[Tony H]

Hi,

I'm a 41 yr old male & I have a very unusual type of post-concussion syndrome.

After my head injury – incurred over 12 years ago playing Australian Rules Football - I recovered fully (my head ‘cleared’ after a couple of months) and a MRI scan showed no problems. And normally, I have no problems with attention, processing and memory.

However, certain types of ‘hard’ vibration (e.g., from riding a bicycle) seem to trigger mild post concussion – my head seems a bit ‘cloudy’ and I struggle a bit with short-term memory, processing and concentration – it is quite noticeable. Fortunately, the ‘adverse effects’ normally wear off after a few days.

This problem has been limiting the activities I undertake, as I have to avoid activities such as running, cycling etc..:

Just wondering what the best course of action would be?

Thank you for any assistance.

[Sissy]

http://www.round-earth.com/HeadPainIntro.html
Hi Tony, even if you don't have any headpain you might want to look at this article. I'm wondering if your problems could be related to tight muscles, since they can irritate nerves and bloodvessels.

[yannimac]

I have a similar problem. My head is also "clear" now for the most part, but when I exercise it will bring back the symptoms. Are you certain this is a result of the vibrations/impact while running or cycling? Could it be just the fact that you are exercising and increasing you heart rate and sending more blood to the brain? Have you tried a stationary bike or other non-impact aerobic exercise and does that result in the same symptoms? I have been trying to figure out why this happens to me for the last year. The doctors I have seen are clueless, but it seems as though it might be a result of something vascular relating to cerebral blood flow which changes with aerobic activity. I am still trying a few things like neurofeedback, although I have only done 5 sessions so far - seems promising for things like controlling anxiety, but I dont know if it will solve my exercise problems. If neurofeedback does not solve this problem, I may eventually look into HEG feedback which measures the blood flow in the brain and allows you to regulate it based on real-time feedback.

[jeffn]

Hi Yannimac Is the neurofeedback helping and are you making progress with this type of therapy?

Checked out your b log and it looks like your making some progress also been checking out Daves b log no new post in the last month or so.

I'm very interested in neurofeedback as a possible treatment plan for TBI and correcting or re building the neuro transmitters, but it does look like this type of treatment needs to do done in a controlled environment, support group and a trainer.

Still researching this type of training before I make the 1200.00 investment and the cost of setting up the assessment. So any feed back on what you have learned so far would be appreciated. jeffn

[horsegal]

Hi everyone,

I am new to the board and need a little advice...

My case of PCS isn't nearly as difficult or severe as many of the posts I have read on this site (sending good energy your way) and I hesitated even writing in, but I have had trouble finding answers to some basic questions and hope some of you out there wouldn't mind helping me. Here is my story:

I fell off of my horse a week and a half ago, out for 10+ mins and after two trips to the ER (normal MRI/CT scans) was diagnosed with PCS. Last week i was a mess, depressed, couldnt sleep, ears ringing, difficulty speaking, irritable - classic symptoms, i spent the week literally in a dark room. Today I started feeling a little better, the fog seemed to lift, and I suddenly wanted to get up and go do something (manic is quite normal for me, otherwise I would worry about that). I just can't get a straight answer on what types of activities I am ok to participate in, obviously riding horses is out, I have been warned that another blow would be it for the head, but I have been tucked away in my condo for over a week now and am wondering what is rule on going for a walk, or light jog - is it safe to try? or am I risking a return of/prolonging symptoms? I know if I sit in the condo another week without any exercise I will get depressed, and that would be true without PCS, so i am anxious to return to some activity. I am just worried that if i start doing things i am going to prolong recovery or risk more damage.

Has anyone out there returned to activities after a concussion this soon or is this break in symptoms just that?

The other question I hesitate to mention, b/c it is sooo superficial, but when can i have a glass of wine? The docs said don't drink until you feel better, so i am feeling better, but won't risk it if anyone has experience on alcohol consumption (a glass or two of wine once a week would be all i would want to do) and a negative impact on recovery.

Again I apologize for my "fluffy" questions about a very serious condition, but I would really appreciate any advice you can provide.

[yannimac]

horsegal,

first things first. Don't do anything that would increase your risk of hitting your head for a few months. Trust me, if you are feeling concussion symptoms now, then you do not want another one any time soon. The symptoms will persist much longer the second time.

Every injury is different and you need to judge the exercise thing based on how you are feeling. Start walking for a few days and if you feel ok, then start jogging. If you still feel ok after jogging, then maybe you can do more. As soon as you start feeling bad I would take it easy for a few days. "No pain, no gain" does not apply to exercise with PCS. That will just make things worse.

With my head injury I felt terrible for a week like you, then started feeling normal and went back to lifting weights and doing heavy cardio. It made me feel terrible, but I thought I could tough it out. After 2 weeks I was feeling really bad and it is possible that doing too much too soon made my symptoms stick around for a long time.

[Tony H]

Hi Yannimac,

There are two reasons why I don't think that exercise (and increased heart rate/blood to the brain) is the trigger for PCS in my case.

First, I don't get any symptoms at all if I do certain types of exercise (eg swimming) which get my heart rate up but don't including any jarring vibrations.

Also, I can get PCS if I am subject to certain types of jarring vibration when I'm not exercising.

I saw a neurophysiologist in Sydney 10 days ago about my problems with PCS.

He wants me to deliberately trigger it, then he'll run some tests (EEG) to determine the impacts on brain function enabling him to consider the best course of action. That is, the results from the EEG will help him design an appropriate cognitive therapy program for me. ... (This is my "lay persons" description of what he was saying - i think i've got it right...)

I am fortunate in the sense that I am able to avoid activities which trigger the PCS, but then again it is getting to the point whereby this is limiting my physical activities a bit too much (not being able to go running or cycling is frustrating to say the least!!).

I have to make a decision as to whether I go down the 'cognitive therapy' track, or simply avoid actions which trigger the PCS.

All the best -

Tony H

Originally Posted by yannimac

I have a similar problem. My head is also "clear" now for the most part, but when I exercise it will bring back the symptoms. Are you certain this is a result of the vibrations/impact while running or cycling? Could it be just the fact that you are exercising and increasing you heart rate and sending more blood to the brain? Have you tried a stationary bike or other non-impact aerobic exercise and does that result in the same symptoms? I have been trying to figure out why this happens to me for the last year. The doctors I have seen are clueless, but it seems as though it might be a result of something vascular relating to cerebral blood flow which changes with aerobic activity. I am still trying a few things like neurofeedback, although I have only done 5 sessions so far - seems promising for things like controlling anxiety, but I dont know if it will solve my exercise problems. If neurofeedback does not solve this problem, I may eventually look into HEG feedback which measures the blood flow in the brain and allows you to regulate it based on real-time feedback.

[Lucy]

Hi Tony H,

I agree about the jarring - I have had pcs for coming up 7 years now and have found that any shaking, jarring vibration of my head will bring on the symptons. (Excessive exercise has done the same - like extreme excessive like absolutely forcing myself to continue.)

With the jarring - going over a judder bar in the road too quickly has done it for me - I was amazed - it is the first time that I actually "registered" that it caused it. Of course whiplash can cause concussion so this really does follow on from that.

I don't see how any cognitive therapy can cure this so I will be very interested to hear more from you about this. How can changing the way you think help the brains physical reaction? It is like wearing a helmet - a helmet will not stop your brain shaking inside your skull.

For quite some time I have been under the impression that my brain needs a stabiliser. My balance is not what it used to be either.

Another thought that I have had in the past is that I am far more comfortable driving myself than being driven and if I am being driven by somebody in a manual car I find this incredibly jerky (lousy driver maybe) - I am not a control freak and have put it down to the fact that hanging onto the steering wheel is maybe not as jerky or perhaps having more expectation of the jerks - this does sound weird sorry!

I no longer play tennis and don't run. I now do a lot of walking and some gym work is ok.

Lynlee

[Tony H]

Hi Lynlee

The neurophysiologist I saw is confident this type of jarring is not physically damaging the brain.

What is happening is that after we damage the brain (initial accident) neurons must communicate in a different way to by-pass the damaged neurons. This method of communicating is, however, less efficient in a brain that has not been damaged.

What is happening is that jarring activity now triggers a change in the way neurons communicate (from efficient to inefficient) even though the activity has not actually caused any physical damage to the brain.

Cognitive therapy encourages efficient communication between neurons and therefore (hopefully) it will reverse the symptoms.

This is just my interpretation of what the neurophysiologist was saying - I think i've got it right but when I summarised what he was saying he looked totally confused!!

Best regards,

TOny H

Originally Posted by Lucy

Hi Tony H,

I agree about the jarring - I have had pcs for coming up 7 years now and have found that any shaking, jarring vibration of my head will bring on the symptons. (Excessive exercise has done the same - like extreme excessive like absolutely forcing myself to continue.)

With the jarring - going over a judder bar in the road too quickly has done it for me - I was amazed - it is the first time that I actually "registered" that it caused it. Of course whiplash can cause concussion so this really does follow on from that.

I don't see how any cognitive therapy can cure this so I will be very interested to hear more from you about this. How can changing the way you think help the brains physical reaction? It is like wearing a helmet - a helmet will not stop your brain shaking inside your skull.

For quite some time I have been under the impression that my brain needs a stabiliser. My balance is not what it used to be either.

Another thought that I have had in the past is that I am far more comfortable driving myself than being driven and if I am being driven by somebody in a manual car I find this incredibly jerky (lousy driver maybe) - I am not a control freak and have put it down to the fact that hanging onto the steering wheel is maybe not as jerky or perhaps having more expectation of the jerks - this does sound weird sorry!

I no longer play tennis and don't run. I now do a lot of walking and some gym work is ok.

Lynlee

[awre1313]

You wrote: "Just wondering what the best course of action would be?"

Go see your trusted neuroloist right away.