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-   Traumatic Brain Injury and Post Concussion Syndrome (https://www.neurotalk.org/traumatic-brain-injury-and-post-concussion-syndrome/)
-   -   Mechanism of cognitive symptoms related to a whiplash neck injury (https://www.neurotalk.org/traumatic-brain-injury-and-post-concussion-syndrome/249793-mechanism-cognitive-symptoms-related-whiplash-neck-injury.html)

todayistomorrow 11-01-2017 05:12 AM

What type of pillow do you use? I had mri DTI scan done at Mayo Clinic and it came back clean. Dr. said that’s means I don’t have mTBJ but PCS and due to chemical changes in brain. 25% of people with PCS don’t recover and they dont know why. Also mentioned he thought I could possibly heal still as I’ve been incorrectly medicated.

If my vision was affected, I have post convergence insufficiency. Seems odd that if I didn’t have brain damage, my vision wouldn’t have been affected. I’m sure my neck plays a role in my headache pain but I want to solve the brain fog/head pressure more than my daily headaches.

Danielson 11-04-2017 04:11 PM

I have question, how do we know that in some cases one of the causes of the cognitive problems after a whiplash injury is the reduced blood flow to the brain due to inflammation of the joint tissues?
What kind of tests or studies had discovered/showed that?

Mark in Idaho 11-04-2017 05:47 PM

There is not definitive way to know. Poor sleep, depression, and other things can be the cause, too.

In my case, the only indication was when I had much better days cognitively when I slept with better posture.

Like so many issues with concussions, trying different treatments or behaviors for an extended period can effect improvements.

There are no direct diagnose and treat protocols. In much of medicine, the try this and see what happens protocol is a mainstay.

Danielson 11-04-2017 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark in Idaho (Post 1254101)
There is not definitive way to know. Poor sleep, depression, and other things can be the cause, too.

In my case, the only indication was when I had much better days cognitively when I slept with better posture.

Like so many issues with concussions, trying different treatments or behaviors for an extended period can effect improvements.

There are no direct diagnose and treat protocols. In much of medicine, the try this and see what happens protocol is a mainstay.

Yes, I understand that it is basically impossible to know for sure the cause of cognitive issues on a specific/singular case.
But generally speaking, how do we know that a whiplash injury can reduce the blood flow to the brain by inflammation of the soft joint tissues thus causing thinking and memory problems?
What kind of studies and/or exams have showed that it is possible?

Mark in Idaho 11-05-2017 12:55 AM

There are no studies I have seen. A medical school professor who used to post his lectures online addressed these issues.

The anecdotal evidence suggests this to be a common issue. The medical industry is not completely behind this but the chiropractic and osteopath professions try to address these issues.

Common logical understandings of anatomy and physiology suggest this is the case. It is well known that excessive pressure in the brain can cause cognitive and memory problems. That is why the MMSE (Mini Mental Status Exam) is used to diagnose neurological condition.

A webinar put on by Headway Foundation addressed upper neck issues this past Thursday but I missed the presentation.

Why do you need to have such specific information?

Danielson 11-05-2017 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark in Idaho (Post 1254125)
There are no studies I have seen. A medical school professor who used to post his lectures online addressed these issues.

The anecdotal evidence suggests this to be a common issue. The medical industry is not completely behind this but the chiropractic and osteopath professions try to address these issues.

Common logical understandings of anatomy and physiology suggest this is the case. It is well known that excessive pressure in the brain can cause cognitive and memory problems. That is why the MMSE (Mini Mental Status Exam) is used to diagnose neurological condition.

A webinar put on by Headway Foundation addressed upper neck issues this past Thursday but I missed the presentation.

Why do you need to have such specific information?

Because I want to try to know and understand as much as possible about the possible causes, consequences, mechanisms and implications of what I am living through.

Danielson 11-06-2017 07:57 PM

I started experiencong severe thinking, concentration and memory problems and numbness two days after the car accident during the first week of May, and then they worsened even more after I did a MMA match on the 17 June.
I did not take any hits to the head or other body parts, but I received a lot of pressure to the neck due to chokes and spinal compression techniques.

With that being said, I have been symptoms free since the half of August, but cognitive deficits (albeit less intense than previously) have gradually returned during this week, starting form November 1st.
I experienced an intense rage due to frustration, and in the process I grabbed, squeezed strongly and throwed around some objects.
Then I started to feel dizzy, groggy and "off", and that was followed by trouble thinking that became greater every day.
I was frustrated and angry in a similar way, many other times during this period, but I never experienced any setback. Hovewer, it was the first time that I physically grabbed and squeezed with much force objects in the process.

According to you, what is the most likely cause for this relapse?
And also, what should I do to avoid aggravating further my situation and improving the chance of a recovery?

I also specific that I have always taken Vitamin B and folic acid supplements during this period (I took them even before the accident to helm me stay focused when studying)

Mark in Idaho 11-07-2017 01:06 AM

It is really not possible to accurately self-diagnose cognitive deficits. There are many causes, including anxiety, OCD (a form of anxiety), stress, school work load, diet, blood sugar levels, thyroid or other hormone imbalances, plus the issues due to injuries.

If you were symptom free from mid August to the end of October, what were you complaining about for the past few weeks?

It sounds to me like you need to slow down and take life a bit slower. Learn to let go of the little details.

btw, What doses of which B's are you taking? How about the other things like Omega 3, and other beneficial supplements.

Do you have access to a Neuro Psychological Assessment to properly quantify your symptoms? Most use an NPA to validate symptoms.

Danielson 11-07-2017 02:48 AM

Quote:

It is really not possible to accurately self-diagnose cognitive deficits. There are many causes, including anxiety, OCD (a form of anxiety), stress, school work load, diet, blood sugar levels, thyroid or other hormone imbalances, plus the issues due to injuries.
I used to think and speak in a very precise, quick, fluid and complex manner, while now I struggle to form one single coherent sentence in my mind and I cannot speak more than a few words without forgetting what I was tryng to say.
I'm also unable to perform simple cognitive tasks that I was capable of doing effortlessy previously.
Can a worsening of the situation of that level be cause by anxiety or stress?

Quote:

If you were symptom free from mid August to the end of October, what were you complaining about for the past few weeks?
I was complaining about having had severe cognitive symptoms for months (beetwen the end of June and July I would not have been able to post on this forum at all) and about the state of high anxiety and fear of my symptoms coming back that I was experiencing.
Also I had been imprecise in sayng that I have been symptoms free in that periodo, I'm sorry.
I meant that I was free from cognitive symptoms, but I still had some other issues like disturbed sleep patterns, sporadic shortness of breath and high levels of anxiety.

Quote:

btw, What doses of which B's are you taking? How about the other things like Omega 3, and other beneficial supplements.
I'm taking a supplment called Be Total which include 2,1 mg of B6, 1,4 mg of B2, 1,1 mg of B1, 2,5 mcg of B12 and 200 mcg of folid acid

Quote:

Do you have access to a Neuro Psychological Assessment to properly quantify your symptoms? Most use an NPA to validate symptoms.
I have never heard about that, could you please elaborate further about it?

Quote:

It sounds to me like you need to slow down and take life a bit slower. Learn to let go of the little details.
You are right but it's not easy, do you have some practical suggestions about that by the way?

Mark in Idaho 11-07-2017 11:22 AM

Back in 1982, I was under high stress after being ripped off by a real estate developer for hundreds of thousands of dollars. My cognitive skills were a in seriously dysfunctional state. I could not finish sentences. I was walking around like a zombie. A psychiatrist diagnosed a serious depression. He got me started on the vitamin regimen with a focus on B-12 and mega dose anti-oxidants. I do not have any recollection of having suffered any kind of head trauma.

In 2002, after a head and neck injury in 2001 and over a year of cognitive struggles, a Neuro Psychologist did an assessment and found serious dysfunction in my cognitive skills. Because of my high scores in the WAIS-II adult intelligence assessment, he diagnosed my cognitive and memory problems as the result of depression. In this case, I scored very low on the depression scales. I researched depression and cognitive skills and found that depression/anxiety can cause a reduction in cognitive skills. I also found that there is a huge overlap between depression/anxiety caused and injury caused loss of cognitive skills.

All this to say there is no way to know the cause of your struggles until you are properly assessed by a professional.

Your accident and MMA neck strain could have triggered an increased anxiety and depression episode. Many with PCS start with injury caused struggles that become worse from the anxiety/depression symptoms. Your focus on details suggests an obsessive focus. This is a sign of anxiety. You are likely a very driven person with high achievement standards. People like that are impacted more severely by PCS so depression/anxiety is more prevalent.

The shortness of breath is a common symptom of anxiety. It comes from muscle rigidity. The anxiety causes people to tense up muscles to the point that they unconsciously hold or slow their breathing until their brain says, "Help, I'm not breathing." It is part of what is sometimes called postural rigidity where the muscles in the torso are held tense.

The dosages in the Be Total are very low. They are dosed to prevent malnutrition, not encourage healing and better stress tolerance. RI or RDA is an amount needed to prevent malnutrition, not to support an injured or stressed nervous system. The B-12 should be 500 to 1000 mcgs or more. The folic acid should be 400 to 500 mcgs. B-6 should be 20 mgs or more.

From a google search, Neuro Psychological Assessments are used in Italy (I think you said that is where you are). The MMSE, Mini Mental Status Exam is also used as an early stage screening tool. Both use tests of memory, motor function, executive functioning etc to diagnose brain and psychological dysfunctions. The MMSE is often done by a medical doctor. It only takes 10 to 20 minutes. The rest are done by neuro psychologists.


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