[vender]

Hi all, I am new to this site. I have TOS or so the Docs say. Not sure what pain level people are feeling. I find myself in extreme pain all the time. By extreme I mean I would go to the ER if I did not know what was going on. I have a very high tolerance for pain. I have had five spontaneous pneumo thorax's and the pain from that has nothing on this TOS pain. This is crippling, I take Opana for the pain and it is not doing the job. I have been told that the 1st rib removal operation is not the best. What are you all doing? what has helped? I have tried PT five time with no help. I need help, its going on five years and I am done. Can anyone recommend docs in Michigan.
Thanks, hope to hear from you all.
Mark

[Jomar]

Hello and Welcome,

Have they checked for vascular compressions /involvement?
Have they checked for extra cervical ribs? {xray/MRI}

where and what kind of pain do you have?
any - zingers, zaps, tightness, numbness, buzzing , vibrating, swelling, heavy, color changes.. - just a few of the usual terms
If you can describe it & the locations of the worst pain - this might help us come up with the best ideas for you.

Did PT try to strengthen you before working to reduce your pain?
{hand bikes, thera bands, weights???}
a PT thread -
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/sh...ad.php?t=33340

It's been awhile since these drs were added to out Drs sticky but these will be a start for you -
Michigan

Gavin I. Awerbuch, M.D. / Neurologist
915 S. Euclid Avenue
Bay City, MI 48706
517-667-5760

Jerome V. Ciullo M.D. / Orthopedic Surgeon
Sports Medicine and Orthopedic Surgery
Sports Medicine Center of Metro Detroit, P.C.
755 W. Big Beaver, Suite 1300
Troy, MI 48084-4903
248-244-8887

Dr. Gerald Zelenock, M.D.
William Beaumont Hospital
3601 W 13 Mile Rd.
Royal Oak, Michigan 48073
Phone: (248)551-1465
Fax: (248)551-3023
Website: http://www.beaumonthospitals.com

Dr Samet / Sarah and crew
Clinic: Preferred Medicine-
Spine, Sports and Occupational Medicine
15636 Southfield Rd
Allen Park, Michigan 48101
Phone: (313)928-0700
Fax: (313)928-0701

Physical Therapy and Pain Management
Dr. Randy Roth, Psychologist and Director of: Pain Management Program University of Michigan Spine Program
(734) 998-6644

Dr. Paul Cullis, M.D.
Michigan Neurology Institute, East
18245 Ten Mile Rd. Suite 130
Roseville, Michigan 48192
Phone: (586)771-7440
Fax: (586)771-9966

Dr. Lance R Chaldecott
Orthopedic Specialists
3200 Biddle Ave
Wyandotte, Michigan 48192
Phone: (734)324-3900
Fax: (734)324-3979

Dr Samet / Sarah and crew
Preferred Medicine- Spine, Sports and Occupational Medicine
15636 Southfield Rd
Allen Park, Michigan 48101
Phone: (313)928-0700
Fax: (313)928-0701

Dr. Lance R Chaldecott
Clinic: Orthopedic Specialists
3200 Biddle Ave
Wyandotte, Michigan 48192
Phone: (734)324-3900
Fax: (734)324-3979

in case you need to look further -
http://neurotalk.psychcentral.com/thread135.html

[vender]

Hello Jo55,
They did xrays, MRI's and a doppler. PT just tried to lessen the pain. I do enough work to strengthen and cause great pain. The pain is in the top of the chest shoulder/back then down the arm to the elbow wrist and hands. It is dull and burning nagging gnawing. I do get tingling but not that often. The elbow pain feels like you hit your funny bone. It hurts to do anything for more than 5 minutes then hands cramp. Pinky and ring finger worse but also have pain in the thumb pad. Shoulder and neck pain are also very bad, by bad I mean a REAL 10. The hands dont work like they used to. I drop everything and have poor control over manipulating them. I do everything from plumbing, electrical, IT work, Certified mechanic, construction...... This is ruining me. I just want it over and the Doc does not seem to excited about the surgery saying "it could make it worse" "only a 65% success". I can not imagine it being any worse. life is just passing me by. I hate it. Sorry for going on but after 4 years I am going nuts from then pain. Which I no does not help the issue.
Thanks

[Jomar]

ahh your description sound so familiar ..
so nothing obvious showed up on your films or tests...?

If not I suggest finding some really good advanced PTs, body workers {Alexander, feldenkrais, hellerworker - any along those lines that work with the whole body to unstick it} or even a expert all around chiropractor. Maybe a team of all or try one type at a time...

I'm just thinking you have some very sticky fascia and maybe some postural and /or alignment issues.

You will need somebody that knows about trigger point, fascia, alignment, muscle spasms. top rib mobilization...


I had the deep burning nagging pain in my neck, shoulders, upper mid back, and the elbow zingers for a short time {my chiropractor did some nice adjustments for those} yes - the hands not working right was a big thing for me.
The constant forearm tightness and weird buzzing/vibrating under the skin was pretty annoying too.
I had minor thumb sx- they tx me for it but it was really the least of my issues...prob cause the doc could actually put a name on it..

non of my docs ever mentioned TOS they were only focused on the multiple RSI injuries - not where they might be really coming from.
Finally had 2 really good PTs that figured it out and by then I had learned some about TOS online too. So from a personal standpoint I was learning what I needed to work on.

I couldn't even stir fry or cook ground beef.
I sure couldn't pick up the small parts at work..could barely drive to work LOL good thing it was a straight shot down a hwy..

that was one of the problems I had with "proving " my injury - i could do large movements and even pick up somewhat heavy things - but no fine or precise finger skills at all..

A really good chiro, adv PT, self care {very important too} and a couple yrs off work has got me back into a functional state.

I still hit the wrong keys while typing {thank Firefox for built in spell check LOL} and handwriting is not pretty at all.
But I can do carpentry, stacked hay, gardened, remodeled, make concrete, shoveled , paint...work on cars = farm gal LOL


If there is any way to swing it - some time off work while you get some focused therapy and give your body time to repair is a good idea..

i tried to work and get PT but it just was a cycle of minor gains and then back to work and lose the progress...

I learned about what muscles are where and how to work them with a tennis ball on the floor or against the wall.
got a good heating pad
got a EMS stim - IF stim is even better but a doc has to sign for those.. next time I'll get the IF type.
those inflatable exercise balls are good for laying over face up and face down to stretch the back and chest


total relaxation and stretching by laying on the floor with arms out to a comfortable place {Sharon Butlers book}
well I've rambled on...

[vender]

Jo the doppler did show TOS and the Adson?? tested positive. I have taken 4 years off to let my body heal. It is only getting worse. Not sure what my next step is.
Thanks for your help
Mark

[Jomar]

I had to refresh my brain on the doppler test - I never have one
Doppler test info-
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c...OS&btnG=Search

so you have more of a vascular type of TOS { blood flow compressions}.
Could they tell if it was more artery or vein , or both equally.

Did they note at what angle or degree your pulse stopped at as they moved your arms around? PTs might have done this part.

It's just a good thing to know so if you can keep arms from those positions until the pain can get calmed down.

Do your armpits feel tight or puffy or sore at times , or all the time - that could be pec minor syndrome also a type of TOS.

Also the muscles and fascia can just plain get sticky as well as the problem of blood flow, they all interact with TOS.