He also says there is no such thing as only Neurogenic. He says that by nature, nerves have blood flow, so it is always vascular as well.

You don't ha e arterys involved if you arm doesn't turn blue. A vascular surgeon wouldn't help. The MRNeurograph would help diagnosis exactly which TOS you have. You probably have nerves involved and as long as you don't raise the arm you are not irritating it. Doesn't mean you don't have TOS. Sounds very possible. Google MR Neugraphy. I don't think you need another doctor to order it. They can probably just work it out. Hope this helps.

I had same experience at Mayo Clinic and Cleveland Clinic. They both said I needed a psychiatrist. I have tried to talk to both about their diagnosis. I have absolute proof I have TOS that involved a couple of kinds

My arm has never been blue or white or experienced any other discoloration, but Dr. Collins' MRI/MRA/MRV showed compression of my subclavian artery. An ultrasound that I mentioned earlier shows it as well. A vascular surgeon will help you. I hope that you listen to the good advice given on these threads and weed out the poor and uninformed advice.

Have you chosen a surgeon for your surgery? Did Dr. Collins recommend surgery for you? Just wondering because a few ppl on another TOS forum said he has steered them away from surgery.

I'm meeting Dr. Gelabert tomorrow and I'm pretty sure that I'm choosing him. Dr. Collins said that he doesn't tell patients what to do because that is the surgeon's job. He did say that he would definitely give PT a shot before going into surgery, and if I do go into surgery he recommended Gelabert. I've been in PT for the past year (without the TOS diagnosis) and currently seeing Ando & Aston. Unless something changes soon with Ando, I'm going forward with the surgery.

That's fascinating because I also have the leg symptoms on the same side as my TOS and often felt there could be a connection between them, but didn't know what it would be.

Does the MRI help show the specific areas of compression, such as scalene triangle, clavicle and pec minor? Did you get more details out of this on why/where you have compression? And if you did, would that help the PTs?

Quite a few of the long timer's w/ TOS would eventually mention low back or hip pain.

I think there is an image or sketch in the sticky thread.. on how we can get tilted , partially due to pain or protecting of the worst side..hmm can't find the one I was thinking of.. it was a simple stick figure drawing...

Basically it is partially due to how the fascia is all connected, and the whole body compensations we make for usage or to avoid pain.

this site touches on the "whole" misalignment issue-
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2953353/

A well rounded whole body therapy approach is best, don't focus only on hands, arms, neck etc..

Make sure u dont have a trendelburg gait re: legs and tos

So if i passes my doppler test, i do not have vasc tos right?

Yeah, look into the Batson's Plexus.

Yes the MRI showed the compressions. I'll post or send you the report when it's complete. I was in too much pain during my visit with him to comprehend everything that he was saying.

I'm not sure if it will help the PT's much but I plan on sending everyone I work with a copy of the report as soon as it's done. (I also plan on sending a mass e-mail with the report to every doc that has misdiagnosed me in the past 2 years)

Dr. Collins thinks the reason I developed TOS is because I put on too much muscle for my small body frame. I'm currently 6' 170 pounds but when it first started I was a muscular 6' 210.

Did you see my response to you about deferred payment for medical treatments?