Traumatic Brain Injury and Post Concussion Syndrome For traumatic brain injury (TBI) and post concussion syndrome (PCS).


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Old 06-01-2021, 12:13 PM #1
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Default Anxiety = number one enemy for concussions

Hi guys, I see a lot of people on this site with prior concussions post about how stressed they get when they sustain minor bumps to the head post-concussion. I've been in the same boat. In 2019 I had a mild concussion...then I googled concussions and my anxiety skyrocketed. fight or flight. And then the vicious cycle started...I started getting anxious about having another panic attack, anxious about everything in general. 2 months later as I was starting to improve...I bumped my head very lightly on a counter...anxiety came roaring back, and back into the horrible cycle.

I've now delved into cbt therapy for my anxiety, and it has really helped. Anxiety can cloud our judgement and logic so much, and it can be so unhealthy. The power of our thoughts can really determine what triggers anxiety. I recently bumped my head at work a few weeks ago..at first, negative thoughts started to flood back...but the I told myself " whether you got a concussion or not, anxiety will make nothing better. It happened. Move on". By the next day, I had forgotten about it and I was fine..instead of anxiety taking over and falling back into the cycle. It's upsetting to see so many people fall back into the trap over minor bumps to the head. I think its at least 70gs of force required for a concussion to happen.

Have a great day everyone. Positive vibes!
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Old 06-01-2021, 03:31 PM #2
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I realise most of the "events" after the event that I define as "THE concussion" are exactly as you describe - anxiety cycles and thought loops. The ones that I can instantly rationalise and dismiss as non-events last a few seconds. The ones I struggle to defeat with logic drag on for 1-2 weeks and in some cases, a few months - these longer ones tend to come in waves. Stress tends to keep them alive for longer.

It seems my mind and body calibrate the symptoms I am going to have based on my appraisal of the scenario severity: type of impact mechanism, momentum, point of impact on head, height or distance of motion, hardness of impact and rigidity of object.

The other week, I was sat on a "build it yourself chair" I bought from Amazon and the thing broke while I was sat on it, wearing noise-cancelling headphones (so a bit detached from that instant proprioceptive reflex). I remember the fall backwards was partly controlled, due to the chair slowly folding under me and I sort of slid down the chair before it hit the ground.

I definitely remember the impact sensation in my upper back as the chair hit the floor - not my head.

However, within 30 seconds or less, the anxiety and doubt kicked in. I could not trust myself to accurately remember the event and started gaslighting myself with thoughts like "you did hit your head, you're just in denial / or you were knocked out for a millisecond and have forgotten the impact". Then I try to rationalise with "ok, if I hit my head, why no bruising, soreness, grogginess?"

Logically, my mind can see the evidence, however, my brain chooses to believe the feelings/fear/uncertainty. A previous therapist identified I suffer with Intolerance of Uncertainty, where I focus on making the the worst-case scenario a reality as a way of avoiding living with the uncertainty.

For me, Anxiety + Uncertainty = "But, what if...?", unfortunately, But what if + Rumination + More Anxiety = "I am certain the 'what if' has definitely happened".

Logically, trusting screwed-up maths formula produced from the emotional brain makes no sense, yet still I believe screwed-up maths formula produced from the emotional brain.

Even though I know all the above, I still don't trust myself to be ok.

I'm having another go at therapy for a bunch of stuff and it's ironic the chair collapsed 10 minutes before the first session with the new therapist.
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Old 06-01-2021, 08:08 PM #3
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Hey guys,

You both have amazing insight into this problem. The ways you have dealt with it are incredible.

I also have this problem. It's been ruining my whole life and driving me insane for 4 years and counting. Almost like some sort of sick joke.

Whenever I bump my head moderately, even if I tell myself "it's nothing to worry about, move on" my dysautonomia and head pressure and dizziness come screaming back

I've had moments where I manage a bit better than I did in the beginning.


Last Thursday I sat down quickly on the carpet on my backside to relax. Didn't hurt my butt or feel initially different or anything.

I then started wondering if me sitting down on the floor quickly was enough force to be a concern as I've read that landing.

My head pressure and dizziness symptoms (autonomic nervous system dysfunction I guess?) went crazy a short time later and is still that way now.

I'm absolutely horrified as I was just starting to make a difference with sub symptom threshold exercise again.

Now it doesn't seem to matter what my heartrate is, my symptoms are full bore.

Do either you know why this is happening? Or think sitting down quickly is something to worry about? I can't tell if I'm going crazy or not.
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Old 06-02-2021, 12:54 AM #4
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I have been calling this Concussion Anxiety Syndrome for years. It ruins lives. The movie Concussion was a big part of starting this epidemic.

As Bud said long ago, It helps to consider if the head bump would have caused such a reaction prior to the recent main event concussion.

I talk about a concussion needing 60 to 80 Gs to be a mild concussion. That is like dropping a 16 pound bowling ball a foot onto your head.

A car can not cause more than 1 G in a hard stop on dry pavement.

CBT and other thought and exposure/desensitization therapies can help.

When CAS causes people to abandon all logical thinking, professional help is needed.

btw, I stop answering "Was this bump a concussion?" questions over 2 years ago. Answering NO never changed the illogical thinking.
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Old 06-02-2021, 03:39 PM #5
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I've been where you guys have been. Any negative body feeling..whether it was dizziness, head fullness etc. can spark anxiety, which in turn leads to physical symptoms (racing heart, brain fog, shakiness) which leads to more anxiety...and then we automatically relate these to the worst case scenario of having TBI. It's a vicious spiral that is hard to get out of.

I find that anxiety has many, many non specific symptoms that can be related to those of concussion. In my experience, I have found the anxiety spiral as I call it is the main culprit for keeping my stress levels up and catastrophizing. And that's what it is...catastrophizing. it's a faulty method of thinking. But the more we do it the more it cements our beliefs that our brains are permanently damaged and then in turn keeps our stress levels and anxiety up. And the cycle continues...

BTW, I'm no expert by any means. This has just been my personal experience 🙂 and other things definitely come into play like nutrition and sleep. Yesterday I felt a bit anxious and unfocused..instead of falling into the spiral..I realized that I had 2 strong cups of coffee that day (more than my usual intake)..which is why I was feeling a bit jittery. "Whatever,no problem!" My mind said. Drink some water, go for a walk to burn the energy off, and move on. I have to be more careful with caffeine...given that it's a stimulant and can actually burn through B vitamins I've heard.
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Old 06-02-2021, 07:44 PM #6
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The experts suggest no caffeine but consider a single serving in the morning as manageable for some.

Caffeine and MSG and free glutamates (fermented soy is a common source) are on the no list along with alcohol.

A single serving of alcohol at the end of the day is also tolerable for most.It is a trade off. The value of relaxing and stress reduction is more beneficial than the challenge a serving of alcohol presents.
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Old 06-03-2021, 12:49 PM #7
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Caffeine is nasty, barely drank it over the last 15 years.

I tend to find enough stimulation from the B5 and B3; flushing Niacin is great. I get jittery when I take a B-Complex regularly (currently have Jarrow's B Right - it's like rocket fuel for me), most likely methylation issues.

I sometimes take L-Tyrosine or L-Phenylalanine if I'm feeling a bit low on Dopamine - both of those are stimulatory and can also raise adrenaline (while 500mg of DLPA is on another level - great for intense workouts, BUT definitely not a PM supplement!)
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Old 06-04-2021, 12:04 AM #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ady_P View Post
Caffeine is nasty, barely drank it over the last 15 years.

I tend to find enough stimulation from the B5 and B3; flushing Niacin is great. I get jittery when I take a B-Complex regularly (currently have Jarrow's B Right - it's like rocket fuel for me), most likely methylation issues.

I sometimes take L-Tyrosine or L-Phenylalanine if I'm feeling a bit low on Dopamine - both of those are stimulatory and can also raise adrenaline (while 500mg of DLPA is on another level - great for intense workouts, BUT definitely not a PM supplement!)
Have you considered taking Mucuna Pruriens to boost dopamine levels.
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