life is too complicated, too constantly changing, to be anything but what it is. And I am, by nature, too mercurial to be aything but deeply wary of the grave unnaturalness involved in any attempt to exert too much control over essentially uncontrollable forces. There will always be propelling, disturbing elements, and they will be there until, as Lowell put it, the watch is taken from the wrist. It is, at the end of the day, the individual moments of restlessness, of bleakness, of strong persuasions and maddened enthusiasms, that inform one's life, change the nature and direction of one's work, and give final meaning and color to one's loves and friendships.

[Alffe]

More from Kay Jamison's book "An Unquiet Mind"

There are many reasons why I have been reluctant to be open about having manic-depressive illness; some of the reasons are personal, many are professional. The personal issues revolve, to a large extent, arround issues of family privacy - especially beause the illness under consideration is a genetic one - as well as a general belief that personal matters should be kept personal. too, I have been very concerned, perhaps unduly so, with how knowing that I have manic-depressive illness will affect people's perception of who I am and what I do. There is a thin line between what is considered zany and what is thought to be - ghastly but damning word - "inappropriate," and only a sliverish gap exists between being thought intense, or a bit volatile, and being dismissively labeled "unstable." And, for whatever reasons of personal vanity, I dread the fact that my suicide attempt and depressions will be seen by some as acts of weakness or as "neurontic." Somehow, I don't mind the thought of being seen as intermittently psychotic nearly as much as I mind being pigeonholed as weak and neurotic. Finally, I am deeply wary that by speaking publicly or writing about such intensely private aspects of my life, I will return to them one day and find them bleached of meaning and feeling. By putting myself in the position of speaking too freely and too often, I am concerned that the experiences will become remote, inaccessible, and far distant, behind me; I fear that the experiences will become those of someone else rather than my own.

[Alffe]

One of the reasons I am such a fan of Kay Jamison and her book, An Unquiet Mind, is because in my opinion there is so much truth and vulnerability in her words.

Our son killed himself and that makes me and my famly "less than perfect" in the eyes of the world. I am not apoligizing for this, I have come to understand and accept how the world views suicide.

And I sometimes fear that sharing it on a public forum somehow demeans it's affect on our lives...somehow minimizes it's importance. My intent is to try to show others how one persons suicide can effect so many others. And to show that it is possible to go on living in spite of losing a loved one to suicide, especially your child.

Maybe I can blame all this on Idealist, for asking the great question about long time posters. Maybe I need to ask myself when is enough, enough.

[Doody]

I really like that first quote in the thread.

Enough is enough when you feel it's enough. At one time, for too long a time for me, I championed for domestic violence/spousal abuse. Then I volunteered my time in a 'safe house' for abused women. I realized then, it was too much for me to bear, so I stopped. Weak? Yes, but I didn't want to climb that hill anymore, it was too much for me.

You're the tie that binds ((Alffe)).

[Curious]

And I sometimes fear that sharing it on a public forum somehow demeans it's affect on our lives...somehow minimizes it's importance. My intent is to try to show others how one persons suicide can effect so many others. And to show that it is possible to go on living in spite of losing a loved one to suicide, especially your child. Quoted from Alffe

the more posts that do tell of how if effects those left behind imo show how HUGE suicide is. how it spreads and mulitplies. how important it is for anyone who is thinking about know that it isn't just going to effect them. it follows generations.

yes, we do go on living. we are changed people. our lives are forever changed.



it is always ok to do what is best for you. i ditto what doody said.Enough is enough when you feel it's enough

[Idealist]

Oh, Alffe, you can blame anything on me you want, and chances are fifty-fifty that you'll be right. But if my thread in any way diminishes the amount of wonderful insight and wisdom you daily submit to these threads, then I have made a huge mistake, and all the other members of this forum are most likely going to be attempting to hang me.

You are in the same shoes that I am when it comes to numbers of posts. But if you were to suddenly stop or slow down because of it, I would be greatly unhappy. Just go back and read Curious's last post on the thread I started. It made all the difference to me.

I love these excerpts you have written here. I think that I'm going to go buy the book myself.

And BTW, if you should have possibly caught me "wandering", then you must have been wandering too, don't you think?

[Alffe]

Oh Idealist, my dear friend, , what can I say that will clarify how so many of us feel.
And for starters, I have no interest about the # of posts..I never considered it of importance...

We all hurt...we all need something or we wouldn't be reading/posting here.
I wish you would "wonder" more often so I'd have a better idea of your needs..Mine are almost always the same...I'm depressed, or ****** off, or guilty about old or recent errors in judgement...

We have such a good friend in Curious...she is selfless...but you know that.

[Curious]

i love y'all soooooo much. now stop embarassing me!

[~scrabble]

[Doody]

I never even pay attention to post COUNTS! Don't look. It doesn't make any difference to me.

Actually, I'd like to make an observation about myself in here. LOL Well, Alffe probably remembers me talking a LOT about having suicidal ideation. Seems like it lasted an awfully awfully long time and I was really tiring of it. I did my own research. I dropped myself on my dose of Cymbalta, because I figured, well...it isn't doing my depression any good. When I did drop, I did notice an increase in my fibro pain. However...I also started to notice the suicidal thoughts had dwindled significantly. But, sometime ago I also quit taking Ambien.

I suspect one or both of those meds were contributing to it, but who knows.

I'm not feeling suicidal now, pretty much. Just lonely a lot...and always in pain. I live with chronic pain. There I said it. I'm a chronic painer but again, I feel guilty bringing it up because I have friends with terrible debilitating diseases.

So now I shut up.

And Idealist...watch out. Alffe knows and sees all.